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The NEW Zero Suit Samus Video Archives (Updated: 01/16/2009)

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noradseven

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Czm4tNvUgo4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_AK5PruU0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGR0W5D3mdQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAwi1TpQ524

edit: Posted on accident before I could say:

These are ZSS vs Pit matches of mine. If anyone's interested I can post more here because I will be getting some more soon. This seems like an appropriate place to post these?
Why would you ever roll dodge with ZSS so much, you are not pit/lucario.
 

ohaiduhg

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Why would you ever roll dodge with ZSS so much, you are not pit/lucario.
Serious question?

Considering I'm against a Pit,


She has really good tilts/jabbing.
If I don't keep actively moving arrows catch me.
I can't Spot Dodge much, because his jabbing will catch me.

I'm not really sure how to answer it. It's more of a stylistic thing. My style is more aggressive as opposed to dancing around the air with the Up B and Uair. If I don't Roll Dodge I'm going to get owned.
 

Snakeee

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Serious question?

Considering I'm against a Pit,


She has really good tilts/jabbing.
If I don't keep actively moving arrows catch me.
I can't Spot Dodge much, because his jabbing will catch me.

I'm not really sure how to answer it. It's more of a stylistic thing. My style is more aggressive as opposed to dancing around the air with the Up B and Uair. If I don't Roll Dodge I'm going to get owned.
Run - Power shield - Run - Power shield - and then when you're close enough either do like an f-tilt or grab.

You can also short hop airdodge through them if you're not that great at powershielding the arrows. It's worth it to practice that though.
 

ohaiduhg

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Run - Power shield - Run - Power shield - and then when you're close enough either do like an f-tilt or grab.

You can also short hop airdodge through them if you're not that great at powershielding the arrows. It's worth it to practice that though.
I thought my shielding and dodging of the arrows was pretty good. Using ZSS' grab is asking to get punishment, especially against Pit. He's really good at pulling out of attacks, and her grab has lag all over it, so... yeah. D:
 

ph00tbag

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The only roll I can understand using ever is forward roll, because of how much it displaces your sprite in the first frames, but otherwise, it's still not a good roll. PSing projectiles is almost invariably a better option for ZSS, as it imparts much less of a disadvantage, and allows you to be more precise with spacing. This is especially vital against Pit.
 

ohaiduhg

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The only roll I can understand using ever is forward roll, because of how much it displaces your sprite in the first frames, but otherwise, it's still not a good roll. PSing projectiles is almost invariably a better option for ZSS, as it imparts much less of a disadvantage, and allows you to be more precise with spacing. This is especially vital against Pit.
If you keep a constant dodging style, you run the risk of becoming predictable.
 

ph00tbag

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If you keep a constant dodging style, you run the risk of becoming predictable.
True, but predicting a powershield will get your opponent nowhere; they may know you'll do it, but the technique is designed not to be punishable. Furthermore, PSing is a means of benefiting from prediction. So if your opponent predicts that you're going to predict him and punish him, then he shouldn't be doing what he's doing anyway.

There's very little projectile characters can do about powershields.
 

ohaiduhg

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True, but predicting a powershield will get your opponent nowhere; they may know you'll do it, but the technique is designed not to be punishable. Furthermore, PSing is a means of benefiting from prediction. So if your opponent predicts that you're going to predict him and punish him, then he shouldn't be doing what he's doing anyway.

There's very little projectile characters can do about powershields.

This powershield predicting really relies on the ZSS being a lot better than the Pit. I play a Pit mainer who I would consider to be at my level. Zero Suit Samus struggles getting him to be combo-able. He has all those extra jumps and quick prioritizing aerial and blahblahblah.

Anyways, thanks for the critique, all. This is just turning into a Pit matchup discussion.:p
 

FadedImage

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The only roll I can understand using ever is forward roll, because of how much it displaces your sprite in the first frames, but otherwise, it's still not a good roll.
I have to disagree with you there...

thread:
K Prime's thread said:
5-12 / 23 Metaknight
4-19 / 27 Lucario
4-17 / 27 Pit
4-15 / 27 Zero Suit Samus
4-19 / 29 Diddy
4-19 / 29 Squirtle
top 6 forward rolls in the game...
 

noradseven

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Ehhh darkwater, once ZSS gets pit in the air she is in a very good spot, its mostly the pain of his ground defense especially if he is under a platform that cause's all the problems, part of the problem is that pit is pretty much the easiest character in the game and when you have a hard time fighting that it can be pretty annoying, read Ky in GG:Isuka there is a reason why everyone still curses him.

I have to disagree with you there...

thread:


top 6 forward rolls in the game...
Her forward roll true, however normally forward rolling gets you killed, at least it should, some people get :dizzy: by it, though.
 

ohaiduhg

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Ehhh darkwater, once ZSS gets pit in the air she is in a very good spot, its mostly the pain of his ground defense especially if he is under a platform that cause's all the problems, part of the problem is that pit is pretty much the easiest character in the game and when you have a hard time fighting that it can be pretty annoying, read Ky in GG:Isuka there is a reason why everyone still curses him.



Her forward roll true, however normally forward rolling gets you killed, at least it should, some people get :dizzy: by it, though.
Depends how you put him in the air. You can Dsmash stun him if he is under a platform, too.:p
 

shlike

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ohaiduhg

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Finals of Local Tourney a couple of days ago

[1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ypvv_JDhTU
[2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tSqCTodBmM
[3] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HP3Hdyo05uE
[4] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaXaMWNivfE
[5] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgS-8eIYcmA

p.s.
he also knocked me out of winners, but i did three stock him on lylat ( no vid :/ )

p.s.s.

I HAVE NO IDEA WHY I WENT NORFAIR INSTEAD OF RC

(facepalm)
You need to be more aggressive. There were instances you could have killed with Fsmash KO'd.:O Work on your SideB and Neutral B spacing.

You confused me. Final Destination you played weirdly, but Brinstar you knew the level pretty well?? Why?XD You won on both stages... still.:p

Yeaaahhhh I wouldn't have gone with Norfair either. It was fun to watch, though.:p

With whatever said, you looked like a natural with ZSS.
 

shlike

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heh thanks I guess and really going agressive against marths isnt a very good idea, I wasn't playing too smart at times either, but w/e thats how you learn, and lol @ fsmash ko
 

ohaiduhg

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heh thanks I guess and really going agressive against marths isnt a very good idea, I wasn't playing too smart at times either, but w/e thats how you learn, and lol @ fsmash ko
If you know how to space the SideB on him you out everything he has including his counter. But, yeah, you Dsmash stun'd him when he was really high in %. You could have followed that with Fsmash since he was level with you.

lol yeah, I know I've had a fair share of stupid moments to learn from.XD
 

shlike

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If you know how to space the SideB on him you out everything he has including his counter. But, yeah, you Dsmash stun'd him when he was really high in %. You could have followed that with Fsmash since he was level with you.

lol yeah, I know I've had a fair share of stupid moments to learn from.XD
if you spam side b it becomes predictable, and can be punished, trust me I used to think side b was zss's best move and after seeing how many options she has BESIDES side b, I tend not to spam it as much (at least I try not to) I'm just learning how to get more and more creative with zss, and I'm having sooooo much fun with it.

Now only if I could do that in tourney... lulz
 

WarpStatus

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Just wondering Nick, but why do you rarely double d smash? I know as much as anyone sometimes we buffer a jump or something right after the first to go right into an attack. However, there were times where a double dsmash was plausible, but it looked like you just waited.
 

Hence

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Just wondering Nick, but why do you rarely double d smash? I know as much as anyone sometimes we buffer a jump or something right after the first to go right into an attack. However, there were times where a double dsmash was plausible, but it looked like you just waited.
Example One: Snake cannot DI out of a D-Tilt following a D-Smash at low percentages.

Example Two: Pivot B-Air and Receeding Plasma Whip are very difficult to land after a second D-Smash.
 

NickRiddle

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Just wondering Nick, but why do you rarely double d smash? I know as much as anyone sometimes we buffer a jump or something right after the first to go right into an attack. However, there were times where a double dsmash was plausible, but it looked like you just waited.
Umm, I was kinda scared fighting him. I got out of the habit of double downsmashing because I used to do it on instinct, and get punished when the first one hit the shield. /fail It seems to help me in those matches though. (Chops is scary with his pressure sometimes. -.-)

Hence: I don't find it hard to double downsmash and bair, I was just... nervous and trying to be very safe. (Like, if he shields the hit, I can follow with jab, ftilt, dtilt, utilt, or I can run away.)
 

wWw Dazwa

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Match 2, 1:34. I am stealing that so hard. I seriously thought "wait, no d-smash?" after the jabs, and then I noticed the down+B's hop and went "OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH." Still watching the other vids, but that particular part was crazy o_0

Only other things I've noticed were maybe not reading a Cypher airdodge early in game 2. The initial jump should've been enough to coax him into air-dodging, then with that read and correct timing, you could've nailed the fair you went for. You would've put Snake into an even worse position (an awkwardly spaced/timed Cypher) with more damage, but instead Snake got back to the stage and got a jab-ftilt in :(

Game 1...Your armor play seemed pretty weak, but my opinion on that changed in game 2.

K I've typed too much and I really want to watch the rest, very impressive and creative play :)

Also, who put Rainbow Road on their FD? That song only fits on Rainbow Cruise >_>
 

NickRiddle

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Match 2, 1:34. I am stealing that so hard. I seriously thought "wait, no d-smash?" after the jabs, and then I noticed the down+B's hop and went "OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH." Still watching the other vids, but that particular part was crazy o_0

Only other things I've noticed were maybe not reading a Cypher airdodge early in game 2. The initial jump should've been enough to coax him into air-dodging, then with that read and correct timing, you could've nailed the fair you went for. You would've put Snake into an even worse position (an awkwardly spaced/timed Cypher) with more damage, but instead Snake got back to the stage and got a jab-ftilt in :(

Game 1...Your armor play seemed pretty weak, but my opinion on that changed in game 2.

K I've typed too much and I really want to watch the rest, very impressive and creative play :)

Also, who put Rainbow Road on their FD? That song only fits on Rainbow Cruise >_>
Yeah, I know about the cypher thing. Sometimes when I follow him, he randomly bairs or uairs, so I'm cautious vs. him.

I use armor randomly. Sometimes I'm confident, and sometimes I am not, so it's pretty random if I decide to use them.

Thank you for the compliment. :3

ESAM did it. Ban him!
 

WarpStatus

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Example One: Snake cannot DI out of a D-Tilt following a D-Smash at low percentages.

Example Two: Pivot B-Air and Receeding Plasma Whip are very difficult to hait with after a second D-Smash.

With case one, snake is large its very easy to hit him with a forward air or up air followup from double dsmash even at 0 percent. Also with good spacing dash attack uptilt is very damaging. Not to mention you can go for footstool-> dair double dsmash. I do understand the last one is tricky, and I haven't pulled it off in a tourney match yet for lack of practice, and landing a dsmash at 0 percent doesn't happen too often. It is still an option.

For case two, pivot bair is difficult to hit maybe around the 90% if the snake is smart, but still at this percentile it is too early to go for a KO on a snake anyway. I would stick to a forward air or up air which is easier to hit after double dsmash. Around 110% and above you should be able to consistantly hit with bair out of a double dsmash because of the extra time you have for setup. If you're right above his head and then use bair he will run into the hitbox, you can't DI that.

*edit*

I noticed a bunch of posts were made while I was making mine. Just wanted to add that I understand exactly what you mean Nick when you are trying to be safe with the single one. I usually see snakeee do something similar in his vids. I still honestly believe your/his game can be improved with knowing when/where to use each and I understand that its hard with the fast paceness the game can take. Just my opinion anyway.
 

shlike

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Good stuff nick that fthrow, dash atk, jab, down b was seriously the best thing I've seen in a LONGGG TIME

keep it up man

and Yeah

watch out for snakes nair, if you SDI them right you can get behind him and get a free uair or just simply airdodge away
 

NickRiddle

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Good stuff nick that fthrow, dash atk, jab, down b was seriously the best thing I've seen in a LONGGG TIME

keep it up man

and Yeah

watch out for snakes nair, if you SDI them right you can get behind him and get a free uair or just simply airdodge away
Yeah... I learned how to SDI it FINALLY sometime during the second set. -.- That move owns my soul.
 

Nefarious B

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Very nice matches, I liked the jabx2 spotdodge mixup, I usually would just run away after completing the two or dtilt, which usually gets shielded and punished.
 

Hence

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With case one, snake is large its very easy to hit him with a forward air or up air followup from double dsmash even at 0 percent.
You shouldn't count on D-Smash > D-Smash > F-Air, as it's SDI-able and unreliable. Sorry, I wasn't thinking clearly or something when I typed my previous response. Or it's plausible that you misinterpreted my text. Either way, D-Tilt > D-Smash does in fact work at low percentages unless the Snake player jumps.
The frame window to jump is very small, so even if Snake does jump he'll likely eat a D-Smash. Considering his very slow and fast falling first jump, anyway.
 

ph00tbag

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Match 2, 1:34. I am stealing that so hard. I seriously thought "wait, no d-smash?" after the jabs, and then I noticed the down+B's hop and went "OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH." Still watching the other vids, but that particular part was crazy o_0
Wooooord. I'm nominating this one in the best vids of each character thread. Basically every KO in this match was brilliant, and aside from all that Snake grenade nonsense in the first stock, there are very few major mistakes.
 
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