The Official SBR-B Brawl Tier List v3.0

[Red Arremer]

Your attempt to exhibit any emotional response from me has has resulted in failure. Insults and mockery have no merits with me.

Uhm, no. I wanted an actual response from you, I didn't aim to insult you. I was completely serious with this post.

 

[zeldspazz]

But at the same time, what i am disagreeing with is people who are abusing the tier list as a means to shut out any character that isn't on the top, which is what i do not like. I can disagree--i have that right. If i present it in a mature and easy to read manner, than i should only be corrected or rebutted, not ridiculed. I'm not disagreeing that a tier exists or that it doesn't determine anything. What i'm disagreeing with is the people who say any character not in the top tier will lose against a character that is, period.

Thats the thing, we are not saying that. It is inheritantly harder due to the attributes of each character that soem are more likely to lose to each other. We are not saying to dont main low tiers. We are not saying that top tiers will win every tournament. It is basically a rough outline of how each character does in relation to the cast. However, yes characters at the top are going to be seen at and winning tournament more often, simply because theyre character give them a higher probability of winning. It is completely possible however for a low tier to beat a high tier or to win a tournament. Its just harder for the player using teh low tier in most cases.

 

[Planet Mars]

Uhm, no. I wanted an actual response from you, I didn't aim to insult you. I was completely serious with this post.

If you're implying that i spam a move with Kirby to win then i'm not sure i'm following the point of that post

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

Your attempt to exhibit any emotional response from me has resulted in failure. Insults and mockery have no merits with me.

I will record tournaments and my credentials. I will go to matches and beat everyone. And when i come back i'll taunt you with my cute puffiness. However, unlike most of those 'champions', i will be humble and share my strategies at the same time, because that is what makes a true player. Being good at the game doesn't make you a good player

Clever mindgames man.

If you go to Pound4, see if you can record your matches cause I can like...totally learn from you.

Edit: Hopefully you know what sarcasm is...

 

[Red Arremer]

If you're implying that i spam a move with Kirby to win then i'm not sure i'm following the point of that post

No. I didn't even talk about Kirby at all. Where do you get that?

I was making a thought experiment.

 

[Planet Mars]

Thats the thing, we are not saying that. It is inheritantly harder due to the attributes of each character that soem are more likely to lose to each other. We are not saying to dont main low tiers. We are not saying that top tiers will win every tournament. It is basically a rough outline of how each character does in relation to the cast. However, yes characters at the top are going to be seen at and winning tournament more often, simply because theyre character give them a higher probability of winning. It is completely possible however for a low tier to beat a high tier or to win a tournament. Its just harder for the player using teh low tier in most cases.

that makes sense, but there are people who are abusing that and saying that low tiers stink. So who's at fault--me or them?

 

[.Marik]

It is inheritantly harder due to the attributes of each character that soem are more likely to lose to each other.

It is basically a rough outline of how each character does in relation to the cast.

These two statements warrant me to say:

"Basically, this".

 

[gamerguy217]

Originally Posted by Planet Mars
I will go to matches and beat everyone.

Wow, you're not stuck up at all >.>

 

[BSP]

that makes sense, but there are people who are abusing that and saying that low tiers stink. So who's at fault--me or them?

Them, but you can't change that. Most smart people will see that the lower tiers can win, they just have a harder time doing so.

You completely missed Onishiba's point btw

 

[zeldspazz]

that makes sense, but there are people who are abusing that and saying that low tiers stink. So who's at fault--me or them?

Well its true. Relatively speaking a character in the lowest tier does suck compared to the ones in the highest tier. But isnt that to be expected? You are saying you believe in tiers. Now that isnt to say the player behind the character isnt a very good player. Its just the characters themselves that we are comparing, not the people who use them

 

[.Marik]

I'll post the PM I sent Planet Mars.

Yo.

I've seen your posts around the Tier List v.3 thread, and you do give off an impression you haven't the slightest clue you understand what you're talking about.

Well, I hope I can explain some things to you, I'm sorry if SWF is coming off as rude, but this is basically what we do as a serious hobby. We have extensively studied the metagame inside and out, we have analyzed all these characters and their viability in controlled environments of equal skill level.

The Tier List really has nothing to do with personal skill level of an individual, rather, it has to do with a characters potential, or viability, against top players and the odds of placing and obtaining points for the further development of Tier Lists.

Yes, I play Yoshi. Who's practically Bottom-Tier, but I try really, really, really hard to win, because Yoshi is garbage, hence why he's so low in the Tier List.

All those characters at the bottom? They are there for a reason. They absolutely suck compared to the characters at the top.

In Melee, these considerable gaps weren't as noticeable, but over-centralization and brokeness of characters have destroyed anything remotely similar to balance.

See I play Yoshi. He sucks, but I learn matchups. AT's and how to play him effectively.

The lower you go down, the harder it is, hence why they are ranked in a specific order, and it's accumulated by an assortment of tournament results, which is primarily used to determine a characters viability in a competitive scene.

So, I ****. People are like "omg yoshi is bottom tier!1" and I simply say "I know. I just work hard with him"

Is it possible? Sure. But is it really hard? Yes, because he's trash and is ranked low for a valid and legitimate reason.

You play Kirby, a character far from Bottom Tier.

Ally is the best player in the world when it comes to Brawl, and he beat Mew2King, the best player in the world.

Ally has proven Snake is capable, as well as overall tournament results and Snake possesses lots of tools and options to allow him to place against the rest of the roster.

Hope this makes sense.

Tiers exist man, it's undeniable. You just have to work harder if you play a crappier character.

I tried to explain it in simplest terms possible.

 

[황미영]

First of all. WHO THE **** IS PLANET MARS?! This person comes in here and starts claiming to be some great *** player. Once you get wrecked by high level players, then you will shut up. Or not, most likely start Johning.

Listen, stop making false claims and/or trolling. 'Kay?

 

[.Marik]

We don't know -for sure- whether he's actually trolling, but then again, it's really hard to pinpoint a troll when they're not completely 100% obvious.

 

[BSP]

First of all. WHO THE **** IS PLANET MARS?! This person comes in here and starts claiming to be some great *** player. Once you get wrecked by high level players, then you will shut up. Or not, most likely start Johning.

Listen, stop making false claims and/or trolling. 'Kay?

One man's opinion, but I don't think this is the necessary approach. Flaming doesn't get anyone anywhere

I agree with you, but...i wouldn't say it like that.

Maybe I'm too nice...

 

[Suspect]

how can you have 2 best players in the world?

 

[zeldspazz]

@Marik: I think what hes caught up on is that he thinks it means people who main bottom tiers are bad players. Which isnt true and you told him isnt true (I tried to say that too in my last post)

 

[Flayl]

Marik: You didn't tell him anything new.

 

[황미영]

One man's opinion, but I don't think this is the necessary approach. Flaming doesn't get anyone anywhere

I agree with you, but...i wouldn't say it like that.

Maybe I'm too nice...

I'm not really flaming. I'm just stating the obvious. Most cocky ignorant people lose and make up some excuse for it. So, I'm saying once he goes to a tournament where it has high level players that use top tier characters maybe then he will change his mind.

 

[★Chaos★]

ppl who main bottem tier's can be good,but have a higher chance of being bad

 

[gamerguy217]

ppl who main bottem tier's can be good,but have a higher chance of being bad

Don't you mean have to work harder to play against high tier mains?...

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Please link us your achievements in offline, hell online as well, tournaments. To be quite frank, I really doubt you could reach the top of any major tournament.

Completely irrelevant to his post.

 

[Aibou]

ppl who main bottem tier's can be good,but have a higher chance of being bad

That makes no sense Falcon

 

[.Marik]

@ Flayl: To him it's new and completely foreign news, I would imagine.

how can you have 2 best players in the world?

Ally is Brawl. Mew2King is overall, because of his placings in both Melee and Brawl tournaments.

@Marik: I think what hes caught up on is that he thinks it means people who main bottom tiers are bad players. Which isnt true and you told him isnt true (I tried to say that too in my last post)

It doesn't mean that at all though.

Planet Mars, the Tier List solely has to do with particular characters viability in a controlled setting.

The characters themselves are lackluster and often hold players back, which is why it's suggested you play a higher-ranked character, because they possess more appropriate attributes and qualities required for placing.

See the characters at the bottom? They usually have more mediocre matchups as you go further down, which subsequently affects tournament placings and the position on the Tier List.

I've seen players with poorly ranked characters place, but it's so much harder and you will never win a national or regional, even.

We have thoroughly analyzed and studied Brawl, so you have to understand why some members find your arguments which are devoid of any proof or evidence; quite silly.

 

[BSP]

ppl who main bottem tier's can be good,but have a higher chance of being bad

you mean a higher chance of losing?

 

[zeldspazz]

I dont think anyone ever knows what Falcon means =.= lol

 

[Mr. Johan]

What i'm disagreeing with is the people who say any character not in the top tier will lose against a character that is, period.

No one's saying that only a top tier will win a tournament all the time, although they arguably will most of the time. If they did win all the time, their matchups ratios would have even greater amount of 70:30s and lower. They're just saying that they have an easier shot at winning said tournament, primarily because they have a multitude of tools at their disposal which they can abuse. Meta Knight has transcendent priority, fantastic attack speed, and fantastic recovery options, Snake has great stage control, and long-range tilts in case the fight is taken up close, Diddy Kong has his bananas, Falco has the chaingrab and Laser, and so on.

The tier list takes tournament results as a factor as well. If a character is winning tournaments left and right over a long period of time, then that means that there must be something about that character that makes him a threat to every other character, even at the top level of play. And because they are able to win tournaments consistently, people who are playing to win will likely take up this character, because it gives them a greater shot at winning the next tournament. This leads to an increase in representation, which leads to a greater shot at winning tournaments, and the cycle repeats.

If you are capable of beating the top players around consistently with a character that is not top tier, then that is a testament to your skill and/or to the fact that those top players do not know the matchup as well as others. If you are able to do that even longer, then it may show that the character has ability that people may not have realized beforehand. An example is how Sonic took a huge leap up on this list thanks to his consistent tournament results.

So if you are able to show that your able to beat the top characters, it may not necessarily change anything about their tier placings, because those characters still have advantages everywhere else on the board. But it will show that they are not unbeatable, as you think the tier list dictates.

 

[Aibou]

I dont think anyone ever knows what Falcon means =.= lol

you mean a higher chance of losing?

↑ I think that's what he means zeldspazz. Which would make sense.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I've seen players with poorly ranked characters place, but it's so much harder and you will never win a national or regional, even.

Never is a strong word.

 

[.Marik]

Never is a strong word.

But it rings true regardless, and by "win" I mean absolute 1st in regional or national tournaments.

 

[Flayl]

Completely irrelevant to his post.

But i'll have you know that if any more tournaments, whether world wide, televised, professional, whatever were to be set up, i would be able to carry Kirby, Pikachu, or Mario up to the top. That's how true professionals play--They play who they like, not who will win.

Learn to read please.

 

[zeldspazz]

And then there was silence

 

[Liquid Gen]

It's clear he didn't like Mr. Eh's vid.
I was trying to find something that showcased a different bowser, except there's like NONE on YT.
Also, There's like a huge gap between levels of play for Falco, I'm aware the Falco was pretty icky. The problem is that I have like very few resources.
The video did enough of a job to prove certain points wrong that were previously stated:
1. The battle isn't bagged when Falco gets a CG
2. Fortress isn't the only thing to worry about
3. Falco can't kill Bowser until a much higher percent than what has been stated

Old vido, old post lololo

If you're gonna use me use the one where I knew how to play vs Falco plx

*retusn to lurking*

 

[Planet Mars]

Clever mindgames man.

If you go to Pound4, see if you can record your matches cause I can like...totally learn from you.

I hope i'm not sensing sacrasm...It takes alot more than just winning. Winning it itself is nice, but winning because you are better isn't fun. Winning because you applied what you knew better is a true win, but the way you handle that win is what determines whether you are a stuck up fool or an honest and genuine player.

 

[gamerguy217]

 

[Planet Mars]

Is Planet Mars Trolling:

Have i directly insulted anyone? Nope
Have i voice an opinion on something? Yes
Have i said any character a particular person on this forum plays is 'trash'? Nope
Have i claimed the forum is lousy? Other than disagreeing, which is natural, nope
Have i claimed to be the best player in the world? Nope
Have i claimed that I know Kirby's potential and can emerge victorious in most battles with him? Yes

If anything, you guys are all shunning me because i play Kirby. I also had no intention in calling anyone childish, but it's clear that many children are on here who are resorting to immature replies and insights onto the discussion at hand.

I'm just a player like you. I enjoy the game and i love playing it just for the heck of it, but at the same time i have mastered certain characters and know how to play them at a competitive level. I will participate in more tournaments to give my claim more credit. However, i'd appreciate it if people supported others who aspire to do great, instead of ridicule them and shut them down. But i guess that's the world we live in right?

 

[Red Arremer]

Who mentioned Kirby? O_o

 

[gamerguy217]

I will go to matches and beat everyone.

This statement still stands >.>

 

[Planet Mars]

Who mentioned Kirby? O_o

was in a different thread where a few people said Kirby stinks and i do as well if i play him.

 

[zeldspazz]

Thats not us though so I dont know why you are accusing us of saying that when we definitely are not. Go take it out on those people?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

But it rings true regardless, and by "win" I mean absolute 1st in regional or national tournaments.

Still a strong word to use.

Learn to read please.

More like asking how well a person does is irrelevant to an argument.

He did open the door when he said he could carry people to the top, but trying to play a placing war won't advance any discussion on the matter and will result in a, "My **** is bigger than your ****." thing.