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TDB: SEASON 2! LEON (RE4) vs LARA CROFT

B

Blitzmidfielder

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Once again, this looks like it'll get ugly.

However, I believe that canonically, Lucario knows every martial art that humans use. So in terms of skill, I'd say he has a bit of an upper hand. Because of the techniques brought from being a pokemon, there's already an issue about strength.

Also, I feel that being a fighting/steel type should be brought up. Yes, yes, types, redundant, we get it. But Steel is known for being the most resistant type to anything. Fighting is known for absolutely cranked physical stats in most cases. Here I go again with 'natural born killer', but it has to take more than a monkey with a rock to take down a Lucario. Lucario, with its knowledge, should have a hold, strike, or throw for every occasion. With a pokemon's ability to fight, it can fling numerous elemental attacks at its foe. With its projected stats and typing and how they would translate, it would be built by nature for close-quarters combat. Projectiles would be deflected with other projectiles or strikes, and that monkey wouldn't be able to escape.

ExtremeSpeed and Bullet Punch.
 
Smooth Criminal

Smooth Criminal

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OMG. Another "Tiers: If Smash Characters Were True to Their Games" thread.

XD SotR, we got this. (Hi, by the way. How are you?)

At any rate, Lucario would easily beat the pants off of Diddy. Martial arts prowess, energy ball slinging (of many varieties, too), and buffs out the wazoo...what on Earth could the simian genius do? Throw orange grenades at him? Cartwheel into him? Throw a barrel? Maybe if Diddy were given time to prepare he could set a trap and give himself something of an edge...but in the middle of a square, direct fight? Not a chance.

Smooth Criminal
 
smashbot226

smashbot226

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This fight seems a bit one sided, again. Diddy has technology, but Lucario just kills him in everything else. Even without Aura, he has Extreme-Speed, Double Team, Close Combat, etc.

BUT I should probably go more in depth to prove why Lucario wins this hands down. Which disheartens me, because I think Diddy Vs. Ivysaur would've been the MUCH superior choice to this. Or Lucario and Power Suit Samus.

---------------------

1. WEAPON- Diddy has his popguns, jet-pack, orange grenades, and if at all possible, a guitar that can somehow manage to generate shockwaves. Lucario has no weapons, but doesn't need one; he's a fighter with a mastery of many martial arts and uses them to defeat other creatures far more intimidating than Diddy. Even Diddy's arsenal is too slow or cumbersome to catch up with the constantly dodging Lucario. This one goes to Bluey.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- His body IS the weapon, and the best one you can master at that.


2. PHYSIQUE- Diddy is a tiny, weak, and frail chimpanzee. Granted, he's speedy, but he has little else going for him in the endurance department. But Lucario... I mean, really? Even if Diddy manages to land shots with his ZOMG PEANUTS, they're either going to tickle Lucario or just moderately tick him off.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- This match is not going to end well.


3. ARMOR- Neither fighters wear armor, meaning it'll take a mere few blows to finish the foe; however, Lucario can do it in one hit, whereas Diddy will probably need to land more than THREE at best.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- His power is matched only by how unfair this matchup is.


4. SKILL- Diddy is smart and has crude technology. But Lucario is a superhuman athlete that could easily keep up with Diddy's swiftness and technology.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- Honestly, this makes me, as a Diddy Secondary, cry.

-----------

So yeah... in conclusion, this match will end only with monkey blood scattered.
 
adumbrodeus

adumbrodeus

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smashbot226 said:
1. WEAPON- Diddy has his popguns, jet-pack, orange grenades, and if at all possible, a guitar that can somehow manage to generate shockwaves. Lucario has no weapons, but doesn't need one; he's a fighter with a mastery of many martial arts and uses them to defeat other creatures far more intimidating than Diddy. Even Diddy's arsenal is too slow or cumbersome to catch up with the constantly dodging Lucario. This one goes to Bluey.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- His body IS the weapon, and the best one you can master at that.
Click to expand...
I'd say that the overall issue is that according to science in our world, Diddy's weapons wouldn't function.

smashbot226 said:
2. PHYSIQUE- Diddy is a tiny, weak, and frail chimpanzee. Granted, he's speedy, but he has little else going for him in the endurance department. But Lucario... I mean, really? Even if Diddy manages to land shots with his ZOMG PEANUTS, they're either going to tickle Lucario or just moderately tick him off.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- This match is not going to end well.
Click to expand...
Not true, Chimpanzees are actually quite strong, and based on the height/weight ratio, Diddy probably has the more stocky muscular build overall.


That said, Lucario's got the advantage where it counts, his legs (which way outrange diddy) are extremely well-muscled.

3. ARMOR- Neither fighters wear armor, meaning it'll take a mere few blows to finish the foe; however, Lucario can do it in one hit, whereas Diddy will probably need to land more than THREE at best.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- His power is matched only by how unfair this matchup is.
Click to expand...
Actually, the advantage here comes from Lucario being partially steel type, which basically means he's got some sort of extremely hard, ultralight outer armor.





So yeah... in conclusion, this match will end only with monkey blood scattered.
Click to expand...
Yes.
 
JOE!

JOE!

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why has nobody mentioned what would happen if diddy grabbed Lucario?

In the pokemon worls, there are bareley any grappling moves, and Lucario has no real hands to pry diddy off.

If diddy manages to grab his legs or those floppy hair things on his head, he has control with his ape-strength, remember, hes only weak compared to DONKEY KONG
 
B

Blitzmidfielder

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Submission? Vital Throw? Close Combat? Seismic Toss?

There's no lack of options for Lucario. Also, while hands are useful, most grappling arts tend to use the elbows, wrists, and knees. Surprisingly I find that gripping shirts in Jiu-jitsu is actually kind of moot, but just reassuring; most grips are more than enough using a wrist around a joint.

In Muay Thai, the Clinch technique is performed by placing your wrists at the base of your opponent's neck. To give a bit on an example... take your hand, right now, tighten and straighten your fingers so no fingers are stretched out. Know, at the knuckle in your fist, the base knuckle, bend all the fingers until they are 90 degrees. Now, bend the wrist inward. Do the same to your other hand. if you place your palms behind someone's neck/head, and keep your arms close, they'll have a hard time escaping (usually ducking loses as an option due to your proximity, and typically the Clinch is used in correlation with Knees.)

In Jiu-jitsu, a basic move is that if you ever get into a position where you need to think a little and possibly tire your opponent out ( and a painfully basic but surprisingly effective technique), you assume the 'Seatbelt'. In this hold, you bring one arm up over your opponent's shoulder, your other arm under their armpit, and just hold your hands, hug them to you, wrap your legs around them ( I know this sounds very homoerotic, but this is how it's done), and apply just enough strength to keep from getting tossed or broken. It's typically best from behind, where you can slip into a possible Armbar or Rear Naked Choke.

In both these cases, and many more (like Crane style hooks), the fingers play little role.
 
uhmuzing

uhmuzing

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Blitzmidfielder said:
Once again, this looks like it'll get ugly.

However, I believe that canonically, Lucario knows every martial art that humans use. So in terms of skill, I'd say he has a bit of an upper hand. Because of the techniques brought from being a pokemon, there's already an issue about strength.
Click to expand...
Uh, I'm pretty sure that would be more than a bit of an upper hand. :)
 
squirtleuser007

squirtleuser007

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is lucario able to use his aura sphere? that doesnt seem very realistic, but then again, a pokemon isnt realistic...
he can also wield a kind of lance almost in the form of bone rush. if you've seen the anime for the show, the gym leader uses her lucario and he uses that move.
 
¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯

¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯

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JOE! said:
why has nobody mentioned what would happen if diddy grabbed Lucario?

In the pokemon worls, there are bareley any grappling moves, and Lucario has no real hands to pry diddy off.

If diddy manages to grab his legs or those floppy hair things on his head, he has control with his ape-strength, remember, hes only weak compared to DONKEY KONG
Click to expand...
How would diddy be able to get in grabbing range of Lucario? Lucario can just use Bone Rush and he'll basically have a bludgeoning weapon and be able to further increase his range. Bone Rush+Close Combat+Extremespeed+Aura Sphere=No way in hell Diddy gets anywhere close to Luc. This is a slaughter.
 
payasofobia

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smashbot226 said:
This fight seems a bit one sided, again. Diddy has technology, but Lucario just kills him in everything else. Even without Aura, he has Extreme-Speed, Double Team, Close Combat, etc.

BUT I should probably go more in depth to prove why Lucario wins this hands down. Which disheartens me, because I think Diddy Vs. Ivysaur would've been the MUCH superior choice to this. Or Lucario and Power Suit Samus.

---------------------

1. WEAPON- Diddy has his popguns, jet-pack, orange grenades, and if at all possible, a guitar that can somehow manage to generate shockwaves. Lucario has no weapons, but doesn't need one; he's a fighter with a mastery of many martial arts and uses them to defeat other creatures far more intimidating than Diddy. Even Diddy's arsenal is too slow or cumbersome to catch up with the constantly dodging Lucario. This one goes to Bluey.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- His body IS the weapon, and the best one you can master at that.


2. PHYSIQUE- Diddy is a tiny, weak, and frail chimpanzee. Granted, he's speedy, but he has little else going for him in the endurance department. But Lucario... I mean, really? Even if Diddy manages to land shots with his ZOMG PEANUTS, they're either going to tickle Lucario or just moderately tick him off.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- This match is not going to end well.


3. ARMOR- Neither fighters wear armor, meaning it'll take a mere few blows to finish the foe; however, Lucario can do it in one hit, whereas Diddy will probably need to land more than THREE at best.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- His power is matched only by how unfair this matchup is.


4. SKILL- Diddy is smart and has crude technology. But Lucario is a superhuman athlete that could easily keep up with Diddy's swiftness and technology.

ADVANTAGE: Lucario- Honestly, this makes me, as a Diddy Secondary, cry.

-----------

So yeah... in conclusion, this match will end only with monkey blood scattered.
Click to expand...

Whoa, you are seriously overrating Lucario.


WEAPONS: Diddy's weapons wouldn't work on the real world, and Lucario would not be able to use energy attacks or aura, so there are no real weapons here.



PHYSIQUE: Lucario has low defense and stamina. He will feel a moderately powerful attack AND a strong attack will probably leave him very damaged.

And chimpanzees are not frail little creature. I dare you to fight against on and see if you last for more than a few minutes. Chimpanzees are 3.5 times stronger than us humans. Lucario is smaller than a person.



ARMOR: again, lucario has low stamina, defense and has a small and frail physique, and he dies easily in the games too. Hell, a POLITOED (a frog) has more defense and stamina than him!

Chimpanzees constantly fight each other and survive sumersaults and blows from each other in their environment.



MOVEMENT: Lucario is not a superhuman athlete. His speed is above average but it is nothing to be very proud of. His speed is the same as a Poliwag's speed. Woah, that sure is surprising!

Diddy is very athletic, can make great jumps and can swing from platforms easily.




ADAPTAVILITY: Lucario has no real advantage on any real battlefield. Diddy could easily overpower him if they fight on the jungle, on a confusing place or a place with multiple platforms and places to hang in.



POWER: Lucario has a high attack stat, but it still is not broken. Diddy is 3 times as strong as a normal human and the speed of his attacks add to the already enormous strenght.



SKILL: Lucario is more skilled than Diddy because of his fighting styles, but, were they created to fight against angry simians? Or were they made to fight against other practicioners of the same fighting style or to defend against robbers with knives? If they were made for the latter, then superior skill will not matter.




ATTACKS: In a realistic fight, there are no peanut popguns, propulsion devices made out of barrels, energy attacks or your body suddenly transforming into metal to attack the enemy. Lucario still has physical fighting techniques, but those are techniques like Karate chop, close combat or normal stuff like that. Diddy has his simian grapple moves and tackling abilites. Noone has anything special, really.




If Lucario could use his normal techniques, then he may have a chance, but not here. This is a 'REALISTIC FIGHT' situation, not a 'TRUE TO THEIR GAMES' fight. Without his abilities Lucario is screwed. And even with them Diddy could still put a fight.
 
squirtleuser007

squirtleuser007

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^. no. the only correct thing that you have stated here was your point on adabtability.
1. lucario's speed is ABOVE average in pokemon. get your facts right.
2.lucario is a STEEL type. meaning he is made of steel! his defense is a base 70, which is shabby, but it gets the job done.
3.lucario is fast. meaning he dodges LOTS of blows in a real life fight. diddy probably wouldnt even be able to touch him.
4.lucario isnt an average human(@ your point about power). which means diddy doesnt vastly overpower him.
you have a lot to learn about pokemon my friend ;)
 
D

Dy17

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squirtleuser007 said:
^. no. the only correct thing that you have stated here was your point on adabtability.
1. lucario's speed is ABOVE average in pokemon. get your facts right.
2.lucario is a STEEL type. meaning he is made of steel! his defense is a base 70, which is shabby, but it gets the job done.
3.lucario is fast. meaning he dodges LOTS of blows in a real life fight. diddy probably wouldnt even be able to touch him.
4.lucario isnt an average human(@ your point about power). which means diddy doesnt vastly overpower him.
you have a lot to learn about pokemon my friend ;)
Click to expand...
I thought you guys were talking on brawl terms though.
 
payasofobia

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squirtleuser007 said:
^. no. the only correct thing that you have stated here was your point on adabtability.
1. lucario's speed is ABOVE average in pokemon. get your facts right.
2.lucario is a STEEL type. meaning he is made of steel! his defense is a base 70, which is shabby, but it gets the job done.
3.lucario is fast. meaning he dodges LOTS of blows in a real life fight. diddy probably wouldnt even be able to touch him.
4.lucario isnt an average human(@ your point about power). which means diddy doesnt vastly overpower him.
you have a lot to learn about pokemon my friend ;)
Click to expand...

1)Lucario's speed is above average but not as fast as that poster said. 90 base speed is not broken. And Pokemons are not god-like beings that put Goku and Superman to shame. Even the Pokemon god's strongest attacks produce small-scale explosions. Just look at the games and the anime.

2) Lucario does not have the elemental Rock/Paper/scissors to help him on this fight. And even then you might say that Diddy's punches are Fighting type.

3) The games and the anime dissagree with you. He is just slightly faster than your average human, and realistically wouldn't even be able to jump very high or run that fast, extreme speed notwithstanding.

4) I said he has a high attack stat, but it still is not totally broken to kill diddy in one hit. Learn2read. And Diddy still has enough power and speed to overpower him. ( THE STRENGHT OF AN ATTACK IS NOT PURELY DECIDED BY RANDOM MUSCLE OR BECAUSE I SAID SO, IT IS ALSO DECIDED BY SPEED, MASS AND THE WEIGHT OF THE ATTACK, AND HE IS HEAVIER AND FASTER THAN LUCARIO) hell, lucario is a twigh and, realisticaly, would only take a few hits from an average man before he collapsed.
 
payasofobia

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squirtleuser007

squirtleuser007

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1. i was referring to your point about poliwag being as fast as lucario. i dont even watch the anime, as i think it gives the games a bad rep. and the explosions in the movies are definitly not smasll scale.
2.i wasnt even mentioning the type advantages. i was simply stating that he is made out of steel. surely didy cant bust through steel.
3.once again, i dont watch the aanime, i only saw one episode.
4.i never said he could kill diddy in one hit, simply that diddy doesnt vastly overpower him, but nevertheless, he does. you sir, need to learn2 read yourself. he would OUTSPEED the man. diddy is fast and strong, but honestly, is probably more frail than lucario.
edit: that first story came from connecticut(where i used to live !!!!!) random, but i thot u should kno, lol.
edit 2: my bad, you are correct about poliwag. my apologies
 
uhmuzing

uhmuzing

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I dunno... Payasofobia's avatar gives off the impression of an intelligent individual. But I disagree with Diddy's supposed strength. Chimps do not have 5x the strength of humans, and even if they do, Diddy doesn't even look like a full grown chimp.
 
squirtleuser007

squirtleuser007

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dragonblooded said:
I dunno... Payasofobia's avatar gives off the impression of an intelligent individual. But I disagree with Diddy's supposed strength. Chimps do not have 5x the strength of humans, and even if they do, Diddy doesn't even look like a full grown chimp.
Click to expand...
they do have 5x the strength, but i agree with you on the point that diddy probably isnt even an adult, so he's maybe 1.5-2X the strength of a normal human, and lucario is around 2.5x, IMO
 
payasofobia

payasofobia

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1) you realized it for yourself. And the anime representation is more accurate than the games and the attacks look the same.

2) The only part made of metal are his spikes. That's not going to cover much.

3) Then you have missed an accurate representation of Pokemon fights. The creator himself said that the fights in the manga are accurate, and the fights in the manga and anime are roughly the same.

4)I was refering to the previous poster's....post. And you know very little about chimps. They are not frail little creatures and slaves to us. When they get serious the only thing that will get them away from your face is a Rifle's shot to their face.
 
payasofobia

payasofobia

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squirtleuser007 said:
they do have 5x the strength, but i agree with you on the point that diddy probably isnt even an adult, so he's maybe 1.5-2X the strength of a normal human, and lucario is around 2.5x, IMO
Click to expand...
5 year old chimps (AKA: toddler) already are stronger than adult humans .... Diddy is probably an adolescent chimp so he is probably 3.5-4.5 times stronger than a human. And if said chimp is an alpha male... 7 times stronger than a human. And if for some reason Diddy is bound to become an alpha....
 
uhmuzing

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squirtleuser007 said:
they do have 5x the strength, but i agree with you on the point that diddy probably isnt even an adult, so he's maybe 1.5-2X the strength of a normal human, and lucario is around 2.5x, IMO
Click to expand...
Yes. I was fixing to say that - Lucario is not on the same terms of strength as a human. So instead of saying how much stronger Diddy is to a human, compare him to Lucario.

Now, Lucario may or may not be as fast as Diddy; he's probably not. But Lucario has more knowledge of combat than that monkey. He's better suited for this match.
 
payasofobia

payasofobia

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More like, he is allowed to use PHYSICAL moves. Not energy projectiles and punches that catch fire. He can still use physical projectiles though (think bullet seed...maybe.)


Now, if this was a canonical fight, then Lucario would own Diddy 'till next sunday (IMO). In a realistic fight, the laws of nature are against Lucario in all aspects.
 
uhmuzing

uhmuzing

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Well then, I'm going to go check out all the moves Lucario can learn...brb

EDIT: Ones that aren't unrealistic, I mean...
 
squirtleuser007

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it never mentioned the special/physical split, so i'm counting that becuase he needs some ranged moves(diddy gets a peanut popgun). the only ranged fighting moves besides tht are vacuum wave(special) and focus blast(special once again)
edit: back to the environment, lucario can sense eveerything(watch lucario and the mystery of mew) with aura, so even in a forest, he knows where diddy is
edit2: he has force palm, which is ranged, but not very far...
 
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