Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[DrCoeloCephalo]

Okay I missed most of this pokemon discussion but like, I don't see what's so "shallow" about liking a pokemon just for its design when that's often meant to be the main appeal of most pokemon. Like yeah I used to play competitive and there are plenty of pokemon I learned to appreciate more because they were useful to me competitively, but like, I don't think there's a wrong reason to like a fictional cartoon monster. I'd go so far as to say that line of reasoning is even kind of elitist.

Chill out and let people like what they like. Some people would call you shallow for only liking pokemon that are somehow useful for you competitively - I'm not one of those people but some would.

Then let me make it clear that that's EXACTLY what the word shallow means, to only care about the looks. If you don't believe me, you can look that up.

Problem is that that would be factually wrong to call it shallow because being shallow means caring about looks first and foremost. The stats are a completely different trait from the looks. Plus, the stats go DEEPER than the looks by going into the DEPTH of the metagame. So you really can't call it shallow at all since you're caring more about the depth of the monster. It's not like they're useful just to me. Hundreds of people besides me are using top tier mons in actual tournaments and winning with them as we speak.

While everyone is entitled to their own opinions...

...isn't this literally Team Rocket's and Silver's raison d'etre? The whole "I only like them since they're Smogon approvedTM" idea?

I feel like most RPGs are set up so you can power through the game with the bad-stats stuff, and it's even a mark of how good you are if you can win despite the stats. I can even call back to Skyrim - the most iconic armor in the game is the first set you get, so it's incredibly weak, and the set that he wears in the promos is even mixed light cuirass with heavy everything else so there's two different skills needed to make it good. Doesn't stop it from looking badass though.

But you do you. Me? I'm taking my team through as many Pokémon games as I can get them no matter what Smogon says I should use. When Smogon starts programming the AI, then we can talk.

While I don't know what RPGs you're playing, I can definitely tell you that that is not even remotely the case. Other monster collectors BESIDES Pokemon basically get it through a players' head that some monsters are just superior to others. Yo-Kai Watch, Dragon Quest Monsters and especially the Shin Megami Tensei titles basically beat you to a pulp for trying to pull alot of the same stuff Pokemon lets you get away with due to how brutal those games get later on. You're certainly not about to solo Shin Megami Tensei 4 Apocalypse with a Food Katakirauwa since that'd just be ASKING to lose and give your opponents free turns to walk all over you.

Smogon doesn't deal with playing through the story. They deal with a 6v6 Singles meta. So how well your monsters are doing in a story doesn't really prove anything for or against them since that's an entirely separate metagame that ingame tier lists exist for.

Regardless of what you think about Smogon, this kind of thing still exists OUTSIDE of the Smogon format. Heck, it exists in Game Freak's official metagames too, so even the people that program the AI of Pokemon have a system set up where most of your mons aren't really going to do you any favors. The official VGC Doubles format also has tier lists that make it blatantly clear some options are just more recommendable than others and that meta is a joke for how little variety it has from cookie cutter teams but at the end of the day, Game Freak is giving those players using said cookie cutter teams and winning with them thousands of dollars for winning, trophies as testaments of their skills and literally calling them Pokemon Masters. You can't really blame those competitive players for using the best options to win since it's not like Game Freak is telling them not to do that in their own metagame.

 

[Pyra]

Noi

Poi

:BigThink:

Noi

De

Poi

better

 

[Bionichute]

uhhhhh hey did you guys know there's a wrestling shark in yokai watch

he's pretty rad

 

[Will]

call me when there's a loan shark pokemon

You're about to get catfished.

 

[Deleted member]

I can't pick a definitive favorite Pokemon, I like too many.

Consistent favorites include Dewott, Poipole, and Noivern.

Favorite Pokemon for me are easily these three:

Spoiler

1.

I know, I know, who would've guessed that I like the unicorn Pokemon?

2.

I don't know why I love it, I just do.

...Upon reflection, I now know why I like Piranha Plant being in Smash.

1.

Has been my all-time favorite since I first started playing the series with Pokemon Conquest. I actually have a plush of this one, and it's probably one of my most favorite plushies ever, lol.

 

[Gentlepanda]

uhhhhh hey did you guys know there's a wrestling shark in yokai watch

he's pretty rad

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN IT'S THE SHOWDOWN OF THE CENTURY

 

[DrCoeloCephalo]

uhhhhh hey did you guys know there's a wrestling shark in yokai watch

he's pretty rad

Who needs that when we have Steve Jaws and Indiana Jaws?

 

[PsySmasher]

uhhhhh hey did you guys know there's a wrestling shark in yokai watch

he's pretty rad

Literally the first thing that popped into my mind was: “Why does he look like Emperor Awesome from Wander over Yonder?”

If anyone remembers that show, you have my utmost respect.

 

[Bionichute]

i think one of the big things that yokai watch has going for it is that it gives all like 800 of its monsters very distinct personalities. each has a unique voice, power, set of dialog, and set of abilities, while also being cohesive enough for kids, its main demographic, to get down really quickly. you're more often likely to see yokai in cutscenes, usually fleshing them out beyond just a short bio

i think i started liking yokai watch because it actually focused on my favorite part of the mons genre, which isn't something you see that often. the actual pokemon are my favorite part of pokemon as a series, and yet up until sun and moon they've barely gotten any real focus plotwise outside of the two legendaries. the end game of sun and moon not being focused around one of the legendaries and you having to fight it was such a relief

in yokai watch, each plot point is caused by yokai, the villains are yokai, and even the bosses get personalities. each of the villains in the three games is completely unique and bizarre from each other, most of them verging into the point of surreal horror when you get to their final forms. mckraken, dame dedtime, and the ghoulfather all have their own unique themes and plans, which is better than just having the same villain organization to fight throughout most of the games

(though on an actual objective level pokemon probably handles its villains much better, especially compared to the first yokai watch game where the plot literally does not start until the literal last part of the game. yokai watch 2 and 3 are way better about this, 2 especially)

oops i rambled about villains again, but basically my point is that yokai watch handles the actual mons part of its mons game fairly flawlessly. i don't think there's a single unmemorable yokai, even if they end up having basically no screen time in either the anime or the games. even the recolor yokai from the first game are handled as best as they could have (dont worry 2 and 3 only have a handful of recolors each, to signify the hardest to get yokai in the game)

i mean its good aside from the insanely rng based befriending system. that's not very much fun. but i still like yokai watch a lot despite its faults AND ALSO

 

[PLATINUM7]

I always feel like I’m right at the cusp of elite smash...
Right now I’m at 2.1M and I feel like I’m so close to getting there.

It’s kinda funny that Palutena is popular in this game bc I feel like last game I was the only person alive who played her.

Does anyone else see their main a lot when they play online and have you learned any neat tricks?

(By the way I think online is honestly fine now I don’t really have many complaints except changing characters in quick play)

I've seen Yoshi a couple of times but I can't say I've learnt anything from the other Yoshi mains.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I can't believe no one's said Garchomp yet.

It's a Shark.
Crossed with a Dragon.
That swims in the ground.

It is literally a land-shark.

He's also two types that aren't playable Pokemon in Smash yet. Dragon and Ground. He's a fantastic pick honestly.

put kaiba back on that ****ing list

I ain't putting no damn manga character on no damn list!

 

[Will]

I ain't putting no damn manga character on no damn list!

PUT THE MAN BACK ON THE LIST

 

[SnakeFighter64]

"Dataminers"

****'s fake. Game's been scrubbed enough at this point.

I just got an update yesterday. Couldn’t this just be.... fresh?

 

[Pyra]

i'd like to hear any legitimate complaint anyone has about Kaiba being in Smash

 

[Galactic Gecko]

guys tbh garbodor has great moveset potential

 

[Idon]

i'd like to hear any legitimate complaint anyone has about Kaiba being in Smash

Here's one.
It's not Yugi.

 

[Bionichute]

Here's one.
It's not Yugi.

how exactly is that a complaint

 

[Noipoi]

i'd like to hear any legitimate complaint anyone has about Kaiba being in Smash

His dlc pack would cost too much.

 

[Pyra]

Here's one.
It's not Yugi.

Yugi's already in Jump Force tho. He's only human, he can only be in one place at a time.

 

[Galactic Gecko]

guys, do any of you have any ideas for a new jigglypuff final smash? i am writing a fanmade smash bros game and i have no idea what to replace Puff Up (a useless final smash) with. if anyone could give me ideas it would be much appreciated

 

[Noipoi]

guys, do any of you have any ideas for a new jigglypuff final smash? i am writing a fanmade smash bros game and i have no idea what to replace Puff Up (a useless final smash) with. if anyone could give me ideas it would be much appreciated

She sings her iconic song, causing every one to fall asleep. Angry that they're sleeping through her performance, she does a super version of rest. Causing a huge explosion.

 

[Idon]

guys, do any of you have any ideas for a new jigglypuff final smash? i am writing a fanmade smash bros game and i have no idea what to replace Puff Up (a useless final smash) with. if anyone could give me ideas it would be much appreciated

The fairy type z-move probably.

 

[Michele]

Has anyone realized that the CSS now have all the original 12 characters on the first row of the complete CSS character? Just like Brawl? (Of course, this is assuming the Echo Fighter is set to be displayed in one fighter and not separately, but still)

 

[Galactic Gecko]

She sings her iconic song, causing every one to fall asleep. Angry that they're sleeping through her performance, she does a super version of rest. Causing a huge explosion.

this is great! thanks!

 

[Bionichute]

I just got an update yesterday. Couldn’t this just be.... fresh?

actually that video is older than the update and is mostly just reiterating guesswork that we've already seen (no sylux spirit! rare stuff found in the code that's still genuinely weird!) and then some bizarre thing relating lloyd from tales to lloyd from earthbound in order to try and prove he'll get in

 

[Will]

Here's one.
It's not Yugi.

Here's another.
It's not the Chazz, an actual rival who beats the protagonist.

 

[fleshdude.gov]

Here's another.
It's not the Chazz, an actual rival who beats the protagonist.

Ah, yes, I too want the Ojama Trio's lackey in smash

Actually though, how exactly would you want Seto Kaiba to fight in terms of playstyle?

 

[Wademan94]

Since we’re on the topic, anyone interested in helping me out with some moveset ideas for Garchomp? (as part of Cynthia as a whole?) Moreso Garchomp’s standarad moves since I already have her special moves more or less figured out.

guys, do any of you have any ideas for a new jigglypuff final smash? i am writing a fanmade smash bros game and i have no idea what to replace Puff Up (a useless final smash) with. if anyone could give me ideas it would be much appreciated

How about Sparkly Swirl, Dazzling Gleam or Moonblast since it’s a Fairy Type?

 

[PLATINUM7]

Yugi's already in Jump Force tho. He's only human, he can only be in one place at a time.

As if Kaiba would bother competing in anything Yugi isn't.

 

[Will]

Ah, yes, I too want the Ojama Trio's lackey in smash

**** you man i play ojama ABC Dragons

 

[Deleted member]

i'd like to hear any legitimate complaint anyone has about Kaiba being in Smash

Literal pay to win character. I'm not talking about him being DLC, I mean that'd be, like, his gameplay gimmick

Here's one.
It's not Jaden.

Fixed

guys, do any of you have any ideas for a new jigglypuff final smash? i am writing a fanmade smash bros game and i have no idea what to replace Puff Up (a useless final smash) with. if anyone could give me ideas it would be much appreciated

Just clone Peach's FS, I still wonder why Jiggs doesn't have that.
EDIT:

Since we’re on the topic, anyone interested in helping me out with some moveset ideas for Garchomp? (as part of Cynthia as a whole?) Moreso Garchomp’s standarad moves since I already have her special moves more or less figured out.



How about Sparkly Swirl, Dazzling Gleam or Moonblast since it’s a Fairy Type?

Garchomp was my first Spirit so sure.
What are its Specials and what theme are you going for with it though?

 

[Will]

Fixed

you want me to play a depressed kid whose backstory is just bootleg yugi?

eh, i guess the music is nice enough

 

[Noipoi]

Since we’re on the topic, anyone interested in helping me out with some moveset ideas for Garchomp? (as part of Cynthia as a whole?) Moreso Garchomp’s standarad moves since I already have her special moves more or less figured out.

For neutrals you usually just take a notable part of the character and use it for attacks.

What are Garchomps notable features? It's arm blades, it's tail, it's shark like maw. You use those features for neutral attacks.

It's pummel could be biting the opponent in it's grasp. It's up air could be a flip, striking with it's tail. Dash attack? A swipe with both arms.

 

[T-Donor66]

Since we’re on the topic, anyone interested in helping me out with some moveset ideas for Garchomp? (as part of Cynthia as a whole?) Moreso Garchomp’s standarad moves since I already have her special moves more or less figured out.



How about Sparkly Swirl, Dazzling Gleam or Moonblast since it’s a Fairy Type?

Dont have too much time right now but his side B could be a dig attack that makes him swim through the stage with his fin sticking out, and when he mades contact with an enemy he emerges and slams his head upwards, koing at high percents and dealing massive shield damage.

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

call me when there's a loan shark pokemon

Come on, dude. Pokemon ain't ToonTown.

 

[Noipoi]

Come on, dude. Pokemon ain't ToonTown.

If executed well, it wouldn't be that bad an idea.

The trick is making it seem like the semi-natural behavior of a cartoon animal. Instead of literally being a shark out for money, it could be a shark that gives food to other Pokemon, and then hunts them down demanding even more food. If they don't pay up, it eats them. It's still rather silly, but it works.

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

If executed well, it wouldn't be that bad an idea.

The trick is making it seem like the semi-natural behavior of a cartoon animal. Instead of literally being a shark out for money, it could be a shark that gives food to other Pokemon, and then hunts them down demanding even more food. If they don't pay up, it eats them. It's still rather silly, but it works.

I know. I was making joke, lad.

 

[Bionichute]

If executed well, it wouldn't be that bad an idea.

The trick is making it seem like the semi-natural behavior of a cartoon animal. Instead of literally being a shark out for money, it could be a shark that gives food to other Pokemon, and then hunts them down demanding even more food. If they don't pay up, it eats them. It's still rather silly, but it works.

you could just have that be the personality of a single garchomp

 

[Icedragonadam]

I know I'm a little late on the Updated Information on Joker, but is it possible Joker was probably not intended to be 1st DLC character? Maybe he was actually either suppose to be the 3rd, 4th or last character revealed, considering the way his reveal was handled. It seemed like the 1st DLC character was going to be revealed much later(probably January), but Nintendo's decision shuffled the DLC development during when the VGAs were getting close.

 

[DarthEnderX]

i'd like to hear any legitimate complaint anyone has about Kaiba being in Smash

He's not a video game character?

The fairy type z-move probably.

Sadly, the Fairy Z-Move is kinda lame.