The Single, Best Improvement For Your Main

[FerrishTheFish]

We've all got our favorite characters, moves, techniques, etc. But if you could make one small change to your main or other favorite character, what would you change and how much would he/she improve?

EXAMPLES:

Character: Captain Falcon
Current Tier: A-tier
Improvement: R-cancel the Raptor Boost
Results: This move would suddenly become amazingly spammable. Thinking you can shieldgrab my Raptor Boost? Guess I'll just cancel outside your grab range and come in with a knee instead. Whoops, I accidentally Raptor Boosted while recovering high--who gave you permission to taunt? Oh well, guess I'll knee you and recover with a wall-jump. Trying to spot-dodge out of my Raptor Boost? Not if I can tap R and just grab you instead.
Conclusion: This spammable combo-starter makes Falcon an extremely potent threat. Good luck ever dodging or teching again.
Proposed New Tier: S-tier

Character: Link
Current Tier: E-tier
Improvement: Faster Jump
Results: Fastfallers beware: an actually useful wavedash makes Link combos/techchases possible on reaction. Link's shield pressure and edgeguarding is almost as good as Marth's since he now has an easy way to space effectively. Pressuring Link's shield is also much harder now that I can nair out of shield.
Conclusion: It doesn't solve all of Link's problems by a longshot, but it addresses his biggest weakness.
Proposed New Tier: C-tier

Character: Ganondorf
Current Tier: C-tier
Improvement: Warlock Pawnch replaced by Kirby's Swallow
Results: Picture it. Just ... just picture it.
Conclusion: Hey, he's still got his utilt, right?
Proposed New Tier: C-tier

 

[ShroudedOne]

Cute. =)

Character: Peach
Current Tier: A-tier
Improvement: Use angled f-smashes to change the outcome of her forward smash (an idea KirbyKaze had)
Results: Peach's forward smash could now become viable. Do I want a combo? Just angle her forward smash up for the frying pan. Do I want a kill move? Angle her forward smash downwards for the tennis racket. For the golf club, simply angle it to the side. Think of how you can angle Mario/Luigi/Doc forward smashes.
Conclusion: This would give Peach a few more tools to do neat things (like whack Sheiks).
Proposed New Tier: A-Tier (It wouldn't make her absolutely amazing, but it would be a very good improvement that wouldn't warrant people complaining about her even more (as opposed to cancelling turnip pull animation on stage or something like that.)

Character: Zelda
Current Tier: F-tier
Improvement: 1 frame Nayru's Love that can be JC'd
Results: It's essentially another shine, which will give Zelda an actual OoS option. I mean, we all know how amazing her Nayru's Love OoS is already, but imagine if it were one frame. So, say you're a Zelda, sitting in shield, getting pressured, and you think, "Huh. I wish I could something about this. But my grab sucks, up smash OoS is only semi-reliable, and that's in version 1.0, and nothing else even comes close to a good option, besides rolling." And then give her a shine!!! Zelda's metagame explodes.
Conclusion: Of course, she still has terrible mobility generally, but this is one step to help the poor gal out.
Proposed New Tier: D-Tier

EDIT: And then I went and had fun with the colors and things...

 

[VGmasta]

Yeah, an L-cancel raptor boost would make Falcon super busted.

I would L-cancel Doc's Up-B. It's already a decent move to escape shield pressure. But having an L-cancel attached would allow him to Up-b more liberally (like Samus).

Either that or make the guy's grab range better. Doc's grab range is soo bad. It can't shieldgrab anything that has any kind of spacing on it.

Doc would easily go up at least one tier if his grab range was any better than it is now.

 

[TheZhuKeeper]

Falco - fair becomes knee.

 

[JPOBS]

hey^ falco's fair *****. wouldnt change it for the world

lets get rid of his stupid upair instead.

 

[Battlecow]

Give marth a longer sword

Like, half again as long, but it's all tip.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Samus's Zair should be L-cancelable and do like 7% instead of 4%. Then she would have aerial priority and not be totally locked into a ground game. Better game against characters that spam aerial priority against her like Ganon, Sheik, Peach, Puff, etc.

Samus's missiles should explode and have a transcendent priority hitbox of fire damage that deals 12% or so to whatever touches it. So you can't just nair through it with every character and you have to actually respect it.

Mario's fireball, Pikachu's jolt, Samus's charge beam, Mewtwo's shadowball, etc. should have transcendent priority. Or at least work like PK Fire does, where you can hit it but it just keeps going through. This greatly, greatly improves the approach game of most of these characters because, once again, people can't just continue to mindlessly swat the projectiles as they come close and move back a bit. It also improves their defense by having a projectile that isn't so easily plowed through by the approaching character.

DK needs an aerial facing forward. A sex kick, or something. Because, my god, he cannot do anything when the opponent constantly forces him to face them.

 

[ShroudedOne]

The first stage of needles (uncharged) break a full charge shot from Samus. It's really funny.

 

[Sinji]

Character: Fox
Current Tier: S-Tier
Improvement: Even bigger hitbox for shine and his laser gun from N64. Reason being, it will allow you to waveshine combo marth easily without an initial dash. His lasers will make him unapproachable.
Conclusion: You wont have any problem fighting Marth on FD any more and the Marth main will be spiralling with questions saying, "I wonder what I should counterpick"? Also his laser improvement will guarantee fox first place in every tourney.
Proposed new tier: God Tier


NB: If this were to happen, every player would have to perfect their power shield technique.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

Character: Jigglypuff
Current Tier: S-Tier
Improvement: An instant kill frame one attack with the same knockback as G&W's 9 hammer. Also has invincibility frames and cooldown equal to the amount of time it takes to get star ko'd and respawn for epic rage.
Conclusion: Oh wait.
Proposed new tier: S-Tier

 

[40secondz]

Character: Jigglypuff
Current Tier: S-Tier
Improvement: An instant kill frame one attack with the same knockback as G&W's 9 hammer. Also has invincibility frames and cooldown equal to the amount of time it takes to get star ko'd and respawn for epic rage.
Conclusion: Oh wait.
Proposed new tier: S-Tier

Best post ever.

 

[Pi]

give samus a 7 frame grab

 

[sulliman1]

mewtwo could have semi-disjointed hitboxes on tail-based attacks (bair, ftilt, dtilt, uptilt, upair) so he could maybe approach with them some and not get outprioritized/trade

 

[Shadic]

mewtwo could have semi-disjointed hitboxes on tail-based attacks (bair, ftilt, dtilt, uptilt, upair) so he could maybe approach with them some and not get outprioritized/trade

That could be done by removing the two hurtboxes on his tail.

 

[Kal]

Character: Fox
Current Tier: S-tier
Improvement: Gives me Falco's ****ing laser at Fox's fire-rate
Results: SHDL with Fox now has knockback, **** all of you
Proposed New Tier: God-Tier

 

[Violence]

Character: Samus
Current Tier: C Tier
Improvement: Extended grapple can now grab characters out of midair.
Results: If Samus gets the opportunity to get the Extender, which she can do in midair, she suddenly has a ridiculously mobile grab that is difficult to avoid.
Proposed Tier: A Tier

 

[sulliman1]

That could be done by removing the two hurtboxes on his tail.

an even better solution

 

[Deleted member]

Character: Kirby
Current Tier: Not a real character tier
Improvement: Fox's Up Smash, Fox's Down smash
Results: He has Fox's smash attacks
Proposed New Tier: Not a real character tier

 

[sulliman1]

it'd be cool if kirby could choose the down b/fb/neutral b of a character he swallowed (up b kinda not feasible/stupid)

and if suck was better, as in if it went through shields like a grab and didn't kill momentum so you could approach with it

 

[Mind Trick]

give yoshi a jc out of shield and he's c-tier

 

[Van.]

Yeah, an L-cancel raptor boost would make Falcon super busted.

I would L-cancel Doc's Up-B. It's already a decent move to escape shield pressure. But having an L-cancel attached would allow him to Up-b more liberally (like Samus).

Either that or make the guy's grab range better. Doc's grab range is soo bad. It can't shieldgrab anything that has any kind of spacing on it.

Doc would easily go up at least one tier if his grab range was any better than it is now.

...surely you would prefer a longer recovery?

 

[Acryte]

Ah yoshi, jc out of shield is big, that or decent momentum and height on the side-B so it becomes a recovery move for him

 

[darkoblivion12]

Character: Roy
current tier: bad
fix: give the aerials less ending lag.
reasoning: less ending lag gives roy and offstage game that he's never had.
new tier: less bad

Character: Roy
current tier: bad
fix: give the aerials more hitstun.
reasoning: if he doesn't get less lag, his moves need to have more impact. if he had aerials that combo'd into one another, he could actually finish combos with things other than fsmash.
new tier: less bad

 

[Tee ay eye]

jump-cancel rests with jigglypuff
give marth a sex kick
give falcon a sex kick

 

[40secondz]

jump-cancel rests with jigglypuff

then you would be able to wave "rest" like fox's and falco's waveshine.

 

[Krynxe]

Character: Jiggs
Current Tier: S-tier
Improvement: Replace her nb with shine, her dair with falco's, dthrow with sheik's, and her fsmash with marth's.
Results: Something that everyone will play and will win every tournament
Proposed New Tier: Almost Meta-Knight tier

 

[Thoraxe]

character: Luigi
current tier: D-tier? seriously?
improvement: ****ty fireballs turn to mario's fireballs (but green)
results: a viable projectile to counteract the projectile spam played against him.
New Tier: B-tier, move over IC's.

 

[1048576]

make each hitbox of yoshi's bair a knee.

 

[kevo]

Character: Marth
Current Tier: A-tier
Improvement: Fair has 25% less knockback, same amount of stun frames, and becomes a "sex sword" where the sword's hitbox kinda just stays out front until the IASA frame.
Results: Ken combo is a true combo, overall ridiculousness
Proposed New Tier: Still A-tier, but more annoying to play against

Improvement: Three more jumps, wall jump
Results: fair wall of pain, shenanigans off the edge, less sense
Proposed New Tier: Maybe S-tier if both improvements are added

 

[sulliman1]

thoraxe luigi's fireball doesn't need a change of trajectory, the trajectory is unique to the character giving him unique techniques

it needs a change of range, that **** should go at least twice as far

and maybe even a way to speed it up too, like cancel endlag on aerial fireball on landing like lasers (still not insanely spammable because his shff is pretty slow)

 

[Zodiac]

Character: Link
Current Tier: E-tier
Improvement:shield pressure
Results: His jab and fair make for such great spacing tools that he can sit there and pressure your shield from a nice far distance and do it faster than other characters of that range. It will force opponents out of their shield and either to retreat or attack, if they attack you can just jump and put a nair in their face that has godlike priority and last For-freaking-ever. and if they retreat you can just pursue with a fair or a hookshot.
Conclusion: It changes things up and puts a high tier on the ropes, something they will not expect from a link, plus it pays back falco for all the pain he has caused link.
Proposed New Tier: Hero-tier

 

[Deleted member]

this thread reminded me of this:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=35599

All of which I agree with.

 

[Massive]

Character: Kirby
Current Tier: Not a real character tier
Improvement: Fox's Up Smash, Fox's Down smash
Results: He has Fox's smash attacks
Proposed New Tier: Not a real character tier

This would actually suck, as his down smash is a decent move.

Character: Kirby
Current Tier: Actually worse than pichu tier
Improvement: No longer loses forward momentum when jumping
Results: Kirby now has Jigglypuff's aerial maneuverability with a decent KO move (uair)
Proposed New Tier: Slightly better than Pichu tier

 

[Taj278]

Character: Mewtwo
Current Tier: F
Improvement: Working special moves.
Results: His Forward B (Confusion) will actually reflect projectiles, serve as a great anti-air approach from SHFFL, Float, Tilt, and SHL abuse, and lead into free grabs or forward airs on floaties, or free down smashes and techchases on fast fallers from the extra stun.

Down B (Disable) can have two possibilities... keep the same criteria of working against grounded opponents that are facing you, but having more sleep time to land a DJC down air or smash at lower percentages and hitting through shields, sidesteps, and rolls.

Or... Make it come out a bit faster, remove the grounded and facing requirement, and stun opponents facing backwards or in the air to be a good edgeguarding/anti-air move against certain characters. I wouldn't even mind if the stun scaled the same as it did now with those changes.

Conclusion: Mewtwo has unique special moves that actually do something. He might even gain respect as a character! Mewtwo's biggest problem is that he doesn't have ANYTHING threatening in front of him so you have to play an absurdly air tight WD/DD spacing game with a character that jumps like Ganon/Yoshi/Falco just to scratch someone until they're high enough to be KOed with up throw.

Even with those changes, he would still be squishy, but have an option to lead to his other finishing moves and combo starters, which would put him somewhere in D tier, probably under Pikachu.

Proposed New Tier: D-Tier

 

[sulliman1]

Samus's Zair should be L-cancelable and do like 7% instead of 4%. Then she would have aerial priority and not be totally locked into a ground game. Better game against characters that spam aerial priority against her like Ganon, Sheik, Peach, Puff, etc.

the whole grapple should be a hitbox too and not just the tip. and maybe even control the direction of the tip to an extent with cstick after the grapple is already out like sheik's chain.

link and yl should be able to move their grounded upbs horizontally like bowser/dk

taj-agree so hard. another possibility for disable is to actually function like it does in pokemon and remove the use of that move for the entirety of the stock, just how pressing aerial down b does nothing for dk. hell it could even be a combination of the two.

speaking of dks aerial down b it should be a grab move like koopa klaw with a hitbox mostly on the forward/down diagonal so characters have to respect his descent in front of them more

also dks forward b needs to not suck, trapping them in the ground for longer, bigger range in front of him, a stronger meteor, and doesn't give invincibility when they pop out of being stuck in the ground

someone should make this thread for stages

 

[Bing]

Character: Marth
Current Tier: A
Improvement: The Ability to Wall Jump?
Results: Gives a bit of assistance to his so-so recovery, and who wouldnt want to wall-jump dair?
Proposed New Tier: Still A, Possibly S :D

Character: Marth(again)
Current Tier: A
Improvement: U-smash becomes just like his U-tilt but charged.(Like Links u-smash but only 1 hit)
Results: U-smash has more mobility, range and use.
Proposed New Tier: A-S :D

Character: Kirby
Current Tier: Z
Improvement: Different from the Hammer/ Less lag on the Hammer
Results: Gives his over-B some sort of... use?
Proposed New Tier: Equal to Pichu.

 

[Hydro_Smasher]

Character: Falcon
Current Tier: A-tier
Improvement: less lag time on falcon dive landing
Results: Being edge guarded or punished by charecters becomes easier to deal with, and doesnt make me rely on ledge cancelled backwards momentum as much.
Proposed New Tier: A-Tier

yeah, I could care less about raptor boost, but the recovery needs help. alot.

 

[Twinkles]

Character: Marth
Current Tier: A
Improvement: The Ability to Wall Jump?
Results: Gives a bit of assistance to his so-so recovery, and who wouldnt want to wall-jump dair?
Proposed New Tier: Still A, Possibly S :D

I thought this could be cool if it wasn't for the fact
that Marth can't reach the edge if he wall-jumps.

 

[Bing]

I thought this could be cool if it wasn't for the fact
that Marth can't reach the edge if he wall-jumps.

We would find a way, I mean, It might just require an over-b then up-b to work

 

[YOSHIDO]

Character: Yoshi
Current Tier: F
Improvement: Give yoshi s class priority + duration on all air attacks.
Result: Yoshi would actually have a nasty approaching game that doesn't have such high risk. This would defeat his whole shielding paradox. Not saying jumping out of shield wouldn't be awwsome. But since that was said I chose this improvement. He'd be a much faster version of peach. Minus the **** tier down-smash.
Conclusion: B Tier.