Top ten at Apex 2013 predictions.

[The Star King]

Yo Hbox should utilize the YOYO GLITCH

Like for example he got a jab reset on the YS game, he could have done the YOYO GLITCH. But instead of doing so he just did a bthrow, which is less punishment than the YOYO GLITCH thanks to thunderjacket. I think YOYO GLITCH may be the edge he needs

 

[KrazyKnux]

hahaha i definitely agree on the YOYO GLITCH. I definitely hope he continues to try out Ness. That set was so hype, and I know for sure he could have had both of his first 2 matches - they were so close. Maybe a little bit more practice? And certainly more YOYO GLITCH.

 

[Sox]

I don't understand why he went ness over shiek. Was it because Fairs block bombs?

 

[KrIsP!]

Yo Hbox should utilize the YOYO GLITCH

Like for example he got a jab reset on the YS game, he could have done the YOYO GLITCH. But instead of doing so he just did a bthrow, which is less punishment than the YOYO GLITCH thanks to thunderjacket. I think YOYO GLITCH may be the edge he needs

I definitely think you need to be more subtle...

I could come up with theories as to why he went Ness other than for hype but he'd need to answer it himself. If he did go a top tier and won though, he'd just get cped and either have to play peach vs. non-puff or puff ylink and it would come down making sure you win the counter pick battle. Armada may have been more inclined to play the MU the same way he was for awhile. Not to mention the fact that he apparently uses up to jump and z to attack. Ness might fit into that playstyle for him and besides, Armada has practiced against top tiers with ylink and I doubt HBoxs shiek would be the best one you ever saw, while on the other hand, Ness was a match up he didn't know. I don't think Ness was enough for what I now want to call the Blitzkrieg(those bombs dropping so fast) as a character but he did some amazing things with his shield(which Ness has a pretty good shield compared to his height) and how he got those many grabs I do not know, cause grabbing someone zipping around with ness is like....yeah.

 

[Mahone]

I don't understand why he went ness over shiek. Was it because Fairs block bombs?

i think something A LOT of people are overlooking is the fact that armada has probably not practiced the ness mu


if hbox chooses a top tier character, even if armada hasn't specifically practiced against that character (although im sure hes prepared for sheik and most of the other top tiers), armada will understand the character much more because he has played AS and AGAINST all the top tiers for YEARS...


so by picking a character like ness, he will be far less familiar as to how the mu goes and what ness' weak ness' and strengths are

i'm not sure if ness will work next time though, now that armada can prepare for that mu


also, it wouldnt surprise me if armada did train the ness mu since he was aware that hbox had a secondary ness

but that doesn't change the fact that he can't really know how ylink vs ness mu works at high level, since i doubt any ness is close to hbox's level in europe





@edit: **** krisp's edit sorta said what i said but whatevs

also, i think hbox should use marth instead, that way he has some sort of chance of winning game 1 if he double blinds and is forced to face armada's peach

 

[MaskedMarth]

I think it's incorrect, as a Jigglypuff main with no competitive secondary, to choose Ness as the character to level up to beat Young Link.

But I dunno that it went down like that. Many smashers enjoy having a low-tier secondary and Hbox might've picked up Ness for that reason. Then, when time came to prepare for Armada's Young Link, Ness was available so why not? Plus Ness vs. Young Link in top Melee--who wouldn't want to see that?

I suspect Sheik/Fox/Falco would be a better answer than Ness to Armada's Young Link, but Hbox is not known for being character flexible. Maybe he needed to find a character that gelled with him and Ness was the best fit.

Or maybe it was the surprise factor. A lot of speculation. It would be interesting to hear the story from Hungrybox himself.

EDIT: I think (besides Puff of course) Captain Falcon is the best character for Hbox to use if he wants a shot at beating both Young Link and Peach.

 

[Mahone]

oh i forgot about falcon, ya thats REALLY good in that situation

 

[leffen]

The main reason that Hbox picked Ness is that he wanted the crowd to be on his side. He would have won otherwise, but he preferred to have the crowd on his side even if he had to sacrifice winning for it.

Armada would not have stood a chance against a one week sheik/falco but to be fair Hbox should've won the second game but armada got lucky as FUUUUUUUCK and that definitely changed the outcome of the entire set.

 

[Sox]

The main reason that Hbox picked Ness is that he wanted the crowd to be on his side. He would have won otherwise, but he preferred to have the crowd on his side even if he had to sacrifice winning for it.

I don't believe that at all. he is a competitor as much as you are, and he is more than used to people cheering against him. I think he did it because he thought he could win, but personally i think shiek is a better option. I cant speak for him, tho

 

[leffen]

He posted something along the lines of "Maybe its time for me to move on with my life" shortly after apex, and then later posted:

Crowd actually cheering for me felt too good. Eff it, let's go to Genesis 3 / EVO. See everyone in July.


Trust me, he did it for the crowd.

 

[iRobinhoood]

The main reason that Hbox picked Ness is that he wanted the crowd to be on his side. He would have won otherwise, but he preferred to have the crowd on his side even if he had to sacrifice winning for it.

I doubt this especially with the amount of money on the line.

 

[leffen]

yeah mango has never done anything like it with money on the line



O WAIT

 

[Divinokage]

Leffen, I'm going to own you next time!

 

[Sox]

yeah mango has never done anything like it with money on the line



O WAIT

Leffen, im a fan of yours, but i still disagree about hbox doing it for the crowd. Sure, he liked it, it's out of the ordinary for him. but at such a large US event im sure the crowd would be behind him with any char he chose. He takes losses hard, and I dont think that having the support gave him more satisfaction than winning the match would. Again, I could be wrong, I dont speak for him, but I dont think that was what he was doing.
Also, mango and HBox are so different in nearly every way.

 

[leffen]

but at such a large US event im sure the crowd would be behind him with any char he chose..

u're either a very funny or stupid guy

the crowd cheered for ME when I was playing against him, lol.

 

[Europhoria]

That's checkmate lol

 

[Keblerelf]

Leffen, you would have been the hero of Apex if you knocked hbox into losers.

Hbox should go ganon against young link.

 

[leffen]

I was terrible at apex for a number of reasons that won't ever ****ing happen again.

next time im gonna body all of you.

 

[Sox]

I was cheering for you too. everyone expected hbox to beat a fox... the fact you made it so close was damn impressive. I dont think too many americans wanted armada to win it all, and hbox was one of the few that could legitimately beat him.

 

[Yeerk]

@leffen says the guy who claimed he wouldn't john also, people want to cheer against the previous european 1st of Apex, not the european 33rd. you were more of an underdog in the match, crowd loves that.

 

[ShroudedOne]

I don't think he's johning...he just sets high expectations for himself.

Idk though, maybe

 

[leffen]

im not johning, im telling you that me losing was 95% my own fault, and I've learned from these mistakes and they won't be a factor next time. I sucked at apex, but I learned a lot. Next time I'm gonna destroy Hbox, Javi... just wait.

 

[oukd]

i honestly thought you were gonna beat javi before the set started lol. oh well

fun tournament ~_~
players that surprised me the most: m2k, shroomed, silent wolf, GUCCI

 

[leffen]

omg gucci is soooo good

I really hope he comes back year, japans melee scene has just been revived recently and its already hella strong.

 

[smopup]

+1 to rooting for Leffen. That set with Hungrybox was incredibly tight. I was so pissed when the stream went down, lol. You came so close to shaking up the bracket drastically. Looking forward to seeing how you play at future tournaments.

 

[t3h Icy]

It's interesting that had Leffen finished off Hungrybox, he would have played Overtriforce or Armada next, clinching 5th for either Over or Leffen (both very cool results). Perhaps Leffen would have even beaten Armada and made it to WFs.

Hungrybox would also have pulled Javi, Axe, and Hax all back a ranking too (most likely).

Another really interesting bit is that Ice defeated Tope twice in Pools, but lost to him in Losers'.

Also, all of the players in top 12 were 1st seeds in their pool, except Vwins who actually got 3rd.

And Dr.PP vs Armada was extremely similar to Smashers' Reunion, where Armada won WFs with a clean sweep, lost last game to PP in GF1, and then took him out in the 2nd last game of GF2.

There's lots of random junk and facts for anyone bored enough, lol.

 

[Beat!]

I don't think it's completely unlikely that Hbox picked up Ness with the crowd at least partly in mind, despite his otherwise competitive mindset. I mean, we're talking about the guy who's received more hate for his character choice and playstyle than any other player in Melee history. The crowd ALWAYS cheers against him, even against foreign players. Finally getting to hear a huge crowd cheer FOR him must've felt like a dream come true lol.

That being said, Armada has tons of Sheik practice thanks to Android, and iirc he did pretty decent against PC Chris' Fox last year, so I'm not sure if either of those characters would've cut it. I think Falcon might've been a good choice.

I really hope Hbox doesn't "move on with his life" just yet, if he's considering it. A lot of people may not realize it, but his passion and general attitude towards the game is great for the community. I also happen to find his Puff enjoyable to watch, but I realize I'm probably in a minority in that regard lol.

Keep it real, Hbox.

 

[t3h Icy]

The thing is that Hbox isn't a particularly technical player, and might not be able to play Falcon/Fox/Falco to fast standards. But maybe he could get away with that due to his smarts.

I think Hbox's best chance of winning is to stick to Puff. Ness came close twice, but Armada will be better prepared for it next time I imagine.

At the end of game 4, I'm not sure why Hbox went for a rest when he had a percent lead. If he followed with Bair instead and then ran away, it may have been more successful.

All that said, Hbox finally landed Rest (twice too) on Armada's Young Link, which is showing some improvement.

 

[TheZhuKeeper]

Someone should just personally ask hbox rather than speculate over very minimal data!!!

 

[Beat!]

It's interesting that had Leffen finished off Hungrybox, he would have played Overtriforce or Armada next, clinching 5th for either Over or Leffen (both very cool results). Perhaps Leffen would have even beaten Armada and made it to WFs.

Hungrybox would also have pulled Javi, Axe, and Hax all back a ranking too (most likely).

Another really interesting bit is that Ice defeated Tope twice in Pools, but lost to him in Losers'.

Also, all of the players in top 12 were 1st seeds in their pool, except Vwins who actually got 3rd.

And Dr.PP vs Armada was extremely similar to Smashers' Reunion, where Armada won WFs with a clean sweep, lost last game to PP in GF1, and then took him out in the 2nd last game of GF2.

There's lots of random junk and facts for anyone bored enough, lol.

The similarity to SRMG is actually even closer than that.

SR WF/GF went 4-0, 3-4, 2-4
Apex WF/GF went 3-0, 2-3, 1-3

Pretty crazy.

 

[Mahone]

isn't that exactly what he said?

 

[Beat!]

That it is. I must've missed his last sentence lol. MY BAD.

 

[leffen]

The thing is that Hbox isn't a particularly technical player, and might not be able to play Falcon/Fox/Falco to fast standards. But maybe he could get away with that due to his smarts.

I think Hbox's best chance of winning is to stick to Puff. Ness came close twice, but Armada will be better prepared for it next time I imagine.

At the end of game 4, I'm not sure why Hbox went for a rest when he had a percent lead. If he followed with Bair instead and then ran away, it may have been more successful.

All that said, Hbox finally landed Rest (twice too) on Armada's Young Link, which is showing some improvement.

Im trying so hard not to john ****ing hell.

im so mad at a certain group of people, and one guy in particular

jesus ****

 

[t3h Icy]

Im trying so hard not to john ****ing hell.

im so mad at a certain group of people, and one guy in particular

Is it Leffen?

 

[TaFoKiNtS]

Mikehaggar or tafokints

 

[leffen]

neither

im just gonna stop, sorry.

im ****ing gonna win for sure next time, thats all im saying

 

[ZetTroxX]

Do it mother****er! I wanted you to play Armada sooo bad. Your Fox + NTSC advantage vs Armada...I want to see that next time!

Btw I´ve heard you took a set from Armada recently? Where and when did that happen? Has the set been uploaded?

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I've thought for about half a year now that leffen's Fox playstyle is optimal

He just doesn't have the smarts of the top 5, or at least he hasn't shown it yet

 

[Beat!]

Do it mother****er! I wanted you to play Armada sooo bad. Your Fox + NTSC advantage vs Armada...I want to see that next time!

Btw I´ve heard you took a set from Armada recently? Where and when did that happen? Has the set been uploaded?

leffen's never taken a tournament set off Armada. I know the commentators during leffen's set with DJN (D1 and G$ I think?) were the ones who said it, but they were wrong.

They did, however, play a VERY close WF set at a swedish regional (Beauty) right before Apex, with leffen leading 3-2 and almost winning before Armada squeezed out a 4-3 victory. Not recorded, unfortunately.


Edit: leffen has beaten Armada in teams. That might be where the misunderstanding comes from.

 

[ZetTroxX]

Now I see. Thank you.