The Unhappy Thread

[Holder of the Heel]

I don't believe the legal system is in place to give just desserts, it's their to mitigate crime as a force to take into account when considering to do illegal actions. In other words, simply a deterrent for those outside of the courtroom/jail. The "will" of the individual matters little in the face of this truth.

That being said, I understand what the lawyer is saying. The intent is actually really important in terms of the length of sentence and the punishment. It is imperative that we don't teach society that killing and doing other illegal things is okay if you are under the impression it is, but it is also imperative to distinguish between people who are a danger to society and those who must be sentenced for the sake of keeping that order.


At any rate, whether I am a defense attorney or a prosecuting attorney, I will definitely work whatever angle I can get. On the subject of that, I do feel being a defense attorney would be best, and fits my personality more.

 

[Teran]

At any rate, whether I am a defense attorney or a prosecuting attorney, I will definitely work whatever angle I can get. On the subject of that, I do feel being a defense attorney would be best, and fits my personality more.

It takes a special kind of person to do that. It's very easy from a detached point to say you can pick holes and play with technicalities to defend your client, I mean I'm sure if you know full well the person was innocent it would be no problem, but the real money goes to defending those who are obviously guilty, and are the kind of people that ruin countless lives.

Like I said, it takes someone special not to care at all and work as hard as they can to get these people back on the streets instead of in jail.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

...you do realize that there is carpet cleaner out there at your local grocery store that could've got that blood out, right?

Spray paint is only going to compound the issue. Good luck finding a hue that'll much the exact color of the carpet, and good luck trying to make that patch of carpet look like anything but.

My advice? Take your lumps. You don't wanna make this any worse than what it is. Talk to your landlord, and tell him what happened. Be honest.

In other news, my back is royally ****ed. Been in bed the past couple of days for the most part with bags of frozen vegetables affixed to my spine. I think I tore or strained some muscles around the middle of my back; every time I stand up, or even if I shift in an odd way, that area of my back seizes up and contracts painfully. I guess I wasn't used to all of the backbreaking labor I took part in to pave way for my company's president. Thankfully, my sister is a sort of understudy to a chiropractic clinic. She demonstrated various stretches and methods to alleviate my pain and mitigate any long-term damage to my back.

That was the source of my frustration with my job, by the by. Yes, I know, ****'s gotta look real nice for the president. But, why in the hell are we carrying all this preparation out like we're chickens with our heads cut off? We had plenty of notice, little over a damn week. There really shouldn't be this frenetic air, this sense of urgency, that propels management to issue gimlet stares and encourage incautious haste. Not to say that's what caused my injury or anything---I will openly admit that being out of shape contributed a lot to it---but the ****ing pressure that the upper echelons put on (chiefly, the store manager) felt ridiculous. The worst part was that it wasn't just me; my peers, and even my immediate supervisors, they were also exasperated and distraught much like myself! Add on to the fact that the same upper management core wanted the most inane tasks performed (seriously, who the **** scrubs a part of the building with a brush, some paper towels, and some cleaner when it's going to be pressure washed anyway?), stupid chores that actually harmed our efficiency and cohesion in a lot of ways (detracting ultimately from what actually needed to get done), and it's a maligned buncha people you got staffed that might **** up according to your incessant worrying.

My job also made me file worker's comp forms this morning, since it was technically an on-the-job injury. I felt kinda bad doing it, but I understand the legalities behind it. Thankfully, I didn't have to visit a chiropractor proper, as my previously mentioned sister saw to the lion's share of the care I needed in instruction and the nurse I spoke to thought those methods were sound and safe enough to ensure bed rest for recovery. Which is good, 'cause specialists like that hit my wallet really hard, and I can't afford that right now.

I am feeling better than I have been for the past couple days, but I'm still not quite there yet. Hopefully I can go back to work in a couple days.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Holder of the Heel]

It takes a special kind of person to do that. It's very easy from a detached point to say you can pick holes and play with technicalities to defend your client, I mean I'm sure if you know full well the person was innocent it would be no problem, but the real money goes to defending those who are obviously guilty, and are the kind of people that ruin countless lives.

Like I said, it takes someone special not to care at all and work as hard as they can to get these people back on the streets instead of in jail.

Don't misunderstand, I wouldn't even take a case if I don't want to win it. As a defense attorney, it would be my job to believe in my client and prove his innocence. But if I am stepping in, and obviously incapable of believing in them, then I'm doing an injustice to the legal system and that order that I mentioned. If I truly believed what I said before the part you quoted, I'd be clearly contradicting that by saying I'll try to get those who are obviously guilty to society on the streets and show the world that you can get away with monstrosities.

Not to mention, being the lawyer of someone who is obviously guilty is a poor idea. In a fair case, if my client is guilty, the prosecution has a clear advantage of getting the verdict they want. This means I'm probably going to get less money (assuming that's how it works?) and also I lose reputation because I am not winning cases due to picking very poorly. The attorney of someone obviously guilty is going to likely lose in the courtroom unless I'm falsifying evidence or the prosecution is beyond incompetent.

So to put as I probably should have: When believing in my client, I'll work whatever possible angle I can to help protect them.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Don't misunderstand, I wouldn't even take a case if I don't want to win it. As a defense attorney, it would be my job to believe in my client and prove his innocence. But if I am stepping in, and obviously incapable of believing in them, then I'm doing an injustice to the legal system and that order that I mentioned.

Wait 'til you gotta deal with clients that are guilty and you have to defend them anyway. Criminal lawyers have to sacrifice their conscience in a lot of cases in order to succeed at their jobs. It's really tough.

And sometimes you can't pick what jobs you're going to take, and there's no reliable way to divine whether your client is being entirely honest with you. Until you get your name up somewhere at a firm, it's feast or famine.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Holder of the Heel]

You do raise some good points, I'm going to have to concede that it's not going to be as easy I make it seem. Honestly I don't have much of an answer other than believing in my client, trying my best to get the truth from them, and somehow avoid cases that wouldn't be very smart to get.

Just imagine winning a case, and when you and your client are walking out of the courtroom, he admits his guilt to you because it is too late for him to be convicted. I wonder if that kind of crap happens, that'd really hit hard, as if he punched me in the face.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

You do raise some good points, I'm going to have to concede that it's not going to be as easy I make it seem. Honestly I don't have much of an answer other than believing in my client, trying my best to get the truth from them, and somehow avoid cases that wouldn't be very smart to get.

It's exceedingly difficult, Holder, and to be brutally honest such positivism has little place in the courtroom. Clients are clients---nothing more, nothing less. Deserving of their right to council and all, yes, but that's the long and short of what they are to you. They're in the courtroom today for some reason, and regardless of that reason, it's your job to absolve them of any guilt that the accusing party invokes through hook and crook. If you let your feelings and your core values get in the way of that, you're going to find yourself not taking very many cases at all and before you know it, you'll be out of a job and dirt poor on top of that. The bottom line is, you need to get paid too.

Have you looked into becoming a civil lawyer instead of a criminal one? Their area of expertise deals in a lot less grey, and in a lot of cases your virtue could serve you well. You'll be handling things like divorces, prenuptial agreements, and all that jazz.

Smooth Criminal

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

The lawyer was an example of a drunk driver running over a child shouldn't be judged any harder than a drunk driver that didn't run over a child...Their crime was drunk driving

 

[Teran]

In a nutshell, it seems Holder wants to be Phoenix Wright.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

I'm not quite sure. While you're right, my ideals might be unfitting considering the gray areas I'll consistently be in, its the same ideals that find civil matters to not be interesting. Of course, I could end up doing that, I won't pretend to know what Future Holder will end up doing. It's just, the appeal of being a lawyer is the idealism of it. Using all of the logic, philosophy, and ethics I learned in a place that could make a difference. A part of me might have to just go, "If my client is guilty, I'll have to assume the prosecution will be able to prove it despite my defense," because as I said, taking on someone who is guilty (whether I know that is the case or not), really leaves it up to the detectives to pick up on the trail and the lawyer to point it out to everyone.

I do appreciate the food for thought though, but if I'm going to guess how I'll go, I might try to take my chances with cases. Besides, rarely will there be cases that I'll clearly know my client is guilty prima facie. A lot of it will be having to believe in my client like I've mentioned before, if he turns out to be found guilty, I'll just have to realize I win some and I lose some. I still get paid from being hired at the very least.


Basically, what Teran said. As much as one can legitimately be that way in the reality of a real courtroom. XD

As for the drunk driving thing, isn't the intent the same? I doubt drunk or sober you'd be like, "Let's try to run over this kid!" as in, had any intent. Though, obviously the person who was drunk and did it should receive more punishment, because of him breaking the law by just getting in the car and driving at his state and creating a situation where lives are in danger (though without his knowledge, which can't be murder I guess) but also the fact that the only thing the sober guy did wrong was have an accident, which I'd have trouble making him out to be a bad person deserving jail time.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

The lawyer was arguing he shouldn't receive more jail time because he had no intent to kill the kid.

That's where I'd disagree with him

The driver may not have had murderous intent, but he still killed someone and should receive judgement based on his actions, as well as intent

 

[Smooth Criminal]

It's involuntary manslaughter on top of a DUI. Maybe throw in reckless endangerment, among a plethora of other charges. These sort of laws are in place for a reason, to protect others and make sure those people who break the law are handled accordingly. Depending on the judge, the jury and the state laws, the extent of the punishment of the offender may vary.

He can argue all he wants about "intent," or a lack thereof. According to the law, that guy ****ed up. Now he's going to pay the piper.

Smooth Criminal

 

[FrenchToasts]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/aurora-colo-batman-shooter-james-holmes-phd-student/story?id=16817842

 

[Teran]

Yes indeed, here's the thread for it by the way. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=14701945

 

[Froggy]

...you do realize that there is carpet cleaner out there at your local grocery store that could've got that blood out, right?

Spray paint is only going to compound the issue. Good luck finding a hue that'll much the exact color of the carpet, and good luck trying to make that patch of carpet look like anything but.

My advice? Take your lumps. You don't wanna make this any worse than what it is. Talk to your landlord, and tell him what happened. Be honest.
l

No, I didn't know that. Just one more of the things I never needed to know until I had to keep my room tidy.

Win or lost, get to stay or be kicked out I'll tell him what happened. He knows I was cut yesterday so if there ever was a time to explain the situation then it's now. It still all sucks though.

 

[Froggy]

Sometimes I wish I was dead. There'd be less stress and anxiety then.

 

[#HBC | J]

Yeeeeeesh, never think about that sort of thing Froggy because there is always a reason to live even when the going gets really tough.

 

[Jasou]

Agreed. Life is something precious. Sometimes it doesn't give us what we want, but it's not something to throw away so easily.

 

[Chronodiver Lokii]

Froggy, for future reference....
Do not use bleach on carpeting
and most floors
....and most surfaces . ___ .;;;;

That sucks though. good luck with the landlord

 

[Jasou]

A friend that's a girl over skype is saying really weird things about me and her...... urg x_x, it's really awkward....... and she won't stop...... The worst part is that she's 14 years old. I'm not like that at all....

 

[Holder of the Heel]

Giving up on life is a bit presumptuous. It is like saying that you have the power to see the future and know that isn't going to be good. It is also easy to remedy by a change of perspective. Seize your future and be content with your life, and things will only get better.

 

[#HBC | J]

A friend that's a girl over skype is saying really weird things about me and her...... urg x_x, it's really awkward....... and she won't stop...... The worst part is that she's 14 years old. I'm not like that at all....

o_O Well assuming you are older, that is definitely...interesting to say the least. Have you told her politely to possibly stop?

 

[Jasou]

o_O Well assuming you are older, that is definitely...interesting to say the least. Have you told her politely to possibly stop?

Yes I have. It was even in a chat group with other people in it. After a while of it someone kicked her out for now. It was really awkward and i'm not sure when i'll be talking to her again.

 

[Dooms]

Yeeeeeesh, never think about that sort of thing Froggy because there is always a reason to live even when the going gets really tough.

I actually disagree with this. It's going to sound really depressing (maybe because I'm still down from March), but I simply don't see a reason we have to live. If I were to die, people would move on from it in a year or two tops. After that, they'd be depressed when people brought me up MAYBE, but I wouldn't see anyone holding their life back for more than a year. With that aside, people would take my place very easily in anything I was trying to do. Music teacher? There are tons. Math teachers? Also tons. Music performer? Still tons. The only reason there would be to live would be to keep your family members not depressed for a year or two. There's also the "you can make a change in this world that no one else can make" crap, but honestly, with how difficult it is to find a job now (people with college degrees having to work in fast food places), it's pretty obvious that our generation won't be making much of a change in this society. When it comes to everything besides friends/family, there is no reason to live. Friends is honestly a reach (you can be replaced by most friends) unless they're close friends. There are also families that are broken apart/not close, so that could be taken away.

Just my thoughts on the subject. Dieing for less stress/anxiety, however, would be completely idiotic. You still get joy out of life if you're only doing it for stress/anxiety. If you had major depression (to the point where you can't feel happiness) or a disease that confirms you as dead, then it would honestly be understandable. Stress/anxiety is just something that everyone has to deal with. Dealing with these rewards happiness/fun memories at some point, so it's normally worth it in the end. Once again, just my thoughts.

 

[Teran]

Even if you see no specific reason to live, you can either sit their brooding about how pointless it all is and suck yourself into the vortex of never ending misery, or actually go out and actually have a little fun.

There's not much functional purpose to sex outside of procreation, well, maybe as exercise? xD

We still do that, right?

It's good to be analytical and philosophical at times, but sometimes it's just destructive and even more pointless than the life you believe to be so.

But what would I know.

I'm a rock.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Sometimes I wish I was dead. There'd be less stress and anxiety then.

That's a pretty stupid way of thinking about life. Yeah, it's true that you'd never be stressed or anxious again, but there'd also be no potential for joy and happiness for you ever again. Life is means different things to different people, but to me it's about the positives. I live to be with the people I like, do things I enjoy doing, and just immersing myself in the beautiful world around me. I don't claim to know your life, but if you'd really like to sacrifice all of those things in your life just to lift a little stress off of your back...that just doesn't make sense to me. Everyone has negatives in their life, and there's always someone who has it worse than you. If you're feeling down in the dumps, change your perspective, find a different routine, switch things up, don't just give up.

 

[Dooms]

Even if you see no specific reason to live, you can either sit their brooding about how pointless it all is and suck yourself into the vortex of never ending misery, or actually go out and actually have a little fun.

There's not much functional purpose to sex outside of procreation, well, maybe as exercise? xD

We still do that, right?

It's good to be analytical and philosophical at times, but sometimes it's just destructive and even more pointless than the life you believe to be so.

But what would I know.

I'm a rock.

Sex feels good.

Living doesn't most of the time. Except during sex of course .

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

What if the person in question doesn't have sex?

 

[Dooms]

Then they have no point for living obviously.

(There are other ways to get happiness obv :|.)

 

[Jasou]

I don't think sex is the only way to be happy in life. Friends make life a lot more fun. imo

 

[Teran]

Sex feels good.

Living doesn't most of the time. Except during sex of course .

The point is you're supposed to be productive in making life feel good, not festering in a pool of resignation.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I'm productive in making sure tomorrow is going to be better at the sacrifice of today's happiness. However, it does leave me unhappy today

 

[Chronodiver Lokii]

I don't think sex is the only way to be happy in life. Friends make life a lot more fun. imo

This
Doing something you love/hobbies/etc
Helping others/charity
Spending time with family (well, if you have a good family life; friends can count towards this because blood doesn't restrict family)
Enjoying the little things
Going on adventures
Tryin new things
Accomplishing goals

Etc etc etc

(and note this list isnt to compare to sex - its to list stuff that can make life enjoyable)

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I got stuck with more responsibility at work without additional pay.

Well, technically I'm getting additional pay because I've been stuck after work for additional 1/2 hour every day cleaning up others messes. Not my ideal way of getting paid more

 

[Yonder]

I will never understand why we are forced to do math so much in our educational system. I understand knowing the basics, and perhaps some geometry, but to force the entire population that enters it to do more than what is necessary is a complete waste of time and resources. We need to allow those who don't want to specialize in it the opportunity to just move the **** on. They're just going to dump all of the information out of their head when they are done with the class to begin with. The same applies to other subjects as well. Basically, our potential is crapped on by this "jack of all trades" policy that the world seems to think works, but if you interview the general population, oh my gosh, you'll found out that it doesn't.

I'd give anything to just be able to go to school and learn some philosophy and law. Then I can write a critique treatise on our education system that one or two people will buy. Then I'll die eventually, and people will study it for years.

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My sentiments exactly.

I am amazing at English, yet I must upgrade my math to the highest level to even have the opportunity to get a Bachelors of Arts degree. I love P.E and considered something like Kinesiology, yet you need Chemistry and Physics. FOR GYM. You don't even need a gym course for a gym related career path, so long as you have been on one sports team for like, one semester. I also am quite efficient at Biology. I wanted to consider Marine Biology. Buuuut....I need chemistry, physics, highest degree of math, along with Biology.

I ******* hate our education system! We have probably lost so many great minds due to this flawed educational system. Fml.

 

[Luigitoilet]

There really should be more individual decision making in regards to what we learn, not just in the later years of college. Wouldn't it be more productive to give the children more control over what they were learning about? I know personally that it's way easier to learn about something I'm vaguely interested in (writing, history and art)as opposed to something that makes me want to kill myself (math).

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Doesn't working on math in essence "stretch your brain muscle" which allows you to learn better and faster in other fields as well?

 

[Luigitoilet]

Doesn't working on math in essence "stretch your brain muscle" which allows you to learn better and faster in other fields as well?

Well, I don't mean to say that math should ever be outright ignored. As much as I hate it, it really does help the brain learn "how" to think in a sense. But still, I don't think I need to know trigonometry if I want to be a filmmaker or writer.

 

[Jasou]

There really should be more individual decision making in regards to what we learn, not just in the later years of college. Wouldn't it be more productive to give the children more control over what they were learning about? I know personally that it's way easier to learn about something I'm vaguely interested in (writing, history and art)as opposed to something that makes me want to kill myself (math).

I agree with this point, as long as I learn the basics of a subject to the point where I can use it for everyday things. I'm not talking about math, just any subject. I find physics to be very interesting and I want to learn a lot more about it.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

I am circling the drain....so to speak.

Welll...not really but I have a massive head cold. I have been sneezing non stop, I feel light headed, not hungry, and my throat hurts pretty bad. I think I may have an ear infection but I am not sure at this point. Thing is, I can have my ear drum bleeding from a ear infection and I never feel a thing.

So naturally, I should go see a doctor but I used up all of my sick time and I can use vacation time SO I have to go work despite the hospital being across the street. If I go there, my boss will know and I will be penalized for it. So, I have to wait till after work...

Which sucks because after work, I have to meet a guy in order to transfer his car into my ownership. This requires paperwork and officiating. I am unable to go to the doctor until Wends. It kind of sucks :/