The Mario Rediscussion Thread. Currently Rediscussing: Diddy Kong

[hippiedude92]

well just do the peach MU (didn't know it was in peach's favor, going luigi for that next time lol..) i mean if we're avoiding them because of drama thats dumb cuz we're always bound to get disagreements in discussions and that's why we even have them in here, i'm pretty sure theres lots of things they know that we don't know. we need to be a more educated community instead of fighting which is right and wrong imo lol

 

[Matt07]

Yea, I mean we had no drama with the Ness boards, so I think we can try and do Peach.

 

[Kanzaki]

I vote Peach. Only reason it gets out of hand cause some people thinks Mario is Metaknight when he takes off his mask, and some people thinks Peach is Snake without his camouflage.

 

[mars16]

I got an Idea

How about_______


+Drum roll+

..................... Captain Falcon!

If not then I go with who ever Has the highest votes

 

[A2ZOMG]

I want to discuss Captain Falcon.

That matchup can be REALLY annoying for Mario if the Falcon is good. Falcon in many ways can frustrate Mario more than other characters when played intelligently. He has more mobility, and can do a pretty good job of punishing, and if you don't gimp him, he survives long due to his weight and fall speed. He's not exactly easy for Mario to just dominate due to his mobility.

 

[kirbyfan66]

Falcon, Luigi, or Peach? =P

I'll post my opinion on the MU if we can stick to one character.

 

[Inferno3044]

I guess the majority is Peach. Let's go with this.

Luigi doesn't need discussion. It's just an idea of ratio change and I think most people would go with 50:50.

 

[The Master of Mario]

Luigi has 3-4 more frames landing lag on U-air, N-air, and B-air, but his D-air is less laggy.

And uh, you're better off U-tilting Luigi's aerial approaches usually.

Mario's B-air and D-air also auto-cancel better because the time between the end of the aerial and the autocancel is less. Mario's D-air autocancels with better advantage than if you SHFF or groundcancel it so it's actually pretty close to Luigi's aerial in lag. The time from the Last Hit->Autocancel is ~8 frames while for Luigi its ~10 frames. Mario's B-air autocancels after ~8 frames while Luigi's B-air takes ~17 frames.

U-tilt still takes longer to attack Out of shield than jumpcancel Up-smash OOS and does less damage. But U-tilt is much safer at stopping Luigi when he is not lagging and can attack with N-air. Mario doesn't have many other options than OOS attacks and U-tilts against Luigi's airgame. Shield Grabbing is best against Luigi's Landed N-air which is not laggier.

 

[mars16]

Peach
-----------
Peach can be a difficult apponant for Mario... Her floaty ability and high priority aerial attacks together makes her one of Mario's most difficult.
A Peach that likes staying close to the ground and using Niar and Fair Makes Mario's ground game not that good, Mario has a better chance in the air with his Bair.
Peach can be a good edge gaurder as well, the diadem smack has good knockback.... good for edgegaurding.... Well thats what I use
EXTRA--She also has Toad, witch is a good counter move....
___________
Mario
------
Mario's got stuff to.. Peach can't reflect, Mario got better Projetile, also Peach's Aerial dodge sucks...But she has toad for that....
Mario has better ground game... I Think and thats why Peach Likes Floating...
If Peach likes to float so close to the ground then she still can be grabbed, Sheild and grab, buit at the right time....

Mario's Fludd is almost uselliss in the match.......Just sayin"

Correct me if I'm wrong, I have yet to play a very good Peach.....Only Level 9's CPU

 

[Inferno3044]

FLUDD is not useless. It completely messes up her floating by sending her too high to hit you. Just putting that out. I'm gonna wait for more comments to post my opinion.

 

[Matador]

FLUDD is not useless. It completely messes up her floating by sending her too high to hit you. Just putting that out. I'm gonna wait for more comments to post my opinion.

QFT, screwing up Peach's spacing/catching her in Fair FIHL can create safe openings.

 

[mars16]

Thats true
.
..
Didn't think ah dat

I was really refering to if you tryed to gimp her with fludd

 

[Dark.Pch]

And this is why peach should be short hopping her moves instead of being typical and floating so much. So far the stuff I read on Peach, really coming from A2 is a Peach playing basic. Floating to Fairs and Etc. A Peach that has lots of mindgames, short hops moves to pressure game and all that crazy stuff, it's another ball game.

Kirin has played me. At SNES He played me and never lost to a Peach there. He knows that match up. the only peach he loses to as of now is me. yet he does a good job playing me. Peach has a small advantage on mario.

 

[Kanzaki]

I like cape ****** Peach's toad :]

 

[Dark.Pch]

I like toss a turnip, you cape it, I toad the relfected turnip and you die from the spores :]

GG?

 

[BoTastic!]

Sh Fair will still lag upon FIHL. Any aerial with more priority than fludd will lag.

 

[mars16]

I like toss a turnip, you cape it, I toad the relfected turnip and you die from the spores :]

GG?

Sounds Like a cool move!

I'll try that

 

[Dark.Pch]

Sh Fair will still lag upon FIHL. Any aerial with more priority than fludd will lag.

Thats why it is best to short hop the move if I was ever to get hit with that thing. I won't be open so much and can land sooner. And incase **** goes wrong, Peach still has a jump and float she did not burn.

Also it be foolish for a Peach making an obvious attack from deep where mario can see it and then use fludd. really peach should not even be trying to akkact from distance with a move like Fair at all.

 

[A2ZOMG]

So basically whoever gets out their aerial pressure first *****.

I'm pretty sure you have amazing technical mastery of your character Dark Pch. The only thing I must say is most of our players haven't yet achieved that level of technical mastery for Mario.

The day every Mario main consistently pulls off Sliding Up-smash kills and 2 Jabs -> D-smash I will say that our character is properly represented.

 

[BSP]

Luigi has 3-4 more frames landing lag on U-air, N-air, and B-air, but his D-air is less laggy.

And uh, you're better off U-tilting Luigi's aerial approaches usually.

IMO, Luigi has the brute strength, seen in his ko power, while mario has the speed, with his aerial prowess and his movement.

What, is that like 3 people saying it's even? Change it please.

Semi ninja'd i guess.

I don't know all the details on peach, but it does seem slightly in her favor. Has anyone tried using up-b OoS against her?

 

[A2ZOMG]

Yeah, Up-B OOS is great if she is trying to D-air pressure your shield.

 

[mars16]

OK

what does OOS mean?

 

[Matt07]

OOS= Out of Shield.

 

[hippiedude92]

it means out of shield

and i played this matchup wrong

i went aggro

FML

edit : **** i got ninja'd lol matt

 

[Matt07]

Dear God this is a wall of text, I apologize in advance.

I don't know much about Peach so I may seem ignorant on some parts, so Dark.Pch can help correct my mistakes/rebuttle my points.

Options per Situation

Approach
Mario: Mario has Fireballs to help approach a grounded Peach, but Peach will never be grounded. Basically Mario has very little approach options in this match-up, anything else will get outranged by Peach, or we'll eat a d-air.

Peach: Peach has tons of tools to approach Mario. Floated aerials, Glide-Tossed Turnips, into what-ever she pleases. Peach will be approaching the most in the majority of the match-up, she'll try weaving in and out too bait the Mario.

Peach wins in approaching.

Defense
Mario: Mario has plenty of tools for being defensive versus Peach. SH, FH retreating Fireballs, up B OOS, FIHL -> Up Smash, up B, if Peach get's a little to anxious with her aerials.

Peach: N-air OOS (?), she has Turnips, Jabs, Grabs too try and keep Mario out of range.

Mario wins slightly in defensive options.

Edgeguard
Mario: Edgeguarding a Peach will not happen, period. Don't try anything too risky offstage with a Peach or you'll find yourself in a bad position. Best we can do is just use Fireballs to annoy her while she recovers, she'll take damage, but it won't stop her from coming back.

Peach: Edgeguarding Mario is tricky. He has a very high priority up B that will go through Turnips (?), he has a Cape to reflect the Turnips. However things get a little worse with Peach's f-air she will try and bait you into her f-air, or even n-air, once your hit you're not guaranteed to come back.

Peach wins.

Recovery
Mario: Mario has to best be very careful when recovering. FLUDD'ing her is probably a really good option since it pushes her back far if she tries f-air, n-air you. However she still has Turnips to try and make you waist our Cape.

Peach: Peach wins this for sure. She'll eat damage from Fireballs time to time, but she'll always make it back on stage, unless she makes a silly mistake and get's hit by a f-air spike, or get's knocked back to far from u-air or n-air. But still not likely to happen.

Peach wins.

Margin of Error

Mario: Mario doesn't have much room for error, he has trouble keeping the lead, and if we get too confident we will quickly lose that lead. Our defensive options just don't do enough damage to her.

Peach: Almost like Mario, if she makes too many mistakes she'll eat damage quickly. However she has enough options to bring it back, it's still risky though however, because of her light weight.

Peach wins.

Degree of Punishment
Mario: Mario can punish Peach if she is silly with her aerials, and she's predictable with her grounded moves she'll most likely eat a Fireball. Mario has tools to punish a Peach but as stated earlier if only his OOS did more damage...

Peach: Haha what can't she punish Mario has to throw? As long as she's careful with her aerials and avoids FIHL she will be fine. She has a many damaging ground moves (Uugh I don't like Glide Tossed Turnips >_>.)

Peach wins.

Character Attributes
Mario: Fast aerials, good OOS options, Fireballs, can live a lot longer, better KO options.

Strengths: Good range, good recovery, good options to punish, good edgeguard potential.

Weaknesses
Mario: Suspectable to being gimped if not careful, not good enough range, not enough damaging OOS options.

Peach: Poor KO options, if too anxious/predictable she'll take damage from Mario's OOS options, dies early, hard to score KO's.

Covering Weaknesses
Mario: can cover a lot of his weakness by just playing very patient, using Fireballs, FLUDDS, and OOS options carefully, and punishing Peach's mistakes when they happen.

Peach: Playing carefully, not getting too over aggresive, predicting Mario's defensive options and capitilizing on them.

Peach wins.

Kill Potential (Gimping would also go here)
Mario: Mario will KO earlier here. But landing the KO move will be very very difficult. We have dsmash that can KO, and it will most likely (and should) be unstaled, because she's always in the air. However fsmash will be most likely impossible to land, or very very difficult. Up smash can be landed if you catch her in a d-air and FLUDD it.

Peach: Peach will have trouble KO'ing, however she can rely on gimps, once you get Mario offstage at a very high % we'll most likely be KO'd from a f-air, or n-air. The problem is, is the % at which Mario will be at, and how much lower Peach has to be from being KO'd from a mistake.

Mario wins.

Damage Power and KO Power
Mario: Slowly but surely, pretty much sums it up for damage. Mario's Fireballs, u-smash, up B will rack up the damage (not much) but it won't be all that much. KO Power, Mario has stronger KO options for sure, especially against someone versus Peach.

Peach: Tons of damaging options, and plenty of moves she can do to keep her moves fresh, thus making it easier for her to rack up damage. Her KO Power if very poor, and this will help Mario be able to close the gap.

Even.

Gimp Ability
Mario: Very poor gimp ability.

Peach: Turnips, and punishing him when he makes a mistake, or mis-times a Cape.

Peach wins.


Overall
Peach wins this match-up.

Ratio
Disadvantage (40:60 - 35:65)

 

[Inferno3044]

I like toss a turnip, you cape it, I toad the relfected turnip and you die from the spores :]

GG?

Lol.

Approach
Mario: Mario has Fireballs to help approach a grounded Peach, but Peach will never be grounded. Basically Mario has very little approach options in this match-up, anything else will get outranged by Peach, or we'll eat a d-air.

Peach: Peach has tons of tools to approach Mario. Floated aerials, Glide-Tossed Turnips, into what-ever she pleases. Peach will be approaching the most in the majority of the match-up, she'll try weaving in and out too bait the Mario.

Peach wins in approaching.

I don't see why fireballs wouldn't help against Peach in the air. They're not useless. Actually they can help. Toad has lag so they aren't gonna use Toad for every fireball. Straight up thrown turnips should be shielded (not saying turnips won't ever hit Mario). They are pretty versatile, but they are items and not projectiles. Because of that, Peach can't do aerials with a turnip in her hand giving you some prediction. You can also catch turnips. Peach does win in approaching overall.

Edgeguard
Mario: Edgeguarding a Peach will not happen, period. Don't try anything too risky offstage with a Peach or you'll find yourself in a bad position. Best we can do is just use Fireballs to annoy her while she recovers, she'll take damage, but it won't stop her from coming back.

Peach: Edgeguarding Mario is tricky. He has a very high priority up B that will go through Turnips (?), he has a Cape to reflect the Turnips. However things get a little worse with Peach's f-air she will try and bait you into her f-air, or even n-air, once your hit you're not guaranteed to come back.

Peach wins.

Correction. Mario will not gimp Peach. There's a difference. We can definitely rack some damage while she's trying to get back on stage. Also, you won't be gimped that easily by Peach. It's why you save your mid air jump. Peach will probably gimp Mario more than the other way around, but I don't see it happening much.

Margin of Error

Mario: Mario doesn't have much room for error, he has trouble keeping the lead, and if we get too confident we will quickly lose that lead. Our defensive options just don't do enough damage to her.

Peach: Almost like Mario, if she makes too many mistakes she'll eat damage quickly. However she has enough options to bring it back, it's still risky though however, because of her light weight.

Peach wins.

To me, it just feels like you don't have much Peach experience which is fine because there are very few Peach players. I learned a good tip to fight Peach that I will say after I comment on your wall of text. Their margin of error is about even.

Degree of Punishment
Mario: Mario can punish Peach if she is silly with her aerials, and she's predictable with her grounded moves she'll most likely eat a Fireball. Mario has tools to punish a Peach but as stated earlier if only his OOS did more damage...

Peach: Haha what can't she punish Mario has to throw? As long as she's careful with her aerials and avoids FIHL she will be fine. She has a many damaging ground moves (Uugh I don't like Glide Tossed Turnips >_>.)

Peach wins.

Lol. You have some wrong ideas. Peach is not the ultimate punisher. Everything you do isn't going to be punished. The only character semi-close to doing this is Sonic. Peach wins by a small bit though.

Character Attributes
Mario: Fast aerials, good OOS options, Fireballs, can live a lot longer, better KO options.

Strengths: Good range, good recovery, good options to punish, good edgeguard potential.

Weaknesses
Mario: Suspectable to being gimped if not careful, not good enough range, not enough damaging OOS options.

Peach: Poor KO options, if too anxious/predictable she'll take damage from Mario's OOS options, dies early, hard to score KO's.

I really want to point out the fast aerials. Peach doesn't have many fast aerials in front of her and she normally approaches facing her opponent. Peach also doesn't have many KO options. Her best kill move is fair iirc. The problem with that is not only is it one of her most reliable kill moves but it's also her spacing tool and it's used pretty commonly. Her fair is also kinda slow. Slow enough to react to.

I agree with your facts on covering weaknesses but I believe it's even.

Kill Potential (Gimping would also go here)
Mario: Mario will KO earlier here. But landing the KO move will be very very difficult. We have dsmash that can KO, and it will most likely (and should) be unstaled, because she's always in the air. However fsmash will be most likely impossible to land, or very very difficult. Up smash can be landed if you catch her in a d-air and FLUDD it.

Peach: Peach will have trouble KO'ing, however she can rely on gimps, once you get Mario offstage at a very high % we'll most likely be KO'd from a f-air, or n-air. The problem is, is the % at which Mario will be at, and how much lower Peach has to be from being KO'd from a mistake.

Mario wins.

Peach can't rely on gimps for this. As I said before, fair is a slow aerial and you can react to it. Nair doesn't have that much knockback iirc. Peach just in general won't gimp Mario much. It will happen every now and then. Once a set possibly but that isn't much.

Damage Power and KO Power
Mario: Slowly but surely, pretty much sums it up for damage. Mario's Fireballs, u-smash, up B will rack up the damage (not much) but it won't be all that much. KO Power, Mario has stronger KO options for sure, especially against someone versus Peach.

Peach: Tons of damaging options, and plenty of moves she can do to keep her moves fresh, thus making it easier for her to rack up damage. Her KO Power if very poor, and this will help Mario be able to close the gap.

Even.

I'd give this to Mario because Peach's KO power is bad. It will take some time to kill Mario while our Usmash should reliably kill Mario.

Gimp Ability
Mario: Very poor gimp ability.

Peach: Turnips, and punishing him when he makes a mistake, or mis-times a Cape.

Peach wins.

I'm not sure what you mean by mis-times a cape. Peach will almost never gimp Mario by clipping his jump with a turnip. You would see the turnip being thrown at you or she would be so close to you that she should use something else.

Overall
Peach wins this match-up.

Ratio
Disadvantage (40:60 - 35:65)

I highly disagree. I do not think Peach wins (by win I mean 60:40 or greater). It's 55:45 Peach at worst, even at best.

There is one note I wanna put out for fighting Peach. In December, I went to a local smashfest and I played ADHD's Peach in a set. Before game 2, I hated fighting Peach because I didn't know what to do. At game 2, I remembered Pierce talking about vertical spacing and releasing an article about it and using Peach as an example saying that she likes being above you pressuring your shield with dair than use fair to pressure more and auto cancel it. The way to fight against this is to fight around the same vertical level as Peach. I did this a lot against ADHD game 2 and won. His Peach isn't bad.

To sum this up, fight Peach on the same vertical plane and that will help against some things, especially her shield eating.

 

[Matt07]

Lol I tried xD.

I'm gonna sit this one out now, I try discussing match-up's but I'm not the greatest per say.

 

[HeroMystic]

<3 u Matt.

Having an initiator is always important.

 

[Dark.Pch]

I don't see why fireballs wouldn't help against Peach in the air. They're not useless. Actually they can help. Toad has lag so they aren't gonna use Toad for every fireball. Straight up thrown turnips should be shielded (not saying turnips won't ever hit Mario). They are pretty versatile, but they are items and not projectiles. Because of that, Peach can't do aerials with a turnip in her hand giving you some prediction. You can also catch turnips. Peach does win in approaching overall.

Maybe if you was luigi, fireballs wpould be a bigger problem. Your fire balls are grounded, how is that gonna help you if I jump over them of float for that matter. I can also sort hop air attacks to get through your fire balls and get at you.

Tad can help, if I am close and catch you tossing one, I can toad it and you eat spores. I sometimes like to go to mario and toad cause he is already tossing fireballs or has one out as I got near. And it is not hard for Peach to get near you when you lauch fireballs. And once I get close, no fire balls for you or else, free hit for me.

Also where have you been sir? Peach can do air attacks while holding a turnip thanks to floating. This has been known since melee. someone serious needs to do thier Peach homework.

And Mario approaching better than Peach? I dont think so:

- Fair
- FC>Fair
- Dair
- FC>Dair
- FC>Nair
- Turnip>Fair
- FC>Turnip>Fair
- Bair
- Glide tossing
- Nair

Advance approaches:

- Glide toss> FC>Nair
- Glide toss> Reverse Bair
- Glide toss> Nair
- Glide toss> Grab
- Glide toss> Dtilt
- Glide toss> Fsmash (incase after the glide toss they wanna try and roll behind you, Fsmash hits from behind her as well, so total protection)
- Reverse Glide toss> Dsmash or Fsmash
- Reverse Glide toss> Bair

Correction. Mario will not gimp Peach. There's a difference. We can definitely rack some damage while she's trying to get back on stage. Also, you won't be gimped that easily by Peach. It's why you save your mid air jump. Peach will probably gimp Mario more than the other way around, but I don't see it happening much.

Remember my lil toad trick with the turnip? You are at risk of getting gimped alot more now.

To me, it just feels like you don't have much Peach experience which is fine because there are very few Peach players. I learned a good tip to fight Peach that I will say after I comment on your wall of text. Their margin of error is about even.

he is actually correct here. If you don't wanna belive this from a Peach main, ask Kirin, and he learned this match up from me

Lol. You have some wrong ideas. Peach is not the ultimate punisher. Everything you do isn't going to be punished. The only character semi-close to doing this is Sonic. Peach wins by a small bit though.

Lets keep in mind though I can punish Mario for alot of stuff he does. Also, Peach's pressure game and evasion leads to her being good at punishing alot of things, not just with Martio but with nearly the whole cast.

I really want to point out the fast aerials. Peach doesn't have many fast aerials in front of her and she normally approaches facing her opponent. Peach also doesn't have many KO options. Her best kill move is fair iirc. The problem with that is not only is it one of her most reliable kill moves but it's also her spacing tool and it's used pretty commonly. Her fair is also kinda slow. Slow enough to react to.

I agree with your facts on covering weaknesses but I believe it's even.

Someone needs to do their home work on Peach:

she does have a few kill options.

**= Can kill well with and mostly used for a finisher
* Can Kill but not as great as a kill move with 2 starts

- Fair **
- Bair **
- Nair
- Uair*
- Dair (% has to be quite high. Best to catch them in the air with it to make it a lil easier to kill with)
- Utilt **
- Ftilt *
- Dtilt (% has to be quite high)
- Fsmash **
- F-B (High damage or gimps)
-Up-B (% has to be pretty high. But this type of task can be easier if you do it high in the air or on a platform)
- Usmash**
- Turnips(Yes I am serious....turnips)**
- Toad (Yes......toad, but the % of the enemy has to be pretty darn high and it depends on character and stage.) Or you could toad them off stage. (kills characters like meta that glide attack to to you coming back to the stage. Jump out and toad, they die.)

Now remember that this all depends on:
- How many times you used the attack
- Stage
- character you are playing
- the % or the enemy
- What part of the stage you are on when you unleashed the attack.

But how we gonna get that damage out? Oh we have options with that as well dude. We rack up damage faster than you.

Basic combos

-Dthrow>uptilt
-Dair>Nair
-Dair>Uair
-Dair>Fair
-Dair>Bair
-Jab>Dtilt
-Jab>grab
-Jab>Nair
-Jab>Nair
-Turnip>fair
-Turnip>Nair


Advance combos ( you would need good control of Peach and her floating as well)-

*= Depends on where your enemy is/goes after the first or second hit of the combo

-*Dair>Dair>Fair
-Dair>Dair
-Dair>Dair>Dair
-Dair>Dair>Dair>Uair
-*Dair>Dair>Dair>Uair>Up-B
-*Dair>Dair>falling Dair>Usmash/Utilt/Up-B
-*Dthrow>Ftilt>Uptilt/Usmash/Up-B
-*Dthrow>Ftilt>Jab>grab>Dthrow>Utilt/Uair/Up-B
-Bair>grab
-Fair>Jab>grab> (look at the list of what you can do after grabs)
-*Falling Dair>Jab>(look at the list of what you can do after jabs/grabs)
-*Falling Dair> Usmash/Utilt/Up-B/Nair/Bair

"But your moves might be stale from all of this"

Yea you are right, they are.....what to do.............oh I know *down-B*

Just rack up damage or get grabs to bring moves back. Then by this time the enemy could be around 100-140. And now we have fresh moves again. Mario is not that heavy so if the Peach is not playing typical and abusing moves alot, Mario is not staying on stage for long. People seriously ovber rate her kill level cause of Peach wanting to Fair pr Ssmash alot. Like seriously, how many times have you seen this. But when you see a Peach using moves like Nair, jab to grabs, Dtilt and Smart use of turnips, lets see how long you gonna be on stage when her moves are stale and you get clapped with her options to K.O you.

Peach can't rely on gimps for this. As I said before, fair is a slow aerial and you can react to it. Nair doesn't have that much knockback iirc. Peach just in general won't gimp Mario much. It will happen every now and then. Once a set possibly but that isn't much.

You are in danger when off stage. wether gimps of not, though I already went trough this. of stage Fairs or Nair is all it takes to end Mario cause of his recovery.

I'd give this to Mario because Peach's KO power is bad. It will take some time to kill Mario while our Usmash should reliably kill Mario.

I went through this already. people really need to stop underratting this, Then again, I doubt any of you fought a Peach that saves her kill moves well.

I'm not sure what you mean by mis-times a cape. Peach will almost never gimp Mario by clipping his jump with a turnip. You would see the turnip being thrown at you or she would be so close to you that she should use something else.

And this is where my toad trick comes in. You ether get sniped by turnip and I time an edgehog or cape it and eat spores.

There is one note I wanna put out for fighting Peach. In December, I went to a local smashfest and I played ADHD's Peach in a set. Before game 2, I hated fighting Peach because I didn't know what to do. At game 2, I remembered Pierce talking about vertical spacing and releasing an article about it and using Peach as an example saying that she likes being above you pressuring your shield with dair than use fair to pressure more and auto cancel it. The way to fight against this is to fight around the same vertical level as Peach. I did this a lot against ADHD game 2 and won. His Peach isn't bad.

To sum this up, fight Peach on the same vertical plane and that will help against some things, especially her shield eating.

Not to get on ADHD Peach but if you got this from him, you need to play a better one who knows his character to a full extend. And the match up as well.

 

[Matador]

Lol I tried xD.

I'm gonna sit this one out now, I try discussing match-up's but I'm not the greatest per say.

I know that prolly took you awhile to write up, I think you did a good job

I think Hero should just post the template for us all to see and we should try to fill it together with people constantly updating...it's too much for one guy to do in one sitting.

I should probably play against you Dark P.ch. The only Peaches I've played are MD/VA ones (excluding Azen when he played) and they make me believe it could be 55:45 in any direction. Not that they're bad...I could simply just be amazing...

But yea, if I ever get to serious traveling, expect friendlies.

 

[HeroMystic]

I think Hero should just post the template for us all to see and we should try to fill it together with people constantly updating...it's too much for one guy to do in one sitting.

Honestly, that was the point of it. But I can't be everyone's mom for everything now can I?

 

[Matador]

But I can't be everyone's mom for everything now can I?

<---wants chocolate milk

Are we going to integrate it into this match-up thread or start your own specifically for filling out your template?

I don't think Peach has an answer for an extremely defensive Mario like Vato vs Peach. It seems like her offensive options are limited if you decide not to approach. It makes floating unsafe since there are constantly fireballs being lobbed at you, and unless you're constantly power-shielding, your approach via glide-tossing or spacing aerials will often be unsuccessful if we're retreating full-hopped fireballs.

If Peach DOES happen to get close, I think our OOS options protect us rather nicely. I think if played this way, it's pretty even.

 

[HeroMystic]

<---wants chocolate milk

Are we going to integrate it into this match-up thread or start your own specifically for filling out your template?

Inferno's choice. I just want progress to happen, not looking to ransack his ownership of the MU thread.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Hasn't this match up been discussed several times?

Spoiler

And with each discussion, haven't we got even furthur from actually reaching a conclusion?

Just a few things to throw out, Peach can perform aerials whilst holding a Turnip when she's Floating. She'll throw the Turnip if she isn't Floating. However, something you should be cautious of is her Z dropping the Turnip first and then performing an aerial

This is really a match of whoever plays smarter which I think is what I said last time. Marios F Smash has that fire part so if Peach is intent on spamming SH Fairs against you, just stutter step F Smash her (and angle it upwards I think?). I would argue that Mario's fireballs aren't as effective as Luigi's at stopping any kind of Floating approach (not that Floating is really used as an approach) since they travel down to the ground rather than horizontally but they're still useful. If Peach enjoys powershielding your fireballs and running at you then don't use them cause they have a fair amount of after lag (not that you guys didn't know that lol). If Peach is playing campy, expect her to be reverse glide tossing Turnips a lot. Don't feel obliged to charge in if she's doing this. Be careful hitting her sheild up close since her OoS options are pretty decent and paticularly be careful if shes holding a Turnip since she can very easily punish a move as an OoS Turnip is very quick

You'll probably be wanting to be keeping Peach at bay with your Bair, kind of like Kirby does if you know what I mean but just be careful of her stutter step F Smashes. You could try mixing it up and mix up spaced Bairs and reversed Fireballs to catch her out. If Peach decides to use Toad when recovering, Cape her, it'll give her a pretty nasty shock when she goes flying into the stage boundry

I can't really think of anything else tbh, its been ages since I played Brawl due to my workload. Really, just use common sense and play the match safe and make patient use of your best moves (if you ask me, Bair in this match)

 

[Inferno3044]

Dark.Pch I don't know what you're talking about with the turnip trick. Honestly, I don't think much has changed since the last couple of times. It was 55:45 Peach before and I see that as a reasonable ratio.

 

[TheCubeStud]

I'll throw in my two cents quickly, because I'm great and am probably the only one with offline Praxis experience. She's a *****, not as as even as you think (then again, I think almost every ratio listed in this thread is too even because everyone has too much pride) and it's probably 6:4 Peach. She's just better. Whoever rattled off that long post matching up everything, and saying 60:40-65-35 is closer to right than I think most others are.

 

[Praxis]

lol.

Peach beats Mario. He can't approach her if she camps, and she has better approach tools to get a lead.

She also edgeguards him pretty solidly and can outspace him very safely.

6:4.

Yea, I mean we had no drama with the Ness boards, so I think we can try and do Peach.

lol. Was a nice thought, but we have Dark.Pch.

 

[Flameleon]

-Peach is indeed hard, if they're playing carefully or in a defensive way, because, Peach is great at counterattacking, mostly with her Nair and because we have low range, we need to keep our distance at short with her, leaving us with a disadvantage, i'll try to do a summary of this later, because i have a lot of exp vs Peach, but, i think, it's 55:45 Peach, at most...the fight could be either easy or hard as hell x9-

 

[Flameleon]

Peach beats Mario. He can't approach her if she camps, and she has better approach tools to get a lead.

-She sure "beat" us, if u know what i mean x9, anyways, we can approach walking like anyone o.0, Peach can camp.? Fludd>Turnips, even Fludd would break your floating game, so, it doesn't work that much, and about her approach, most Peaches do approach only with glide toss or dash attack, Fair too and a few other things but...they're very repetitive, being calm and patient is the key here...

She also edgeguards him pretty solidly and can outspace him very safely.

-Peach can only rack damage and almost never kill us when she's edguarding us but we CAN kill her if we're edgeguarding...

6:4.

-55:45, still in Peach's favour x9

 

[Smash G 0 D]

Peach beats Mario. 6:4.

Y'all should trust me on this one >_< And Praxis is completely right. Also, it's too hard for Mario to rack up damage on Peach. It's so hard to get in there.