the CONTROLLER thread! Button Mapping, Controller Type, etc

[Joppe]

As you get used to the gamecube controller you'll be able to move between Y and the C-stick more quickly. You can also try setting L or R to jump (since you only need one shield button) if you want. You don't always have to use the c-stick to aerial, using A is fine a lot of the time anyway, the c-stick helps when you're trying to move a different direction to the aerial.

Yea everybody uses different settings, my settings are weird >.>
I've got R as attack, Z as jump and X as grab (tap jump off)

What character do you play? I'd suggest finding out their ATs (advanced techniques) and figuring out what controls allows you to perform them with greater consistency.

Aah, I still have to get used i guess, I'm using falco, ike and marth. i already checked their advanced techniques. But does that mean i should be using different controls for different characters? And the most annoying thing about the GC is that you have to press the L and R hard. That's why I don't like to jump with L/R.

 

[Ghostbone]

Aah, I still have to get used i guess, I'm using falco, ike and marth. i already checked their advanced techniques. But does that mean i should be using different controls for different characters? And the most annoying thing about the GC is that you have to press the L and R hard. That's why I don't like to jump with L/R.

Na don't use different controls for different characters, that will just confuse you.
If you're finding the L and R buttons a problem, you can always take the springs out of them. (I know many top players do that)

 

[Joppe]

Na don't use different controls for different characters, that will just confuse you.
If you're finding the L and R buttons a problem, you can always take the springs out of them. (I know many top players do that)

That´s a good idea! I think I´m gonna do that. And indeed i noticed that I have to get used to the GC, but its working out fine! thanks alot!

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

Na don't use different controls for different characters, that will just confuse you.
If you're finding the L and R buttons a problem, you can always take the springs out of them. (I know many top players do that)

I'd like to try this too, but meh, who knows man.....who knows.
I might just copy gnes's controller

 

[Tarp]

Related to the jumping with L on the GCC, how hard is it to SH with L? I'm maining with Falco right now, so SH's are obviously very important.

 

[I38VWI]

I'm glad to read I'm not the only one who uses CCPro...

I really enjoy the extra button it gives me (ZL), and the fact that it's wireless without awful awful Wavebird lag.
The fact that the triggers are all much shorter draw is also huge to me.

I have all face and shoulder buttons rotated around so that it feels more GC-y: A=Jump, B=Attack, Y=Special, X=Grab (never use it though), ZR=Shield, and R is also Grab (for pivot/boost grabbing).

As for the left triggers, I have them set up so that thunder/pikastorming is easy as pie and so that I can DACUS with Sheik: ZL=Attack and L=Jump

Another good thing about this configuration is that it does not take long to get used to from GC controller, especially for those that are R-Shielders like me; most of the buttons are in a configuration that matches as close as possible.

 

[azn_tony_908]

I usually don't map my controllers, since I don't want to have to go through the trouble of having to change controller settings every time I go to a friends house or a tournament.

 

[popsofctown]

Fun fact: The only way to perform a neutral air while continuously drifting to the right (or left) is to use set the c stick to attack (tilt sticking).

You flick the stick in a diagonal direction, and you perform a nair. To the best of my knowledge no one with a smash stick can do this.

The diagonal direction is specific enough that I don't usually attempt to perform a nair with this method. Occasionally, though, I'll be unsure which cardinal aerial I want to perform and end up nairing. For some characters that option is an inbetweener sort of option and ends up working nicely. For some characters it's an epic fail.

I don't play any characters like Wario or Jiggs that would motivate me to master drift Nairing. But sometimes I wish I did so I could brag and stuff.

 

[Lof]

hmmm...for my terribly scar'd hands...maybe some button rearranging is in order...its sad...i try so fast to keep up even with fast characters that I forget I can grab...even as dedede o_o

 

[SlayerZaxy]

Why is tap jump such a bad idea?

It's only really "bad" for certain characters. Yoshi specifically. He has an Up + B that doesn't use his second jump, but all B moves auto cancel jumping. This means that when you use tap jump and you do an Up B, your Second jump gets spent. If it is off then you can do several up b's and then use your second jump after.

 

[Esotera]

L jump. Zspecial, X grab, tap jump off. :D

 

[DrSoussou]

why Zspecial?

Personally, I main Lucario (basically the only character not from Mother who gains a crazy wavebounce from B-sticking) and have tap-jump off and c-stick set to specials. It was a tough decision considering that smash/tilt-stick both help DI + aerials so much, and Lucario is heavily an aerial-comboing character, but my ability to mixup charging aura sphere has increased by a ridiculous margin. For these reasons, I feel like your controller settings are HIGHLY character-dependent. On the other hand, I feel like tap-jump kills the amount of horizontal distance that ANY character can cover with a short-hopped attack. Trying to sh an attack with tap-jump and move across the stage simultaneously is exponentially harder than using X or Y to jump and attacking with c-stick.

 

[Dexident]

I never use the C-stick. I always have tap to jump off.

Though I might try configuring to b-stick, that sounds like an interesting idea. I doubt I'll use it though. I also think the Idea of setting to tilt stick sounds like a great idea. If only I could get in the habit of setting L to grab and actually using it. I never touch the L button ever...

 

[Tesh]

Well ZSS, ICs and Pikachu can all do some...interesting things with wavebouncing, but only ZSS would really use it in her playstyle.

I don't think there is any AT you can't perform with the smash C Stick setting. I can wavebounce and bstick all specials with the Smash setting for Wiichuck dpad, it just takes timing.

 

[DrSoussou]

I think any configuration can be learned to play with, even those that seem ridiculously complicated to others. The key is just having everything at your disposal and being able to implement all of it into your gameplay. For example, Lucario's Aura-sphere (neutral-B) wavebounce with the b-stick requires me to tilt the c-stick very quickly and ONLY in a diagonal direction. This is very hard to do in general, but with the right amount of practice, I was able to learn to even pull it off in a pinch. Now I can even short-hop a Fair and retreat by charging my AS. Its fine if you never use X or Y, as long as your tap-jumping is perfect and you make up for its disadvantages by mastering c-stick aerials. You can survive without ever shield-grabbing as long as your ability to use the Z-button is just as fast.

 

[DrSoussou]

I never use the C-stick. I always have tap to jump off.

Though I might try configuring to b-stick, that sounds like an interesting idea. I doubt I'll use it though. I also think the Idea of setting to tilt stick sounds like a great idea. If only I could get in the habit of setting L to grab and actually using it. I never touch the L button ever...

If you change to b-stick, try training with it a lot so that when you actually play against an opponent your muscle memory will take over. When I first made the switch, I changed my B-button to attack so that I HAD to use the c-stick in order to do specials. Once I felt very comfortable with it I switched the B-button back on and now I regularly use both in different situations.

I used to think that tilt stick was a good idea, but I never really found a good way to implement it on the ground. Since I had tap-jump off, I would simply Utilt by holding Up on the control stick and mashing A. Same with Dtilt. With Ftilt, I found that it was much more practical and controllable to manually tilt. If you're not used to that, then practice it, but I didn't think it was worth allocating my entire c-stick to tilts if I was only going to use it for Ftilt and aerials.

I also never touch my L button, lol

 

[Dexident]

Lol well see my thing is that I never use my c-stick whatsoever. Like ever. I have even touched it (without actually pressing it) maybe upwards of ten times ever.

So if I were to use it in any capacity it would probably be a very forced action. . . For some reason I have trouble f-tilting accurately, the others are of course no problem for me. Every now and then I find myself walking, or running a little ways before an f-tilt, and that's not what I want.

The thing is GW doesn't really have any directional b moves that I would benefit by having a b-stick... maybe bucket braking but I've already got that in my muscle memory as it is... I dunno, I do want to implement chef wave-bouncing though, there might be some use to that.

 

[DrSoussou]

That chef move with b-stick woud involve the same precise diagonal tilt that I use for Aura sphere, and trust me when I say that even though I rarely play as/against G&W, you will find little to no practical value in that technique or in his neutral B in general lol. Also, if you already find yourself walking forward occasionally when attempting an Ftilt, you will definitey have trouble with this tech.

I don't mean to discourage you, like I said, every configuration is possible with the right amount of practice. Its just that the wavebounce is mostly used for an aerial mixup and G&W already has superb aerial mobiity, especially when you consider his side-to-side parachute drift. You'll also find yourself getting stuck in burger-flipping mode more than you'd like.

If I were to make a suggestion, it would be to play towards G&W's strengths. In the case of the c-stick, his smashes and aerials. You will make RIDICULOUS progress if you implement stutter-smashing with the c-stick as well as using it to attack in the air while using the control-stick to simultaneously DI. It will seem foreign at first, but if you just keep c-stick set to smashes, hop into training mode, and practice using the same technique over and over again, you will get used to it.

 

[MasterGorf]

Hi, I've started to play Brawl with my friends and want to get in the competitve scene, right now I use the Wii + Nunchuck, will probably get a GameCube controller eventually, but for now what is the best buttons to set for the Nunchuck?

 

[DrSoussou]

I would say that getting the gamecube controller is your first step; don't bother getting used to playing with something you're planning to replace. I don't know anything about wiichuck settings because I don't know anyone who uses it.

 

[infiniteV115]

I use turnaround-Bs, B-reversals and wavebounces more than any other player I've seen, and I don't have anything set to special other than the Y button (I jump with X). Setting Z to special or using B-stick isn't necessary, doing it normally isn't hard at all.

Tesh, b-reversals are important to Pikachu when edgeguarding with thunder, and I suppose occasionally they can help with Tjolts.

My controls are (GCC)

Tap Jump off (I jump with X)
Y set to special (makes jump-->immediate special a lot easier)
B set to shield (makes powershielding, platform cancelling and precise airdodges [like when trying to avoid a SL] easier)
R set to jump (helps with platform cancelling, tether cancelling and things like retreating rising fair/approaching rising bair/RAR easier. tbh I don't use R much, lol)
D-pad set to grab, jump and shield (K-Pr1me mashing)

Everything else is default.

 

[Tesh]

What I was talking about wasn't the usual b reverse of thunder. I was pointing out that using the Bstick is mostly useless for just about everyone. I'm not sure if its called a reverse wavebounce but its like.

Wavebounce Up B= Reversed momentum+Reversed direction
Reverse Wavebounce Up B= Reversed momentum+ same direction. Pretty sure it doesn't matter which wave pika is facing when Up B is done, since its so laggy he must have landed or SDed if he used it.
Reverse Wavebounce Side B= Reversed momentum + same direction. This is pikachu moving backwards while charging a forward skull bash.

I was saying the 2nd and 3rd techniques are the only ones made simpler by setting the Cstick to Specials and they are borderline useless anyway.

I find ZSS reverse wavebounce to be the most useful of all though.

 

[DrSoussou]

@infinite: I actually tried for a while, but I could never figure out how to wavebounce manually. For example, in order to jump forward while facing forward and then initiate ASC at the peak of the jump while facing forward but traveling backwards, I have to wavebounce with b-stick. If I knew how to do that same technique manually, I would totally switch my c-stick back to smashes so that I could get all the benefits rather than having to choose one.

Also, how does B-shield help platform-cancelling?

@Tesh: I definitely see your point as far as Pika goes, but the technique I just exemplified does have practical KO potential with Lucario if it means connecting with a FCAS. The ZSS wavebounce is definitely useful as well. Mixing up her side-B with B-reversals, wavebounces, and turnarounds makes one of her best killmoves really hard to predict and properly space from.

 

[infiniteV115]

Ok I'll use the Smash Lab Terms List

Turnaround B - Character changes the direction they're facing while momentum remains the same. Press back right before pressing B.

B-reversal - Character changes the direction they're facing AND momentum changes. Press back right after pressing B.

Wavebounce - Character changes momentum while facing the same direction. Press back before pressing B, then press the opposite direction after pressing B.

So, to give an example, pretend you're a Lucario running to the right. You jump right while facing right, and you're going to do all 3 of these to your ASC. You rise, initiate ASC at the peak of your jump, and then you fall while charging your AS.

Turnaround B - Press left (I find flicking the analog is the easiest way to do this) and then press B.
While rising, Lucario is moving right and facing right. While falling, Lucario is moving right and facing left.

B reversal - Press B, then press left immediately after.
While rising, Lucario is moving right and facing right. While falling, Lucario is moving left and facing left.

Wavebounce - Press left, press B immediately after, then press right immediately after. (Double-flick makes this easiest imo). Pretty much, this is a turnaround B-reversal.
While rising, Lucario is moving right and facing right. While falling, Lucario is moving left and facing right.

The inputs I provided apply to all upBs, downBs and neutral Bs, with a few exceptions.
Obviously for sideBs, there is no turnaround-B; you can just press left+B (at the same time) and you'll face left and fall right. A sideB to the left...idk how else to put it XD
And, by extension, there is no wavebounce for sideBs; you just sideB to the left and then press right.

I've wanted to make a general video about these for a while but I don't have a capture card and I'm poor.

Edit: Missed a question. There's a platform cancel dropthrough where basically you platform cancel, and you buffer a dropthrough immediately.
It looks like this, he did it twice.
If you're confused (you might be cause it's pretty fast), what exactly he did was
Jump-->PCDT(platform cancel dropthrough)-->jump-->PCDT-->falling uair.
Since momentarily, you land on the platform, you get your 2nd jump (or multiple jumps) back, it can be kinda useful. eg ZSS is offstage and has already used her downB, she PCDTs the SV platform to get it back; now she has her 2nd jump AND her downB.

Anyway, I'm rambling. The input for it is shield+smash down on analog (when I say smash, I mean press down quickly. Like doing a smash attack, but instead of pressing A, you press shield). When I found out about it I practiced it for like 2 hours straight and was only getting it like...40% of the time at most. Then I realized that since I have Y set to special, I don't use the B button for anything, so I tried setting it to shield to see if it would make PCDTing more easy...and it did.

 

[yoshi8984]

I use a GC control, but I only changed a few of my settings.

I turn tap jump off; Sometimes I will accidently jump instead of doing an U-Tilt/U-Smash/Up-B. But I don't want that to happen. While it does force me to press the jump button for OoS U-Smash/Up-B, it's something I can live with. Plus my characters are better in the air XD

I set Y to grabs, but only because I will never use Y to jump and had nothing else better to set it to. XD

I change my L button to specials for PK Jump and PKF Lag Cancel (Ness specific) and I just prefer using the L button instead of the B button for specials for my other characters. (except for Up-Bs, I always use the B button for recovering lol) Plus I will never shield with L. XD
Well actually for Peach I set L to attacks since I find it awkward to hold X and press A/use C-Stick to do aerials while floating. But with the L button it makes it easier imo.

 

[DrSoussou]

Thanks, Infinite. That was really helpful, more so than I had expected. It'll take some work, but hopefully I'll be able to erase everything from my muscle-memory that I learned about B-sticking and try to master wavebouncing manually with that info. From there I can re-implement the smash stick and learn to use retreating Fairs and get better DI/aerials in general.

As for the PCDT...holy **** lol. I still don't even have the standard PC down pat, but now I know I have to work on it a lot more.

Btw, who do you main? I feel like I see you on Lucario and ZSS threads all the time but you pop up in other places too, lol.

 

[Tesh]

Ok I'll use the Smash Lab Terms List

Turnaround B - Character changes the direction they're facing while momentum remains the same. Press back right before pressing B.

B-reversal - Character changes the direction they're facing AND momentum changes. Press back right after pressing B.

Wavebounce - Character changes momentum while facing the same direction. Press back before pressing B, then press the opposite direction after pressing B.

So, to give an example, pretend you're a Lucario running to the right. You jump right while facing right, and you're going to do all 3 of these to your ASC. You rise, initiate ASC at the peak of your jump, and then you fall while charging your AS.

Turnaround B - Press left (I find flicking the analog is the easiest way to do this) and then press B.
While rising, Lucario is moving right and facing right. While falling, Lucario is moving right and facing left.

B reversal - Press B, then press left immediately after.
While rising, Lucario is moving right and facing right. While falling, Lucario is moving left and facing left.

Wavebounce - Press left, press B immediately after, then press right immediately after. (Double-flick makes this easiest imo). Pretty much, this is a turnaround B-reversal.
While rising, Lucario is moving right and facing right. While falling, Lucario is moving left and facing right.

The inputs I provided apply to all upBs, downBs and neutral Bs, with a few exceptions.
Obviously for sideBs, there is no turnaround-B; you can just press left+B (at the same time) and you'll face left and fall right. A sideB to the left...idk how else to put it XD
And, by extension, there is no wavebounce for sideBs; you just sideB to the left and then press right.

I've wanted to make a general video about these for a while but I don't have a capture card and I'm poor.

Edit: Missed a question. There's a platform cancel dropthrough where basically you platform cancel, and you buffer a dropthrough immediately.
It looks like this, he did it twice.
If you're confused (you might be cause it's pretty fast), what exactly he did was
Jump-->PCDT(platform cancel dropthrough)-->jump-->PCDT-->falling uair.
Since momentarily, you land on the platform, you get your 2nd jump (or multiple jumps) back, it can be kinda useful. eg ZSS is offstage and has already used her downB, she PCDTs the SV platform to get it back; now she has her 2nd jump AND her downB.

Anyway, I'm rambling. The input for it is shield+smash down on analog (when I say smash, I mean press down quickly. Like doing a smash attack, but instead of pressing A, you press shield). When I found out about it I practiced it for like 2 hours straight and was only getting it like...40% of the time at most. Then I realized that since I have Y set to special, I don't use the B button for anything, so I tried setting it to shield to see if it would make PCDTing more easy...and it did.

??? I'm confused. There IS wavebouncing for side B isn't there?

 

[DrSoussou]

Yes, there definitely is. I think he was trying to say that its not precisely the same tech since it already requires a control-stick input?

 

[infiniteV115]

^
What he said. So yes, you can wavebounce sideBs. You can make a sideB change its momentum without changing the direction the move comes out.

If you're confused, just pretend I never said you can't wavebounce/turnaroundB sideBs. You CAN.

Soussou, I main ZSS...I don't know how you saw me in the Lucario boards, I posted there once or twice a couple of months ago...XD
Ever heard of V115? That's me.

I also frequent the Pika boards since I 2nd Pikachu but it isn't tourney ready, so in terms of tournament play I'm a ZSS player and nothing more...for now

If you watch my videos on youtube you'll notice that I tend to turnaroundB, b-reverse and wavebounce the **** out of everything.

Edit: On 2nd thought, maybe you wouldn't see me do it that often while watching my youtube vids...but if you played me in person you'd know for sure.

 

[DrSoussou]

Lol sorry, bro. I've barely heard of anyone. I don't even know the people in my region XD. I'll watch your vids, though. ZSS matches are some of my favorite, I'd say she's my strongest secondary but still pretty far from my Lucario.

 

[infiniteV115]

If you're from Southern Florida then you live in the same region as the best (imo) ZSS, dude. XD
Florida's a pretty strong region.

 

[DrSoussou]

Yeah hopefully I'll be meeting him and a lot of other people at ZP monthlies on the 26th. Unfortunately that's only a week away and I won't have re-learned everything with my controls by then...unless I literally dedicate this entire week to it, which I can't because of this annoying thing called real life that keeps interfering.

Incidentally, I'm practicing now and I'm not having much success lol. I've had b-reversals and turnarounds down for a while, but the wavebounce was my favorite I keep doing FP when I try it manually but at least I'm achieving it. My goal is to be able to execute a wavebounced FCAS shot directly after a forward sh Fair. That was my most common tech to use with B-stick, and I could always pull it off on command..as well as following the Fair with a retreating charge. This will take SERIOUS getting used to

 

[DeLux]

Why not just use Bair (which is safer on shield) and mix up with a reversal Paralyzer?

Same effect as your Fair thing, only safer AND easier to input.

 

[Dcold]

Gamecube Controller:

X set to special for mashing (Dabuz way)
R set to attack for making DACUS an easier motion to make
Tap Jump set to off.

Helps me mash quickly and it's efficient for me.

 

[DrSoussou]

Iridescent, I definitely like the sound of that idea for ZSS but I was talking about Lucario, lol. Sorry if there's any confusion. FP = Force Palm (Lucario's side-special) and FCAS = fully charged aura sphere.

Dcold, I like that idea for easier DACUS. I might make a profile with that configuration and save it for when I play Wario occasionally, lol.

 

[Napos]

Ok, so I use the Classic Controller Pro.

All you other CCP peeps out there having this problem that is super ****ing annoying.


The special button not being sensitive as well as other buttons. So for example....Diddys upB, firing once you input, or snakes grenades being pulled and thrown immediately. This control is brand new, and its the Gold edition(From 007 game) It ****ing sucks cause the first day I got it, Worked great...after a few days...controller went sour.

Thinking of switching to GCC if this is a common problem.

 

[Tesh]

^Yea I'm finding that alot of the wii controllers just can't take the vigorous button mashing that goes on in competitive play and practice. Just recently the shield button on my nunchuck broke.

 

[Flayl]

Ok, so I use the Classic Controller Pro.

All you other CCP peeps out there having this problem that is super ****ing annoying.


The special button not being sensitive as well as other buttons. So for example....Diddys upB, firing once you input, or snakes grenades being pulled and thrown immediately. This control is brand new, and its the Gold edition(From 007 game) It ****ing sucks cause the first day I got it, Worked great...after a few days...controller went sour.

Thinking of switching to GCC if this is a common problem.

It's because of the wiimote, it has nothing to do with the button itself

Your wiimote needs the best position possible for a stable connection to the wii

edit: Other stuff that can happen: Dashes being interrupted mid run while still holding the stick, shields being dropped while still holding the button

 

[Napos]

It's because of the wiimote, it has nothing to do with the button itself

Your wiimote needs the best position possible for a stable connection to the wii

edit: Other stuff that can happen: Dashes being interrupted mid run while still holding the stick, shields being dropped while still holding the button

****. Any suggestions for a great wiimote position? Or maybe I can buy the wiimote that has the motion plus for supreme connection? also do i need to have the sensor bar going cause I don't use it.

 

[Flayl]

No you don't need the sensor bar. Just leave the wiimote in a position that's completely unblocked from the wii, if the wii's on a table make sure the wiimote is above the table level too etc. You should be able to have the wiimote 2 meters away and have it work perfectly.

If you're still having problems then try using someone else's wiimote before you buy a new one.