Legend of Zelda The Milk Bar [Archived]

[Bowser King]

I enjoyed that game as well.

The most annoying had to be the rolling game in the fishing area.

My hands shake so much when I play that game D:

-Bowser King

 

[Skrah]

Yeah that one was kinda hard.

So did you guys play the Wii version or the GC version? I played both.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I played the wii version.

Got use to the motion controlled bow with it.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Wii version.

I never played with waggle before that, so waggle>no waggle. At the time.

 

[Bowser King]

Yeah that one was kinda hard.

So did you guys play the Wii version or the GC version? I played both.

Wii version.

Kinda the main reason I had so much trouble with it

-Bowser King

 

[Skrah]

I prefer the GC version over the Wii, probably because the controls were pretty awkward with the Wiimote. That's what happens when you don´t work to adapt controls to the Wii boys.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

I prefer the GC version over the Wii, probably because the controls were pretty awkward with the Wiimote. That's what happens when you don´t work to adapt controls to the Wii boys.

It's kind of sad that Twilight Princess continues to have some of the best motion controls on the wii.

 

[~Simple~]

It's kind of sad that Twilight Princess continues to have some of the best motion controls on the wii.

Lol yeah it is but the wii remote was so sensitive, everytime I wanna do the shield attack (for a good oly helm spillter) it would perform a spin attack instead.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

How did you do the special attacks with the gamecube controller? Like the helm splitter and such?

I would have preferred those with a controller rather than motion

 

[Bowser King]

The motion controls were actually pretty fun. It's one of the few games where I didn't hate it.

-Bowser King

 

[Skrah]

Ending Blow: Z target a fallen enemy and then just press A

Shield Attack: Z target an enemy and press R

Back Slice: Z target an enemy, move the control stick to one side, press A to do a side dodge, press A again to roll and then press B to do a sword slash.

Helm Splitter: Z target an enemy, shield attack (R) and then when prompted press A

Mortal Draw: Without Z targeting, wait till an enemy is near you, and when prompted press A

Jump Strike: Z targeting an enemy, hold A to charge, and release to do the Skill.

Great Spin: When hearts are full, normal spin attack, either by holding b or by rotating the control stick and pressing b

Great Spin: When your life energy is full you will be able to perform a far more powerful spin attack with a far greater range. This will come in great handy in the Cave of Ordeals when taking down over 40 foes at a time in some cases.

 

[Scott!]

Yeah, I only played the GC version. Didn't have a Wii till the next Christmas, and had no plans of having one at that point. I wasn't about to wait, either. I also wanted to play the one with the more canonical map. I never understood why they mirrored the whole game, or anything at all. If it were 1-1 motion, I could see mirroring Link, or offering an option of left-or right-handed. But it just seemed a bit odd, especially when the map's layout is significant.

I did play the Wii version at a friend's house briefly, and was totally disoriented, since nothing was in the right place.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

The motion controls were actually pretty fun. It's one of the few games where I didn't hate it.

-Bowser King

Agreed.

Yeah, I only played the GC version. Didn't have a Wii till the next Christmas, and had no plans of having one at that point. I wasn't about to wait, either. I also wanted to play the one with the more canonical map. I never understood why they mirrored the whole game, or anything at all. If it were 1-1 motion, I could see mirroring Link, or offering an option of left-or right-handed. But it just seemed a bit odd, especially when the map's layout is significant.

I did play the Wii version at a friend's house briefly, and was totally disoriented, since nothing was in the right place.

I heard the mirroring was done because it was the easiest way to make Link right-handed for the port, because most people would want to waggle Link's sword in their right hand rather than their left.

 

[Bowser King]

I heard the mirroring was done because it was the easiest way to make Link right-handed for the port, because most people would want to waggle Link's sword in their right hand rather than their left.

I think that would make sense.

In the GC game, it didn't matter if you were left handed or right because you still play the same way (clicking buttons). Though on the wii version, it did matter and seeing how the majority of people are right handed it was a smart move making the change.

-Bowser King

 

[Scott!]

Yeah, I heard it was for making his hand match most people like that, but I'm just mildly surprised that the easiest step was to mirror absolutely everything. *Knows next to nothing about the processes involved*

Of course, being an off-and-on Zelda purist, I'd almost wand to use my left hand, even though I'm right handed. It would just be right, pun not intended.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I wonder if they tried just mirroring Link instead of the whole game

 

[Skrah]

Yeah, playing GC and then Wii version was pretty confusing. Another reason why I played the GC more.

 

[Bowser King]

Yeah, playing GC and then Wii version was pretty confusing. Another reason why I played the GC more.

Playing the wii version first I think the same would happen if I tried the GC version.

Still, other then the motion controls and the map flip not much changed. I didn't really get much trouble from the switch to right hand though but I guess that was because I played the wii version from the start.

-Bowser King

 

[The Halloween Captain]

I wonder if they tried just mirroring Link instead of the whole game

Well, a mirroring of Link is no different than a mirroring of the game, except the cut scenes would need to be completely re-done with the mirrored Link. Link himself would not easily fit into the world if only he was mirrored, due to any interactions he has with object that involve a right and left side. Something as simple as the program for getting on Epona could become a fairly difficult re-animation of Link.

Besides, anyone who's played Mario Kart knows how much experience Nintendo has mirroring entire games.

 

[Vorguen]

I really wish there was a way to play Twilight Princesses with a Gamecube controller. >.>

I hate the wiimote.

 

[Skrah]

Playing the wii version first I think the same would happen if I tried the GC version.

Still, other then the motion controls and the map flip not much changed. I didn't really get much trouble from the switch to right hand though but I guess that was because I played the wii version from the start.

-Bowser King

I meant Link being left handed on GC lol. I'm kind of a purist myself

 

[Bowser King]

I meant Link being left handed on GC lol. I'm kind of a purist myself

ohh...

I really don't mind if the made him left handed/right handed. Having him left handed would have been great and all but it wouldn't have suited the controls.

-Bowser King

 

[Darkslash]

Lol yeah it is but the wii remote was so sensitive, everytime I wanna do the shield attack (for a good oly helm spillter) it would perform a spin attack instead.

You shake the nunchuck to much...you push forward. After I found that out I never really had that many spin attack moments.

TP GC=Canon
TP Wii=Fun but not cannon

Think that then OKAY!!!!!

 

[Spire]

No, it wasn't just about mirroring Link. How his model is rigged to his animations and how those animations interact with everything in the world would have changed. The easiest method was simply mirroring the game (which took practically no programming, but rather just an optical flip).

I tried playing the GCN version after playing through the Wii version and I couldn't. The controls were fine, but I had the entire Wii Hyrule's map memorized, so the inversion just totally screwed me up. I would rather have played the canonical version, but I had got a Wii and TP the Christmas it came out, so I had zero intentions to play the GCN version (plus, I wasn't aware of the mirroring til after I got the game).

 

[Bowser King]

You shake the nunchuck to much...you push forward. After I found that out I never really had that many spin attack moments.

TP GC=Canon
TP Wii=Fun but not cannon

Think that then OKAY!!!!!

..and this.


The wii version was basically made for the sake of a port and getting the wii on a right track with a good game.

That's why I'd be pretty disappointed if the wii version of TP counts as one of the two zelda games nintendo releases for each system (3-D).

Though, guessing by the amount of time remaining in the wii's life (which I'm guessing to be another 3-4 years max since nintendo wanted to finish it early) I'm guessing that is what's going to happen D:

EDIT: I think what spire and THC said seems accurate. Mirroring the game was a good way to get around that problem since it didn't really interfere.

-Bowser King

 

[Darkslash]

Though, guessing by the amount of time remaining in the wii's life (which I'm guessing to be another 3-4 years max since nintendo wanted to finish it early) I'm guessing that is what's going to happen D:

-Bowser King

We could have an extra one. If the Zelda game after the Wii one uses the same engine it could cut down development time.

 

[Spire]

..and this.


The wii version was basically made for the sake of a port and getting the wii on a right track with a good game.

That's why I'd be pretty disappointed if the wii version of TP counts as one of the two zelda games nintendo releases for each system (3-D).

Though, guessing by the amount of time remaining in the wii's life (which I'm guessing to be another 3-4 years max since nintendo wanted to finish it early) I'm guessing that is what's going to happen D:

-Bowser King

If we're lucky, we'll get a new, high-resolution WiiWare Zelda game made in lieu of the N64 titles along with "Zelda Wii".

 

[Bowser King]

If we're lucky, we'll get a new, high-resolution WiiWare Zelda game made in lieu of the N64 titles along with "Zelda Wii".

That would be cool. I'd have loved to see a WW/PH kind of zelda wii game but I doubt that's going to happen. Unless "zelda wii" IS that but I highly doubt that since the windwaker plotline is pretty much closed down. Though PH and WW weren't really connected, I saw PH as being more of a game to just play then really connected to the storyline of WW (plus the graphics were easier for the DS then graphics like the wii).

-Bowser King

 

[Spire]

That would be cool. I'd have loved to see a WW/PH kind of zelda wii game but I doubt that's going to happen. Unless "zelda wii" IS that but I highly doubt that since the windwaker plotline is pretty much closed down. Though PH and WW weren't really connected, I saw PH as being more of a game to just play then really connected to the storyline of WW (plus the graphics were easier for the DS then graphics like the wii).

-Bowser King

Besides TP, the past five Zelda games have been in the "Toon" style. In reverse chronological order:

Phantom Hourglass
The Minish Cap
Four Swords Adventures
The Wind Waker
Four Swords

I say they leave that realm alone for a while and focus on a) their realistic Zelda style, and b) a new Zelda style (artistically speaking).

 

[Skrah]

What style do you have in mind, Spíre? I think maybe an Okami-ish style would fit well enough.

 

[Scott!]

Personally, I think the toon style is very well suited to the handhelds, while I prefer realistic for the consoles. WW is a nice exception, but I'd leave it as that. Though another art style entirely would be welcome too. Not sure what it could be, but I'm openminded. I judged WW, and was smacked down for it by the games awesomeness. Never again.

EDIT @ Skrah: I thought of that, but I'd rather have Okami stay unique. It's such an awesome game, though I haven't played nearly enough. It is made by its style, and that should be left alone. If Zelda goes in a new direction, it should actually be new, not just copying another series.

 

[Bowser King]

Besides TP, the past five Zelda games have been in the "Toon" style. In reverse chronological order:

Phantom Hourglass
The Minish Cap
Four Swords Adventures
The Wind Waker
Four Swords

I say they leave that realm alone for a while and focus on a) their realistic Zelda style, and b) a new Zelda style (artistically speaking).

I forgot about minish cap and adventures (4 swords was only a multiplayer game though).

Mainly because although the art style was sort of similar there were still many differences. I also found that minish cap connected to 4 swords more then WW/PH.

Anyway, what do you think would be a good new art style for zelda?

Scott, I didn't really see a problem with WW and thought it was one of the better games. That art style looked beautiful on the console but as spire said I think moving on would be a good move. Maybe revisiting it later on. That would be pretty cool.

-Bowser King

 

[Scott!]

I forgot about minish cap and adventures (4 swords was only a multiplayer game though).

Mainly because although the art style was sort of similar there were still many differences. I also found that minish cap connected to 4 swords more then WW/PH.

Anyway, what do you think would be a good new art style for zelda?

Scott, I didn't really see a problem with WW and thought it was one of the better games. That art style looked beautiful on the console but as spire said I think moving on would be a good move. Maybe revisiting it later on. That would be pretty cool.

-Bowser King

Oh, I liked WW too. I wasn't clear. I just think that, in general, the toon style is better for handhelds than consoles. It was nice, but I don't want the series to become that. I don't have a lack of love for it though.

 

[Skrah]

Yeah, I guess you're right about the okami thing.

I think Twilight´s realistic style was pretty good, even if it was a little bit cartoonish.

 

[Spire]

Yeah, handheld = Toon. Console = realistic / risk-taking with introducing new styles.

I'm thinking a very stylized (for lack of a better word) physique to the design of characters - not realistic, but not cartoonish either. Sort of where OoT was heading, but far more emphasized to truly capture the aspects of the characters. For instance, King Zora from OoT was a giant, bloated Zora, not just a decorated, old-man Zora. He's a very memorable character because he, himself, was designed incredibly uniquely. I think this must be kept in mind when designing the individual characters, but as for the overall appearance?

I think designing it less texturally, and more fluidly would be a great move, making the 3D models appear to be "sculpted", with a sort of mix between pseudo-realistic textures, paint, clay, and ink, but not so the game is overshadowed by this art direction. Imagine it this way. Say you set up your "foundation materials". Perhaps they are:

- Paint
- Clay/Stone
- Ink
- Metal/Rust
- Realistically rendered textures

You craft this game around those elements entirely. Say every object, character, and region is built around these five elements. Keep in mind, this is all hypothetical, and I'm not necessarily saying it's the best idea, but for the sake of sparking some innovation, let's carry on. So each 3D model is composed of these five elements. Depending on how the developers want the model to feel in relation to all around it, and how you interact with it, the "levels" of each of the five elements would alter. Say you are designing a moss-covered rock. It would appear to be made of clay (for the rock), some paint (for the moss), and some undertone textures. Remember, the world would not act like these materials necessarily would, but for aesthetic purposes, it could help to shape the game in a very artistic and relative fashion (as it does not feel like we're just interacting with this totally 3D world, but rather a world that looks like we could have hand-crafted it). It would be a smart move to really draw in players of all types and ages. Think about Psychonauts. It had a very keen style (the stage based in Spain was the most beautiful part of that game, and of the history of gaming, as it was designed with a semi-Nightmare Before Christmas Oogey Boogey's lair-type "neon-noir" effect).

Anyways, again, this is not how I necessarily want Zelda to look, but it's simply an idea to spark some thoughts.

 

[~Simple~]

Well I find that the freaky cutscene after you get all tears of light on Lanyru Provindence was the only cartoonnish part Skrah.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I don't like Toon Link games, that's why I am hoping for a realistic Link game.

Previous 5 may be why I haven't bought a Zelda game (Before TP) in ages...

 

[Scott!]

Cartoonish might not be the best world, but TP is definitely stylized rather than purely realistic. I think that's what Skrah means.

Also, at Spire's idea. I'm having a bit of trouble getting a solid visual, but that's just how I am with these things. It does sound interesting though, and I'd like for some game to implement it, if not Zelda.

 

[Skrah]

I meant tbat Link and other characters had some anime traits, like the big eyes.

EDIT: Yeah, that's what I meant.

And I can't really picture what Spire is saying, but maybe its just his artistic side talking lol.

 

[Spire]

Heh, I suppose my ideas don't leave my head well through words. That's why I paint.

Perhaps at some point, I'll mock some drawings of the style I might like to see Zelda take.