Super Smash Brothers Strife

[Battlecow]

L canceling is dumb though. We have this discussion a lot in the 64 social thread- it's really just an extra button press for no good reason. With one or two exceptions, you should ALWAYS Z-cancel, so it's the equivalent of making you press R every time you want to do a Uair- extra techskill for no good reason other than to make a completely arbitrary techskill gap between skill levels.

Look at it this way- if melee had come without L cancels, and someone came up to you and told you that they had this idea where you'd have to press L while landing or else get lagged from aerial moves, would you call it a good idea?

 

[ETWIST51294]

We already know that. The only depth l canceling adds is messing with the timings with your shield.

 

[Pi]

^still just a tech skill gap

i'm down for auto l canceling


people would ***** and moan and say people who didn't have to learn it had it easy but in the end put them a couple months down the road you're fighting the same person

 

[ETWIST51294]

I actually like L-canceling. I can understand why people want it out though.

 

[Jonas]

Iwata said that if Sakura didn't want to make Brawl he would have taken what they had (which is Melee) and build on top of it...

I could not have been sadder when I read this.

Edit: Basically I don't know if Iwata is dumb or not. Then again, who could have foreseen what was going to happen.

Keep in mind that Iwata actually announced a new Smash Bros. before he even asked Sakurai to make it. He had to do SOMETHING

 

[StretchNutz]

SSB: Kampf

if this has been said somewhere else then w/e. I aint reading this lame ***-thread

 

[Jonas]

SSB: Mein Kampf

 

[Beat!]

LOOOOOOOOOOL

 

[Roneblaster]

I love lcanceling. *****es be trippin if they have a problem with it.

 

[Beat!]

Yeah, l-cancelling is nice. It would feel weird without it.

 

[Glöwworm]

I feel like I've been accustomed to always press a button to cancel out lag after an aerial and if there's such a thing as automatic L-cancel, it will throw me off so hard if it's in a game setting similar to Melee (e.g., fast paced). Even though there's no L-cancelling in Brawl, I still do it so you can kind of see where I'm getting at. It's something that I think I will have to get used to if that was the case.

 

[MasterShake]

It seems taking it out would be an inconvenient convenience.

 

[Roneblaster]

I like that master shake.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Anyone who thinks L-Cancelling is a pointless input has never played against a decent ICs player.

Part of their game is alternating between different sized shields between Nana and Popo to screw with timing.

 

[Glöwworm]

It seems taking it out would be an inconvenient convenience.

That's exactly what it is. Though, I think for the Brawl folks, it would be an easy transition.

 

[stelzig]

I feel like I've been accustomed to always press a button to cancel out lag after an aerial and if there's such a thing as automatic L-cancel, it will throw me off so hard if it's in a game setting similar to Melee (e.g., fast paced). Even though there's no L-cancelling in Brawl, I still do it so you can kind of see where I'm getting at. It's something that I think I will have to get used to if that was the case.

Never had the l-cancel "problem" in brawl, but I do tend to try and JC grab causing me to fullhop airdodge xD

As for l-cancelling i'm also gonna have to side with it being fine. If that is the only input you'd always do as the best decision in this game it's also doing pretty well compared to many others.

"Look at it this way- if melee had come without L cancels, and someone came up to you and told you that they had this idea where you'd have to press L while landing or else get lagged from aerial moves, would you call it a good idea?"
I don't mind the abbility to cancel various types of lag so I wouldn't outrule it. Now i've always had l-cancelling and never questioned or had a problem with it though, so I suppose it's impossible to really answer.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I don't see how it's even possible to have an L-Cancelling problem in Brawl unless you are sloppy enough with your timing to accidentally shield when you land (which is a result of bad timing in Melee too).

 

[Glöwworm]

There's a curious mechanic in Smash 64 where if you don't Z cancel (it's Z in this game) the down-air with Jigglypuff and Kirby, there's an added hitbox when you land. So say if you down-air with Jigglypuff, if you don't Z cancel as soon as you land (even though the down-air animation is finished), you get hit once more sending you a bit upwards (how far is dependent on percentage of course). With Kirby, you get sent horizontally. However, if you Z-cancel, there's no added hitbox on the down-air when you land.

Something else that I should note pertaining to Z-cancelling or "L-cancelling" is that on the old Smash 64 website, Z-cancelling was considered an "advanced technique" and it also explained how to perform Z-cancelling.

Pretty interesting stuff.

Never had the l-cancel "problem" in brawl, but I do tend to try and JC grab causing me to fullhop airdodge xD

As for l-cancelling i'm also gonna have to side with it being fine. If that is the only input you'd always do as the best decision in this game it's also doing pretty well compared to many others.

"Look at it this way- if melee had come without L cancels, and someone came up to you and told you that they had this idea where you'd have to press L while landing or else get lagged from aerial moves, would you call it a good idea?"
I don't mind the abbility to cancel various types of lag so I wouldn't outrule it. Now i've always had l-cancelling and never questioned or had a problem with it though, so I suppose it's impossible to really answer.

lol yeah, I always try to JC grab in Brawl.

I don't see how it's even possible to have an L-Cancelling problem in Brawl unless you are sloppy enough with your timing to accidentally shield when you land (which is a result of bad timing in Melee too).

Ah, I think there was a misunderstanding when I said I try to L-cancel in Brawl. I do in fact try to L-cancel in Brawl but it's not to the point where my shield comes up. In Melee, you can L-cancel by half pressing the shoulder button and that's what I do. In Brawl, the L button registers only if you press the shoulder button all the way down so nothing happens when I try to L-cancel. It doesn't mess me up or anything, it's just something I stated that supports my statement that L-cancelling is basically ingrained into my brain lol.

 

[King Funk]

I think that the fact there's no l-canceling in Brawl nerfs aerials and gives more focus into the ground game. It also makes you put more thought on how to use your aerials. Of course, I'm not saying that it's not the case with Melee, but I don't think that no l-canceling is all that bad.

Auto l-canceling/low lag aerials can be fun with the correct hitstun. Gives a nice combo aspect. Combine that with a technique to land on platforms (doesn't have to be wavelanding, but anything that gives a similar effect), and you get a potentially really fun game.

 

[Anth0ny]

PURE JOY AT E3 2001

crazy

 

[Jonas]

E3 seemed kind of smaller back then. They actually had a black curtain behind the speaker, as if it's held at a school or something lol.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Did anyone notice how weird the physics were? Like a stupid 64.

edit: And wtf was with that weird, creepy Luigi at the end of the Luigis mansion trailer? That wasn't in the game.

 

[Anth0ny]

I think Falcon's dthrow didn't cause you to bounce in that trailer... lol

 

[StretchNutz]

SSB: Mein Kampf

tht wuz that joke home slizzle.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Personally, so long as Smash 4 doesn't have random BS I can't control (tripping, support ghosts, PICTOCHAT) especially the latter two which people insist on keeping in tournament, I'll be happy. So long as dynamic stages don't **** with balance like they do in Melee (damn you Fox invalidating like 1/4 of the stages in the game) I'll be happy.

Personally, I play Brawl for 4 reasons.
1. King Dedede
2. Pokémon Trainer
3. Dynamic stages in competitive play
4. General modability

 

[EPsilon933]

(damn you Fox invalidating like 1/4 of the stages in the game)

There's plenty of other worse stuff about those stages

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Yeah, but Fox is a major problem on a very large amount of stages.

And competitive Melee these days is pretty much S and A tier, with a few mid tiers and then one or two low tiers. Honestly I'm getting a bit bored of watching it, seeing the same thing every match by different players. Where's the epic? Where's my double falcon punch kill to win the game? I mean, Kage and Axe was pretty pimp, but it's a fairly rare occurence these days.

 

[EPsilon933]

Yeah, but Fox is a major problem on a very large amount of stages.

And competitive Melee these days is pretty much S and A tier, with a few mid tiers and then one or two low tiers. Honestly I'm getting a bit bored of watching it, seeing the same thing every match by different players. Where's the epic? Where's my double falcon punch kill to win the game? I mean, Kage and Axe was pretty pimp, but it's a fairly rare occurence these days.

Low tiers are boring

 

[Mike G]

Low tiers are boring

This post makes me sad.


you make me sad

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Low tiers are boring

What is this I don't even

 

[Mike G]

Those are the kinds of posts I wish people got infracted for LOL

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I definitely have to agree. Seriously, how can anyone not want more than 8 viable characters? Melee balance is amazing... among the top 4-8. But the gaps in balance start getting pretty big pretty fast, not counting Pichu because Pichu is intentionally bad.

And then you have Kirby who you can argue is worse than Pichu and be taken seriously.

 

[Eggm]

Taken from the official tier list thread:

The List

S: Fox, Falco, Jigglypuff, Sheik
A: Marth, Peach, Captain Falcon
B: Ice Climbers
C: Dr. Mario, Ganondorf, Samus
D: Pikachu, Mario, Luigi, Donkey Kong
E: Link, Young Link
F: Zelda, Roy, Mewtwo, Yoshi, Mr. Game & Watch
G: Ness, Bowser, Kirby, Pichu

D and up and maybe even E although that might be stretching it are all viable characters. 15. That's not bad at all.

 

[TheDekuNut]

Nintendo on E3 Right naow http://www.youtube.com/E3

edit:
lololol @ Wii U

edit:
its not ergonomic at all :-(

 

[Divinokage]

I definitely have to agree. Seriously, how can anyone not want more than 8 viable characters? Melee balance is amazing... among the top 4-8. But the gaps in balance start getting pretty big pretty fast, not counting Pichu because Pichu is intentionally bad.

And then you have Kirby who you can argue is worse than Pichu and be taken seriously.

If you payed attention, there's a lot of people that do well with low tiers exactly because the stagelist is small. The more stages you have, the less low tiers are viable because they get absolutely destroyed because of the stages. More balanced maps = more balanced matchups in general. And.. I mean one of the best in the world plays Pika, that must mean something. =P

 

[EPsilon933]

Did you hear iwata just now!?!?!?!

 

[rhan]

So guys. Smash Bros for 3DS and Wii U.

Hopefully it's not bad.

 

[KishPrime]

For both of them. Simultaneously?

:/

 

[rhan]

Yes.

10 char

 

[KishPrime]

Seems to eliminate the entire point of the new controller.

Also SAKURAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII