Squirtle Squad (General Disc.)

[RaphaelRobo]

Personally, I feel like Squirtle's edgeguarding is like Ganons, in that all he needs to do is jump pretty far out and get one good hit/bubble in, and he can recovery easily. The puff style edgeguarding also works well on him, though. I think it's good that he has the flexibility to do either.

 

[Translucent]

One bubble can definitely seal the deal sometimes. If I can tell that bubble will not kill them for sure, I usually go for the fair or Bair. Shell shift away from the edge and back to an up smash sometimes catches the opponent.

 

[bubbaking]

Oh man, Squirtle's wall cling is so GOOD for edgeguarding on stages with walls! Just jump down and press against the wall without using your DJ while you wait for the opponent to come back. Squirt can cling for a really long time, and I believe he can cling multiple times in succession. I've already utilized wall cling > wall jump bubble, fair, bair, and nair for edgeguarding already. As long as you didn't DJ before clinging, you should still have your DJ for getting back onstage (or further maneuvering offstage for the gimp), but even if you don't, if you're close enough to the wall, you can re-cling > walljump > upB.

Also, guys, take advantage of the fact that Squirtle has invincibility on his tail during bair (and f/dtilt). Because of this, I usually edgeguard with RAR bair instead of fair unless I'm already in the air facing forwards (like during a wallcling/jump).

Edit: Remembering that you can cling also lets you go really far down for gimps as long as you make sure to stay close to the stage.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I usually edgeguard with Bair as well, although I think that's partially a habit I picked up from Ganon (it's almost always best to edgeguard from his back, so he can reverse Uair or Bair). I don't RAR, though, because I don't care enough about technical skill to try and use it.

 

[bubbaking]

RAR lets you turn around and act quickly in case you're running short on time, such as when running across the stage to the ledge while the opponent recovers. It can be used for more than quick bairs out of a run, though. You can also use it for a quick ledgehog (RAR WD back).

Also, on the recovering end, if you are forced to get to the ledge what do you guys think are some good options? I've seen ledgejump bubble, but that just seems gimmicky, and I think it can be punished on shield.

Ledgejump bubble is a decent option for catching opponents off-guard, I guess. It can be punished on shield, but bubble has pretty low lag after the hits, so it probably isn't as easy to punish as you think. Of course, you also have ledgeHOP bubble, which would probably punish extremely poor spacing right next to the ledge. Then you also have ledgehop fair, nair (4% armor), and Withdraw (also 4% armor). I've used all of these options and they're all pretty fast and decent. One option that I have never tried is ledgejump Withdraw. It seems like it could work as a mix-up (which all these options are, technically). Some of these options, especially the Withdraw and Bubble ones, also give Squirt the ability to turn the tables from the ledge quickly if he gets a hit in.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Another thing you can do is ledgedrop UpB. It only really works when they think you're going to ledgehop, though.

 

[bubbaking]

Oh, something I've discovered (maybe others have too) is that if Squirt does his upB directly next to and slightly under the ledge, he will instantly grab the ledge in a fashion similar to Fox, Falco, and Sheik grabbing the ledge out of their upB startup animations. I do it via ledgedrop > DJ > upB when squirt's 'back is touching the ledge while flipping' (how I see it visually). I've managed to become pretty consistent with it and it seems like it could be useful for stalling.

Also, don't forget that, for ledgehop/jump Withdraw, you can upB out of the Withdraw for a quick surprise attack or to go over the opponent. It really helps that the move is good at edgecancelling on platforms as well, since Squirt is so slippery.

 

[sa1vy]

Also, guys, take advantage of the fact that Squirtle has invincibility on his tail during bair (and f/dtilt). Because of this, I usually edgeguard with RAR bair instead of fair unless I'm already in the air facing forwards (like during a wallcling/jump).

Where did you get the info for the invincibility frames? ftilt etc. aren't on the squirt data yet.
Edit: by "invincibility on his tail" do you just mean a disjointed hitbox, or is he actually invincible?


Also, is shell armor the exact same thing as super armor? Or are there some tweeks?

 

[dettadeus]

Shell Armor is resistance to anything that deals 4% or less, so weak projectiles, weaker multi-hit moves, etc. It's basically light armor.

Like Bubba said below, two of his smashes also have higher armor (12%).

 

[bubbaking]

It's in the squirt data thread, posted by cmart himself. His tail is actually invincible. Check it out!

Shell armor is % armor, meaning you can go through any attack that does that % of damage or less without flinching at all. Some of Squirt's attacks (I believe nair, Withdraw, and SS) have 4% armor. His two shell smashes (f/dsmash) have 12% armor, which is incredibly useful.

Super Armor can't be broken by anything short of a grab and is very rare in Smash. Not even Bowser has SA on anything. I believe the only cases of SA in the game are on DK's fully charged punch startup and Yoshi's DJ, but I could be wrong.

 

[dettadeus]

Super Armor can't be broken by anything short of a grab and is very rare in Smash. Not even Bowser has SA on anything. I believe the only cases of SA in the game are on DK's fully charged punch startup and Yoshi's DJ, but I could be wrong.

Wario's Fsmash in Brawl had it, Yoshi's DJ doesn't have super armor, iirc it's 15% heavy armor in Brawl and it was like crouch cancelling in Melee (only worked until a certain knockback threshold).
Moves more commonly have invincibility than super armor.

 

[sa1vy]

^^ in brawl Ike has superarmor on neutral b and up b. I think they took them out for p:m though.

edit: don't forgot olimar too! whistle too good!

 

[sa1vy]

Also, does squirtle's withdrawal still have weird properties like it did in brawl, how it could turn around sometimes when you were hit (but not hard enough to break withdrawal)?

 

[bubbaking]

Oh, how could I forget my vBrawl main? DDD's upB had super armor during the ascent in vBrawl.

About Squirt's tail invincibility:

I can say that Squirt's tail has invinc during ftilt, downtilt and bair - I'll put those moves on my to-do list so you can have the frame windows for that (for ftilt and dtilt though, it's safe to say when he's swinging it).

Keep this info in mind. It is very useful!

^^ in brawl Ike has superarmor on neutral b and up b. I think they took them out for p:m though.

He had it on his Eruption in 2.1, but idk about 2.5.

Also, does squirtle's withdrawal still have weird properties like it did in brawl, how it could turn around sometimes when you were hit (but not hard enough to break withdrawal)?

I'm not sure, but I wouldn't think so. Squirtle's withdraw in vBrawl seemed to ignore damage, but I can't remember exactly...

 

[bubbaking]

Woops, sorry! Double post...

 

[RaphaelRobo]

So, right after PM comes out with two new Pokemon, Nintendo reveals two new Pokemon games. Is it just a coincidence, or is there some kind of competition going on between Nintendo and the PMBR?

 

[bubbaking]

Pretty sure it's just a coincidence. I personally know PMBR members who were just as surprised by the new Pokemon announcement as we were...

 

[sa1vy]

^conspiracy theory.

so is this going to be the social thread now that we have an AT thread?

 

[MonkUnit]

I thought it was already sort of a social thread, but probably.

 

[dettadeus]

Well it is general discussion.

In other news, we have the most posts of any character board by far.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

It's because we're all pro spammers.

And yeah, I vote for this to be the social thread. That way I don't have to pay attention to any of the others. I don't get better at this game, I just talk about getting better, and hope it bleeds over to my gameplay.

 

[sa1vy]

In other news, we have the most posts of any character board by far.

That's because we have the coolest character by far.

 

[Translucent]

That's because we have the coolest character by far.

This is the reason I live, and I will guard it with my life.

 

[sa1vy]

This is the reason I live, and I will guard it with my life.

*ultra-like*

I think that everyone should have to change their profile pic to squirtle in order to post here

 

[Translucent]

There are some pretty cool pictures of squirtle out there. We could have every squirtle main have a squirtle meme as their avatar. :-D

 

[dettadeus]

Guess I'll just say I main ROB/G&W and Squirtle is secretly my main...

 

[bubbaking]

^^^^^^MY LIFE!!!!!

 

[Eaode]

Done and Done.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I'm glad I'm a Squirtle secondary and not main. Ganon/Kirby avatars are enough for me.

 

[Tero.]

There are some pretty cool pictures of squirtle out there. We could have every squirtle main have a squirtle meme as their avatar. :-D

what is this, I don't even...

 

[Translucent]

Done and Done.

That's a pretty good picture of squirtle man.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

After practicing at Stingers' for the last 7 hours, I've decided to make squirtle my main. I'll have some videos up in the future. And when I say videos, I mean one ultra long video, and I'll just link to where individual matches start.

 

[Dubforce]

After practicing at Stingers' for the last 7 hours, I've decided to make squirtle my main. I'll have some videos up in the future. And when I say videos, I mean one ultra long video, and I'll just link to where individual matches start.

I'll be doing something similar, but probably just one long video and **** it find the matches yourself.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Yeah. I'll like to the highlights in mine, though. The cool combos I pulled off, the time I did a Withdraw turnaround Aqua Jet (Great for mindgames), and when I finally started to get the hang of using WG against Falcon. There are probably other good moments in their too, related to Waterfall KOs.

 

[stingers]

waterfalls silly.
i decided to main ivysaur. i know yall dont care, but its important nonetheless. we have a pokemon bond and all that jazz.

im really just a PT main. I already mained charizard, now im maining ivy, and I mean squirtles cool too...

 

[bubbaking]

Same here! Lucario, Charizard, Squirtle, and Ivysaur for me. (^_^)

 

[Translucent]

I'M SQUIRTLE FOR LIFE!!! <3 that little ninja turtle.

 

[Dubforce]

Yeah squirtles pretty sick.

ADOLESCENT MUTANT NINJA SQUIRTLES,
ADOLESCENT MUTANT NINJA SQUIRTLES,
ADOLESCENT MUTANT NINJA SQUIRTLES,
HEROES IN A HALF SHELL, SQUIRTLE POWER!

 

[Translucent]

Yeah squirtles pretty sick.

ADOLESCENT MUTANT NINJA SQUIRTLES,
ADOLESCENT MUTANT NINJA SQUIRTLES,
ADOLESCENT MUTANT NINJA SQUIRTLES,
HEROES IN A HALF SHELL, SQUIRTLE POWER!

I can see a new cartoon network show coming soon...

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Here's a link to the videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REqW1gy8tjY

Unfortunately, it turns out I forgot to fix a problem with my recording program speeding everything up. I'll probably do that today. Until then, you can watch everything at about double speed. There are some interesting teams games there. At one point in the middle I do a 1v1 with a Ness and pull off some cool withdraw stuff, but you can't really see it because of the sped up video. At the end against Falcon on SSE:J, I start comboing with WG, and it works great. But it's also not particularly easy to see.

EDIT: Alright, I messed with my settings and fixed it. Next time the recording will be fine. Also, Alex, I'll bring some food next time so you won't be feeding everyone.