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Meta "The Final Content" [1.1.4] Patch Discussion

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LonkQ

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Roy hasn't had any changes to his damage or running speed.
 

Bribery

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This is what I've noticed so far in training mode for Marth (so no freshness bonus). All tests were done on a 0% Mario.

Nair (Hit 1):
Sour: 3% -> 3.5% (2 sours did 7% to Mario)
Tipper: 4% -> 5%

Fair:
Sour: 7% -> 8%
Tipper: 10% -> 11.5% (2 tippers did 23% to Mario)

Uair:
Sour: 9% -> 9.5% (2 hits did 19% to Mario)
Tipper: 12% -> 13%

Dair:
Meteor: 14% -> 15%
Tipper: 13% -> 14%
Sour: 11% -> 12%

Bair:
Tipper: 12% -> 12.5% (2 tippers did 25% to Mario)
 

KeithTheGeek

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The cooldown of Dedede's nair landing feels significantly shorter. Can anyone confirm?
D3's nair has always had rather low landing lag. When I was testing him out I didn't notice any changes, but I wasn't looking too in depth for lack of ti
 

Ultinarok

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I can second the Marth tipper changes. His first tipped nair hit does 5%...didn't it used to do 3%?

Also did GW always have a landing bair hit that does 3%? I know he didn't at launch but
 

Kofu

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I can second the Marth tipper changes. His first tipped nair hit does 5%...didn't it used to do 3%?

Also did GW always have a landing bair hit that does 3%? I know he didn't at launch.
No, he's always had a 3% landing hit that has a significantly different launch angle than the aerial hit.
 

Nobie

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By the way, if people are testing between 3DS and Wii U, Dreamland seems to be the most accurate stage shared by both versions.
 

arbustopachon

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Can someone test charizard's down throw? It seems to confirm into Uair way easier at around 95% on middleweights.
As i am in the 3ds version i cannot check wether it can be airdodged or not.

It might be placebo, but if it isn't it would be really big.
 
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Ffamran

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Something that frame data won't be able to tell like it did for Falco's Up Smash, Greninja's Up Smash still does not interact properly with platforms on 3DS version of Battlefield. Would like someone else with a Wii U to follow up on this as it's strange how Falco's Up Smash was changed in 1.0.8 to only hit with the second hit on Battlefield's lower platforms, but not Greninja's. Consequently, Greninja is left with a frame 12 Up Smash that only does 5%.

Something else that frame data will debunk or prove: Falco's Up Smash may have gotten a slight increase to its knockback. Here's the problem: hazy memory and I used Pit to test Falco's KO percents way back. For the record, I still have the old percents and a full connection from Falco's Up Smash killed Pit at 130% on omega Wily Castle. Note: the KO percent is the lowest percent when the red sparks appear marking it as a kill move. Today's check? 121%. As a two-hit move, the final hit is what matters for the kill and I have that too. The old data says 138% while today, it's 129%. Like I said, the problem is that I don't really remember and since I tested on Pit... yeah...

Actually, I just checked... damn Crashboards... @kenniky found KO percents for Falco before with Mario on the 3DS: http://smashboards.com/threads/kill-percents-on-all-relevant-moves.407089/. kenniky's data for 1.0.8 said that Falco's Up Smash kills at 132% with both hits; today, 1.1.4, it kills at 122%. The last hit was said to kill at 136%; today, 1.1.4, it kills at 130%.

TL;DR: Greninja's Up Smash still doesn't interact with Battlefield's lower platform and Falco's Up Smash knockback increase if confirmed, means Falco's (fully connected) Up Smash ties as his 2nd strongest raw kill move with Bair. If not, then it was always this powerful, but something screwed up... or nobody bothered to check 1.1.0 and onward which frame data would be against... >_>

Also, Little Mac's Smashes might be doing more damage... Angled up (uppercut) and straight (straight or cross) do 20% (fist) and 18% (arm) instead of 19% and 17% and angled down (body hook) is doing 24% instead of 22%; Up Smash is doing 21% sweet and 16%, and Down Smash is doing 13%.
 
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xaviersykora

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If I'm not mistaken, Wii Fit Trainer's back air seems to have a LOT less end lag than it did in 1.1.3.
 

Halfy

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The first hit of toon link's forward smash seems to link more reliably into the second hit now
 

Radical Larry

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I think Link's running speed is faster.
It barely just matches Falco and is almost equivalent to Bowser Jr.'s dashing speed.
I've tested it on Falco, Jr. and Peach, and Link seems to run faster than he did before.

Anyone want to check his stats?
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

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This for sent to me by a smasher on facebook

Mario/Luigi/Doc lost invincibly on Usmash.

Proof:
 
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DunnoBro

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Duck Hunt's Down Throw is a combo throw now. Knockback is very noticeably low @ 0%. Up Air true combos at high percent for another example. Pretty sure there are more setups, but DHD boards probably got that covered.
Not true, it's exactly the same. It always registered as a true combo with no DI vs some charccters.

Duck hunt received no notable buffs i can find.
 
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Darklink401

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Jeez, I can definitely confirm the duck hunt dthrow buff

Dthrow upair kills ZSS at 115%, confirmed. Welp, there goes his problem killing.
 

Ghostbone

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I think Link's running speed is faster.
It barely just matches Falco and is almost equivalent to Bowser Jr.'s dashing speed.
I've tested it on Falco, Jr. and Peach, and Link seems to run faster than he did before.

Anyone want to check his stats?
No
Link still runs slower than Peach and faster than Dedede as always
Get your placebo out of here.

Also @ everyone claiming half a character's moves were buffed by like 1%, you're probably comparing the damage they do fresh to the damage they do in training mode, or getting decimals confused.
 

Yikarur

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Mario's upsmash still has invincibility. If you hit too late you've always clashed because he is not full invincible.
 

vermillionshift

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Testing out Bowser right now. I'm not terribly good at reading the hitboxes frame by frame, and obviously please double check in case I am wrong.

-Dash Attack: Damage 11% > 12% (I might be wrong about this, but I remember doing 11 pre-patch)
-Dair (Meteor): Angle changed to 85 region
-Dair: Angle changed to 60 region

That's all I can find that appears to be changed about Bowser. I might be off base, but I'm not finding any different results after nearly an hour of tests.
 

Shaya

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This wouldn't include possible end lag or base stat (mobility) changes, but a good basis to believe in at this time!
 
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Ffamran

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This for sent to me by a smasher on facebook

Mario/Luigi/Doc lost invincibly on Usmash.

Proof:
Welp... the game lies to us again... "Up Smash Attack – A powerful upward headbutt. Mario's head is invulnerable while performing it. Useful against opponents moving in to attack from above." That's probably going to need to change or has been changed... Weird... Why remove the I-frames? They could have easily stopped it from being spammy by increasing the recovery frames instead. I'm going to assume that Mr. Game & Watch, Rosalina, and Wario kept theirs?

Edit: Never mind.
 
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FEFIZ

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Ness and Roy looks the same. About Luigi, well, he lost upsmash invencibility(?)
 

Radical Larry

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Someone check Link's Jab Attack to see if it's still Frame 7.
And someone please, please, please get some Link datamining? I'd really appreciate if anyone would find changes.
 

Yikarur

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stop repeating the same thing over and over.
They did not lose their invincibility on their upsmashes. Neither of them did.
 

DunnoBro

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Jeez, I can definitely confirm the duck hunt dthrow buff

Dthrow upair kills ZSS at 115%, confirmed. Welp, there goes his problem killing.
Are you testing with DI? It always registered as a true combo without DI on ZSS/Sheik/Ryu.
 
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Ffamran

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This wouldn't include possible end lag or base stat (mobility) changes, but a good basis to believe in at this time!
Welp, of that list, Falco and Little Mac get a "Yea" from me of having changes; Falco's Up Smash's second hit knockback change and Little Mac's Smashes all gaining +1% except for angled down Side Smash gaining +2%. And yes, I tested these on training mode... I rarely ever fight or use CPUs unless I'm going for trophy unlocks for newly released Smash games. There is potentially another Falco change, but I will blame this from having not played in a while: I think Falco's U-throw and maybe B-throw have him fire his laser a bit faster... Problem is I have no idea how to test this or how the sixriver people tested this. Also, I only have one system. So, take this potential change and probable placebo with a grain of salt.

Yeah... I don't want to sound rude, but that shows almost nothing. Maybe Falco's animation is faster. Maybe Falco's 0.001 faster. We need a comparison like him running next to Ike, Ryu, or something. I swear to god, developers! If you up his running speed from 1.472 to 1.473, I'm going rip down a wall!
 
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FlynnCL

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Unless everyone I tested has been changed, Falco's run speed appears to be unchanged in any noticeable way.

Falco (1.472) still runs slower than Ike, Luigi and Lucas (1.5) and is basically identical to Olimar (1.47).
 
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