~The Olimar Matchup Thread~Review: R.O.B. or someone~

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

one early kill, which oli has no problem getting, complete F**KS with luc's game
it puts them in a state of urgency and leads to more openings for oli

That only truly applies to characters like Wario or Snake who are heavy enough to take advantage of the power drop, except it's easier for Luc to juggle Snake when he does less damage.

Olimar's too light for this to apply.

 

[asob4]

WAC > everything
whistles and power shields will wreck low damage luc
i never get gimped by lucario anymore because fair/nair is so easy to whistle pass

 

[phi1ny3]

WAC > everything
whistles and power shields will wreck low damage luc
i never get gimped by lucario anymore because fair/nair is so easy to whistle pass

Fair->nair isn't supposed to knock back really, and certainly not used for gimping.
Also, does it outlast dair's two hits? If so, then we still have that gimp line.

 

[|RK|]

Could we use Micro D-Air

As an approach option?

Unlike normal D-Air, Micro D-Air's hitbox is around Lucario's entire body, minus his tail.

I assume that'd be useful for deflecting oncoming Pikmin.

​

 

[asob4]

dair shouldn't be used for gimping unless accompanied by a fair
you won't be able to chase before we get back if you're trying to dair us only
and we can whistle right past any fair leading to the dair

i've played many lucarios, they don't gimp me.
i play against dory (formally known as 4BDN) a lot, so i know the tricks

 

[|RK|]

Hm? Oh, you misunderstand. I'm not talking about using D-Air to gimp,

But to use the kinda sorta AT Micro D-Air for approaching through waves of Pikmin.

Also, after a bit of testing

I found a way to force Olimar to come to us.

Aura Sphere.

​

 

[Greward]

pikmin toss completely outcamps lucario's aura sphere... we can also throw pikmins on the aura sphere to evade it, but the pikmin will die...

lucario hasnt got good options to gimp olimar, they are all safe to whistle. he hasnt got a good aproach and he cant outcamp us. olimar wins, just try to watch out for his attacks that will outprioritize ours.

 

[asob4]

i was talking to the others, not you RK

aura sphere won't work -_______-

 

[|RK|]

I was waiting for someone to criticize my knowledge. Darn it, I was hoping for someone more gruff though, like Sunshine

But yeah, so long as our Aura Sphere can cover our body, we can stand at the edge and charge it up, facing away from you. The only way you can get to us like this is a Dash Attack, grab, or frontal attack. The frontal attack is most dangerous because you will have to be offstage and you're putting yourself in front of us. With a fully charged Aura Sphere. Not smart. I dub this, the Aura Shield!

So, yeah, you'd have to approach. A less reliable version is at Onecario, because while like this, we can even shut down your Dash Attack, but, you can just stand there and run out the timer. making that useless.

​

 

[asob4]

or we can throw a purple

it's hitbox is larger than its hurtbox
so it'll hit through it
:D

 

[|RK|]

I curse you to never get any purples. Ever.

But will it hit through it?

I don't feel like testing right now...

I just finished.

​

 

[asob4]

it should
it has a pretty huge hitbox....

i'm too far from my wii to test

 

[|RK|]

I just tested. At 150%, your Purple's won't go through. All the moves that can hit us at that point are close range. You would have to approach. :D

​

 

[Dyyne]

This aura shield isn't new, people have been talking about using it to block pikmin since last march lol. You just named it first I guess. Although, it's interesting that at that high percent, purps won't go through. Perhaps I can also do some testing over the weekend.

 

[asob4]

we can walk forward... you launch
we power shield! :D

 

[|RK|]

Yeah, the farthest range move that can hit us then is your grab and U-Smash can too. And at Onecario, that doesn't even go through.

Asob, we'd be standing at the edge facing away from you.

We could just cancel it or F-Smash you. At Onecario, our F-Smash will kill you at 45% uncharged. Not like it matters at Onecario 'cause you could just stand there and let the timer go by.

​

 

[asob4]

we can pretty much do that any time... lolol

that won't really help, as you will almost always be at a higher percent then us

 

[|RK|]

It works with a normal sphere if we're far enough

​

 

[Dyyne]

Hey guys, I was thinking. If the luc uses AS to not get hit by pikmin, if you throw one past it (assuming there is a little bit of room), when it starts walking back and gets hit by the charging AS, could you do a desynched usmash?

 

[|RK|]

Stop thinking. Now.

​

 

[Zori]

rk joker shut the **** up you say the dumbest **** ever, everything you say is 100% bull**** and you have lost credibilty as a smasher and a lucario main







LOL i must love infractions.....

 

[|RK|]

Hi. No I have not. I have actually started discussing intelligent things on the matchup, and my word is still credible. That and I have openly admitted I was wrong about DT.

 

[Vionce]

But yeah, so long as our Aura Sphere can cover our body, we can stand at the edge and charge it up, facing away from you. The only way you can get to us like this is a Dash Attack, grab, or frontal attack. The frontal attack is most dangerous because you will have to be offstage and you're putting yourself in front of us. With a fully charged Aura Sphere. Not smart. I dub this, the Aura Shield!

So, yeah, you'd have to approach. A less reliable version is at Onecario, because while like this, we can even shut down your Dash Attack, but, you can just stand there and run out the timer. making that useless.

​

right so oli walks up and tries to grab. Luc has to ground dodge or roll, which would then end the aura shield. since oli knows ur going to ground dodge or roll it shouldn't be too hard to punish.

 

[|RK|]

Or we can, you know, press/tap the shield button and jump or reverse the Aura Sphere.

 

[Kitamerby]

we can pretty much do that any time... lolol

that won't really help, as you will almost always be at a higher percent then us

That's what gimping is for.

dair shouldn't be used for gimping unless accompanied by a fair
you won't be able to chase before we get back if you're trying to dair us only
and we can whistle right past any fair leading to the dair

i've played many lucarios, they don't gimp me.
i play against dory (formally known as 4BDN) a lot, so i know the tricks

But do you play good Lucarios? A simple delayed or mindgamed attack should screw with the whistle timing. Of course, that's not to say it's a complete cakewalk to gimp an Olimar, but it definitely shouldn't be as hard as you're making it out to be.

one early kill, which oli has no problem getting, complete F**KS with luc's game
it puts them in a state of urgency and leads to more openings for oli

Olimar's a lightweight, so it's an entirely different story when Snake gets a so called "early kill" and Olimar does.. Whistle or no whistle, he can be gimped about as easily as you will be getting your so called "early kills." If the Lucario is worth his salt, he should be used to being in the clutch. Any Lucario who panics when he's behind is never to be used as an example in a matchup discussion. I pray that all the Lucarios you face don't fall for these simple shenanigans.



Also, Joker, you're banned from matchup discussions until you can make 30 consecutive posts without mentioning "Onecario." Go away.

 

[XienZo]

Hey guys, I was thinking. If the luc uses AS to not get hit by pikmin, if you throw one past it (assuming there is a little bit of room), when it starts walking back and gets hit by the charging AS, could you do a desynched usmash?

I actually got this to work a few times....


...when I was standing right next to Lucario.

 

[|RK|]

Also, Joker, you're banned from matchup discussions until you can make 30 consecutive posts without mentioning "Onecario." Go away.

I said that Onecario was worthless, lol. You're talking about coming back, and you hate the Aura Boost 'Sides, I'm not talking about sandbagging. Honestly, that's REEEEEAAALLLLYYYYYYY stupid. Period.

For everyone who doesn't know, Onecario is the terminology for Lucario down two stocks at 170-172%. He is a the maximum power he can have at that point. However, using Aura Shield like this, as stated before is beyond worthless. At that point we'd know what you can do, yeah, but you really don't have to do anything. At all. If we stand there like that, you can stand motionless, taunt, dance, whatever. Because we will lose.

 

[Kyas]

I just tested. At 150%, your Purple's won't go through. All the moves that can hit us at that point are close range. You would have to approach. :D

​

Everything you write, Joker, seems very... dramatic.

I have to admit, though, that the held aura sphere, or "shield" as you call it, does provide you a short respite from pikmin throw. However, charging it while facing away has it's drawbacks.

The position limits lucario to only 3 means (if I've missed any let me know) of escaping an approaching Olimar:
Spot-dodging, Rolling, and Shielding.

Because you are on the edge, rolling only works in one direction.
Because you are facing away, firing at our approach is not an option.
All of these options can be punished by Olimar with relative ease. And, since the "aura shield" is not effective until you reach 150%, the punishment would most likely be fatal, even with QCDI, if the Olimar knows what he is doing.

If I were you, I would reconsider the tactical situation you are putting yourself in when you use this aura shield, especially on smaller stages.

OH I get why it seems so dramatic! You center align all of your posts! Isn't that...

...INTERESTING!​

 

[|RK|]

Whoops, lol. I meant to say stages like Final Destination. Get the Olimar close enough. Act directly out of grab range, like when he's on the second to last arrow. Then tap shield and act fast.

 

[Kyas]

Wait... how does Reverse Aura Sphere work again? My last post may have been mistaken...

 

[asob4]

dory is probably the best lucario on the west coast at this point (<3 samuelson and kuro)
he doesn't gimp me. i haven't played samuelson enough but i doubt he could (<3)

so yes, i do play good lucarios and i don't get gimped and i usually win

early kills mean a lot.
it's worse from olimar because he can build your damage that much faster

0-90 with the right pikmin, maybe even a 0-death
you will die fast.

 

[Kyas]

dory is probably the best lucario on the west coast at this point (<3 samuelson and kuro)
he doesn't gimp me. i haven't played samuelson enough but i doubt he could (<3)

so yes, i do play good lucarios and i don't get gimped and i usually win

early kills mean a lot.
it's worse from olimar because he can build your damage that much faster

0-90 with the right pikmin, maybe even a 0-death
you will die fast.

Vids plz?

10vids

 

[asob4]

haven't recorded in forever D:

come summer i'll probably record a lot though if spencer gets a dazzle

 

[Dyyne]

Hey guys, I was thinking. If the luc uses AS to not get hit by pikmin, if you throw one past it (assuming there is a little bit of room), when it starts walking back and gets hit by the charging AS, could you do a desynched usmash?

Anybody want to acknowledge my thought? Hilt, you tested the desynching pretty thoroughly, what do you think about this?

 

[XienZo]

Anybody want to acknowledge my thought? Hilt, you tested the desynching pretty thoroughly, what do you think about this?

I tried it, and it works from a roll's length away.

 

[|RK|]

Nah, if it's big enough, it should shield most of our bodies. If it doesn't, Lucarios: Don't use Aura Shield if they can desynch cause of it. I caught Alus in the Aura Sphere while he was in front of me and chained it to a shot.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Anybody want to acknowledge my thought? Hilt, you tested the desynching pretty thoroughly, what do you think about this?

researching time :D


edit: tried it out and cant figure out how you got it to work XienZo O_o

any trick involved before the pikmin is thrown? Or a video?

When I tried it with the purple by itself, i'd whiff the smash. And when i tried it with other pikmin in my line at the same time, it would use those pikmin. I even tried whistling in a certain way, as well as throwing the pikmin and using chain while it was returning, to make the purple be the next in line to be used.

 

[jog]

lets talk about lucas

 

[asob4]

why?
awex should know this match up best

 

[jog]

idk, just throwing it out there. the lucas boards have a match up ratio for every character but us. we're listed as ???