Unpopular Smash Opinions (BE CIVIL)

[Opossum]

Also "not a character"? As if any Nintendo characters have more personality than Piranha Plant? Almost the entire Smash roster is blank slates and silent protagonists.

I know this is the Unpopular Opinion thread, but I genuinely don't get how anyone can believe this in earnest. Mostly because it's blatantly untrue.

 

[FazDude]

As time has passed, I'm starting to not only appreciate Incineroar's inclusion more, but also think he's a more interesting fighter than Decidueye could have been.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

As time has passed, I'm starting to not only appreciate Incineroar's inclusion more, but also think he's a more interesting fighter than Decidueye could have been.

I think you're spitting facts

...yet this also fits in the "unpopular" side of things.

 

[Janx_uwu]

I know this is the Unpopular Opinion thread, but I genuinely don't get how anyone can believe this in earnest. Mostly because it's blatantly untrue.

Added it up myself. There are 22 blank slates or silent protagonists. You could make arguments to include more characters (like how technically all of one Pokemon will have different personalities) but it still wouldn't be close.

That being said, I do understand the point Wario was trying to make here - that whether a character has a personality or not shouldn't determine their eligibility for Smash.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Added it up myself. There are 22 blank slates or silent protagonists. You could make arguments to include more characters (like how technically all of one Pokemon will have different personalities) but it still wouldn't be close.

That being said, I do understand the point Wario was trying to make here - that whether a character has a personality or not shouldn't determine their eligibility for Smash.

Alright, I'm gonna need to know who these 22 are. You can't just pull a number and expect people to just go with it.

Also, I'm curious.

 

[Janx_uwu]

Make that 20 - for some reason I included Greninja and Lucario in the original list.

Mario, Link, Kirby, Ness, Ice Climbers, Dr. Mario, Young Link, GNW, Pokemon Trainer, Olimar, Villager, Wii Fit, Pac-Man, Robin, R.O.B., Joker, Hero, Byleth, Steve

Again, you could make arguments for and against many of them. Like, Olimar has a notebook that gives away his personality and he also crashes his rocket ship and can be very clumsy, so I can understand in that case. Or like Robin or Byleth or Hero or Joker (I've never played those games so IDK but they're avatar characters in an RPG so I just assumed). Still, it's a non-zero number, which is the point I was trying to make.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

But it's also far less than Wario's "almost the entire roster" claim, so that's still good to know it's not very true.

With that said, calling Robin a blank slate might get you the ire of Awakening fans.

And I will honestly never fail to be annoyed at people calling Byleth a blank slate. Being stoic =/= having no personality.
Doubly so since their personality actually gets affected by your chosen route as the game goes on.

 

[Oracle Link]

But it is important as mook/stage hazard, not as a playable character. You want to properly honor the piranha plant? Make a Mario stage with some of them getting out of pipes, like they are known to.

I dont even have anything against playable mooks i just dont think pirahna plant is a really interesting/Important mook
having Metroids, Slimes or maybe thats bias Octoroks playable instead would be something i would love!

 

[FazDude]

having Metroids, Slimes or maybe thats bias Octoroks playable instead would be something i would love!

I'd honestly love an Omega Metroid as a fighter, and I'm not even that much of a Metroid fan.

 

[Perkilator]

I dont even have anything against playable mooks i just dont think pirahna plant is a really interesting/Important mook
having Metroids, Slimes or maybe thats bias Octoroks playable instead would be something i would love!

I remember Sakurai having Slime as a Plan B in the event of Square Enix not allowing the Hero.

 

[Opossum]

Make that 20 - for some reason I included Greninja and Lucario in the original list.

Mario, Link, Kirby, Ness, Ice Climbers, Dr. Mario, Young Link, GNW, Pokemon Trainer, Olimar, Villager, Wii Fit, Pac-Man, Robin, R.O.B., Joker, Hero, Byleth, Steve

Again, you could make arguments for and against many of them. Like, Olimar has a notebook that gives away his personality and he also crashes his rocket ship and can be very clumsy, so I can understand in that case. Or like Robin or Byleth or Hero or Joker (I've never played those games so IDK but they're avatar characters in an RPG so I just assumed). Still, it's a non-zero number, which is the point I was trying to make.

It's an even smaller number than this.

Mario himself is absolutely not devoid of personality like the original claim alluded to; his personality is fairly well defined. It's standard, yes, but it's there. He's neither silent nor a blank slate.

Olimar is also one of Nintendo's most fleshed out protagonists. He's neither silent nor a blank slate; some might even argue he's among the most fleshed out leads Nintendo has, especially for one that isn't from an RPG.

Robin is absolutely not a silent protagonist without personality, either. In fact, aside from gender, hair color, name, and build, Robin is very much a defined and unique character with a set story. They're honestly an avatar in name only compared to the likes of Steve or Villager.

Pac-Man also has a set personality and isn't silent, particularly in Pac-Man World 3 where he's very snarky and sarcastic.

Smash itself takes Subspace as canon when pertaining to R.O.B., so I'd also not call him a blank slate, silent as he may be. Similarly, Smash's portrayal of Wii Fit Trainer also plays up the fitness nut aspect of her. These two aren't much, but it's important to recognize that it's significantly more than Piranha Plant has.

That honestly goes for Joker, Hero, and Byleth as well. They're more traditional silent protagonists, yes, but they're also not devoid of personality in their home games, between Joker's possible dialogue choices, Byleth's stoicism and in-universe justification for it, and Hero having quite a few moments of levity in DQXI.



That's all to say that trying to gas up Piranha Plant as having "the same amount of personality as any other Nintendo character on the roster" is ludicrous. On the Nintendo side, quite literally the only other ones as devoid of a concrete personality are either ones that are Literally Animals (Pikachu, Pichu, Jigglypuff, Squirtle, Ivysaur, Charizard, Duck Hunt), or are actual blank slate avatars (Villager and Mr. Game & Watch...Steve would be here too if we counted third parties). And even then, most of these exhibit more of a personality than Plant does, particularly the Animal group.

 

[Janx_uwu]

So what you're saying is if a character dosen't have a personality, they shouldn't be in Smash.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

I don't know why you're all debating the point I brought up in passing as a half-joke and not my actual main argument about the dangers of design-by-committee and importance of individual creativity.

 

[GameArtist1993]

I've got loads of personal unpopular opinions (but important) related to Smash Bros. franchise as a whole:

• I don't like that the Donkey Kong fighters aren't being voiced by their original voice actors. I find it baffling that Takashi Nagasako voices Ganondorf in Ultimate, but not Donkey Kong. When will Takashi Nagasako voice Donkey Kong in a Smash Bros, only time will tell.
• World of Light could've been a much better Adventure Mode mixing elements from Melee's Adventure Mode, Brawl's subspace Emissary and Smash Run from SSB4 3DS
• Kamek and Black Shadow are characters I want to see most in Smash Bros since the ones that are rarely requested are the ones I support the most because at least they serve as prominent antagonists of their respective franchise and played a big role, at least Kamek was the caretaker of Bowser during the latter's childhood and Black Shadow at least was voiced by Norio Wakamoto from the anime. Norio Wakamoto is the REAL reason why I want Black Shadow in Smash Bros in the first so I can recreate the finale scene from the F-Zero anime's final episode where Black Shadow says his final words "Watashi wa shinen, shienzuu!" When people ask for characters who are commonly requested like Bandanna Waddle Dee, Waluigi etc. will they actually enjoy playing the character?
• Blood Falcon could've been an Echo Fighter of Captain Falcon
• The Yoshi series is unloved and underappreciated so it rightfully deserves better representation
• Certain fighters should be demoted into having non-playable roles like take for example, Jigglypuff. Demoting Jigglypuff as an Assist Pokemon than as a fighter seems more fitting since its role in the anime is always putting enemies to sleep.
• Final Smashes are wasted potential compared to Super Moves you see in games like Street Fighter, Tekken etc.
• I miss pre-Brawl Break the Targets
• I do not dislike the Black Yoshi alt, but Orange Yoshi would've been a better fit as it completes the colours of the rainbow
• I don't think Waluigi is ready to join Smash yet unless he appears in a Wario game due to him and Wario having a good relationship in Mario spin-off games
• I would like to see Under Night In-Birth get represented in Smash Bros someday so I can listen to Unknown Actors

 

[chocolatejr9]

I don't know why you're all debating the point I brought up in passing as a half-joke and not my actual main argument about the dangers of design-by-committee and importance of individual creativity.

THAT was the point you were trying to make?

 

[Schnee117]

I don't know why you're all debating the point I brought up in passing as a half-joke and not my actual main argument about the dangers of design-by-committee and importance of individual creativity.

"Actually I was just joking!" I say after getting pushback for saying something stupid.

THAT was the point you were trying to make?

It's not a good point to make about an IP crossover.
The artistic merit is limited to how the stuff they pick is presented, it has no bearing on what they actually pick unless we want to get into some art elitism thing where Character A has more "artistic merit" than Character B because the former isn't a super popular character.
It's dumb.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

So what you're saying is if a character dosen't have a personality, they shouldn't be in Smash.

This is putting words in their mouth.

They're saying that the characters who "don't have personality," do have defined personalities. A character doesn't automatically have more just because they're a cartoon, and I wish Smash fans would stop assuming that's what personality is.

Byleth being stoic is a personality. K. Rool being a goofy villain is a personality. Neither is more of a personality than the other. So the initial claim that Piranha Plant has more personality than the majority of the roster is dishonest.

 

[Opossum]

I don't know why you're all debating the point I brought up in passing as a half-joke and not my actual main argument about the dangers of design-by-committee and importance of individual creativity.

Because said claim was alarmingly off base and without backing, while being asserted as something plain to see. It read like trying to dishonestly prop up Piranha Plant in a way that doesn't fit.

 

[UserKev]

I've got loads of personal unpopular opinions (but important) related to Smash Bros. franchise as a whole:

• I don't like that the Donkey Kong fighters aren't being voiced by their original voice actors. I find it baffling that Takashi Nagasako voices Ganondorf in Ultimate, but not Donkey Kong. When will Takashi Nagasako voice Donkey Kong in a Smash Bros, only time will tell.
• World of Light could've been a much better Adventure Mode mixing elements from Melee's Adventure Mode, Brawl's subspace Emissary and Smash Run from SSB4 3DS
• Kamek and Black Shadow are characters I want to see most in Smash Bros since the ones that are rarely requested are the ones I support the most because at least they serve as prominent antagonists of their respective franchise and played a big role, at least Kamek was the caretaker of Bowser during the latter's childhood and Black Shadow at least was voiced by Norio Wakamoto from the anime. Norio Wakamoto is the REAL reason why I want Black Shadow in Smash Bros in the first so I can recreate the finale scene from the F-Zero anime's final episode where Black Shadow says his final words "Watashi wa shinen, shienzuu!" When people ask for characters who are commonly requested like Bandanna Waddle Dee, Waluigi etc. will they actually enjoy playing the character?
• Blood Falcon could've been an Echo Fighter of Captain Falcon
• The Yoshi series is unloved and underappreciated so it rightfully deserves better representation
• Certain fighters should be demoted into having non-playable roles like take for example, Jigglypuff. Demoting Jigglypuff as an Assist Pokemon than as a fighter seems more fitting since its role in the anime is always putting enemies to sleep.
• Final Smashes are wasted potential compared to Super Moves you see in games like Street Fighter, Tekken etc.
• I miss pre-Brawl Break the Targets
• I do not dislike the Black Yoshi alt, but Orange Yoshi would've been a better fit as it completes the colours of the rainbow
• I don't think Waluigi is ready to join Smash yet unless he appears in a Wario game due to him and Wario having a good relationship in Mario spin-off games
• I would like to see Under Night In-Birth get represented in Smash Bros someday so I can listen to Unknown Actors

I love long lists of unpopular opinions like this I do agree to an extend on your opinion regarding Waluigi. I don't agree that he isn't ready to join Smash. I say by next Smash will definitely be time for Waluigi. But at the same time I believe Birdo should be in Smash before Walu.

WoL was exceptionally fun the first time I played, I will NEVER! play again. I do believe Melee has the perfect basis for an Adventure Mode that formula should be used again. Yoshi isn't particularly unloved. The Yoshi series has gotten something new every installment. We just want more Yoshi representation.

 

[StrangeKitten]

As time has passed, I'm starting to not only appreciate Incineroar's inclusion more, but also think he's a more interesting fighter than Decidueye could have been.

Same here! Well, I've felt this way since a couple months or so after Ultimate's launch, but still. While Decidueye would be interesting, we have arrow users who can "fly" in Pit and Dark Pit. We didn't have a wrestler character, and not much in the way of grappling either.

 

[Laniv]

Peach needs a moveset overhaul more than Ganondorf. Honestly, she needs an overhaul more than half the characters people say need one.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

The only character from before Namco's reign who needs a full overhaul is Sonic, everyone else is overtuned or undertuned at worst, and a lot can be fixed with just one extra tool (Ganondorf floating for instance) - but once you get into the Namco games, things get real bad, almost to the point of comedy. Mega Man in particular strikes me as a character in need of a full revamp.

 

[Soy_Man]

Peach needs a moveset overhaul more than Ganondorf. Honestly, she needs an overhaul more than half the characters people say need one.

I don't really see why. I've always seen her as one of the more well designed and interesting characters in the roster.

Mega Man in particular strikes me as a character in need of a full revamp.

I'd say the same about megaman.

 

[Laniv]

It doesn't have to be anything big, something like what Pit got from Brawl to Smash 4 would suffice. I was just wondering why, from Melee to Smash 4, she used Toad as a meat shield and slammed her butt into people

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

I really don't like Peach's ass attack, but I think you could quite easily retheme it without changing the function - she gives Mario the P-Wing in 3, so there's an easy choice.

 

[UserKev]

Yeah. Peach feels like a very well designed and perfect character that should never be messed with. Ass attack is the only move you can get rid of if you want to avoid explicit reasons, which is a still overall very reliable move.

Bowser's moveset feels lazy to me. Up Smash should be different. Natural B should be fire balls.

 

[GamingFan1997]

Not sure if this is an unpopular opinion, but I feel that Sm4sh could've been an opportunity for the Smash Bros. series to go through a reboot of sorts, mainly in terms of remaking and refining previous characters' movesets to be more accurate to their games of origin (and to make the pre-existing clone characters more definitively distinct from their originals).

In terms of more definitively unpopular opinions, I feel that Ultimate's decision to bring back every character from a previous Smash Bros. game did more harm than good for the roster, particularly in terms of moveset diversity (did we really need three different versions of Link with more-or-less the exact same moveset?) and series representation (of the ten playable Pokémon in Ultimate, six of them are from Generation 1). Admittedly, this is more of an issue of the previous Smash Bros. rosters not really aging well rather than an issue with the decision to bring back all previous Smash Bros. characters on its own, but the point still stands. I have similar feelings about the choices for returning stages in Ultimate (we really didn't need both Green Hill and Windy Hill to return, but not only are they both here, but they're both the only Sonic stages available in Ultimate).

 

[Perkilator]

Not sure if this is an unpopular opinion, but I feel that Sm4sh could've been an opportunity for the Smash Bros. series to go through a reboot of sorts, mainly in terms of remaking and refining previous characters' movesets to be more accurate to their games of origin (and to make the pre-existing clone characters more definitively distinct from their originals).

In terms of more definitively unpopular opinions, I feel that Ultimate's decision to bring back every character from a previous Smash Bros. game did more harm than good for the roster, particularly in terms of moveset diversity (did we really need three different versions of Link with more-or-less the exact same moveset?) and series representation (of the ten playable Pokémon in Ultimate, six of them are from Generation 1). Admittedly, this is more of an issue of the previous Smash Bros. rosters not really aging well rather than an issue with the decision to bring back all previous Smash Bros. characters on its own, but the point still stands.

With Ganondorf in particular, I feel Sm4sh was the perfect opportunity to reuse Ganondorf’s OoT 3D design and give him a new moveset based around his abilities in that game, along with the trident used by Phantom Ganon and his Spaceworld 2000 sword.

As for the roster not aging well… I suppose that’s because hindsight is a harsh mistress.

 

[Aligo]

Bowser's moveset feels lazy to me. Up Smash should be different. Natural B should be fire balls.

How about tapping for fireballs and holding for fire breath? Bowser has used both since super mario 64, and makes heavy use of the fire breath in oddessy and the movie.

 

[fogbadge]

(did we really need three different versions of Link with more-or-less the exact same moveset?)

yes

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Smash Ultimate doesn't have the worst online experience for a first-party Switch title.

That honor goes to Best Multiplayer Game of 2022, Splatoon 3.

 

[fogbadge]

Smash Ultimate doesn't have the worst online experience for a first-party Switch title.

That honor goes to Best Multiplayer Game of 2022, Splatoon 3.

that’s due to the other people isn’t it?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

that’s due to the other people isn’t it?

The fact that literally 80% of the matches I did yesterday ended up with me being kicked out because most of the lobby can't have a good enough connection to actually play the game is definitely something that leaves a sour taste, imo.

Sure, the first three of them were me because somehow, my usually good connection decided to flip me off, but you can tell whose fault it is based on whether the game chalks it up as your loss or not. And then it kept happening but didn't count as a loss, meaning it was others.

 

[fogbadge]

The fact that literally 80% of the matches I did yesterday ended up with me being kicked out because most of the lobby can't have a good enough connection to actually play the game is definitely something that leaves a sour taste, imo.

Sure, the first three of them were me because somehow, my usually good connection decided to flip me off, but you can tell whose fault it is based on whether the game chalks it up as your loss or not. And then it kept happening but didn't count as a loss, meaning it was others.

Well I certainly won’t disagree the connections are as dodgy as ever

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Well I certainly won’t disagree the connections are as dodgy as ever

The thing is I've never had these issues nearly as often with Ultimate.

Yeah, I know that they replace the game with a CPU when against randoms who DC, but you can also tell when that happens because your GSP is unchanged when that happens and I don't recall seeing that nearly as often as me getting kicked out of games in Splatoon 3.

 

[fogbadge]

The thing is I've never had these issues nearly as often with Ultimate.

Yeah, I know that they replace the game with a CPU when against randoms who DC, but you can also tell when that happens because your GSP is unchanged when that happens and I don't recall seeing that nearly as often as me getting kicked out of games in Splatoon 3.

I’ve never had online issues with ultimate either. Min you I’ve never been online with ultimate

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I’ve never had online issues with ultimate either. Min you I’ve never been online with ultimate

Yeah, never going online would be a good way to never have online issues

 

[StrangeKitten]

I’m honestly really going to miss Piranha Plant if it gets cut. It just has such a strange and fun moveset. I’m going to have this weird, empty feeling wash over me once it’s been months and months and I still can’t play Plant.
Also, since we didn’t get Geno, and Plant brought a couple SMRPG references with it, it has kinda filled that Geno-shaped void for me. Probably a weird way to feel, but it’s how I feel.

Same goes for if Incineroar gets cut, but y’all could have probably guessed that if you’ve read any of the posts I’ve made where I’ve mentioned my love of Incineroar.

It’s to the point I really don’t want to see these two get cut, though I understand why it’s likely they will be.

 

[fogbadge]

I’m honestly really going to miss Piranha Plant if it gets cut. It just has such a strange and fun moveset. I’m going to have this weird, empty feeling wash over me once it’s been months and months and I still can’t play Plant.
Also, since we didn’t get Geno, and Plant brought a couple SMRPG references with it, it has kinda filled that Geno-shaped void for me. Probably a weird way to feel, but it’s how I feel.

Same goes for if Incineroar gets cut, but y’all could have probably guessed that if you’ve read any of the posts I’ve made where I’ve mentioned my love of Incineroar.

It’s to the point I really don’t want to see these two get cut, though I understand why it’s likely they will be.

what about peach’s smrpg references?

 

[StrangeKitten]

what about peach’s smrpg references?

I’m a fan of them! But Peach doesn’t click as well with me as Plant does, moveset-wise. Plus, we know she’s never getting cut