The Unity Ruleset: Discussion

[Deleted member]

Wait, why are we discussing MK bans here? We all know that's not allowed in this sub-forum. Take it to the social group, guys, you can find the link to it in my profile.

Come on, guys. The discussion isn't allowed here, so let's not push it to the point of warnings or infractions.

You can find a link to the group in my profile as well.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

That's silly. It's perfectly feasible. It's not like the MK problem is going to go away by itself.

No, it really isn't that simple. But I'm not going to further discuss Pro/Anti Ban arguments in this thread. This not the time, nor the place. So:

Topic change time.

 

[DRDN]

Whens the next update to the unity ruleset?

 

[MK26]

i think they said after genesis

EDIT: this means that there are guaranteed to be no changes until genesis

 

[DRDN]

so essentially all TOs using the unity ruleset only have an Idea of what their rules will be... that cant be good for advertising

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

We don't have an update ready and waiting...if there is an update that will happen, it will occur after Genesis.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

We are not making any changes to the Unity Ruleset until after Genesis 2 (July 15th-18th). With so many major tournaments that have taken place since the last change and the ones that have yet to happen, we feel it would be best to give people a chance to adjust to these new changes. But as ESAM stated we don't have anything waiting in the wings. We haven't actively discussed anything because of that. Always looking for new things to deliberate on however.


@DRDN: Wait what? It's worst for "advertising" if we make changes every week.

 

[MK26]

yeah, i worded that wrong <_<

 

[Tesh]

^^ive been told that the second option is possible

the problem isnt the voting, its the fact that discussion will always devolve into trolling and flaming, creating a headache for the mods
the previous four ban discussions required basically 24/7 attention from the mod team

This is just a really dumb justification for banning discussion. There is plenty of flaming and trolling in the tier list thread and the matchup thread. Maybe those discussions shouldn't exist. I've already gone over simple solutions to fix this sort of thing.

With Smash 4 announced, anti-ban sees how much time is left on the clock and they are ready to play patient for a couple of years.

 

[DRDN]

Im saying you guys are changing it a lot it feels like the ruleset itself wasntg finished when you released it and your patching the hell out of it

Everything should have been pounded out and then changed MAYBE 2 times a year max

I know if I were a TO I would like to have my Info known and available to alll who think about coming and forcing people to use this ruleset and constantly changing it is very counter productive in trying to draw a crowd

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I agree DRDN. However, at the time of the first release, we had to agree on all the stages that were there. Only after the ruleset was released could we discuss adding/removing stages, which is why Pictochat was removed. We were torn between a 5 and 7 starter stage list, and since there was more negative than positive responses, we discussed that again. The cards were necessary as a punishment instead of "Seeing as the TO see fit" so that was reasonable as well.

 

[ElDominio]

Is the IP address thing not possible?

TWiNK knows how useless an IP limit is.
So while it may be entirely possible, it is completely useless.
Like ledge grab limits.
And that odd MK rule.

 

[MK26]

@iblis: im unsure of the ip thing (though its probably easily dodged) but the 'no voting unless you had 100 posts by x date' thing is definitely doable

 

[John12346]

^ B10n1c is capable of creating a filter like that; he told me himself. He's tied up in some other matters at the moment tho, so maybe later? Although a community vote would also fall under the category of "maybe later," with a huge emphasis on maybe, and by maybe, I mean probably not. -___ -;

Also, doing an IP check on the 4th ban vote's results would definitely be a legitimate option. Since there was no restriction to IP addresses, naturally people would just use the same IP address instead of going through the trouble of making a new individual IP address for each account. All we really have to do is check for the number of unique IP addresses that have voted for each side.

Counting it up by hand is a monstrous task; I tried, by using the criteria of "users who signed up before August 2009 and currently have 100+ posts or more," and gave up before I finished the second line of users... we're gonna have to call in a favor on this one...

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

idk why john#s, but that ending just gave me that feeling of epic about to go down.

... we're gonna have to call in a favor on this one...

seriously, i feel like going out and kicking *** after reading that. and i seriously don't know why

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I still don't see why you'd want to go through all that trouble. But no one is going to stop you if you do.

 

[John12346]

Well, I mean maybe there's some way a site coder could make it so moderators have the ability to change "Members that voted" to "IP addresses that voted," then just copy paste the whole list to me and I could sort it out from there...

That's what I meant by a favor...

And Maharba, you probably heard that phrase from some movie involving the mafia. That's probably what provoked your reaction, lol.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Okay but what about the households that actually have multiple SWF users under the same roof; using the same computer?

 

[Grim Tuesday]

They are a minority and if they feel strongly about it, I'm sure they can access another computer.

 

[Tesh]

I'm pretty sure I could just go to my local library and have access to alot of computers to vote with.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

they are not a minority you. the majority of texas brawlers either live with at the very least 1 other person that is active on here. and so does a lot of california. and im sure if you asked other states you would find most of the brawlers are roomated in some way or other. also iirc there is only one computer in mexico so you'd completely take their vote out (if i have to point out that the last sentence was a joke.....)

but in all seriousness a lot of brawlers are college room mates

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I'm pretty sure I could just go to my local library and have access to alot of computers to vote with.

So... you'd have to create a new account for each computer.

I doubt that anyone would be willing to do that to a large enough extent to affect results.

they are not a minority you. the majority of texas brawlers either live with at the very least 1 other person that is active on here. and so does a lot of california. and im sure if you asked other states you would find most of the brawlers are roomated in some way or other. also iirc there is only one computer in mexico so you'd completely take their vote out (if i have to point out that the last sentence was a joke.....)

but in all seriousness a lot of brawlers are college room mates

A lot =/= majority. I'm sure that a lot of players are room-mated with other players.

HOWEVER, even more players are either living by themself or living with other people who either don't play Smash or don't play it competitively.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

grim aren't you located in like, australia? btw since this only counts for us/ca/mex literally NO1 else from other countries not listed should even come close to remotely having a say in this vote if for some reason they currently do. and i honestly believe that in the US more smashers live together than those that still live at home and the very few who live completely by themself

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Why wouldn't Australia get a say in the vote? We are part of the community too, lol.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

the unity ruleset doesn't apply to australia. it specifically said only the us/ca/mex are being put under the unity ruleset. that means no europe, no australia, no asia. i mean don't get this the wrong way, im not implying you other countries aren't part of the community, im saying since you guys aren't affected by the unity ruleset, you shouldn't have a say as you would only be throwing off wat those who are actually affected by it want.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Maharba...you fail to realize that the BBR-RC isn't going to do another vote, so this whole discussion is moot right?

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

oh. i thought i read somewhere that they were voting on something. touche then good sir. must've misread it

 

[WindMajor]

Nobody is voting for anything. The status quo hasn't changed.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

You guys started talking about it...talking about recounting the votes and ****. I didn't say anything. Hell, if anything, I said WE AREN'T going to ban MK, not we are going to discuss it >_>

 

[Reizilla]

People do dumb things when they're desperate.

Just let them wallow in whatever it is they're supposed to wallow in.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

the unity ruleset doesn't apply to australia. it specifically said only the us/ca/mex are being put under the unity ruleset. that means no europe, no australia, no asia. i mean don't get this the wrong way, im not implying you other countries aren't part of the community, im saying since you guys aren't affected by the unity ruleset, you shouldn't have a say as you would only be throwing off wat those who are actually affected by it want.

Majority of the other countries in the world still follow the Unity ruleset (or a very similar variation), even though they have no obligation to.

A major change like an MK ban would apply to more places than just US/CA/Mex

 

[xDD-Master]

Majority of the other countries in the world still follow the Unity ruleset (or a very similar variation), even though they have no obligation to.

A major change like an MK ban would apply to more places than just US/CA/Mex

No, JUST no.

Other North American countires isnt "Majority of the other countries" wtf.

Europe alone, which has at least 5 active countries and Japan both won't ban him and use there own (better ) rulesets.

 

[Tesh]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTnly7rFOfw&feature=related

is this stalling?

 

[John12346]

Way to misread.

Grim meant that countries OTHER than NA countries use the Unity Ruleset...

Also Tesh no way that is stalling. Sonic couldn't even keep the walljumps going for more than 10 seconds, although I'm pretty sure he could keep up a perma-HA stall in there...

 

[Life]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTnly7rFOfw&feature=related

is this stalling?

I'd guess no, because Sonic can't do it for very long and he risks the stage flipping while he does if he's not careful.


/hope3

 

[xDD-Master]

Grim meant that countries OTHER than NA countries use the Unity Ruleset...

And which?

 

[John12346]

Why are you asking me? Grim was the one who brought it up.

He doesn't live in this country, so I'm pretty sure he'd know at least one non-NA country that follows the Unity Ruleset...

Also, whether other countries end up following the Unity Ruleset or not, it in no way makes a MK ban any more or less warranted. The countries that follow our ruleset will continue to do so, and the ones that do not will continue to not do so. It's like saying we need to model our stagelist around Japan's stagelist or vice-versa. We just have to create rules that we as NA'ers feel are best.

 

[Tesh]

InCom , you don't die if the stage flips when you are in those spots.

 

[xDD-Master]

It's like saying we need to model our stagelist around Japan's stagelist or vice-versa. We just have to create rules that we as NA'ers feel are best.

Thats true, as long you don't want other countries to accept it sooner or later.

It's pretty sure, that EU won't follow it, as long as RC/Brinstar (Both of them, one would may be ok) are legal.

So yeah. If expanding out of NA isnt one of the goals, then you really shouldnt


Maybe EU would at least accept everything except this.

 

[John12346]

Grim said that other countries use Unity with slight variation... maybe Europe uses the entire Unity Ruleset minus Brinstar as a legal stage?