Our scene isnt dead and we never said our scene was dead. Our scene is just currently small. We are not alienating players at all because we will still have GA tourneys for our locals to go to. Idk when any of us said we would stop hosting tourneys and rely on AL.
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The Alabama Power Rankings: Image=protier
- Thread starter Saki-
- Start date
- Status
Ingulit
Ing-u-lit
Then I reverse my statement. Go for the merge.
EDIT: Wait, is BigLou not from GA? I totally thought he was.
EDIT: Wait, is BigLou not from GA? I totally thought he was.
Hes gone to one tourney this season because of work. He will be active after September 3rd.
Mahgnittoc
Smash Ace
wuht. I come back to this thread and see we're merging?
<--- Rage
<--- Rage
people just dont wanna be knocked off the PR.
idk man i think we'd look more legit to have AL/GA PR instead of seperate.
if anything i feel like GA is more respected than alabama so the fact that we'd be in the same thread as you guys will get us recoginition and people can stop being like "lol at alabama"
i just want us to be legit and this is a step in that direction.
and for the record i think the annexing Pcola thing was more ridiculous than the merging of AL and GA. we're talking about a scene here and you guys are reluctant to help and expand but one kid says he doesnt want to drive to tournaments in his state because its too far wah wah wah wah and we add him? you guys just dont make sense to me at all most of the time lol like straight up.
i agree with everything DRN is saying.
idk man i think we'd look more legit to have AL/GA PR instead of seperate.
if anything i feel like GA is more respected than alabama so the fact that we'd be in the same thread as you guys will get us recoginition and people can stop being like "lol at alabama"
i just want us to be legit and this is a step in that direction.
and for the record i think the annexing Pcola thing was more ridiculous than the merging of AL and GA. we're talking about a scene here and you guys are reluctant to help and expand but one kid says he doesnt want to drive to tournaments in his state because its too far wah wah wah wah and we add him? you guys just dont make sense to me at all most of the time lol like straight up.
i agree with everything DRN is saying.
Not really, when things got bad here in the scene was just abot dead. Did we hear GA knocking at our door, I sure didn't. I got up and i start holding tourneys sure they wasn't it was something. I don't even care about being knocked of the pr. And who said that GA has more respect the Al, let me holla at them. I understands pcola's situation that's and isolated city. If GA a freaking state is having a problem maybe they should get together like we did. Or somebody in should GA pick up the bat and take a swing. I did it, aurburn got together and did it. Ingulit did it. The next thing you know Al was sh*ting tourneys. Now we have ASL, give them a chance to save themselves first. LIKE WE(ALABAMA) DID. Then we should discuss to bail them out of their situation. If their solid attempts fail. Then and only then we should extend our hands of merger.
Yo AL didnt approach us at all either when their scene wasnt doing so well. Now that ours is a little....unstable reflex mentioned merging and i talked to him/raf/calvin a lot more about it and the pros outweigh the cons imo and in theirs. It is not like we are not trying to reboot our scene. Micaelis is actively trying to get people to come to our tourneys. Its not like we dont have them....We have had like round robins all summer besides like 2 tourneys. We are still gonna continue to try to build our scene but even if it was larger i would still would like to merge at this point. We should have prob merged a while ago but ASL gives us the chance to make everything work perfectly. But seriously GA has always been legit about trying to travel to both AL and NC to help create bigger attendances but we never get the same kind of love and especially now when we need it.
Edit: But yea what Reflex said xD. Our scene tends to become unstable because of the summer.
Slam <3
This has nothing to do with their scene dying (it isn't; it simply tends to slow down during the summer, and there's plenty of promise in a new venue available and BigLou's ability to attend tournaments after September 3). The states' communities have just become closely knit, and it would increase the legitimacy of both Alabama and Georgia's scenes.
Georgia commands more respect than Alabama. It's a fact, no matter how skilled the players in either scene actually are. Most people who meet me from out-of-state assume that I'm from Florida or Georgia because they aren't aware that Alabama has a Brawl scene at all.
The issue is not about state pride, and it shouldn't be, because state lines are an arbitrary way to divide the community, the same way that disallowing Pensacola players would've been. The ASL hasn't even started, and still doesn't have nearly enough money to make work because people keep putting registration off. A fair amount of the money we -do- have is a result of the GA players who were already regularly going to AL tournaments.
None of the arguments being laid out by the people against it have much merit to them. "It could discourage up-and-coming players" won't happen, as the ELO rankings are specifically designed for people to be able to monitor their progress, and it is losing to the players above them that would be potentially discouraging, which will happen regardless of a merger. "Let Georgia take care of themselves" just serves to divide the community and implies that the Georgia scene is dying, which is not the case. Merging the two PRs only serves to benefit the community and more accurately represent our scene and our tournament play, and since that's what PRs are for in the first place, I don't see any problem with that.
*Cam*
Smash Lord
Let's get one thing straight.
Alabama has a strong Smash scene. We are very organized and have a lot of players. We have a multitude of motivated T.O.s putting together events all the time. We came together with several different tournament series to form the Alabama Smash League, and other states are taking notice of it. 3 of our state colleges now have Smash clubs. Suggesting we are weak or not respected without a merge is wrong. We do have enough players if we want to maintain our own PR. We should be very proud of how well we have done recently. Frankly, our scene is doing much better than Georgia's right now.
I didn't say that Alabama doesn't have a strong Smash scene, though it's probably best that we leave that alone. Part of the reason that Georgia is better-known and the like is because Billy is half-GA anyway, and Billy and myself are the only AL people who regularly go to out-of-state tournaments, which is why people tend to make that call. That said, I'm not trying to start some sort of skill comparison.
We've yet to see what kind of changes that the ASL will bring, since no major changes have really been put into place and seen to be successful as of this moment, so it's probably not a good idea to boast about projects that are still in development. That said, we do have a solid amount of tournaments, which is nice, for sure.
Suggesting that Alabama would only stand to benefit from a merge is entirely correct, though, from what I can tell.
I SEE YOU
Smash Ace
Nigga's don't know about my yoshi...
*Cam*
Smash Lord
I'm not suggesting we boast; I'm suggesting we be proud of our scene.
The clubs are a done deal (Ryan's has been running for a year now). The ASL is a done deal. Those are things to be proud of. I'm not arguing against the merge; you know that I'm ambivalent to that. I'm arguing against this popular notion that GA is strong and AL is weak. Even if that's not directly what you are saying, that is the implication. You're not the only one either. Many have made similar comments, and frankly, it upsets me that this attitude persists despite all we have accomplished in the past few months. We need to start thinking positively about our own Smash scene.
My hope is that eventually these new projects will change people's attitudes towards AL.
Mahgnittoc
Smash Ace
Also I was jking. IDC if we merge or not.
Ingulit
Ing-u-lit
It doesn't sound like it was even optional/up for debate anyway.
Micaelis
Smash Journeyman
I kept typing long paragraphs but I really don't want to argue because essentially I don't care much. But I do want to quickly stress a couple of facts.
GA's scene isn't bad. I'm regularly TOing and we'll have 20-30 people turn-outs that would be even more with better OoS attendance.
AL's scene IS strong. But people don't know about it because barely anyone consistently travels OoS. Sorry but smasher knowledge is usually limited to their local and big national tournaments. So spice up their locals/nationals with a little AL or throw your own and they'll learn just how strong you are.
I like you guys but you're all silly with PRs anyways. You should know how good you are. Strive to be the best you can be while having fun in the process; nothing else really matters.
GA's scene isn't bad. I'm regularly TOing and we'll have 20-30 people turn-outs that would be even more with better OoS attendance.
AL's scene IS strong. But people don't know about it because barely anyone consistently travels OoS. Sorry but smasher knowledge is usually limited to their local and big national tournaments. So spice up their locals/nationals with a little AL or throw your own and they'll learn just how strong you are.
I like you guys but you're all silly with PRs anyways. You should know how good you are. Strive to be the best you can be while having fun in the process; nothing else really matters.
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
This lol. it sounds like you guys kinda already got this going down anyway.
i agree with Cam. Where did we get this idea that GA is "respected" and AL is not? I've never heard anyone talk about GA's scene, at least not more than ALs? i feel like right now AL is more active than GA in Brawl. maybe i'm wrong.
all in all though. it's just a ****ing power rankings list. it is not a big deal at all lol who cares just play the game. i don't really see how a merger will help or hurt anyone its just kind of a random thing to do whatever. alabama doesn't go to GA tournaments, its just a fact. reflex and billy go and that's it right? and billy ****ing lives in georgia lol. maybe we can talk about this after this season of tournaments to see just how much GA attends our ****. i don't even know how this got brought up. I don't really understand whats going on, i think i missed something. how is this merger useful at all?
Ingulit
Ing-u-lit
I'm with Janitor in the idea that we should wait to do this until we see just how many AL or GA tournaments people attend this season. If AL players go to a lot of GA tournaments and vice-versa, then I think a merger will be an almost unquestionable suggestion that I think will go over much better to far more people. Just give it a few tournaments.
I am only saying that that -is- the popular notion.
What we have to understand is that a lot of this "overwhelming majority" comes from GA, which is just one part of two. If there isn't such a majority within just the AL players, it doesn't matter how many GA players want it to happen. Same with if it was backward.
To be fair, GA and AL are not widely watched and feared as an area like, say, Florida is. That said, people don't travel from AL, so there is basically no exposure from there.
In the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter all that much either way. A merged PR won't change who is going to our tournaments. It's just a list that says who is doing well in the area's tournaments.
I didn't feel like quoting people. So the main thang I've been reading is that GA whats us to go to there tourney. I don't mind that all. I'll catch a car pool whateva. I don't mind supporting anybodoy's community, tourney, i don't care. We are neighbors and very great neighbors, everybody form GA is pretty cool, laid back folks. But just because where good neighbors married with kids we move in together cause we get along. Why just not invite us over for dinner from time to time and we do the same. I'm talking about merging the states, I could care less about the pr. Territories exist for a reason, boundary lines exist for a reason. And I'm just fine the way things are. I could less who thinks how silly my opinion is are not.
We can help there situation without merging, has anybody thought about that yet?
We can help there situation without merging, has anybody thought about that yet?
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
ultimately this whole things sounds really random and arbitrary, so I don't care either way. I don't imagine this will affect how I feel about playing this game or attending tournaments. it sounds like you guys just want to "pretty up" the PR list, but that doesn't actually make our players better so I don't really understand it. but again, whatever, do what you like, I'll still be ON THAT ****
yes ^ basically this. i am not comparing skills or saying our scene is bad but i am just saying that smashers in the USA, rather it be true or not, believe that GA is a very strong state (at least for the south) and alabama is basically garbage. its a fact. im sorry but thats what literally every smasher that isnt from a state right around AL thinks about us. Merging with GA would be a great way to get our name out there and get recognition.
i talk to players, ranked and unranked and they all hold an opnion of "lol everyone in alabama is garbage. wait... reflex is from alabama??"
Ingulit
Ing-u-lit
Slam, to be fair, one of the main reasons we started the ASL is to hopefully get Alabama some real attention (at least to the level of GA). We're starting a large number clubs and tournaments to really educate players on how to get better, such that ideally (read: optimistically), people will start to see Alabama as more than the state where Reflex lives.
As I said in an earlier post, I think we should wait until the season is over until we start talking about a merge. If we were to go through with it RIGHT NOW, it would be that much harder to actually improve Alabama's scene in the short term. Currently, Alabama's scene is not much better than GA's, which is why we started the ASL. However, the ASL hasn't officially started, so we don't know yet if it will improve AL's scene or not (hopefully it will, of course). While one of the ASL's goals is for the ASL concept to spread to other states (provided it works), I think we need to establish its concept in a (our) single state to prove it works. To me, it sounds odd to start this large organization with "Alabama" in the title it it only covers half of the tournaments a merged PR would represent.
In the long term, however (read: after we see if the ASL worked or not), a merge would be both fine and a good (great) idea. Currently, however, I think it would be beneficial if Alabama could be given some time to grow and establish some new players so that we can at least compete with the caliber of GA's PR before merging. Beyond that, I really don't want there to be any possibility that the ASL will get undermined after the ASL organizers (read: Cam) have been going to so much trouble to just get it started, and I believe an immediate merge could do just that.
I'm fine with a merge so long as we wait a little while before going with it. Besides, more time will give us a better idea of where to put people on the merged PR (IE Biglou, etc).
As I said in an earlier post, I think we should wait until the season is over until we start talking about a merge. If we were to go through with it RIGHT NOW, it would be that much harder to actually improve Alabama's scene in the short term. Currently, Alabama's scene is not much better than GA's, which is why we started the ASL. However, the ASL hasn't officially started, so we don't know yet if it will improve AL's scene or not (hopefully it will, of course). While one of the ASL's goals is for the ASL concept to spread to other states (provided it works), I think we need to establish its concept in a (our) single state to prove it works. To me, it sounds odd to start this large organization with "Alabama" in the title it it only covers half of the tournaments a merged PR would represent.
In the long term, however (read: after we see if the ASL worked or not), a merge would be both fine and a good (great) idea. Currently, however, I think it would be beneficial if Alabama could be given some time to grow and establish some new players so that we can at least compete with the caliber of GA's PR before merging. Beyond that, I really don't want there to be any possibility that the ASL will get undermined after the ASL organizers (read: Cam) have been going to so much trouble to just get it started, and I believe an immediate merge could do just that.
I'm fine with a merge so long as we wait a little while before going with it. Besides, more time will give us a better idea of where to put people on the merged PR (IE Biglou, etc).
The reason I think Al might not get talk about( i want to see evidence of that) cause of melee. Before brawl came out we weren't that strong and Al,MS,TN, and AR was together. GA was by themselves and they had a damn good melee scene. We had reflex, moogle, joot, and myself that stood out. I went to so many south Fl tourneys people thought I was part of FL. Even some in Al. IF you want your name to get out there and people recognize you is to do very well and tourneys, win them from time to time, and beat the heavy weights. That's the only way you as a player would get recognized. Merge the pr won't help that and if it don't merge it won't help either. And how they know who is garbage or not, that's when it was you time to stand up in say something. I'll be damned if i let anybody talk about you or anybody else from Al. I'm not garbage, I'll tell M2k that, or whoever else. I'm not the best, but i'm not garbage. And when they were talking too you when they said that, they were talking about you too. I hope you know that.
The PR has nothing to do with the Alabama Smash League, though. Most of the upcoming Alabama tournaments happen to be within the ASL, but a person who doesn't sign up for the ASL that continues to pay normal tournament fees and does well would still be considered for the AL PR. If/when I have my own non-ASL tournament in Phenix City, it will count toward PR consideration. Part of the reason that the ASL is doing the ELO rankings is to avoid drawing subjective tiers made by a small handful of players within the scene (which is basically what the PR is all about).
Ignoring the merger point for a second, have we given any thought to separating the AL Power Rankings from the ASL altogether? That way, we could put much more emphasis on the objective rankings that we'll have and start from scratch, so that people don't have this idea that they'll have to claw their way up from the bottom.
I expect the ASL to help the scene a great deal, and I really do wish for it to go excellently.
Evidence of it? Ask around the next time you go to an out-of-state regional. I think that you'll be disappointed more often than not.
I don't see how the Melee scene would be responsible for AL going unnoticed. We had some great players. I was the East Coast Gimpyfish in my prime. I still get a fair amount of respect in general for my Melee play, even though I dropped Melee for good as soon as Brawl came out.
As far as AL going unnoticed, I would say that it's because a vast majority of our players don't go out of state. Maybe you would do quite well at a regional, Rag, but, we'll never know, since you hardly ever go out of state. That's probably just due to the circumstances, but, you can't blame other states for thinking that you don't exist when they don't ever see you. Billy and I are well-known because we travel often (as well as place well, but, that's not as important); nobody else from AL really goes to out-of-state regionals. From many players' points of view, if a person is not going to any regionals, their skill level is irrelevant, because they don't affect the metagame at all. If you want to be respected as an individual, you have to go out and show people that you have skill, and that you are a threat at the tournaments that you go to.
Saki-
Reset Project
By the way, every time we have this discussion it always ends up being "Lets hold it off for another season." and nothing ever gets done.
This is the truth. I don't see why we need any more data, when the players who would be added have appeared at AL tournaments time and time again. If a person is against it, don't let it be because we don't know if GA will be showing up at our tournaments, because they have been, they are, and they will very likely continue to do so, especially with some of GA's players signing up for ASL.
The panelists would include both GA and AL players, mostly in order to get an accurate representation of both scenes at tournaments where one state didn't show up, and vice-versa. The Melee guys did the same with Melee's Mid-South Power Rankings, and they didn't have any problems, despite the fact that I very rarely got to play any Arkansas players. No one will be under-represented as long as they go to some of their own state's tournaments, at least.
Yeah, your right I haven't been out of state in awhile not really since brawl came out. I used to go out of state all the time. But just because a certain person doesn't go out of state doesn't mean there trash. You just don't know how good there are. Anybody who wants to make a name for themselves has to go out of state in wreck and people can see. The only thing they can say is that Al don't travel. I know i'm not able to travel like that. Maybe once or twice a year depending on my job. It can be a person out there better than M2K out there rite now, but we don't know cause they mite not be able to go to tourneys or maybe just don't want to go. Its people unknown out there better than the people that are known. Its just that they are unknown. Not just video games, guns, martial arts...etc. That's a fact.
I suppose it doesn't, but why would they actively fear someone as a threat at a tournament if that person hasn't done anything outside of their area if that area is small?
It's less of, "AL is trash" and more of, "AL doesn't affect the current metagame at all." You could be a better player than M2K, Rag, but it doesn't mean anything to tournament goers if you only go to local tournaments. In that case, no one would care about them in a competitive sense, since they still don't affect the metagame at all.
Chris Langan is often referred as the smartest man in the world, but almost no one knows of his existence. Very few people pay attention to his findings because he lived in poverty, had a ****ty home life, and learned to resent authority, so he never ended up getting credentials that are basically required in order to be taken seriously in the academic world. I think this is somewhat relevant, in that remaining sheltered prevents people from taking notice of you, no matter how great you might be at something.
There are exceptions, of course. For example, as far as I am aware, innocentroads doesn't actually enter tournaments, but people make a big deal about him because his discoveries have affected the metagame in a significant way.
Player-1
Smash Legend
Didn't know all the PR discussion was going on in this thread :3
People saying that GA only want to merge just because our scene is dieing and that AL didn't ask for a merge when their scene was dieing are dumb since that point is irrelevant in the first place. Also, I was the one that originally brought the idea up the first time we discussed it when GA's scene was still pretty good and AL's scene wasn't btw.
People saying that they want to get more attention to AL's smash scene before the merge are also dumb because you're not going to get any more attention from OoS people unless you actually go OoS and do something like what GA/Reflex does and a merge would only help get more attention for in state people.
People saying that GA only want to merge just because our scene is dieing and that AL didn't ask for a merge when their scene was dieing are dumb since that point is irrelevant in the first place. Also, I was the one that originally brought the idea up the first time we discussed it when GA's scene was still pretty good and AL's scene wasn't btw.
People saying that they want to get more attention to AL's smash scene before the merge are also dumb because you're not going to get any more attention from OoS people unless you actually go OoS and do something like what GA/Reflex does and a merge would only help get more attention for in state people.
well i dont think you guys are garbage but i feel like im pretty pathetic at smash :/
maybe its just my low self confidence or maybe its true but i always feel like im missing something that the rest of you guys have. i just always feel like im a nub and im lacking in alot of ways. idk if it seems like that to other people though id appreciate it if i were to get feedback though so i can get a better picture of where i am and seperate my low self esteem from my actual skill. but yeah, i stick up for AL, just not myself.
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
I think its a joke to say that Alabama and Georgia have a cohesive scene together, and i also think its a joke to say that merging the PR list is going to affect or improve the fact that Alabama and Georgia don't have a cohesive scene together. Alabama doesn't travel. alot of us have rarely even seen a lot of Ga's top players.
The only way this idea isn't dumb is if Georgia brings ALL their top players to most of our upcoming tournaments, or if Alabama suddenly starts travelling to OoS tournies more often. Both which are entirely possible, but sound unlikely to me, personally.
Or unless you guys are saying you're only going to consider Alabama tournaments when you do the Power Rankings, and make Alabama sort of the hub for the AL/GA scene, since we have the ASL. which would be unfair to GA players who don't travel as much. But would make this idea not useless.
i don't think its a bad idea, in that I don't think anyone will be hurt by the merger except people who really wanted to be on the PR list without actually becoming good at the game. but I don't really think its a very logical or useful thing to do either. I don't really care what you guys do though.
I feel like you couldn't possibly even make this decision without first actually seeing if GA actually comes to our tournaments coming up, though.
The only way this idea isn't dumb is if Georgia brings ALL their top players to most of our upcoming tournaments, or if Alabama suddenly starts travelling to OoS tournies more often. Both which are entirely possible, but sound unlikely to me, personally.
Or unless you guys are saying you're only going to consider Alabama tournaments when you do the Power Rankings, and make Alabama sort of the hub for the AL/GA scene, since we have the ASL. which would be unfair to GA players who don't travel as much. But would make this idea not useless.
i don't think its a bad idea, in that I don't think anyone will be hurt by the merger except people who really wanted to be on the PR list without actually becoming good at the game. but I don't really think its a very logical or useful thing to do either. I don't really care what you guys do though.
I feel like you couldn't possibly even make this decision without first actually seeing if GA actually comes to our tournaments coming up, though.
Ummm IMO the merge is dead and over now considering ASL has switched to all MK banned. We wouldnt be able to get accurate results for the PR unless mk banned tourneys soon became the standard(soon as in before the season started lol).
Also we were pretty much offering to bring all our best players to your state and make you the main hub to compare. Players such as BigLou/Kismet/Micaelis/Player-1/Dynomite
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
oh i guess that makes sense about MK.
and I guess i didn't see that part about alabama being the hub, but yeah that's the only way it'd make sense.
and I guess i didn't see that part about alabama being the hub, but yeah that's the only way it'd make sense.
Mahgnittoc
Smash Ace
I think AL and GA should just have a baby out of wedlock and take care of it on alternating weekends
Ingulit
Ing-u-lit
Oh my God Mahg you are awesome
I'll do my best to make it to GA tournaments after the next month or so. Does this make the merger really a dead idea?
I believe so. We wouldnt be able to create accurate results from the ASL tourneys until MK banned tourneys become the true standard. Soo basically it kills this idea lol. O wellz
Player-1
Smash Legend
**** AL, let's just merge with NC
Micaelis
Smash Journeyman
Yeah, the tournament results between states will be too different especially since DRN and I use MK. I'll still be coming to all of AL's tournaments though. Would love to see you guys at ours too <3
Why merge at all? I'm fine with a Top 5 GA and us just wrecking OoS :D :D got to represent though. We got this.
EDIT: I <3 you Cheap!
Why merge at all? I'm fine with a Top 5 GA and us just wrecking OoS :D :D got to represent though. We got this.
EDIT: I <3 you Cheap!
_Keno_
Smash Lord
Honestly, state lines are dumb. We would merge would GA if it were up to me. I'm closer to every GA smasher than I am to Ragnarok.
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