The *NEW* Snake Matchup Discussion Index

[Bonds]

It's not situational at all lol
Grab falco on fd or smashville and you are go

 

[MVD]

It's not situational at all lol
Grab falco on fd or smashville and you are go

I do it, I'm just inconsistent

 

[Dekillsage]

Doesn't really seem worth it to do the grab release regrab on falco since it doesn't do much damage. Maybe if he's close to kill % off a dash attack and you want to refresh your moves but other than that dthrow or gr dash attack just seems like better ways to get damage. Always go for practical guaranteed damage imo

 

[MVD]

Doesn't really seem worth it to do the grab release regrab on falco since it doesn't do much damage. Maybe if he's close to kill % off a dash attack and you want to refresh your moves but other than that dthrow or gr dash attack just seems like better ways to get damage. Always go for practical guaranteed damage imo

You release to re grab towards the edge and d throw him close to edge

 

[Bonds]

^

You release to re grab towards the edge and d throw him close to edge

Even assuming you only get one pummel per grab release you still refresh 3 or 4 slots of your stale move queue AND get a dthrow situation right at the edge. I don't see how this isn't practical and it is definitely guaranteed. Plus, if you catch him on a roll behind you can just chain grab release him to the other side of the stage, thus refreshing more moves and getting another 15%ish percent including the dthrow.

 

[MVD]

^


Even assuming you only get one pummel per grab release you still refresh 3 or 4 slots of your stale move queue AND get a dthrow situation right at the edge. I don't see how this isn't practical and it is definitely guaranteed. Plus, if you catch him on a roll behind you can just chain grab release him to the other side of the stage, thus refreshing more moves and getting another 15%ish percent including the dthrow.

You get the d throw near the edge which makes the tech Chase SO easy so it is very useful and worth it if you get it

 

[infiniteV115]

Not to mention that if you're facing a Falco on BF, you can put a landmine down on one of the lower platforms and then with the CG you're almost guaranteed to hit him with it.

 

[JTsm]

Falco is free.

 

[Dekillsage]

*face palm* I thought you guys meant dthrowing Falco on the ledge, not next to it. Nvm my post xD Ti's perfect

 

[Shaya]

If you were very pro and air released falco right near the ledge of the stage, you could potentially rar bair him for guaranteed stocks most of the time. He has to jump to use side b to get to the ledge (or up b which works a lot more often than you'd think)

 

[mikeray4]

Guys guys guys just ftilt
And when you want a kill utilt obviously once. If it doesn't hit them you're ****ed.


Snake for e tier

 

[Crackle]

No good marths live in cencal. stop it

Traveling..is always an option...

Anyway, the falco grab release is usually ruined by platforms. And we avoid fd so its.inevitable.

 

[MVD]

Traveling..is always an option...

Anyway, the falco grab release is usually ruined by platforms. And we avoid fd so its.inevitable.

Why avoid FD? Snake is better there, platforms help falco more, I ban SV against falco and diddy

 

[Ralph Cecil]

Yeah I like FD against certain characters as well, and I ba SV against most people lol.

 

[Bonds]

FD against falco is incredibly godlike because of the chaingrab. idk about diddy though

 

[Attila_]

As snake I cp Fd against Diddy... Way better. Sv is rubbish in that mu.

 

[clowsui]

When you see this, Bonds:

vs Marth, you've figured out the utilt part but you haven't figured out nades/dash attack/ftilt. You should be using less nades and more dash attack/ftilt. Nades are not a great way to close off Marth's approach angles and/or options. Instead the purpose of nades in the MU is to make sure Marth is mindful of the timing of his swing as well as to force him to respect your defense. W.r.t ftilt, when Marth gets fancy with his approach or you find him in a bad position and you have momentum, ftilt 1 is extremely good. W.r.t. dash attack, you should try to be less reactive with dash attack and more proactive, mixing in more DACUSes as well.

Aside from that I also felt like I had a lot of freedom to move around because you would either stay in shield too long or fish for grabs/ftilts. Don't let my mobility scare you!

 

[Bonds]

Thank you Chi!

I may start playing on wifi to work on matchups that aren't readily available at home. I would have to fix my wii first though

 

[clowsui]

whenever you do, i'll be ready

 

[JTsm]

Sooooooooo can we move on to IC's?

 

[Crackle]

Where is the explanation of +1 against IC's I must have it! Please don't tell me it's just "ally beats vinnie" because his methods are so ridiculous.

 

[Ken Neth]

This thread is so old... I would say its more of an even matchup than a snakes advantage now that the matchup meta game has progressed. ICs have ways to get around our grenades that we used to count on to keep us safe from chain grabs (though most ICs probably can't pull that off) and everyone in general has just gotten a lot better at fighting snake because of how many blatant weaknesses he has.

Just keep explosives around you at all times, play extremely patient until you have a chance to separate them and then go crazy (but dont be stupid crazy) until they're back together or you kill nana.

 

[Vinnie]

Where is the explanation of +1 against IC's I must have it! Please don't tell me it's just "ally beats vinnie" because his methods are so ridiculous.

I haven't played Ally in almost a year, but the last time we played I won.

 

[Crackle]

IC +1 against snake confirmed for 2013

 

[O1DsLeNdYwHiTe]

For the most part, I think Snake possesses the essential tools to go toe to toe with the Ice Climbers. I think the only scenario where the match would be one-sided would be if the stage was that of a completely flat surface. (Final Destination.) Therefore, most of Snake's options would be instantly neutralized. Easily vulnerable to their infamous chain-grabbing. Other than that, I really can't find any other reason that they would be (+1) over him.

 

[MK_ultra]

most of why snake has a positive MU against IC because the frame speed of the chain grab has to slow down because of how heavy snake is. this gives the snake player more time to get out of the next grab.

 

[Ken Neth]

Once they input the grab, you're not getting out. Doesn't matter that the animation takes longer. They can still throw you right as they regrab, they just have to slow their timing down for when they go for the next grab.

Unless I'm wrong, but that's how I've always thought of it.

 

[MK_ultra]

o now i remember it was from revival of salt (ally vs vinnie) for the ice climbers CGing the heavier characters such as snake forces the animations to slow down and then the IC desynch isn't as cut copy as usual.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2ExVUqo18g
look at that link and see how many grabs vinnie drops because of how awkward the desynch becomes. he drops a lot of them in game 1 and 2.

 

[Ken Neth]

Yeah, characters of different weights all have different timings for the chain grab. That's just him messing the timing up.

Just watched the first few matches, he only dropped one grab the first two games and he got the kill out of it still. And third match he has a chaingrab where he picks up a grenade and throws it away while still continuing the chaingrab. ICs can deal with anything snake has

 

[MK_ultra]

sure most pro ICs will beat snake of a CG. that match proves that snake has a good matchup against ICs because he has some really hard punishes on a unplanned desynch.

 

[Ken Neth]

One match doesn't prove anything...

I'm not understanding the point you're trying to make. The whole goal of ICs is to avoid getting separated from nana and get the chain grab.