Tekken Mafia | Now with the real endgame flavour.... Who won?

[Swiss]

This early in the Day, and you're already worried about how your vote looks?

> mfw every point Kary makes is as dumb as this.

> mfw Kary goes from smart, cautious player to throw scumslips at a wall and see what sticks

 

[Swiss]

One more for postgame ridicule.

> mfw Kuz goes full ******

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Kuz flips town.

Everyone thinks Swiss is scum be default.

What the hell guys?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Jay, how does that line up?

I'm confused by what you are saying.

 

[Blazer]

Kuz flips town.

Everyone thinks Swiss is scum be default.

What the hell guys?

It does look bad on him that Kuz was after him and he was the only person confirmed townie besides FF (Who also hinted at suspecting Swiss)

That's far from enough to call him mafia and bandwagon him though imo.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Alright

Soup is town, his early posts today show so
Dislike blazer. Find what most of soup says is valid, and his 553 reeks of AtE and dismissal.
Kary is giving me mixed vibes. Though I do find most of his Swiss points to be reaching, there is the fact tat he was the first person to attack swiss, which shows how he's looking down other avenues.
Ditz is scum. His 558 is disgusting, and he doesn't actually conclude anything from that post. A poor attack on swiss, after swiss is already being attacked

Vote: Ditz

 

[Swiss]

It does look bad on him that Kuz was after him and he was the only person confirmed townie besides FF (Who also hinted at suspecting Swiss)

That's far from enough to call him mafia and bandwagon him though imo.

He hinted at suspecting me?

Choice words, I think.

He called me straight null and for good reason.

 

[Kataefi]

VOTE COUNT:

[1] Swiss: Kary
[1] Blazer: Яagnarock
[1] Kary: Swiss
[1] Jdietz43: Dark Horse

[0] -Masquerain-
[0] adumbrodeus
[0] Яagnarock
[0] Dark Horse
[0] DtJ Glyphmoney
[0] Nabe
[0] Red Ruy
[0] WashedLaundry
[0] Fynal
[0] Pink Lemonade

[10] Not Voting: -Masquerain- / adumbrodeus / Blazer / DtJ Glyphmoney / Nabe / Red Ruy / WashedLaundry / Fynal / Pink Lemonade / Jdietz43

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I'll throw you a curveball, what do you think of Blazer?

Let me talk you through it. Initially null through WIFOM w.r.t. 'I'm not scum' etc.

I did agree with a lot of Toastin's points though. As for whether or not I think he is scum I'll need more time. I'm leaning towards him being town though.

On the hypothesis of me being Kuz's scum partner, I have no idea where this idea even came from as I've been leaning towards Kuz being scum just haven't had the information to make a good post on it yet. (I've ended up following you, albeit only semi-blindly)

I don't like this either. You were attempting to pressure for opinion (It was obvious anyway, and I did need to do it) but where everyone else accepted that someone was busy and that I'd said "Hey I'm going to post at some point soon" you forced the issue more.

Continued FOS on you.

This I find weird. You don't like that someone voted for you? Surely if Soup hadn't done it, someone else would have? Maybe you just don't like being pressured

Kuz: 251: Toastin obviously fears Swiss. But he makes a good point that Swiss is good enough to get out of anything. I'd still rather have him around myself than have him nightkilled by mafia D2

'I want Swiss around'

320: Just an interjection to him saying everyone has town read on swiss over nothing: Swiss has been doing plenty. He just plays a very null style that leans town.

'I like what Swiss is doing'

In finality, if you don't believe that we can lynch Swiss during the day, why are you trying at him so hard?

Uh, to get a read on him? Also, has Kuz been trying to lynch Swiss particularly?

Swiss:Swiss is an incredible player, makes him a difficult read.
Post 210 he asks for the doc to save him without fail. This bothers me as it leaves open everyone else, but in all honesty, the way he plays I'd probably be saving him.

'What Swiss does bothers me but I still want Swiss around'

Most likely town, but it's impossible to tell.

'I have no idea whether he is, but I really hope Swiss is town!'

'Also the rest of my reads are pretty generic!'

Vote: Kuz

Just because he's the one I have the biggest case against.

Did you even LOOK at the votecount?
Ugh. This is such a weak reason as well.

Also, I almost agree with Kary. It makes me nervous that Swiss was the biggest push on Toastin. Thing is, Toastin brought it on him/themself and did in fact look incredibly scummy. Swiss is a super good player as well, so you'd think if anyone had a shot at seeing Toastin as town it'd have been him...

1. I fail to see what Toastin' did that 'brought it on themselves'
2. I fail to see how you've gone from 'I have the biggest case on them' to 'they were incredibly scummy'
This just smacks of fence-sitting and nonsense and justifying a dumb vote and ugh.

In conclusion, I want to see Blazer do something on their own initiative. At the moment I'm fine with them dying but can't say for sure whether they're dumb/scum. Their vote yesterday sits really badly with me, and their play does nothing to redeem this. I don't like the slowly increasing scumread on Kuz, and I don't like the reaction to your (Soup's) pressure on them. Also there's a lot of johns/defensiveness that seems unnecessary, though that could just be playstyle. I think that's everything.

P.S. yes I am putting words in Blazer's mouth w.r.t. his view on Swiss, but it's to make a point; I am struggling to see where Blazer is getting his reads from beyond sheeping Swiss, and some of the reasons etc. just don't really add up IMO.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Anyone who thinks that someone other than me should be the D1 hammer is obvscum4life.

Like for real learn your SWF history scrubs I obvs need it more than all you and imma pretty much carry dis game so yeah like #swaggastepatme

I KNEW I SHOULD'VE BEEN THE ONE TO HAMMER D=

Blarg, go town!

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Then my town read on Blazer kind of fizzled, but he sits at null again.

I don't know where Deitz is going.

Kary I need to read what he posted.

Swiss help me interpret bad play from scum play, there is too much stupid since this day opened up.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Did Glyph explain his reads at all, more so the DH one? Pretty sure he didn't.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

I'm back, *****es.

 

[Blazer]

If you'll look, my first stance on Toastin'/Kuz was from having hardly read the topic. I skimmed over it in around an hour's time and didn't care much.
On the topic of Swiss, I would rather have a good player around, yes. He's not much use to us if I'm right and he is town and we kill him is he?
And on the topic of Ragnarok pressuring me, I don't like being pressured, you're correct. If I had it my way I'd be one of those people that rarely posts and occasionally interjects with something helpful, as I don't always have much to say on the game. Instead as soon as I stated "Hey, I'm just gonna sit back, try to reread, not vote for a bit and interject here and there" I was jumped on and accused of being mafia. It's just how I'd prefer to play.

 

[Blazer]

I resent comments like "lol everyone has a town read on Swiss despite him doing nothing". I don't have a town read on him

Hinted was the correct word Swiss. He never outright said he had a scumread on you, although it's the more likely scenario if he took the time to point it out.

 

[Blazer]

As for my continual growing distaste for Kuz, it simply looked worse and worse as I actually read the topic. Every reread he just looks scummier and scummier. That happens when you come into a game a week behind and only skim at first. Granted he turned up town, but he'd convinced 9 of us he wasn't prior to.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Alright, so I don't have a lot to say here. Here's why:

-Kuz had to go. His argument was ****, he looked like scum, and he never attempted to flesh out his scumSwiss read despite sitting on it all day.
-Swiss is not scum based on Kuz's flip. Swiss' argument was right. Lynching him for being right is dumb and you're dumb for thinking about it.
-The Kuz v Swiss argument took up the whole thread. Worse yet, that was an argument that more or less revolved around a mechanic. You can't insinuate a damn thing about Swiss from it and Kuz's flip quite literally put us in no really specific direction. Ergo, back at Square 1
-Soup has it right to look at the wagon, though. Scum almost definitely was on it. Getting a lynch on a historically strong player and having him flip town like that almost certainly had to have some scum going "YEAH SURE I'LL TAKE THAT."

Now while I don't think Swiss is scum based off Kuz's flip and find Kary's case full of usual **** from Swiss and 20/20 hindsight, that flip onto Kary was awkward. Swiss flat-out said he had Kary as town early in the pre-game. He said nothing to the contrary throughout D1 unless I missed something huge. Suddenly, he came in D2, drops a vote on Kary, and then does not explain a damn thing. He says it's a legit vote, but then why? Why Kary? The guy who you said was obvtown just a day before? What changed?

vote: Swiss

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

@Glyfe: Talk to me baby. You said you had a couple of reads on both ends of the spectrum but you never extrapolated on them. Particularly that DH scumread, but you also dropped an interesting RR town read and I don't know why you have that. Are you gonna be helpful this game or are you gonna coolguy your way into D3/4 again or can I expect you to give me something?

@Soup: Why does Adumb warrant reinvestigation? His logic for going after Kuz was dumb as **** but that's the kind of method he relishes so you'd be hard-pressed to pin him off that. You never explained that one either, talk to me more about it. Didn't you have him as town at one point or was that someone else?

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Current players I like includes Soup, Fynal, and Nabe. Kary looks pretty towny despite the nooby smell.

 

[Fynal]

o **** this threads open again, after checking every 10 mins for the first few hours i kinda gave up

so, my two scumreads just flipped town. gorfdammit.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Swiss, we are gonna be at each other throats, you know what that means.


Swiss is scum, blazer is showing noobtown so hard it literally hurts. Most players I would believe would mistake this for scumtells.

Swiss would not. No, I don't think I'm giving him too much credit here.


BTW, the answer I was expecting was you to go for was "I was supporting this in order to get a read on somebody else", I was really expecting you to be town, or at the very least, less transparent about it.

Vote: Swiss

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Washed, Glyph had me as a scum read.

Like Washed vote, but premature.

Dislike Adumb vote, poor justification.

 

[Swiss]

Mfw this thread

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Johning, will get myself to a CPU and post tomorrow

 

[Pink Lemonade]

Not happy that the lynch happened as quickly as it did yesterDay, there wasn't much focus on people beyond Kuz and Swiss, and to a lesser extent Blazer, Adumb, and JDeitz.

I really didn't like Soup yesterDay, but his efforts to analyze the Toastin wagon seem sincere. I just vehemently disagree with his jumping on wagons without giving an explanation at the time and making me force it out of him.

I also agree with RR and WL that Swiss is not scum on the Kuz town flip. Ultimately the interactions between Swiss and Kuz could have been SvT or TvT and it's pretty much impossible to say based on those interactions alone because Swiss is composed and logical whether he's scum or town. However, his current vote on Kary is bad, especially after Kary expanded on his vote and said things like this:

Why did Swiss push for a Kuz lynch?
Why did Swiss not want to hear Kuz's reply?
Why was Swiss so focused on the way Kuz was playing, not his intentions?

Which show him looking at intent and made some points about Swiss targeting Kuz's playstyle that Swiss hasn't addressed and I think are worth a response.

I want to reread Swiss but that's not happening tonight, I'll get on it tomorrow but I believe toDay he's already contradicted quite a few reads that he had yesterDay, and not for good reasons.

I still agree with Adumb that Blazer is noobtown and his indecision, especially in his reads and his thought process, and his theories on who is scum which are contrary to most of the other players I cannot feasibly imagine scum putting out there so bluntly.

Jdeitz's post toDay did seem strange to me, and he's someone I've reconsidered. I didn't like the case against him over his comments about pre-game, but I did a quick reread on him and I realized that after the pressure was taken off of him he hasn't really done anything. I especially disliked this quote, which was one of the few after the pre-game thing was settled where he takes a stance on someone:

@Kary: As far as Soup is concerned, I didn't really like some of the things he's done so far. Proposing the hammer system in pre-game was something he'd def. do as either alignment, after which he doesn't have any major impact until he talks about Adum, which is somewhat confusingly worded, but upon de-tangling is ok.



(Soup: This was supposed to read "Adum, Kuz is scum still?" as a question to Adum, right? If you could clarify that it'd be great. I think you already did, but still.)

Then he votes me, which is fine: but it's lacking explanation.




Pressure voting is good, but I'd have really liked to at least see him restate some points so we knew for sure what he was angling/pressuring for at the time he voted. It made me question his motive a bit.


Then this, which I might as well answer to at the same time I read him: My thoughts in green




He then goes on to ask Toastin about why he's voting Swiss as of now: a reasonable question. Then states some reads I have a hard time faulting in any particular way.


So @Kary: Overall he gave me some slight reason to pause, but he seems fine overall.

@Soup: How do you feel about FF's entrance? What about Nabe? (Whisper sweet nothings in my ear)

And I don't feel like this actually gives much of a stance. He starts off with saying he really didn't like some of what Soup did, then goes through a lot of things he doesn't really like, and then in the end gives a mixed read on him of "slight reason to pause, but fine overall", which is keeping room for suspicion but saying its fine for the time being.

His next two posts:

V/LA until September ends


@Fynal: Where is your head at right now in all this when you return? Which of the big 3 discussed (Swiss/Toastin/Adum) do you feel the best about, which do you feel the worst about and why?

@Adum: Would you mind giving us some more of your reads on any non-Toastin slot? Say Soup/Kary/Nabe?

He asks questions to get other people's reads/opinions, but doesn't give any himself on the people he's asking about. Asking people for their opinions before I give my own or in lieu of giving my own is something I have done as scum before to avoid conflicting with town opinion and so it raises some serious flags for me as to what his intent is with asking these questions, especially since he's not really following up on them.

And then his last two posts yesterDay:

Ryu, you've been posting filler far more than I'm comfortable with this game. Give me a more in-depth look at your reads. Why Blazer scum?


Please do.

A little bit of suspicion on RR by saying he's posting more filler than he's comfortable with, but no real pressure or attempt to give a solid read. And another question asking for someone else's read.

Really? What makes you take this stance so soon before Blazer posts for real?
I think if any scum is going to make that admission, it's going to be noobscum.



^This

And then this is his final post of the Day, in which he once again comments on the Blazer accusations and gives his thoughts on Adumb's opinion but still not on Blazer. And the this is wrt Swiss's post about Kuz going inactive after the wagon formed on him, which is really his only indication that he still finds Kuz scummy after placing his vote there.

Vote: JDietz

Well, that started as a reread and ended up as a case O_O Will reread Swiss toMorrow but I anticipate that taking a lot of time and energy that I don't have right now.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Vote: Blazer

Blazer, why should Swiss get blasted for his opinion on Kuz and not you for flipping off your opinion of Swiss and Kuz?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Laundry what is your opinion on Blazer?

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

He reminds me of Kantrip in Math Blasters a lot. I'm still looking back for those newtown tells Adumb's talking about. I get that tentativeness may be an issue but to my knowledge he hasn't voted anyone and has only thrown out FoSes since his initial posts. I didn't mind throwing some pressure at him at first just to try to push him some place and see where he went under pressure but he proceeded to say little and push nowhere on his own and got defensive when pushed. That has me worried.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Mind helping with that pressure after Swiss elaborates, and is acceptable, on Kary?

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

@Glyfe: Talk to me baby. You said you had a couple of reads on both ends of the spectrum but you never extrapolated on them. Particularly that DH scumread, but you also dropped an interesting RR town read and I don't know why you have that. Are you gonna be helpful this game or are you gonna coolguy your way into D3/4 again or can I expect you to give me something?

You used 'extrapolate' wrong in this post, since an extrapolation is a guess based off a trend.

To be perfectly frank I don't even remember why I had those people where I had them outside of Soup. I still agree with PastGlyph, and a quick re-read of D1 will help me reaffirm why exactly.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Viging Glyph sounds like a wonderful idea right now.

 

[Swiss]

/Replace out.

I got arrested and am on bail. Won't be able to continue this game.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

mfw

sorry couldn't help myself

there goes my push on Swiss

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

/Replace out.

I got arrested and am on bail. Won't be able to continue this game.

What the hell. Stay safe Swiss.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

The hell.

Be ok Swiss.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Damn, I'm such a jerk sometimes

Once my surprise has lessened I'm realising this is not cool.

Take care, Swiss.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

/Replace out.

I got arrested and am on bail. Won't be able to continue this game.

Hope things turn out well for you.

 

[Fynal]

sorry about not posting, i was kinda sick yesterday and even worse today, from skimming toDay, i'd say i agree with WL in whatever that post was, kuz was scummy D1 and swiss's vote onto kary ewww etc

maybe tomorrow

/Replace out.

I got arrested and am on bail. Won't be able to continue this game.

holy ****, hope it turns out allright

 

[th3kuzinator]

go town

mfw swiss

 

[Dooms]

I hope things go well, Swiss. ;__;.