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Snake in B-

Mister Cadaver

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OK. An update.

http://www.mediafire.com/?43dnwzmnmtw

I did something very strange here.
Dair links and the last hit spikes, Melee Marth Dair tipper style.

Anyway, If Snake trips, anyone who is near his body when he shakes the ground will trip themselves. Also if he rolls from the edge or from tripping, they will get hit by his frame and most likely trip.
That's hot.
 

Sinz

The only true DR vet.
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Okay so we played a bit tonight. Comments.

Fsmash is really cool, but way too powerful. It killed ganon at 8%.
Usmash should still do 3 mortars.
Cypher is actually a little bit overboard. =/

Take off the fair element. It is really annoying =/
 

Eternal Yoshi

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Okay so we played a bit tonight. Comments.

Fsmash is really cool, but way too powerful. It killed ganon at 8%.
Usmash should still do 3 mortars.
Cypher is actually a little bit overboard. =/

Take off the fair element. It is really annoying =/
I didn't raise the KB at all. All I did was up the damage of Fsmash.
I can't do 3 mortars right now.
Is the hitbox of Cypher too big or something?

OK. Freezing fair will be off next time.
 

Sinz

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I didn't raise the KB at all. All I did was up the damage of Fsmash.
I can't do 3 mortars right now.
Is the hitbox of Cypher too big or something?

OK. Freezing fair will be off next time.
We did some more testing, the fsmash was actually just fine. :) The only thing that needs to get changed is the fair. But, everything else is amazing and perfect. Amazing job.

Wario kept biting the cypher and he was the one dying =/
 

Sinz

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I didn't raise the KB at all. All I did was up the damage of Fsmash.
I can't do 3 mortars right now.
Is the hitbox of Cypher too big or something?

OK. Freezing fair will be off next time.
Reading is pro bro.
 
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I need to download Brawl-. This seems too fun.

*waits for Brawl- namesearcher to namesearch Brawl- for Brawl- support reasons*

Brawl-
THANK YOU

How did I miss this thread this badly?

Too bad you can't make box auto kill.
You can, and I support it. :3 It would be pretty broken though...

Umm... EY, I have to say, sorry about this, but your snake holds a very, very high chance of being completely ignored (I didn't even know you were still working on it!). The reason?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OqxN-XHboc&feature=sub
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgvekjjydxE

Kirk did snake... Notice such interesting effects such as
-Triple mortar
-Triple rocket launcher (fsmash) for rapetastic edgeguarding
-Third 'nade and beyond are motion sensor mines (just spam B after 2 nades are out and you'll get a bunch of them)
-ZOMFG HITLAG
-Tons of shield damage
-Very fast IASA on sideB (shoot a rocket, go run after it)
-Dthrow says "tasty".
-Grenades have a low outward angle, meaning that they will kill way earlier and set up for edgeguarding.

...yeaaaah...

That said, suggestions are fine too.
 

Sinz

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The ZOMFG hitlag makes Snake suck in doubles. I prefer EY's fsmash to the triple fsmash that Kirk put in his. If you guys could do a bit of a hybrid of the two it would be awesome.

So take out the ZOMFG hitlag. It is stupid as ****.
The nikita joke is alright. It still sucks.
Triple nade is really cool :)
Triple usmash is good.
EY's fsmash is ****ing amazing. So much more fun that Kirk's.
The mines look really good on Kirk's build.
EY's nades are the same as Kirk's from our testing.
Saying tasty is funny. :)

If you could combine the efforts of the two it would be awesome :)

I tried out Kirk's Snake last weekend(we downloaded the pack released on the 16th) and I hated Kirk's Snake aside from the usmash. EY's was a lot more fun and everyone thought it was better overall. We did singles, doubles, and free for alls. EY's Snake was superior in all of them.

If I had to choose one Snake in brawl- I would take EY's Snake any day over Kirk's.
 
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I'll be honest, I'm not 100% on Kirk's snake either. I do not like the hitlag one bit. You know there's something really wrong when most of what your char does it punishable on shield... in a game where there's enough shieldstun for SBCs. The usmash is pimp. What did EY do to Fsmash? I like the triple fsmash, it hits pretty hard.

I honestly should take a look at EY's snake... Anyone got a changelist? I can't playtest ;_;

I'll certainly make sure Kirk sees this thread.
 

Sinz

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I'll be honest, I'm not 100% on Kirk's snake either. I do not like the hitlag one bit. You know there's something really wrong when most of what your char does it punishable on shield... in a game where there's enough shieldstun for SBCs. The usmash is pimp. What did EY do to Fsmash? I like the triple fsmash, it hits pretty hard.

I honestly should take a look at EY's snake...

I'll certainly make sure Kirk sees this thread.
EY's fsmash travels. It does one infront of you, then it does another infront of that one, and so forth. It does a total of 5 shots. Snake is stuck in his animation while this is going on. It is punishable in singles so it isn't too broken. It is really good.


Does that make sense? Maybe EY can explain it better.

The one thing i don't like about EY's Snake is the fair, which he said he is going to remove. Everything else is great.
 

Linkshot

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I love Kirk's fSmash beyond belief.

dSmash says "There"
Pummel says "Nom"

You forgot those.

Get rid of hitlag, replace with awesome flash graphic you had, BPC?
 
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EY's fsmash travels. It does one infront of you, then it does another infront of that one, and so forth. It does a total of 5 shots. Snake is stuck in his animation while this is going on. It is punishable in singles so it isn't too broken. It is really good.


Does that make sense? Maybe EY can explain it better.

The one thing i don't like about EY's Snake is the fair, which he said he is going to remove. Everything else is great.
That made sense... Speed it up a good bit and dear god... what have we done... :V

Is there a full changelist for it?

I love Kirk's fSmash beyond belief.

dSmash says "There"
Pummel says "Nom"

You forgot those.

Get rid of hitlag, replace with awesome flash graphic you had, BPC?
Flash graphic? The one that caused constant DCs online? The really flashy, annoying one?

Also, I would totally support the hitlag if there's a code that makes snake just take less hitlag (so you can abuse your opponent getting stuck in hitlag way longer than you are; that is, a hitlag frame advantage)...
 

Sinz

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That made sense... Speed it up a good bit and dear god... what have we done... :V

Is there a full changelist for it?



Flash graphic? The one that caused constant DCs online? The really flashy, annoying one?

Also, I would totally support the hitlag if there's a code that makes snake just take less hitlag (so you can abuse your opponent getting stuck in hitlag way longer than you are; that is, a hitlag frame advantage)...
I just looked through the thread. I saw an old change list. But none of the recent change lists. =/

Thanks for reading this and considering EY's Snake. It is legit :)
 

Eternal Yoshi

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That made sense... Speed it up a good bit and dear god... what have we done... :V

Is there a full changelist for it?
Over here.

Code:
Horizontal air movement increased
Running speed slightly increased to raise range of boost grab
Jab 1 does slightly more damage and is 1.5 times the normal speed
Jab 2 is also slightly faster and does more speed.
Jab 3 has aura effect, does more damage and is faster after the hitbox is gone
Ftilt 1 hitboxes slightly bigger, has a 50% chance of tripping and does more damage(about 12%)
Ftilt 2 has electric effect added, does more damage(about 15%) and has slightly more range.
Utilt hitboxes mirrored behind him, given fire elemental, and raised knockback gain slightly
Dtilt does more damage and is 1.5 time the normal speed.
Dash attack knockback reworked to make it easier to connect to followup
Fsmash does a horizontal wave, does more damage
Usmash animation 1.5 times faster
Mortar shell does more damage and knockback
Dsmash faster
Mine does slightly more knockback
Nair 1.35 times faster
Dair 1.5 times faster
2nd and 3rd hit use the "Falco angle"
4th hit spikes Melee marth dair tipper style
AC window placed earlier to be usable.
Bair AC window placed earlier to be useful
Bair Hitboxes slightly bigger and has more knockback
Fair change pending.....
Choking speed 3 times normal speed at frame 2, hitbox moved to frame 1
Fthrow and Bthrow given more knockback base and gain to be KO throws
Dthrow now does 15% damage
Uthrow knockback reworked to lead to an utilt
Trip rolling and ledge roll animations have weak hitboxes to send foes out of Snake's space
Cypher does more damage, has a bigger hitbox, and does significantly more knockback
Cypher hitbox angle changed to send foes upwards.  
All C4 animations 1.4 times faster
C4 air detonate animation 1.7 times faster
C4 does 17% damage
Grenade pull animation is 2 times faster
Grenade summoning
Nikita launch and cancel animations 2 times faster
Nikita weak hitbox does more damage and a tad more kncokback
Nikita strong hitbox has double hitlag and does more knockback
This is all that I can remember ATM.
 

6Mizu

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Over here.

Code:
Horizontal air movement increased
Running speed slightly increased to raise range of boost grab
Jab 1 does slightly more damage and is 1.5 times the normal speed
Jab 2 is also slightly faster and does more speed.
Jab 3 has aura effect, does more damage and is faster after the hitbox is gone
Ftilt 1 hitboxes slightly bigger, has a 50% chance of tripping and does more damage(about 12%)
Ftilt 2 has electric effect added, does more damage(about 15%) and has slightly more range.
Utilt hitboxes mirrored behind him, given fire elemental, and raised knockback gain slightly
Dtilt does more damage and is 1.5 time the normal speed.
Dash attack knockback reworked to make it easier to connect to followup
Fsmash does a horizontal wave, does more damage
Usmash animation 1.5 times faster
Mortar shell does more damage and knockback
Dsmash faster
Mine does slightly more knockback
Nair 1.35 times faster
Dair 1.5 times faster
2nd and 3rd hit use the "Falco angle"
4th hit spikes Melee marth dair tipper style
AC window placed earlier to be usable.
Bair AC window placed earlier to be useful
Bair Hitboxes slightly bigger and has more knockback
Fair change pending.....
Choking speed 3 times normal speed at frame 2, hitbox moved to frame 1
Fthrow and Bthrow given more knockback base and gain to be KO throws
Dthrow now does 15% damage
Uthrow knockback reworked to lead to an utilt
Trip rolling and ledge roll animations have weak hitboxes to send foes out of Snake's space
Cypher does more damage, has a bigger hitbox, and does significantly more knockback
Cypher hitbox angle changed to send foes upwards.  
All C4 animations 1.4 times faster
C4 air detonate animation 1.7 times faster
C4 does 17% damage
Grenade pull animation is 2 times faster
Grenade summoning
Nikita launch and cancel animations 2 times faster
Nikita weak hitbox does more damage and a tad more kncokback
Nikita strong hitbox has double hitlag and does more knockback
This is all that I can remember ATM.
EY so....this is what you made?
Also, can see if Snake can have the Connecting D-air Spike in Brawl minus.
(By which I mean could tyou get a hold of one of the designers?)
 

smashkng

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He still has the triple mortar and triple fsmash, while the annoying extreme hitlag removed?
 

Linkshot

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I tried it out earlier. It's a beast and would love to see it merged with Kirk's.
Here are my suggestions:
* Huge nerf on fSmash1 knockback; have the first hit EY's, and the last two Kirk's.
* Keep EY's Grenade Pull speed
* MSB pl0x
* Use Kirk's tripping dTilt
* Nikita; have R put it into "Kirk Mode", where the rocket keeps flying forward and Snake can move around.
* More damage on fAir Landing
* Nerf Cypher knockback; otherwise fine
* Sweetspot fTilt1 needs to tap forward to land fTilt2 properly
* Use EY's uTilt, fTilt, DA, dSmash, bAir, uAir, nAir, dAir, pummel, uThrow, bThrow, fThrow, C4
* Attach "There!" to dSmash
* Attach "Nom!" to Pummel
* Attach "Kept you waiting" to Release
* Use Kirk's C4 Sticky Range
* Let Snake hit his own Grenades
* Let dSmash still hit Snake (but maybe just a special low-KB case for him, if at all possible?)
* Keep EY's Nikita KB
* Use Kirk's Cypher Momentum and IASA
* Use Triple Mortar
* Keep EY's run and air Speed.

I think I hit all the points @.@
 

Sinz

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I tried it out earlier. It's a beast and would love to see it merged with Kirk's.
Here are my suggestions:
* Huge nerf on fSmash1 knockback; have the first hit EY's, and the last two Kirk's.
Wouldn't that fsmash last like half an hour?
* Keep EY's Grenade Pull speed
Agreed
* MSB pl0x
Don't understand]

* Use Kirk's tripping dTilt
Sounds good.
* Nikita; have R put it into "Kirk Mode", where the rocket keeps flying forward and Snake can move around.
I still wouldn't use nikita.
* More damage on fAir Landing
You need better English. Are you saying that you want Fair to do more damage when it connects? Or are you saying when you land on the stage with fair it should do damage?
* Nerf Cypher knockback; otherwise fine
Ooooook
* Sweetspot fTilt1 needs to tap forward to land fTilt2 properly
What are you trying to say? Are you trying to say that Ftilt1 should connect to ftilt 2?
* Use EY's uTilt, fTilt, DA, dSmash, bAir, uAir, nAir, dAir, pummel, uThrow, bThrow, fThrow, C4
So you want the triple fsmash, triple usmash, the dthrow, and the jab?
* Attach "There!" to dSmash
* Attach "Nom!" to Pummel
* Attach "Kept you waiting" to Release
Sounds funny :)
* Use Kirk's C4 Sticky Range
Is it bigger?
* Let Snake hit his own Grenades
What? Both Snake's could get hit by their own nades.

* Let dSmash still hit Snake (but maybe just a special low-KB case for him, if at all possible?)
Same thing.
* Keep EY's Nikita KB
* Use Kirk's Cypher Momentum and IASA
* Use Triple Mortar
* Keep EY's run and air Speed.
Sounds good :)

Everyone in Utah loves EY's fsmash. It is so much fun :)
I think I hit all the points @.@[/QUOTE]
 

Eternal Yoshi

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The landing fair damage was a light hit meant to plop the foe up to lead to an utilt or grab.

The slight increase is meant to boost the boost grab's range.

The mine only has one hitbox and I can't add another.

MSB..... can I have a translation?

Exactly how is triple mortar done?
Duplicating the animation of the article doesn't do anything.

Aparrently, I somewhat sped up the item swin and throw animations. I don't know what Peachy is allowed to pull up from the ground in B-, but Snake will be ready.
 
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Working on snake right now.

Gonna take your advice and grab the ftilt, utilt, and a few other things from EY's pac, along with the last hit of fsmash (sexy), maybe some other things (Still haven't looked at EY's snake). I have my own ideas on the aerials though...
 
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Well guys I merged ****.



Code:
~CHANGELIST~

Jab1 - UNCHANGED.
Jab2 - WDKB:20>35, JabLoopPoint:none>9, AllowInterupt:none>21.
Jab3 - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3.
DashAttack - ShieldDamage:1>10, Hitlag:x1>x1.5/x1>x1.5(weakhit). Allows jump cancel frame 12. 

Ftilt1 - ShieldDamage:3>F, Size 7/6/5.5->7.5/6.5/5.5, tripping rate 0->50%
Ftilt2 - ShieldDamage:A>10, size 6/7/5/6.5->7/8/6/7 
Utilt - ShieldDamage:0>10. Size strong hit 6/5/5->8/7/8, weak hit 7/5/6->8/7/7. Damage strong hit 13->15, Damage weak hit 12->14. Strong Hitboxes mirrored behind snake (inverted X-offsets). All strong hits fire.
Dtilt - Angle:80/75/70>275, WDKB:0>30, KBG:110/100>50, BKB:50>30, ShieldDamage:0>10, TripRate:0%>50%, Hitlag:x1>x3.

Fsmash - Loops twice, larger damage, bubble size, and graphic with each blast, DMG:17,22... Third loop has 5 blasts shortly after one another following a line pattern.
Usmash - Generates 3 articles 7 frames apart.
Dsmash - Mine activation:71>50 frames, Mine Duration:25sec>Infinite, TriggerRadius:4>8, DMG:14>17. "There!"

Nair - ShieldDamage:0>5/0>10(LastHit), Hitlag:x1>x2/x1>x3(lasthit), SDI:x1>x0.5(first3hits), frame speed x2 if "B" is pressed after 3rd hit and before 4th hit, calls C4 action. "Good!". Autocancels ending frame 8 (was frame 3) and starting frame 46 (was 49). Hit one damage 6->2, hit 2 damage 5->2, hit 3 damage 4->2, hit 4 damage 13->9, KBG 5F->62. Hit 2 angle 78/3C/64/4B->16B (autolink). Hit 3 angle 104/118/64/4B->16B, hit 4 KBG 62->40
Fair - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3 on tipper (ID2) ID2Bone:Knee>Foot. Weak hit ID1 Damage F->C, Direction 10D->40. Weak hit ID0 KBG 64->40 Autocancels frame 26, allow JC after frame 26, frame speed x1.7	 between frames 1 and 22
Bair - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3/x1>x2(Weakhit).
Uair - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3/x1>x2(Weakhit), AutoCancel:36>33,AllowInterupt:N/A>43. Landing lag can be JC'd.
Dair - ShieldDamage:0>5/0>10(LastHit), Hitlag:x1>x2/x1>x3(lasthit), SDI:x1>x0.5(first3hits), autocancels frame 37 (was 62). Damage first hit 6->2, Angles second, third hit 266/80/80>363/363/363, damage 5->2, angle last hit 361/361/361->10/10/10, damage C->A, KBG 6E->60, frame speed x1.5

Standing Grab - UNCHANGED.
Dash Grab - UNCHANGED.
Pivot Grab - UNCHANGED.

Pummel - DMG:2>4, "Ommnn..."

Fthrow - BKB:3C>5C.
Bthrow - Angle:40>0, KBG:65>45. BKB:65>55.
Uthrow - DMG:10>13
Dthrow - "Tasty!"

Nspecial - Upon article limit(2), pulls out a sensor mine at x0.7 frame speed.
Sspecial - DMG:7>10/14>17, ShieldDamage:1>5/1>10(HiExplosion), TriggerRadius:2.5>5, Automatically exits animation after Missile fires. 
Uspecial - HeavyArmor:7>11, AllowInterupt:41>5, More control horizontally.
Dspecial - StickyRadius:5>8(Ground/Wall/Enemy/etc.), StickyTransferInterval:121>75 frames, Increased size of blast. Blast animation speed x3

Attributes - UNCHANGED.

GrenadeItem: DetonationTime:180>120, Angle:80>20.
SensorMineItem: MineActivation:101>50 frames, Mine Duration:20sec>60sec, DMG:5>1(Thrown)/25>22(Explosion).
C4Articles: StickyDuration:900>3600 frames, AutoDetonate:1600>3600 frames.
http://www.mediafire.com/file/hoqn5ejiy2m/FitSnakeTest.pac

Check it out, see how ya like it. I did what I could with fsmash...
 

Linkshot

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I'd like to note, as the playtester, that there are bugs with fSmash that need to be addressed.
uTilt is missing its graphic, and fAir doesn't have its landing hit.

Aside from bugs and possible mistakes, this Snake is truly a beast. So many wtf combos.
 

Linkshot

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Tilted fSmash has no hitbox.

The non-tilted hitboxes look to be the wrong distance.

There's a TON of cooldown on the third fSmash (about 3 seconds)
 
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So I fix'd the fsmash; you guys will get to see what I did when I'm done retweaking it.

VITAL QUESTION TO THE CONTINUING EXISTENCE OF THE UNIVERSE

WHAT IS THE SOUND EFFECT SNAKE HAS WHICH IS CLOSEST TO "YESZ!!!" AND WHERE IS IT USED????

Also

http://www.mediafire.com/file/o4znzid5lzw/FitSnake.pac

Check it out, see how you approve... Has some interesting stuff.

~CHANGELIST~

Jab1 - UNCHANGED.
Jab2 - WDKB:20>35, JabLoopPoint:none>9, AllowInterupt:none>21.
Jab3 - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3.
DashAttack - ShieldDamage:1>10, Hitlag:x1>x1.5/x1>x1.5(weakhit). Allows jump cancel frame 12.

Ftilt1 - ShieldDamage:3>F, Size 7/6/5.5->7.5/6.5/5.5, tripping rate 0->50%, all hitboxes lightning
Ftilt2 - ShieldDamage:A>10, size 6/7/5/6.5->7/8/6/7
Utilt - ShieldDamage:0>10. Size strong hit 6/5/5->8/7/8, weak hit 7/5/6->8/7/7. Damage strong hit 13->15, Damage weak hit 12->14. Strong Hitboxes mirrored behind snake (inverted X-offsets).
Dtilt - Angle:80/75/70>275, WDKB:0>30, KBG:110/100>50, BKB:50>30, ShieldDamage:0>10, TripRate:0%>50%, Hitlag:x1>x3.

Fsmash - Loops twice, larger damage, bubble size, and graphic with each blast, DMG:17,22... Third loop has 5 blasts shortly after one another following a line pattern.
Usmash - Generates 3 articles 7 frames apart.
Dsmash - Mine activation:71>50 frames, Mine Duration:25sec>Infinite, TriggerRadius:4>8, DMG:14>17. "There!"

Nair - ShieldDamage:0>5/0>10(LastHit), Hitlag:x1>x2/x1>x3(lasthit), SDI:x1>x0.5(first3hits), if "B" is pressed after 3rd hit and before 4th hit, calls C4 action. "Good!". Autocancels ending frame 8 (was frame 3) and starting frame 46 (was 49). Hit 4 size 9->13
Fair - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3 on tipper (ID2) ID2Bone:Knee>Foot. Weak hit ID1 Damage F->C, Direction 10D->40. Weak hit ID0 KBG 64->40 Autocancels frame 26, allow interrupt after frame 26, frame speed x1.7 between frames 1 and 22
Bair - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3/x1>x2(Weakhit).
Uair - ShieldDamage:0>10, Hitlag:x1>x3/x1>x2(Weakhit), AutoCancel:36>33,AllowInterupt:N/A>43. Landing lag can be JC'd.
Dair - ShieldDamage:0>5/0>10(LastHit), Hitlag:x1>x2/x1>x3(lasthit), SDI:x1>x0.5(first3hits), autocancels frame 37 (was 62). Damage first hit 6->2, Angles second, third hit 266/80/80>363/363/363, damage 5->2, angle last hit 361/361/361->10/10/10, damage C->A, KBG 6E->60, frame speed x1.5

Standing Grab - UNCHANGED.
Dash Grab - UNCHANGED.
Pivot Grab - UNCHANGED.

Pummel - DMG:2>4, "Ommnn..."

Fthrow - BKB:3C>5C.
Bthrow - Angle:40>0, KBG:65>45. BKB:65>55.
Uthrow - DMG:10>13
Dthrow - "Tasty!"

Nspecial - Upon article limit(2), pulls out a sensor mine at x0.7 frame speed.
Sspecial - DMG:7>10/14>17, ShieldDamage:1>5/1>10(HiExplosion), TriggerRadius:2.5>5, Automatically exits animation after Missile fires.
Uspecial - HeavyArmor:7>11, AllowInterupt:41>5, More control horizontally.
Dspecial - StickyRadius:5>8(Ground/Wall/Enemy/etc.), StickyTransferInterval:121>75 frames, Increased size of blast. Blast animation speed x3

Attributes - Run initial velocity 1.35->1.47, Air stopping mobility 0.01->0.015, 0.94->1.29.

GrenadeItem: DetonationTime:180>120, Angle:80>20.
SensorMineItem: MineActivation:101>50 frames, Mine Duration:20sec>60sec, DMG:5>1(Thrown)/25>22(Explosion).
C4Articles: StickyDuration:900>3600 frames, AutoDetonate:1600>3600 frames.

The idea is this: Massive Hitlag on Snake's melee attacks. This may put him at a frame disadvantage, especially when powershielded. This is balanced by adding EXTRA ShieldDamage to all of these attacks. And there is always the article fun. My goodness...so many explosions.
 
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