Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3: Fate of Two Worlds

[UltiMario]

Ok so here's a nerf I actually put thought into:

-No special moves during Shogenmu (whatever it's called) but you build meter.

No more Lightning Loop TODs.

People will find different loops/infinites if suddenly meter is no problem for zero.

 

[choknater]

i don't think zero needs nerfs lol

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

As opposed to Dante, Zero isn't full of hard knockdowns to nearly ignore hitstun scaling.

Prove me wrong if he could still combo the way he can now w/o lightning loop AND w/o a lot of assist dependence.

 

[L__]

meeeowwwwwww

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

meeeowwwwwww

 

[Brightside6382]

zero is a fun character to use, unlike metaknight.

I've played 10,000 matches with zero/dante, and I find new technology with them every week. What kind of teams are you guys using against zero? some of his matchups are just impossible for half of the cast

This game is going to boil down zero,viper,firebrand,dorm,dante/vergil, and about 5-6 other characters you guys know about quite well.

wesker mains are going to get exposed pretty bad. wesker against zero/firebrand/viper is hella hard for wesker. why not invest in time with those three characters?

lol, just ranting here, sorry.

I wouldn't say most of the matchups are unwinnable its just we need more character knowledge. The number of decent Zero's is on the rise so of course people are going to over react and say "LOL TOO GOOD CHAR huurrrr" Once we understand the char better the matchups will start to shift and Zero will be less intimidating. Look at Vanilla Phoenix and all the amazing counters people thought of in the span of a few months.

The game will have healthy variety for a long time considering the obscene amount of damage every single char does. Honestly that's a pretty ridiculous statement to make when every major has huge amounts of character variation. Just because WI consists of the same 3 teams doesn't mean the rest of the US does lol.

Also Wesker won't ever be exposed because he is still a very good character. A few bad matchups is hardly enough to write him off. Especially since only one of those characters is semi-common.

 

[Minato]

The way Zero is, I don't think he hurts the game at all. He's a strong character sure, but strong characters always (and usually intentionally) exist.
If I was forced to nerf Zero, the only thing I would think of is scale his Raikousen's damage more if it's like the second one in a combo.

If Lightning Loops really are a problem, then just make Raikousen during Sougenmu not cause soft knockdown or something.

Spoiler

Although I like the loop since it's one of the "technical" things I can do as Zero

But Brightside is right, players will just learn to deal with the matchup. Just like we do for every other game.

 

[mood4food77]

j. H does not cancel into anything, i've tried everything and it's his only move that doesn't cancel

 

[choknater]

as x-23 i've learned that a great thing to do in a neutral game (if charged neck slicers stop working) is spam crescent scythe canceled into diagonal talon dive because both are safe on block. pretty nice stuff

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

as x-23 i've learned that a great thing to do in a neutral game (if charged neck slicers stop working) is spam crescent scythe canceled into diagonal talon dive because both are safe on block. pretty nice stuff

But does it help approach Spiderman dancing at superjump high while hidden missles are after you?

 

[choknater]

no, i guess not haha

but in that situation i think i'd dance around low to the ground and try to punish doom assist when he comes out

x-23 is great at dodging missiles, her dash is the best

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Mirage Feint .

Smooth Criminal

 

[choknater]

good use of mirage feint can only be done with good lockdown. it loses to mashing light/mashing throw

if chars are super jumping, mixing them up from underneath with wavedashes and assists is pretty gdlk

for example, if flight characters are plink dashing to run away or approach, x-23's wd will very easily match their air speed.

 

[TL?]

Anyone use strider? I'm trying to get good with him as anchor.

 

[choknater]

i use him but my strider is still very bad

still not sure when to choose between just normally going in, choosing between various vajras, just normally throwing animals

 

[mood4food77]

how about formation b -> wall jump/vajra?

 

[Pikaville]

spencer is pretty brain dead, basically, once he gets going he's going on auto-pilot, more so than most characters, you can actually handle similarly to how you would zero except a bit easier as spencer doesn't have projectiles or the obnoxious mix-ups zero has, just watch out for good ones, he can kill every character starting from 1 meter (like vergil can), and yes you can air throw his zipline, just don't do it online, it's like zero's j. H, you can throw it but you have a very tight window to do so, so not worth it

zero' j. H isn't as good as people say it is because he can't cancel it into anything except for j. S (but he can cancel j. S into buster so watch out for that), it's just an obnoxious move because of the ****ing hitbox it covers (literally...a ball around him), he's an aerial character that vajra isn't a great choice against, he has to respect the assist but his respect is showing vajra a j. H (most characters can't do this), but a good zero shouldn't just approach with j. H, with dante's jam session, zero gets like a 5 way guess mix-up, it's really really REALLY hard to block

akuma on point is good, it's just his assist is so good that it's usually better to run him second, but since akuma is running akuma/sentinel/doom, he's fine (since just about anything is good with drones/missiles backing it up)

and akuma, we'll get that match in, i gotta do hw now and then class at 4:30 EST, so maybe if i'm done before then we can get our little set in (but highly doubtful)

Yeah grabbing Spencer online is stupid, it's so hard.

I don't use missile assist on my Akuma team, I use plasma beam.

I wonder if missiles would be better?

The beam is so good for teleporting through people and holding them on the ground in general while I try to crossup fireball/tatsu.

 

[mood4food77]

well, you already have drones right? having plasma beam/drones is kind of redundant

and yea, missiles work a lot better for lockdown purposes (overhead shenanigans) and akuma isn't too shabby on protecting assists

 

[sanchaz]

@ brightside: Who is going to stop zero? I understand firebrand/viper, but people like to play wesker. I wish people would play teams like firebrand/sentinel/strider. Thats a team that could possibly scare/stop zero.

@ TL: dude. have I met you before? do you go to nickel city tournaments? I live north from ya. Come to the milwaukee tourneys to complain about zero, :D

 

[TL?]

@ brightside: Who is going to stop zero? I understand firebrand/viper, but people like to play wesker. I wish people would play teams like firebrand/sentinel/strider. Thats a team that could possibly scare/stop zero.

@ TL: dude. have I met you before? do you go to nickel city tournaments? I live north from ya. Come to the milwaukee tourneys to complain about zero, :D

Probably not. I've been to a total of 1 smash tournament where I only entered the minus side tourney. I've been to 0 marvel tournies, might go to a chicago one sometime.

I don't really complain about zero. I play against him really often, so I kind of understand what he's up to even if it's still a tough matchup. I'm free to spencer though. lol

 

[mood4food77]

zero's way harder to deal with than spencer

spencer literally is just zipline, it's his only mix-up tool, albeit a pretty good one, but that's it, spencer also lacks any sort of anti-air move and other mix-ups really

seriously against spencer, call an anti-air assist and watch him die, he can't do **** against them

zero on the other hand.....he just doesn't give a ****

 

[TL?]

zero's way harder to deal with than spencer

spencer literally is just zipline, it's his only mix-up tool, albeit a pretty good one, but that's it, spencer also lacks any sort of anti-air move and other mix-ups really

seriously against spencer, call an anti-air assist and watch him die, he can't do **** against them

zero on the other hand.....he just doesn't give a ****

I wasn't trying to say which is harder in general. Just for me. I think you're being one of those theory monsters who drastically oversimplifies things. It's not as easy as spamming an anti air assist then win (against a good player anyways).

 

[mood4food77]

spencer can't do anything against jam session except bionic arm...literally

you call jam session, watch as spencer flails about trying to get around it, zone put **** everywhere on screen, run away from spencer, repeat

i'm still trying to think of a way of how spencer can truly get around jam session, certain assists might help but in general, spencer has no option to deal with jam session outside of wasting a meter and even then, that's not the smart thing to do

i'll come back with some answers though

 

[choknater]

can he attack dante directly using the straight zipline? i mean, that makes him vulnerable to the pt character but still

 

[mood4food77]

only if spencer is close to dante, zipline and the claw move are cancelled out by jam session

 

[Pikaville]

well, you already have drones right? having plasma beam/drones is kind of redundant

and yea, missiles work a lot better for lockdown purposes (overhead shenanigans) and akuma isn't too shabby on protecting assists

Hmmmmm, good point actually.

The scaling on the combo after the beam is annoying too.

Also would raging demon work on a character that is locked in blockstun from missiles?

Man now I have a bunch of ideas using missiles as an OTG to make longer Akuma combos.

Lots of testing needs to be done later when I get home. :D

 

[mood4food77]

raging demon is a grab so it wouldn't work, but it is easier to get the frame trap

 

[sanchaz]

I don't really complain about zero.

I need to fix this.

go to this tourney:

http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.ph...wn-prime-at-nickel-city-northbrook-il.155422/

I may go to this one or the one in minnesota. I might see ya.

 

[xFats]

all u nuggas are bootycheeks. see my skrull

 

[Brightside6382]

@ brightside: Who is going to stop zero? I understand firebrand/viper, but people like to play wesker. I wish people would play teams like firebrand/sentinel/strider. Thats a team that could possibly scare/stop zero.

@ TL: dude. have I met you before? do you go to nickel city tournaments? I live north from ya. Come to the milwaukee tourneys to complain about zero, :D

Good players will stop Zero. What I was saying was since he is slowly becoming a bigger threat people will find ways to deal with him. Matchups are developed over time. Just because people can't think of a solution in the first encounter doesn't mean they won't develop one in the future.

I'm not denying that Zero is a good character. The only thing I am annoyed by is that a lot of people just sit and complain instead of actually trying to learn the matchup.

Also @TL. If you live in Chicago I highly encourage you try and come out to our gatherings. We have 3 regular meetings during the week at various locations so you should try and make it out to some things.

 

[Pink Reaper]

You cant learn the match-up

Zero beats everything. Forever. j.H beats everything, even hyper beam, which is clearly the best move.

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

I think someone already said that in the thread.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[TL?]

I was at some get together thing at some bowling alley tonight lol. Maybe I could go to windy city showdown. I don't know yet if I'm working that day or not though. Mostly I just play at my school. I still need to learn to use strider too.

 

[sanchaz]

You cant learn the match-up

Zero beats everything. Forever. j.H beats everything, even hyper beam, which is clearly the best move.

standing launcher with some characters beats it. his best move is the buster. if zero didn't have it, he could be camped out pretty hard

 

[mood4food77]

buster is fine

it's the fact he can cancel any move into it that's really stupid

without that, he'd be a very strong character, like A tier, but not his "i don't give a **** about anything" tier

obviously the better player wins but the amount of **** zero can do is stupid and the fact that he's safe on block with anything he does is even dumber

at least i use firebrand, only character whose normals can compete with zero's

 

[Pikaville]

You cant learn the match-up

Zero beats everything. Forever. j.H beats everything, even hyper beam, which is clearly the best move.

Not sure if trolling but I already said that Akuma's shoruken beats it cleanly.

Sentinel's air.m beats it if spaced correctly too.

Nemesis' launcher and and deadly reach beat it too.

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

Iron Fist vs Zero

According to Brightside Iron Fist can win if he knows the matchup.

 

[mood4food77]

iron fist wins if it's justin wong

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

iron fist wins if it's justin wong

Player skill plays a considerable role in this game, but realistically, Zero against a lot of the cast is almost free.


S - Zero, Dante, Doom, Magneto, Viper
A - Wesker, Vergil, Firebrand, Dorm, Strider, Spencer, Ammy
B - Wolverine, Spiderman, MODOK, Felicia, Trish, Morrigan, Akuma

 

[mood4food77]

ahhh, no one knows about firebrand yet