The Unity Ruleset: Discussion

[Grim Tuesday]

I dislike fighting low tiers with any character...

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I dislike fighting high tiers with any characters.

Except Snake and Diddy.

Especially when the Diddy has poor item control.

 

[Atomsk_92]

There is nobody that plays D3 at a top level anymore. Coney quit, Atomsk uses him for Snake only (or maybe some other MUs D3 destroys), and there aren't any that use him efficiently other than those 2 (in america)

Anything that isn't Sonic, MK, Falco, Diddy, Olimar, ICs, GW.


I remember taking money from you in MMs with DDD tho

 

[Atomsk_92]

Btw DDD isn't bad. Just almost everyone that plays him is.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Then help us get better.

 

[Atomsk_92]

Just watch what Coney or I do and copy it, mix in your own style to some degree, don't be stupid, react fast to situations, and choose good options. Boom you're better now.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Wow magic.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rxjPtjJkkk

a real game

 

[infiniteV115]

...

...


You main Zamus.

You effortlessly beat all of my characters.

It's like MK except I don't know the MU because nobody plays the goddamn character.

Don't get me started about ******** characters.

That's because the only characters that ZSS "effortlessly beats" are terrible characters XD

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

doesn't zss lose to squirtle? by a lot? or is that old zss mu thread?

 

[M@v]

In most mus, DDD either hard counters the **** out of you or gets destroyed. He has a lot less "closer" matches than a lot of people.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

DDD either hard counters the **** out of you or gets destroyed.

Wrong.

We go even with Peach for one.

We don't hard counter Snake.

We aren't hard countered by Pit.

There are lots more.

*EDIT* Either you edited or I just didn't read your post all the way, lol.

 

[MJG]

Then help us get better.

Just watch what Coney or I do and copy it, mix in your own style to some degree, don't be stupid, react fast to situations, and choose good options. Boom you're better now.

Wow magic.

Sad but true

 

[Supreme Dirt]

It'd help if there were more matches against Olimar and such though.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

why would you ever go DDD against olimar dirt? i thought you used a bunch of chars?

 

[MJG]

Coney has matches up against oli. It doesn't look like a fun MU tho

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I use , , , and .

I've dropped most other chars for various reasons. Mostly because I'm actually serious about getting better now so I'm trying to focus on just a few.

I might pick up Snake... but he's just so boring to play as.

 

[Atomsk_92]

Wrong.

We go even with Peach for one.

We don't hard counter Snake.

We aren't hard countered by Pit.

There are lots more.

*EDIT* Either you edited or I just didn't read your post all the way, lol.

DDD ***** peach, goes even with Snake, and beats Pit. Anyone that thinks otherwise is dumb AND THAT'S MY ARGUEMENT RAWR!

 

[Supreme Dirt]

DDD ***** peach, goes even with Snake, and beat Pit. Anyone that thinks otherwise is dumb AND THAT'S MY ARGUEMENT RAWR!

I'm really gonna need this explained to me at some point, I struggle with the MU so much.

 

[Jimmyfosho]

Edit: slow iPod connection fuuu

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

i argue it atomsk. i argue that pit soft counters DDD and that pit has the +2. and im not dumb either. i have MU experiance, unfortunately not against you or coney. however if you would like to discuss the MU with me and mayb turn my opinion (or vice versa) we can discuss it either in the DDD vs Pit MU thread that was never finished (due to lack of DDDs with experiance joining the discussion) or we can do via PM or we can do it in this thread for all i care. i legitly wanna discuss D3 vs pit with you so please hit me up on that since you're the only D3 on here that has experiance against pit AND is good at this game.

 

[infiniteV115]

doesn't zss lose to squirtle? by a lot? or is that old zss mu thread?

Can't say much about this MU cause I have no experience with it. But we have a GR CG on squirtle as well as GR --> uair.
According to MU chart, ZSS doesn't lose to anyone below her, on the previous or current tier list.

But I figure our general range gives us an advantage.

 

[DeLux]

Please direct your matchup discussions to the appropriate thread.

This is the Rulesset discussion

 

[Supreme Dirt]

lol how'd we even get to this topic anyways.

brb checking what we were discussing that led to this.

*EDIT* Ah yes Norfair.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

okay. i remember somewhere a long time ago i had read that she loses to falco and squirtle 70:30. i never could really believe the squirtle one but never asked either. im gonna go look it up real quick and see if i can post the link.

edit #1: oh yeah

norfair is legit and should be legal if only because it completely changes some MUs for chars thus making it a true counterpick stage due to many characters benefitting from the aspects of this stage. pit for example can mirror shield lava wall for 3 hits and effectively hide inside of it for several seconds. he can also mirror the plumes by slanting the mirror up while inside the plume. not to mention WOI platform cancel and wing refresh make him mobile as ****, then he has all his jumps, a glide, and another WOI. not to mention that platform mechanics benefit pit due to the high amount of shield push they have or the fact that 3 of his moves eat through shields for breakfast and can force people off of a platform. then his fall through sharked uairs and nairs and trick bairs for early kill and gimps also rock thanks to platform mechanics. so in the end he is a highly mobile ultra defense unit with a controllable projectile and perfectly applied moveset to the stage as well as the 8 ledges to plank on if necessary and has one of the strongest bairs in the game that is good on stages with platforms especially with wing refresh mobility behind it.

that is why i am super biased for this stage to be legal. it allows pit to destroy a lot of differant characters and actually compete with the likes of wario, maybe even help against MK but im not sure. anyways i also know that it helps other characters.

 

[DeLux]

lol how'd we even get to this topic anyways.

brb checking what we were discussing that led to this.

*EDIT* Ah yes Norfair.

The current stance of the BBR-RC is that Norfair is not on the legal stagelist for the Unity Rulesset.

There are no current ongoing discussions to change its legality status and it will remain banned until further notice.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Well I guess any tournament I run won't follow the Unity Ruleset then.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

i just got ****ing infracted for that last post.

**** you bro.

edit:
i collect expired infractions

 

[SaveMeJebus]

Why does the loser of a match get the advantage by getting to not only choose his character after the opponent, but also getting to choose the stage?

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Why does the loser of a match get the advantage by getting to not only choose his character after the opponent, but also the stage?

Because the way counterpicking is supposed to make the match work is

Game 1: stage doesn't affect MU
Games 2 and 3: stage skews MU in one direction or the other.


Which doesn't work anymore because character CPing appears to be the new big thing.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

Why can't players just strike down to three stages (five in best of five sets) and use those stages to play out their set?

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Because that's not how the set works.

Because maybe characters who do poorly on a wide stagelist are bad characters.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

It doesn't seem to be working the way things are now

 

[Supreme Dirt]

That's because Metaknight is legal.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

I don't want to turn this into an MK argument. The players get to strike down to their best stages. This doesn't give anyone a huge advantage and their should be no reason for anyone to get such a huge advantage.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

No they don't.

Characters get to strike down to the stages which neither they nor their opponents excel on.

Also over the course of a set there is no huge advantage.

One game is biased in either character's favour, effectively canceling each other out.

There is no default stage in Brawl so this is how we deal with that.

 

[Zankoku]

Mechanically speaking, there is nothing wrong with minimizing the impact of the stage on the character match-up. It's just not objectively an improvement, either.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

The day Brawl changes to have stages with as little impact as possible on MUs is the day I quit Brawl.

 

[Zankoku]

You should've quit the moment the Smash Dojo announced that Battlefield was a returning stage, then.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Except I like Battlefield because it impacts MUs.

There are no stages in the game that do not bias any MUs.