The *NEW* Snake Matchup Discussion Index

[Dekillsage]

I got dis

 

[Ken Neth]

I don't get why we're still debating MVD's skill level instead of the actual matchup. MVD is good, no doubt about that. Whether he's a top snake in the country seems to be the main point of debate and it all seems to come down to differing opinions, and there's not really a way to prove that. So lets move on to the actual matchup

 

[MVD]

I don't get why we're still debating MVD's skill level instead of the actual matchup. MVD is good, no doubt about that. Whether he's a top snake in the country seems to be the main point of debate and it all seems to come down to differing opinions, and there's not really a way to prove that. So lets move on to the actual matchup

When so many people say I am there kinda is no debate, not many say I'm not

 

[Gadiel_VaStar]

MVD, don't give into it, you are one of the best Snakes in the world! Your Snake is so unique, and has a lot more potential than other Snakes, and quit saying that you don't have experience because you do, but you just have to soak it all in, and apply all that you learned so you can reach an even higher level.

 

[mikeray4]

Snake/Pika is ***.

Mike Ray did do exceptionally well...until I realized that all he does is DACUS and really basic **** (I was expecting more) and then I 3 stocked you on your counterpick.

**** is free.

Also, MVD is probably...3rd or 4th Snake in NA next to Razer, Ally, and maybe Havok (since Havok runs away from a lot of MUs with Snake, like Z's Pikachu)

#OnceAYearNamesearch

Also, he is even with NickRiddle this season (you can see that in our new PR), even against Ryo, loses to Seibrik, beat MJG at WHOBO4 the...2nd time they ever played? and whatever other wins are pretty damn recent (Except mampam, he hasn't beat mampam in a while)

You turned off the power.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

***** I was ALREADY 3 stocking you xD

 

[mikeray4]

***** I was ALREADY 3 stocking you xD

You were winning with half a stock. cheater cheater pumpkin eater

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I killed you once and was CGing you on the left when I was at like 40% lol

Still good ****, though.

 

[JTsm]

This is very productive.

 

[Roller]

MVD, you free as ****.

Stop frontin'.











<3

 

[Neon!]

Not sure what matchup we're supposed to be discussing currently, I've recently changed my mind on snake vs marth. It seems like many people are accepting that marth goes even with snake instead of slightly beating him, I'd have to agree with this as well.

I've played the matchup extensively with shaya and a little with Nike. Once you learn to avoid early gimps and DI his fair correctly the matchup becomes proggressively harder for marth because of snakes longevity.

 

[Attila_]

pity shaya is terrible. can't even beat scrubs with no mu experience like me.

<3

inbeforenamesearch

 

[clowsui]

meh.

i think marth vs snake has tons of room to develop and is more than likely going to develop into marth's favor as time progresses.

 

[Dekillsage]

Yolo dolphin slash is so annoying

 

[JTsm]

meh.

i think marth vs snake has tons of room to develop and is more than likely going to develop into marth's favor as time progresses.

It's def in Marth's favor. Most Marth's however suck and therefore make the MU more even.

 

[clowsui]

Sounding like Tutu now aren't we?

 

[Nike.]

I've always been in the dark about Math/Snake being even, considering that the Marth boards (for awhile) have considered it to be Marth's advantage.
Aside from Snake's weight, dacus alone is such a good "get-out-of-jail-free" card and covers itself quite well.
(obv Marth CAN beat/counter it, but it's such a good anti zoning move in general)
If it weren't for that move (of if it was difficult like Diddy/Sheik), Marth would clearly have the adv.

 

[JTsm]

Projectiles like grenades, C4 and even mines are pretty crucial in that MU. DACUS is too obvious, but I guess you can get hit by surprise. I really want to discuss the IC MU.

 

[Ken Neth]

Difficultly of doing something shouldn't have an effect on the match up. Lack of tech skill doesn't make the match up worse, it makes that person worse in that matchup.

And dacus really isn't that great.

 

[Jrugs]

This Mu is probably even. This Mu is ballz for a if therye even slightly less skilled than the .............However some times Neo makes me feel like Im playing a

 

[Shaya]

pity shaya is terrible. can't even beat scrubs with no mu experience like me.

<3

inbeforenamesearch

yo *****, money match.


Also my Marth spy network alerted me to your bull ****

 

[Ralph Cecil]

If dacus is the hardest thing to deal with in the mu then i'd say that's pretty good lol.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Sounding like Tutu now aren't we?

What a great nanesearch. Glad to see my teachings are spreading.

 

[Attila_]

yo *****, money match.


Also my Marth spy network alerted me to your bull ****

!

didn't realise you had cronies.

in fact, i reckon you just name searched. yep, definitely. not that there is anything wrong with that <3

also, i would've gladly mm'd you if you came to bam... that was definitely your best shot at beating me :D

 

[Shaya]

[1:39:23 PM] Shaya: 180% Z
[1:39:26 PM] Shaya: 90% Shaya
[1:39:27 PM] Kevin "Tennet" Surowiec: tap jump off is nice
[1:39:28 PM] Will: http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=14935503&postcount=132
[1:39:30 PM] Shaya: last stock
[1:39:31 PM] Shaya: last game
[1:39:31 PM] Will: the callouts shaya
[1:39:35 PM] Will: the callouts
[1:39:59 PM] Shaya: dang
[1:40:00 PM] Shaya: that *****
[1:40:05 PM] Will: hahaha
[1:40:08 PM] Shaya: and his ****ing perfect record against me in tournament
[1:40:13 PM] Shaya: gonna haunt me for life

yeah whatever. You did inspire me to name search myself afterwards though.

 

[Attila_]

Not perfect, I lost to you in pools at my second ever tourney. Took you to third game though lololol

 

[Shaya]

Oh snap.

I'll ride that forever then,
just like my victory over zxv in melee.

That's right, you used Pit. I think you took me to that Pit stage (or lylat?) and I killed myself like 4 times. GG.

 

[Attila_]

Nah I always used snake, Tibor used pit. Pretty sure you beat me on big blue trollolol

actually, our second encounter was recorded.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n_eXUetXAg&list=FLdk2KH3y1WqYYzdivhHNlZw&index=93&feature=plpp_video

definitely a highlight :D

 

[clowsui]

lmfao shaya is free vs snake

 

[Shaya]

three vs snake
as in three years
><

 

[Attila_]

top of the australian metagame folks.

 

[JTsm]

lrn2metagame marth mains.

I actually I want to talk about IC/Pika. Esam needs to get bodied with our vasts amount of knowledge.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Pfft, getting bodied by a Snake main...you guys are funny.

 

[mikeray4]

At least we don't lose to peach esam. We two stock peach without breaking a sweat

 

[Neon!]

At least we don't lose to peach esam. We two stock peach without breaking a sweat

Quoted for Truth.

Snake is still a better character than Pikachu. We also don't get countered by olimar, IC's or diddy.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I didn't lose to peach last time I played one...

Also, Snake kinda does get countered by Olimar, ICs and Diddy are even, and you also lose to D3, Falco, Marth, Wario, MK, and Ike.

 

[Neon!]

I didn't lose to peach last time I played one...

Also, Snake kinda does get countered by Olimar, ICs and Diddy are even, and you also lose to D3, Falco, Marth, Wario, MK, and Ike.

Snake loses 45-55 to olimar, its not that bad. I used to think it was slightly worse but Razer has changed my mind, he's far better at the matchup than any other snake.

When it comes to most matchups I like to make 2 different charts, one that is optimistic for my character and one that is pessimistic. These ratios represent the highest or lowest numbers that I believe could realistically be argued for the matchup.

(Optimistic for Snake)
45-55 MK
55-45 IC
50-50 Olimar
50-50 DDD
55-45 Falco
50-50 Marth
55-45 Wario
55-45 Ike

(Pessimistic for Snake)
40-60 MK
45-55 IC
40-60 Olimar
40-60 DDD
45-55 Falco
40-60 Marth
45-55 Wario
45-55 Ike

Even if we accept all of the pessimistic ratios, they're still slight disadvantages. Pika still has even or slightly disadvantageous matchups against characters as bad as Ness, Peach, and Kirby, and borderline characters like GW, TL, and Lucario.

 

[Xubble]

Diddy has a **** ton of even matchups. Does that make him worse than Snake?

 

[Ken Neth]

Hey you stole my avi >_>

Esam, instead of just telling us snake is bad, want to give us your views/tips on the match up? I'd be interested to hear it from the best pika's stand point.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

\

Even if we accept all of the pessimistic ratios, they're still slight disadvantages. Pika still has even or slightly disadvantageous matchups against characters as bad as Ness, Peach, and Kirby, and borderline characters like GW, TL, and Lucario.

(Pessimistic)
Pikachu has losing MUs to MK, ICs, Diddy, Lucario Olimar, G&W, and Peach

(Optimistic)
Pikachu has losing MUs to Diddy, Lucario, and Olimar.

Looks a hell of a lot better than yours.