[SPOILER ALERT] - The Sevens Squares. - A Square-Enix general support threads.

[DarthEnderX]

I really like Frogs theme from Chrono Trigger, thanks for sharing that. I hadn’t heard it until now.

Chrono Trigger in general is probably one of Square's best soundtracks. I recommend giving the entire OST a listen if you haven't already.

 

[perfectchaos83]

My bet is Erdrick in the name of the Luminary. I think this only makes sense to me. I really don't see Erdrick getting in as "Erdrick" or just "Hero".

Japan is probably just going to be a collective "Yuusha". The West will likely get "preferential" treatment in regards to naming. Personally, I feel Erdrick is going to be the "Main" character with a female alt and Luminary as well. Personally, I don't think Luminary would be chosen over Erdrick because DQ11 itself is essentially a love letter to DQ3 anyway.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The Pokemon series has always been a video game franchise first, and the anime is a spinoff.
Kingdom Hearts is completely different, because the entire series is a spinoff of the Mickey Mouse franchise, which is not primarily a video game series.

And Mickey Mouse was already mentioned in Brawl, as noted beforehand. The argument's bunk. If he wants to mention non-game related stuff(like Ash or Ash-Greninja), he will. If he wants to cameo it, he will as long as licensing doesn't make it impossible. It's been proven it doesn't really matter as much as people try to think it does. It doesn't honestly matter one iota that it was a game franchise first. Ash is not a game character and never will be a game character. He could be called an exception to the rule... if there was an actual rule. The only rule he made is that he can't licensed non-game 3rd parties as playable at best. And that's with the context. He never said cameos are impossible, which would include the keychain. Of course, considering Mickey Mousehas been literally referenced in Smash, it's rather hard to believe he would never do it again. The issue just doesn't exist. Disney wouldn't allow it otherwise anyway, not that Sakurai would really care about something as arbitrary as that.

Here's the thing about leakers: they always get SOME things wrong. But once they've proved credibility, as Vergeben has, you must operate on the assumption that getting things wrong is the more unlikely option, though possible. Leaks aren't like Nintendo Directs where everything is all nice and laid out. It operates all on hearsay, investigation, and confirmation.
Compare Vergeben's Erdrick leaks to his Incineroar leak. It wasn't "Incineroar is in" from the beginning. It was, "A Gen 7 Pokemon that isn't Decidueye, Mimikyu, or Lycanroc."
The Erdrick discussion has been eeriely similar. Why would a credible leaker risk his reputation like that?
So, realistically, the chance that Erdrick ISN'T in is the longshot, because we do get outdated information from time to time (Gematsu Leak for Smash 4) and occasional leak bait.

Vergeben risked his entire reputation o the February direct and got burned hard by getting a huge amount wrong.

He still goes in even if he can be wrong. Guy isn't the smartest branch in the tree.

Incineroar isn't really in the same category anyway. He was a base game character, which he mentioned after getting a ton of base game correct. Erdrick is a likely DLC character. Vergeben has gotten nothing right on DLC despite his claims. He isn't credible for DLC at all. It doesn't mean he can't be right, but his track record for Smash DLC is really bad. It's more realistic to be skeptical right now. It doesn't help he's been saying a SE character for a severely long time. Not unlike the Minecraft content, which isn't here. And he got a confirmation it was "a boss" at some point. This feels like the same thing, stuff he was fooled into believing. Though Minecraft and Dragon Quest getting content is still possible, but it doesn't mean Verge knew what was actually going on. For instance, we could get Slime, and no Minecraft(or Microsoft as is) content. Vergeben has also been notorious for getting DLC wrong on many games. He's been nearly perfect on many base games. It's really hard to take him as still credible here, despite the hefty amount of mistakes he's made with Nintendo games(and Smash) as of late.

 

[Calane]

Not arguing that. I just don¨t get how people seem to think that he has leaked stuff left and right and been right with everything.

However, I don't think he's ever been incredibly wrong yet either.

He's just someone to keep an eye on until he's proven himself untrustworthy, I suppose.

 

[Ben Holt]

I respect your skepticism, and I have my own, as I am not 100% certain that Erdrick is gonna be DLC, just 90-95%.
There's a hell of a lot of smoke to not be fire.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Kingdom Hearts is completely different, because the entire series is a spinoff of the Mickey Mouse franchise, which is not primarily a video game series

You'd have to be an alien to consider Kingdom Hearts to be a spin-off of the Mickey Mouse franchise. It features Mickey, along with a ton of Disney characters, but it's not a Mickey Mouse game any more than it's a Final Fantasy game, a Pirates of the Caribbean game or a The World Ends With You game.

 

[Teeb147]

Vergeben risked his entire reputation o the February direct and got burned hard by getting a huge amount wrong.
.

And this is why you watch out for putting people through the wringer.
You're the one saying that he risked his reputation. That's like saying someone risked his passing grade on a test entirely on the last question.

 

[shinhed-echi]

When it comes to DQ reps, honestly, am I the only one who thinks everyone is REALLY sleeping on Luminary? I think his chances are incredibly high.

Sorry for the mess of a dupli-post.

Fixed

Anyway, I think Luminary is really likely, and slept on. I like his design so I wouldn’t mind. But Erdrick is the finest choice. Or Eight.

 

[Teeb147]

Ooh, for Erdrick they might go for
https://youtu.be/qwwpELp6oaM
(DQ3 battle suite)

Luminary would bring:
https://youtu.be/vH9du8eyrE0
(DQ11 battle theme)

Slime could bring something else
https://youtu.be/vH9du8eyrE0
(Dragon Quest Monsters battle theme)

edit: looks like the quotes got jumbled ;p

 

[perfectchaos83]

Vergeben risked his entire reputation o the February direct and got burned hard by getting a huge amount wrong.

He got Pikmin 3 and the Zelda game not being Link's Awakening in the Direct wrong. Bear in Mind, Vergeben was one of the first to leak the existence of Link's Awakening to begin with back in 2017. Verge's official story, which you can verify with ZenythSmash , is that his source expected Cadence of Hyrule to be revealed before Link's Awakening and described it as "a small scale 2D Zelda game coming to the eShop". It's up to you to believe it or not.

What he got right, that I remember, is an Ubisoft game getting revealed and SMM2.

 

[shinhed-echi]

You have the same link for both last tunes again.

I had a cluster**** of old quotes and replies, lol. Hopefully the original post got the irl right this time.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

However, I don't think he's ever been incredibly wrong yet either.

He's just someone to keep an eye on until he's proven himself untrustworthy, I suppose.

Except he has. He's gotten a huge amount of DLC wrong for other games too. He got the entirety of Minecraft wrong, and when it was getting close to the final release of Ultimate, magically "Square-Enix and Minecraft content might be DLC". With how extremely long it is coupled with leakbait being a thing, he's starting to backpedal too often.

He also hasn't gotten any Smash DLC right, and he's had more than one chance. He's doing really badly here right now. Writing him off wouldn't be fair, but he's 0/2 at this point and hasn't stopped being that way, and that's not even including how badly he screwed up during the February direct(ignoring Grand Prix, which was actual leakbait and everybody fell for it anyway among leakers).

And this is why you watch out for putting people through the wringer.
You're the one saying that he risked his reputation. That's like saying someone risked his passing grade on a test entirely on the last question.

Yes, people are taking what he says seriously and sees him as failing to bring real information. He got literally two things right in the February direct, as pointed out above. That's a horrid track record. He also did take a huge risk by throwing all his eggs in one basket. He didn't have to say "this is definitely coming". He could've just said he heard rumors of it and he'd be fine. So yes, he did risk his reputation by specifically doing things as foolishly as possible. Most have heavily condemned him, and it's for good reasons. It's really hard for many to trust him right now(again, Grand Prix aside, the only part everyone would get wrong anyway).

He got Pikmin 3 and the Zelda game not being Link's Awakening in the Direct wrong. Bear in Mind, Vergeben was one of the first to leak the existence of Link's Awakening to begin with back in 2017. Verge's official story, which you can verify with ZenythSmash , is that his source expected Cadence of Hyrule to be revealed before Link's Awakening and described it as "a small scale 2D Zelda game coming to the eShop". It's up to you to believe it or not.

What he got right, that I remember, is an Ubisoft game getting revealed and SMM2.

Which just shows how non-credible he is lately. Getting a couple things right isn't good enough if he makes it clear "Yes, this will happen". He absolutely risked his reputation here. The problem is that instead of being smart and saying they're rumors, though he feels they're likely real, it'd have been fine. People believe bad sources. They're only human. But that's not what he did. He put himself on a high pedestal instead, risking everything with hard statements. It's not surprising people are having a hard time trusting him now. Coupled with the constant backpedaling and excuses, it gets worse and worse.

I'm all for the benefit of the doubt, but he threw himself in a bad position regardless of that. I really don't see any good reason to treat him as credible for DLC right now. There's too much wrong at this time.

Never heard of the story you just told me, but he still believed a bad source about Link's Awakening. This is a problem because he could be believing bad sources right now. He believed some bad ones during base(where's Minecraft again?), he believed some during DLC(look at that SE character showing up before any other Fighter's Pass characters). There's a point when it's clear he's simply given bad information. It's not necessarily the case, but the stars aren't exactly aligning for him right now. He's in grain of salt territory after that disaster of a direct.

 

[Calane]

Except he has. He's gotten a huge amount of DLC wrong for other games too. He got the entirety of Minecraft wrong, and when it was getting close to the final release of Ultimate, magically "Square-Enix and Minecraft content might be DLC". With how extremely long it is coupled with leakbait being a thing, he's starting to backpedal too often.

He also hasn't gotten any Smash DLC right, and he's had more than one chance. He's doing really badly here right now. Writing him off wouldn't be fair, but he's 0/2 at this point and hasn't stopped being that way, and that's not even including how badly he screwed up during the February direct(ignoring Grand Prix, which was actual leakbait and everybody fell for it anyway among leakers).

...Uh, I was talking about Tansut.

Not Vergeben.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

...Uh, I was talking about Tansut.

Not Vergeben.

Ah, my bad.

I thought I had the context there. I'm in the "Eh, it doesn't add up too well." category for him. He has a nice track record, but the story is fishy.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Which just shows how non-credible he is lately. Getting a couple things right isn't good enough if he makes it clear "Yes, this will happen". He absolutely risked his reputation here. The problem is that instead of being smart and saying they're rumors, though he feels they're likely real, it'd have been fine. People believe bad sources. They're only human. But that's not what he did. He put himself on a high pedestal instead, risking everything with hard statements. It's not surprising people are having a hard time trusting him now. Coupled with the constant backpedaling and excuses, it gets worse and worse.

I'm all for the benefit of the doubt, but he threw himself in a bad position regardless of that. I really don't see any good reason to treat him as credible for DLC right now. There's too much wrong at this time.

Never heard of the story you just told me, but he still believed a bad source about Link's Awakening. This is a problem because he could be believing bad sources right now. He believed some bad ones during base(where's Minecraft again?), he believed some during DLC(look at that SE character showing up before any other Fighter's Pass characters). There's a point when it's clear he's simply given bad information. It's not necessarily the case, but the stars aren't exactly aligning for him right now. He's in grain of salt territory after that disaster of a direct.

That's something he's always done, even making his own speculation (SE being first) seem that way. People are only human and are prone to making their opinions seem like fact. It doesn't matter what he does. People will always hold against him what he said regardless of the context. His first Smash leak had Phoenix Wright, Tails and Zero on it. He sold it as an unverified rumor. Then, when he leaked Simon and Ridley he said the other one is likely fake. People still hold it against him. I don't think he's very credible as a whole, but I think his smash info thus far is correct with the exception of the Minecraft ****.

It's worth mentioning, Him being wrong about Zelda is due to assumptions. King Zell thought MPT would be revealed in the direct and it wasn't there. These assumptions likely come from their sources thinking that things are coming due to those projects likely being in the pipeline forever. I've been dealing with Verge since 2017 and what I can say is that when he's dead sure on something, he's pretty much right. I'm not talking about the passive statements he makes for damn near anything, but the statements where he exudes confidence like the stance he took with the Grinch leak and with Kencineroar. There's a reason I attribute Erdrick to being similar to Kencineroar, because both of them are nearly under the exact same circumstances when it comes to Verge's actions.

 

[Teeb147]

Yes, people are taking what he says seriously and sees him as failing to bring real information. He got literally two things right in the February direct, as pointed out above. That's a horrid track record. He also did take a huge risk by throwing all his eggs in one basket. He didn't have to say "this is definitely coming". He could've just said he heard rumors of it and he'd be fine. So yes, he did risk his reputation by specifically doing things as foolishly as possible. Most have heavily condemned him, and it's for good reasons. It's really hard for many to trust him right now(again, Grand Prix aside, the only part everyone would get wrong anyway).
.

You still haven't explained enough why you think getting some stuff in the feb direct wrong somehow ruins reputation.

Someone doesn't suddenly become incompetent all in one go. Verge was ****ty from the start and he still got so much stuff right. And that's because of the good sources that he has. If he wouldn't make so many assumptions about the timing of things he'd be on better feet for sure.

'risking' entire reputations on one event is a harsh way to live by. I hope you dont take that in other places in your life. Imagine if a comedian had to get laughs for all of his jokes, and if he had a string of no-laughs at one point his entire reputation is gone,

..tough crowd. ;p

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

You still haven't explained enough why you think getting some stuff in the feb direct wrong somehow ruins reputation.

I definitely did. He put all his eggs in one basket, intentionally making it clear that there's no way he could be wrong. That's a seriously risky move.

---------------

Removing everything else. Hope that explains the problem with leakers. Anybody who goes all in and treats their information as fact tends to get burned, Verge included.

I also still want the Minecraft stuff anyway. Definitely a series who has earned its spot in Smash. Dragon Quest has to, of course.

 

[Deleted member]

For the love of The Almighty, Can we move from the whole conversation about leakers? This has been repeated ad nauseum in the last couple of days.

I think both points are valid up to a certain point, best way to summarize is that its not good to trust leakers 100% but also dismissing them 100% is pretty silly even talking about Vergeben as it can bite you in the ass.

In the case of Vergeben he has periods with great info and periods with awful info, and in the case of Tansut if you think he is not reliable due to not leaking many things then it's something that can only be proven until the end of the cycle happens

 

[perfectchaos83]

I think you're still missing the point of how leaking is shown as. The more you get wrong, the more your credibility plummets. He's been usually doing fairly bad if you combine it all. He tends to get base game stuff right. Stuff like Directs and Events are generally mixed.

He's doing much better now than he was in 2017. This is why my stance on him has gone from "Worthless" to "keep in mind". I'm well aware of his history, and it's because of his history that I'm now humoring him rather than tossing everything he says in the garbage like I used to.

 

[Teeb147]

I definitely did. He put all his eggs in one basket, intentionally making it clear that there's no way he could be wrong. That's a seriously risky move. Maybe I didn't explain it well enough. He lost a huge amount of people who were actually believing him. He's just likely he has the credibility from most of the base roster being right, otherwise he'd be done as a leaker credibility-wise. He gets things wrong severely often alone, but this is understandably the last straw for people. Why he thinks making yet another giant post after screwing up is anybody's guess.


Having a lack of credibility has nothing to do with competence. ...Incidentally, the man has a lot of anger issues, but he's still very competent. He just got a huge blow to his credibility, enough to lose a lot of support. Which is very understandable. He's already been ridiculed well before that one, but that's due to getting a severe amount wrong on many many games. Man always had a spotty track record. He just now put himself in a lower standing after his current really good one with Ultimate. People gave him somewhat of the benefit of the doubt with the first DLC reveal not being a SE character. There's so much that changes among reveals as is. Getting actual games that are supposed to exist entirely wrong(or games that won't exist in the case of Link's Awakening) is a huge issue. This is a lot more tangible than a slightly off reveal timing. The only one that he really can't be blamed for is Grand Prix. Rest? Definitely a hit to his credibility. Him getting a bit right at least stops him from being in an impossible to come back from position, but he's still on fumes right now.


Welcome to the world of leaking. It makes or breaks you. The crowd is honestly that tough. Especially the Smash Crowd. I wish it wasn't, but that's just how it is. It's not like he has to stay a leaker anyway. He has other things, like a job, probably. And who knows what else.

That much unforgiveness is not healthy :O
Maybe it's losing support from some people who were waiting for a chance to jump on him and bash him. and that isn't a mark credibility (of losing it I mean). If it is, then we dont see credibility in the same way. And in fact you thinking that competence isn't linked to it makes me think you base it way too much on what others think. (well, some)

I agree that he got a blow to it because he did put a lot of eggs in his basket, but once you understand why he got it wrong, it doesn't look that bad. It looks worst than it is, we can say. I get wanting to hate on him and jump to the conclusion that he ruined his reputation with that, but it's just not a fair marker for his overall performance. He should've known by then, hopefully by now, not to claim things when it's not main sources.
Why couldn't he at least be honest about them being possible if he didn't hear it from a very well trusted source? It's not really all that hard, but my guess is that his arrogance got the better of him. And I totally get it, and I dont let it ruin his actuall full trackrecord just because some people wanted a reason to distrust him. Not saying it's not ok to do that, but it's pretty hasty, imo.

Anyway, have fun, time for sleep n all.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

That much unforgiveness is the reality we live in, sadly. :/

Anyway, I already am done with that conversation(as per my edit).

I also really gotta update my Slime moveset. I think I went a bit too much in using its limbs like a whip compared to other spells and abilities.

 

[NomadLuminary]

For the love of The Almighty, Can we move from the whole conversation about leakers? This has been repeated ad nauseum in the last couple of days.

I think both points are valid up to a certain point, best way to summarize is that its not good to trust leakers 100% but also dismissing them 100% is pretty silly even talking about Vergeben as it can bite you in the ***.

In the case of Vergeben he has periods with great info and periods with awful info, and in the case of Tansut if you think he is not reliable due to not leaking many things then it's something that can only be proven until the end of the cycle happens

It's a leakers life in a nutshell.

Also feel free to critique:

Erdrick moveset

 

[ZelDan]

maybe it's just me, but whenever people bring up "FFV" and "music", 99.9% of the time people always bring Battle on the Big Bridge. It's a nice tune and all, but FFV does have plenty of other great music (some of which I like more TBH):

Spoiler: Final Fantasy V music

 

[Just a random scrub]

(sigh) I know it's been said plenty before, but the Squeenix rep cannot be revealed soon enough. I want this ****ing train to end already......

 

[OnyanRings]

(sigh) I know it's been said plenty before, but the Squeenix rep cannot be revealed soon enough. I want this ****ing train to end already......

Trying to get off the dlc train

 

[Teeb147]

(sigh) I know it's been said plenty before, but the Squeenix rep cannot be revealed soon enough. I want this ****ing train to end already......

Two weeks
(probably)

 

[Matadormon]

Right, and no one here will know if that's the case or not, only the companies do and they will obviously not be saying anything. If he is in Smash, they can't say yes anyway because that would break NDA, and if he truly isn't in, they would still say "no". Therefore, my point stands, no one should be calling this a 100% deconfirmation, there is no way to know what's Sora's case really until all DLC characters have been revealed. It changes nothing of what I already said lol.



Let's not do this again. Sora IS a gaming character and was born in a videogame. It doesn't matter what company made him, it's still a game character. The belief that he can't get in because of they keyblade having a mickey logo is void, it's literally a fan made rule a this point. Being from Disney doesn't stop him at all. Disney has made games and they even made him, a 100% game character. The symbol in his keyblade is pointless discussion, if they are willing to lend him to Sakurai to put him in Smash, they are willing to make him keep the symbol that represents them as well, no one but smash community are making up that the symbol is an obstacle.
He is nowhere near Goku, because Goku isn't born from a video game to begin with. This really shouldn't need to be explained over and over again.

This is somehow related to your question, but I recall that Vergeben claimed that DQ is going to get new arrangements, yet, FF didn't got too many songs. How come DQ, according to him then, is going to get arrangements? It's possible that the new arrangements are related to KH. I recall that Sakurai said that he want to collaborate with Nomura again, so it's possible that Sora might get in. Also, regarding the seven SE reps, it's possible that Vergeben claimed that Sora is not in, yet it's possible that he is INDEED in. It's possible that Erdrick is leakbait. And as far as I know, I heard that Erdrick is a negotation nightmare.

 

[Rumble Red]

This is somehow related to your question, but I recall that Vergeben claimed that DQ is going to get new arrangements, yet, FF didn't got too many songs. How come DQ, according to him then, is going to get arrangements?

This is the first time I've heard that one.

 

[Teeb147]

This is the first time I've heard that one.

I dont think he talked about dragon quest music.

This is somehow related to your question, but I recall that Vergeben claimed that DQ is going to get new arrangements, yet, FF didn't got too many songs. How come DQ, according to him then, is going to get arrangements? It's possible that the new arrangements are related to KH. I recall that Sakurai said that he want to collaborate with Nomura again, so it's possible that Sora might get in. Also, regarding the seven SE reps, it's possible that Vergeben claimed that Sora is not in, yet it's possible that he is INDEED in. It's possible that Erdrick is leakbait. And as far as I know, I heard that Erdrick is a negotation nightmare.

Not really.
And, people did talk about DQ11S getting good arrangements, because it was in the nintendo direct.

 

[OnyanRings]

It's a leakers life in a nutshell.

Also feel free to critique:

Erdrick moveset

I finally took some time to take a look at your moveset.

It's quite amazing ! I really like how you incorporated both Erdrick's magic spells and wide array of weaponry in clever ways.

If anything, it makes me a bit sad that it won't end up being the real moveset.

 

[Teeb147]

I finally took some time to take a look at your moveset.

It's quite amazing ! I really like how you incorporated both Erdrick's magic spells and wide array of weaponry in clever ways.

If anything, it makes me a bit sad that it won't end up being the real moveset.

Personally I'd expect maybe 1 or 2 moves being a different weapon. Would be cool if there'd be a lot more or can change equipment tho XD

 

[REZERO]

In the case of Vergeben he has periods with great info and periods with awful info, and in the case of Tansut if you think he is not reliable due to not leaking many things then it's something that can only be proven until the end of the cycle happens

God its awful hearing that name sometimes. If Vergeben said the apocalypse is coming, I know users on this forum that would start preparing for it.

People love leaks here. Like you said I think balance in everything as opposed to 100% would be the best approach but not everyone here treats leaks like that,

 

[Ovaltine]

I have extremely important news for the Geno thread. It's very important. It's huge.

So, you know how Geno calls Mallow 'my fluffy little friend' in the English version? Well, there's an alternative term he uses in the Japanese version: fuka fuka-kun (ふかふか-くん). -kun as a suffix is a way to refer to someone your junior, so it makes sense. What does fuka fuka mean, though? It literally means fluffy fluffy. So, if we're being very literal, Geno is calling Mallow 'Fluffy Fluffy' or even 'Fluffy Fluff', but you may take liberties with the translation to mean, 'Little Fluffy Fluffy' or 'Little Fluffy Fluff'.

This is extremely cute and extremely important. You all need this information. You're welcome.

Sharing this from the Geno thread because you all need this. Everyone needs this. I need it like I need air.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I think Vergeben is trustworthy, but I don't think what he says should be taken as hard-fact. It seems apparent that something he assumes from information he's given could end up coming true at a different time, or could be something that relates to what he says but isn't exactly what he says. If we get an SE character, it could be Luminary rather than Erdrick, or even Slime.

Still hoping for a Pikmin 3 port at E3 if not a Pikmin Trilogy or Pikmin 4.

 

[NomadLuminary]

I finally took some time to take a look at your moveset.

It's quite amazing ! I really like how you incorporated both Erdrick's magic spells and wide array of weaponry in clever ways.

If anything, it makes me a bit sad that it won't end up being the real moveset.

Thank you for taking a look at it. I really tried to make Erdrick be unique, as I know he is super capable of it and not generic as some people would have you believe.

 

[OnyanRings]

Yes, i'm still upset.

 

[Idon]

Yes, i'm still upset.

Don't worry, by saying he's NOT in, surely they're trying to throw us off from the fact he IS in!

Right?

Riiiiiiiiiiight?

 

[NomadLuminary]

Don't worry, by saying he's NOT in, surely they're trying to throw us off from the fact he IS in!

Right?

Riiiiiiiiiiight?

I still believe in the Demi-Fiend

 

[Idon]

I still believe in the Demi-Fiend

Good.

Cuz Atlus don't.

 

[NomadLuminary]

Good.

Cuz Atlus don't.

I know. It's a big sad ;( I'm just waiting for that JRPG Avengers that will never happen because it's a pipe dream.