The Official Geno Thread

[Machspeed]

so basicly i cant post my opionin that i dislike geno, oh wow kill me.

also look at other third parties, all of them have had more than one game with a character from ther franchis in it

Sonicteam has had countless tiltles on nintendo consles
Konami has had 3 or 4
And if megaman gets in, well they had a ton too

Geno unfortunatly has had one, wich could mean nothing, but i think it does mean somthing

No I'm saying your a troll, because you specifically said "to piss of the fanboys". That suggests your in search of an argument.

Pit had one game, enough said there.

 

[Wrath`]

No I'm saying your a troll, because you specifically said "to piss of the fanboys". That suggests your in search of an argument.

Pit had one game, enough said there.

pit was an is owned by nintendo..

 

[Pieman0920]

The game was initially called Super Mario RPG 2, then Super Mario Adventure during production.
Paper Mario was a spiritual sequel to Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars for the Super NES, and is the first game in the Paper Mario series of video games. It has had two sequels released; the first, for the Nintendo GameCube entitled Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door, and a second for the Wii entitled Super Paper Mario, which is designed as a platformer with role-playing elements.

Source

Yes, but that doesn't mean Square was involved, does it? It was a Mario Role Playing Game. Nintendo could use the name, but decided to change it, since it was so different from the original, I guess.

Geno's not a more of an "up-to-date" character appearing in video games because of the SMRPG breaking. He's more of a Retro character, sort of like Pit. (Well, he might as well be since we're most likely not going to see a SMRPG2 either ever or for a long time.) Sakurai seems to like Retro; if this be the last game Geno will be in, I'll be satisfied.

Breaking? And he's not really retro like Pit. Retro goes back to the NES days instead of the SNES really. Heck, Ness isn't back, so does Sakurai really like retro? He has Pit, ICs, and possibly Game & Watch, in comparison to all the new and up to date characters. Sure he'll throw in nostalgic things like trophies, music, and the like, but I don't think that means he's aiming for retro characters all to much. And heck, all those retro characters were actually the stars of their own games, instead of what Geno is. =/

 

[Machspeed]

Breaking? And he's not really retro like Pit. Retro goes back to the NES days instead of the SNES really. Heck, Ness isn't back, so does Sakurai really like retro? He has Pit, ICs, and possibly Game & Watch, in comparison to all the new and up to date characters. Sure he'll throw in nostalgic things like trophies, music, and the like, but I don't think that means he's aiming for retro characters all to much. And heck, all those retro characters were actually the stars of their own games, instead of what Geno is. =/

If you played the SMRPG, Mario's goal is met short-handedly, and pretty much every character plays an equal important role in the game. Mario rescues Peach less than half of the game through.

Mallow has to find his true parents, Bowser must regain his castle, Geno must get the stars to repair star road. There is no "main character" in the RPG, there all share interests at hand which must be met and pursued.

And yes, he likes Retro. If I were to say Game & Watch were to be in Melee, a couple years before release, half the people would laugh and point, and half the people wouldn't know who he was.

EDIT - Here is the article containing that there will be an SMRPG2 sequel eventually on the DS.

 

[Cless]

What are we arguing about again?

 

[Pieman0920]

Mario is still the main character through and through though. From the end to the begining. Everyone else just has their goals when they join up, and then when it's complete. In the middle and throughout everything else though, it's Mario. That's why it's Super Mario RPG, and not something else.

And don't say there will be a sequel when it says it's a rumor.

 

[Machspeed]

You know, same old people always swing by to start an argument.

The usual argument revived over and over every week. "JINO IZ NOT GOIN TO GET A 3RD PRTY SLT BECUZ THERES MEGAMAN ND...," that kind of thing going on.

 

[Machspeed]

Mario is still the main character through and through though. From the end to the begining. Everyone else just has their goals when they join up, and then when it's complete. In the middle and throughout everything else though, it's Mario. That's why it's Super Mario RPG, and not something else.

Pay attention to the last part of the title. Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars.

That points out the significance of the stars to the game.
And no, Mario is just the main character because he has to be (It's developed by Nintendo and guess who's Nintendo's icon!).

EDIT - Not really a rumor if it can be found in a copy of an RPG magazine, now is it?

 

[Wrath`]

You know, same old people always swing by to start an argument.

The usual argument revived over and over every week. "JINO IZ NOT GOIN TO GET A 3RD PRTY SLT BECUZ THERES MEGAMAN ND...," that kind of thing going on.

well if you acept that it is possible we would not argue,

 

[Machspeed]

well if you acept that it is possible we would not argue,

It's just as possible he's added to Brawl, also.

 

[Cless]

Well, the way I see it, it's just as likely either way.

 

[Pieman0920]

And if Square wanted it to be a Geno-centric game, they would have made it without Mario. They made a Mario game though, intending for him to be the main. It wasn't that they were forced into it. You want a Square developed character who wasn't forced to play second fiddle to anyone? Go support Cloud. The fact of the matter though is that it was intended to be a Mario game, and it became a Mario game. Yes there are seven stars going around there, but that's what you collect. Mario started collecting those things even before Geno showed up, too. The justification here is like saying Goombella should be in because she wanted to open the Thousand Year Door in PM2.

 

[Machspeed]

And if Square wanted it to be a Geno-centric game, they would have made it without Mario. They made a Mario game though, intending for him to be the main. It wasn't that they were forced into it. You want a Square developed character who wasn't forced to play second fiddle to anyone? Go support Cloud. The fact of the matter though is that it was intended to be a Mario game, and it became a Mario game. Yes there are seven stars going around there, but that's what you collect. Mario started collecting those things even before Geno showed up, too. The justification here is like saying Goombella should be in because she wanted to open the Thousand Year Door in PM2.

Never said it was all dedicated to Geno. Just letting you know that the whole thing is not based around Mario. "Super Mario" is just the title. Mario started collecting the stars, but he didn't have a clue as to what purpose they served until meeting Geno.

And I don't know why you keep bringing up Cloud around this forum, his 2 minute boss fight in KH2 CoM gives him very close to none chances on appearing in Brawl.

 

[Yitik]

And if Square wanted it to be a Geno-centric game, they would have made it without Mario. They made a Mario game though, intending for him to be the main. It wasn't that they were forced into it. You want a Square developed character who wasn't forced to play second fiddle to anyone? Go support Cloud. The fact of the matter though is that it was intended to be a Mario game, and it became a Mario game. Yes there are seven stars going around there, but that's what you collect. Mario started collecting those things even before Geno showed up, too. The justification here is like saying Goombella should be in because she wanted to open the Thousand Year Door in PM2.

NO! No FF characters. I can't stand that series. And the creators of Brawl must bow to what I can't stand .

The fact is, guys, if you play SMRPG you will notice that the storyteller basically is Geno. Mario and Mallow were intrigued by the stars, yes, but only when they met Geno was it made their mission to get those stars (when before it was to rescue Peach). If it wasn't for Geno, from a story-based perspective, the game would have ended with Booster Tower.

So yes, he is very important, and he is one mysterious bugger who we never really learn the whole truth of. Having him in another game would be a good plan for us, the fans, as well since it might open windows to further games featuring Geno.

Plus the fact that he is a pretty unique character. A doll that shoots stuff out of his hands, and utilizes the power of stars to augment skill and attack opponents with blazing light? Better than another swordsman or plumber, in this one's opinion.

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

well if you acept that it is possible we would not argue,

We've always accepted that Megaman could make it in (I support him), but saying that Geno won't be in because of Megaman is what you guys say. Don't know if you've said it just like that Koarin, but just in general, that's what goes down.

 

[Pieman0920]

Never said it was all dedicated to Geno. Just letting you know that the whole thing is not based around Mario. "Super Mario" is just the title. Mario started collecting the stars, but he didn't have a clue as to what purpose they served until meeting Geno.

And I don't know why you keep bringing up Cloud around this forum, his 2 minute boss fight in KH2 CoM gives him very close to none chances on appearing in Brawl.

Does that mean we should add in Roselina, or any of the other characters that fulfill this type of roll? There are a heck of a lot of them.

And I bring up Cloud, because he's the poster boy of SE. And the fact that you think that he shouldn't get in due to his lack of appearance on Nintendo systems is probably one of the more hypocritical things out there. Aren't you guys the Geno fans? I thought you guys would argue against a lack of screen time. =/

 

[Machspeed]

Does that mean we should add in Roselina, or any of the other characters that fulfill this type of roll? There are a heck of a lot of them.

And I bring up Cloud, because he's the poster boy of SE. And the fact that you think that he shouldn't get in due to his lack of appearance on Nintendo systems is probably one of the more hypocritical things out there. Aren't you guys the Geno fans? I thought you guys would argue against a lack of screen time. =/

Let's see, Cloud had a total of about 5 minutes on a Game Boy Advance. Geno had over 5 hours of screen time on a Nintendo console. Not hypocritical at all, looking at it from Sakurai's point of view. The more you appear on the console, the better your chances are.

And the thing is, Cloud had the chance to be on Nintendo consoles, but his games have always prevailed on Sony. Geno has never been on any other console besides a Nintendo-themed one. (counting the GBA cameo)

 

[Pieman0920]

Sure it is. One of the biggest problems you guys have is that Geno's only shown up for one game. But suddenly since that's a flaw for someone else as well, you put it back into effect? And even though it's only one for Nintendo, he still has loads of time elsewhere, easily beating out Geno.

And Sonic started off as the dreaded competition. But now things are different. The past doesn't matter, so I don't know why you think its relevant. It's more of Square going against Nintendo than anything yesterday, and if there was still a grudge about that, then you'd know Geno wouldn't get in.

 

[Cless]

Sonic is relevant to Nintendo's history. Cloud isn't.

 

[Machspeed]

That's not a problem for me. He had a very long appearance in the SMRPG, kind of how Pit's been in one game. For NINTENDO, and that's all that matters. Sakurai doesn't care how much time he gets on other systems.

Your entitled to your opinions, but I find no reason to run into a thread of a character who you don't believe is going to get in, just to start flame wars. Leave those who believe he will be in to that and just don't click the thread.

Are you really that bored?

EDIT- And by Geno's small cameo appearance in Superstar Saga, it shows SE has no problem loaning the rights to him. They just had a small mention in the credits, and they were satisfied.

 

[Cless]

Well, the thread would be boring if no one argued against his inclusion.

 

[Machspeed]

Sure it was fun arguing in the beginning, but now it's the same perpetual arguments being brought up, with no progress.

I'd rather discuss things like "costume recolors, stages, music" if he was confirmed, or even the SMRPG. Sure would be alot better than people ****ting on him pretty much daily.

 

[Pieman0920]

How do you know what Sakurai cares about? Snake's got references other MGS games that aren't going to be on a Nintendo console.

And didn't the director of M&LSS used to work at Square? Or worked on SMRPG? He'd already know the people and connections to get him in. Also there weren't multiple third party characters at the same time already. >_>

(And yeah, a topic where there's no debate, and just mindless praise is pointless...remember the Ridley topics?)

 

[Machspeed]

What MGS games would those be?

I'd like to see some proof that the M&LSS director used to work at Square.

 

[Cless]

I don't see why it matters that he used to work at Square or not. He didn't when he worked on the game, and they'd still have to negotiate his inclusion.

Well, he wears camo as color changes. That's from MGS3.

 

[Machspeed]

Ahh... forgot the costume changes.

Yeah, I bet. And hopefully they got to a compromise on his appearance in Brawl also.

JINO 4 BRWL

 

[AmericanGTS]

Do you guys think that Cloud would really shift sales that much? I mean.. the people that want to buy Brawl are pretty much all determined by now. I doubt that there are people out there saying "Smash Bros Brawl is going to suck UNLESS Cloud is a playable character". How many people are requesting him? It isn't like Cloud is going to change the game completely.. so whats the deal? Sonic is the character to blame for locking in sales, I also doubt that people are going to say Cloud's addition into Brawl is more significant that Sonic's. Here is something to think about... why would Nintendo want to go ahead and pay Square Enix all this money for Cloud when the game is already going to sell incredibly well? There aren't that many more people to convince, I mean it would have to take A LOT to really shift sales and I'm not quite sure which character could do it at this point.

 

[Devastlian]

Yup, Square-Enix made a big mistake switching from Nintendo, it's the leading system on the market atm.

And it was the opposite when they left. They're making games for every system now.

I dont recall ever seeing Pokemon trainer in 3-d until brawl..so geno should be fine

Pokemon Colesseum.

Sonic is relevant to Nintendo's history. Cloud isn't.

If Sonic is, then Cloud is. It's pretty much the exact same situation.

That's not a problem for me. He had a very long appearance in the SMRPG, kind of how Pit's been in one game. For NINTENDO, and that's all that matters. Sakurai doesn't care how much time he gets on other systems.

How do you know this?

EDIT- And by Geno's small cameo appearance in Superstar Saga, it shows SE has no problem loaning the rights to him. They just had a small mention in the credits, and they were satisfied.

How do you know this? Did they tell you they didn't charge for his appearance or demand some of the profits or whatever?

What MGS games would those be?

His design in SSBB is his MGS2 design, the CYPHER he uses in his up special move is from MGS2, and Metal Gear RAY appears on his stage. There's also the costumes already mentioned.

I'd like to see some proof that the M&LSS director used to work at Square.

http://www.vgmuseum.com/end/snes/a/mariorpg3.htm Second name under directors.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1H4DxquxqDA @3:31

 

[Cless]

How is Cloud relevant? The only way he is relevant is that he is a giant slap in the face to Nintendo. The Genesis-SNES console war was the biggest console war yet. Sonic was more popular than Mario at one point. That was competition; not a giant stab in the back.

 

[AmericanGTS]

If Sonic is, then Cloud is. It's pretty much the exact same situation.

Yes because Nintendo was in direct competition with Square Enix's Genesis system and Cloud was Mario's direct competition for fifteen years. Lets not forget that Square Enix gave up in the counsel wars after their Dreamcast and what system is Cloud primarily appearing on these days?

Has anyone else played Cloud Adventure 2 Battle?

 

[Machspeed]

If Sonic is, then Cloud is. It's pretty much the exact same situation.

That's bull and you know it, Sonic has been in a TON of more games than Cloud. Since Sega has not had a system in quite awhile, Nintendo has been the company they've been leaning towards for most of their games.

How do you know this? Did they tell you they didn't charge for his appearance or demand some of the profits or whatever?

Everyone who has a third party in the game is going to get some kind of benefit. That's pretty obvious.

And it was the opposite when they left. They're making games for every system now.

They may make games for every system, but they are still predominately on Sony making games.

How do you know this?

Sakurai wouldn't put in a character that never appeared on a Nintendo console. That's just common sense. It is a Nintendo exclusive, so I'm guessing they'd only put characters on it that have been on Nintendo.

 

[Devastlian]

Ya, that's why I said "pretty much". He was pretty much the main character, along with Snake, of the competition. Now they're all making games for Nintendo and Nintendo welcomes them and all of that.

 

[Machspeed]

No, what you said is that Cloud is relevant to Nintendo's history, which is just not true.

 

[AmericanGTS]

Ya, that's why I said "pretty much". He was pretty much the main character, along with Snake, of the competition. Now they're all making games for Nintendo and Nintendo welcomes them and all of that.

Cloud has never appeared as the main protagonist of ANY Nintendo title. He appeared in a brief cameo in a GBA game. Hmm, sounds familiar...

 

[SiegK]

Sorry for DP

 

[Fatmanonice]

@Fatmanonice
I found this on the dojo about Saki:
He rivals just about any main character. There were many requests from users for his inclusion, and he IS pretty cool, so I did what I could to include him. After all, this game does let you enjoy a dream cast of supporting characters!

Didnt you say Saki wasnt on polls?
And could that mean something for Geno.

He was definately voted for in the poll but he wasn't in Sakurai's journal. You see, the Toukeden (what I and many people refer to as Sakurai's journal), was the offical poll that Nintendo ran from the E3 06 to the second week of June 06. During that time, Sakurai posted on the japanese dojo site about 10 entries into the poll a day for 29 days that interested/amused him and his staff the most for that particular day. It is estimated that they recieved roughly 333 entires a day for a grand total of about 10,000 entires in all since it was open to the world despite being in Japanese. (There were a lot of sites that translated the poll and they did accept entires in foreign languages.)

In the 290 entires that Sakurai and his staff chose, more then 100 characters appeared. Only 21 of them were mentioned more then once and about half of those were mentioned 3 or more times: Geno (5 entries), King Dedede (5 entries), Diddy Kong (4 entires), Ridley (4 entries), Krystal (4 entries), Ike (4 entries), Claus (4 entries), Captain Olimar (3 entries), Takamaru (3 entries), and an Animal Crossing rep (3 times, two didn't ask for anyone specific and one wanted Tom Nook but didn't mind if someone else repped the franchise instead).

*I mentioned the ones mentioned more then two times because some of the characters that were mentioned twice have already been shot down like Jeff, Sigurd, and Diddy and Dixie as a team, one has been added (Lucas), and another's chances was severally reduced because of another update (Demille because of the Stafy update). Twice mentioned characters like King K. Rool, Isaac (based on a technically) and Megaman are still in the running though and likely as newcomers*

Now, because this journal reflects what Sakurai and his staff were interested in (but it by no means they are absolutely guarenteed a spot but it does give them a decent amount of support), it is expected that some very popular characters didn't appear. Sakurai even said in the journal himself that "adding just popular characters doesn't excite me." I personally believe (and there is strong evidence) that Sakurai was referring to characters he was going to make playable. Let's look at some of the people who have been made into ATs:

1. Samurai Goroh-easily the most requested F-Zero character since even before Melee and yet he didn't appear in Sakurai's journal.

2. Lyn-many polls both in Japan and North America showed that she wasn't too far behind Ike when it came to the next Fire Emblem character people wanted in Brawl but she didn't appear in Sakurai's journal either.

3. Deoxyes-the winner of the offical poll asking Japan who their favorite legardary pokemon was that Nintendo ran before the eighth(?) pokemon movie. Sakurai even went out and told us that Deoxyes was a very popular character but, like the Goroh and Lyn, he didn't appear in Sakurai's journal.

4. Saki- Sakurai came right out and told us just how popular this character was and how many people demanded him and yet, once again, he didn't appear at all in Sakurai's journal.

5. Waluigi- To everyone's horror, was actually the 4th most requested character for the next Smash Bros game in Nintendo Power's offical poll back in 2005 behind Wario, Toad, and Captain Olimar. Despite being highly recongized and appearing in more then 20 games since his debut, he also didn't appear in Sakurai's journal.

6. Toad and Daisy-same situation as above

7. Gardevoir-the only pokemon that actually mentioned once in Sakurai's journal and actually believed to be the most popular pokemon in Japan. This is yet another character that was sent to the preverbial graveyard.

8. Munchlax-referred to by some as the "pichu" of the Diamond and Pearl generation. This pokemon also has a massive following in Japan but didn't appear in Sakurai's journal and became a pokeball pokemon.

9. Meowth-similar situation as the two above

10. Little Mac- Only appeared once in Sakurai's journal and Sakurai hinted that, like the others I've mentioned, was highly suggested. He once noted how Punch Out, the Mystery of Murasume Castle and the Adventures of Lolo were his favorite games. Despite this, Little Mac became an AT and, at this point, it seems like Lolo and Muddy Mole (two other characters he said he really liked in different interviews) will probably go the same route since neither of them were mentioned either. Oddly enough, Takamaru (the star of "the Mystery of Murasume Castle) was mentioned three times and Sakurai has already made two really popular katanna users (Lyn and Goroh) into ATs. Perhaps he's making room for this hero? Only time will tell...

*side note: Sonic was mentioned in an interview but Sakurai didn't state how he felt about the character and meerly reflected on how he knew other people felt about him and the freakish demand for him. I believe the eight characters that Sakurai has mentioned in interviews since 2001 (Lucas, Sigurd, Little Mac, Muddy Mole, Lolo, Lip, the Balloon Fighter, and Sonic) are mostly exempt from the "journal rule" despite more then half of them being mentioned at least once within it. In other words, Sakurai sourcing them outside of the journal's context is relatively important despite, as he has said in the past, not just adding characters only he wants*

So there you go, ten examples regarding popular characters and providing evidence that Sakurai's journal provides evidence about who Sakurai and his team are interested in making playable.

On an ending note, it should also be noted that these characters were also only mentioned once and made into ATs/bosses:

1. Petey Pirhanna
2. Hammer Bros
3. the Advance Wars infantry men
4. the Excite Biker

 

[SiegK]

Do you guys want to Help Avenge Geno? Ill tell you now.

 

[Machspeed]

Wow, your evidence is extremely convincing Fatman.

You help restore faith to those who want Geno in.

 

[Devastlian]

That's bull and you know it, Sonic has been in a TON of more games than Cloud. Since Sega has not had a system in quite awhile, Nintendo has been the company they've been leaning towards for most of their games.

Alright...maybe I over exaggerated that bit.

Everyone who has a third party in the game is going to get some kind of benefit. That's pretty obvious.

What other third-parties were in M&L?

They may make games for every system, but they are still predominately on Sony making games.

There're more games coming out for Nintendo systems than Sony systems. They've publically bashed Sony and the PS3, as well.

Sakurai wouldn't put in a character that never appeared on a Nintendo console. That's just common sense. It is a Nintendo exclusive, so I'm guessing they'd only put characters on it that have been on Nintendo.

I think that's more common knowledge.

No, what you said is that Cloud is relevant to Nintendo's history, which is just not true.

In that context, he is. Before whatever Sonic game first appeared on a Nintendo system. That can be considered the same kind of situation as with Sonic. Maybe not to the same degree but Squaresoft announcing they were making games for Nintendo again and SEGA announcing they were making games for Nintendo were pretty much the same thing...along with Capcom announcing those (what would obviously not be true) exclusive games for the GCN and Konami announcing MGS:TS. Cloud has a sort of rivalry with Link but, again, not as extreme as Sonic and Mario's.

Cloud has never appeared as the main protagonist of ANY Nintendo title. He appeared in a brief cameo in a GBA game. Hmm, sounds familiar...

Ya, that sort of insignifigance should be ignored.

 

[Cless]

Cloud had a rivalry with Link... Wha?