Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Luigi The President]

lol nope.

Mod Edit: Image removed

Post was clearly exaggerating
If you're gonna nitpick and single out Geno fans I'd be happy to find you some posts by the Piranha Plant Gang I myself am a part of mocking people who didn't get in, memeing or not. Because if you're willing to nitpick and focus solely on the bad apples like that, so am I.

Obviously OP up there is a ****ing moron though.

 

[Zinith]

Quick, give me a rundown on some reptile SE characters so I can support them!!!

Pakkun from Seiken Densetsu/Mana
Bub and Bob from Bubble Bobble
Barusa from King's Knight

That's all I got...

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

lol nope.

Mod Edit: Image removed

AAYY HE WANT LAYTO-
*sees his comment*
*turns head* You hear somethin? I dont hear anything

 

[SuperSceptile15]

There are people who hate Cloud? I may have never played a single Final Fantasy game in my life, but even I understand the significance of the character to the franchise itself as well as his influence on the opinion of Western gamers with regards to the RPG genre.

You'd be surprised. I've seen some people who would have rather gotten Terra or a Black Mage over Cloud. I don't know what they're thinking.

 

[Idon]

Not "at the same time", because nobody showed footage of Chrom beating up Chrom yet.

... And you'll think Sakurai would waste resources making another final smash for Robin purely in the fringe case that he's fighting Chrom?
You reaaaaally think that?

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Quick, give me a rundown on some reptile SE characters so I can support them!!!

Pakkun from Seiken Densetsu/Mana
Bub and Bob from Bubble Bobble
Barusa from King's Knight

That's all I got...

You forgot Gex...
Or is he an aphimbian?
Are geckos reptiles or amphibians?
I'm gonna sound so stupid if I'm wrong...

 

[ChronoBound]

Another excerpt from my comprehensive analysis of Ultimate's roster:

Focus of the Roster and Background of Newcomers:

The Ultimate roster had four major motifs running through it:

1. If you were ever a veteran in Smash Bros. you are back.
2. Characters with an incredibly important legacy within their own franchises or to Nintendo as a whole (Ridley, K. Rool, Simon Belmont).
3. Characters that represented characters or software that became extremely prominent after Smash 4’s release (Inkling, Isabelle, and Incineroar, the three I’s).
4. Characters that are both popular and important within their own franchises, but were too similar or popular/relevant enough to made into their own characters (the echoes – Daisy, Richter, Chrom, Dark Samus, Ken).

Despite there only being 11 newcomers for Ultimate, and nearly half of them being the cloniest type of clone fighters (echoes), this roster is being met with less vitriol and bitterness than the ones for Melee, Brawl, and Smash 4.

The biggest point I believe for this is the fact that no veterans were cut. With both Brawl and Smash 4, much of the anger was directed over who got left behind. After Brawl’s release, Mewtwo and Roy ended up being in the Top 10 most wanted characters for Smash 4 (Mewtwo outright in the Top 3). Much of the anger for Smash 4’s roster was again with cuts (Lucas, Wolf, Ice Climbers, and Snake to be specific). Wolf, Ice Climbers, and Snake ended up dominating the ballot and became among the Top 10 most wanted newcomers for the next installment.

With Ultimate, Sakurai made the impossible possible, he brought every single veteran. He made a cryptic comment saying that “we believe this is what the fans wanted”. Sakurai was likely aware much of the anger about Brawl and Smash 4 was about who was left behind as opposed to who did not make it in. I would not be surprised if even Pichu performed well on the ballot. The overwhelming performance for Wolf, Snake, and Ice Climbers on the ballot (as well as how overwhelmingly requested Mewtwo and Roy were during pre-Smash 4) were likely one of the main factors for why Sakurai decided against cuts for this time around.

With no one being left behind (indeed with everyone having been brought back), much of the anxiety that historically plagued the speculation scene since 2006 (whom would be cut), did not exist for the remainder of this speculation round since June. No one had to argue who had to be cut to make way for so-and-so’s character of choice. Everyone is here! That has a very nice ring to it.

The elimination of cuts has thus eliminated much of the historical animosity to the final roster (at least for what was seen with Brawl and Smash 4).

However, what about newcomers? There were only 11 of them this time, and of those 11, nearly half are even more cloney than Melee’s six clones were. The case for Ultimate very well could be for quality over quantity. Ridley and K. Rool were by far the biggest historical titans left not yet playable, Simon Belmont represented the one third-party franchise with the most history with Nintendo after Mega Man, and both Inkling and Isabelle were the two biggest Nintendo characters created during the 2010’s. Also, unlike several of Melee’s clones, the five echoes for Ultimate were all characters whom were popular within their own franchises.

There is also this to keep in mind. Brawl, Smash 4, and Ultimate all added 18 additional characters over the previous game. This is a very curious coincidence, but it shows that in terms of character additions, Ultimate not only is on par with previous games to the franchise, but also vastly exceeds it (since unlike Brawl and Smash 4, it kept all of Smash 4’s veterans).

Brawl:
1, Meta Knight
2. Pit
3. Zero Suit Samus
4. Wario
5. Snake
6. Ike
7. Squirtle
8. Ivysaur
9. Charizard
10. Diddy Kong
11. Lucas
12. Sonic
13. King Dedede
14. Olimar
15. Lucario
16. ROB
17. Toon Link
18. Wolf

Smash 4 (base roster):
1. Villager
2. Mega Man
3. Wii Fit Trainer
4. Rosalina & Luma
5. Little Mac
6. Greninja
7. Mii Brawler
8. Mii Swordfighter
9. Mii Gunner
10. Palutena
11. Pac-Man
12. Robin
13. Shulk
14. Bowser Jr.
15. Duck Hunt
16. Lucina
17. Dark Pit
18. Dr. Mario

Now with Ultimate:
1, Inkling
2. Ridley
3. Simon Belmont
4. King K. Rool
5. Isabelle
6. Incineroar
7. Daisy
8. Richter Belmont
9. Chrom
10. Dark Samus
11. Ken
12. Ice Climbers
13. Pichu
14. Young Link
15. Snake
16. Squirtle
17. Ivysaur
18. Wolf

It is a pretty spooky coincidence, but it shows that Ultimate is not poor in terms of character additions to the roster and is on par with what was added for both Brawl and Smash 4, as well as the fact that unlike those two titles, Ultimate kept all of the veterans from the previous title.

Unlike Smash 4, where only a few of the newcomers had a large amount of requests during the previous speculation period (Mega Man, Little Mac, Bowser Jr., and Villager), many of Ultimate’s newcomers were characters whom were popularly requested in previous epochs.

Ridley and K. Rool were absolute titans in terms of requests, especially on the Western side of things during pre-Smash 4 (and Ridley during pre-Brawl and even pre-Melee, K. Rool became a massively requested character after Diddy Kong’s confirmation in August 2007).

Dark Samus was similarly popularly requested during pre-Brawl (and apparently according to Sakurai she also did very well on the Western ballot), and Chrom was popularly requested during pre-Smash 4 (and as with Dark Samus, according to Sakurai he did very well on the ballot among Japanese fans). Daisy has always been a popular character.

The only character that you could say did not get in at all due to popularity this time around is probably Incineroar. Simon Belmont is the most recognizable and popular of the Belmont clan, and Richter is the next most popular after him (due to Symphony of the Night, and the re-releases/remixes of Rondo of Blood).

Indeed, the whole motif of Ultimate was a celebration of the entire Smash Bros. series up until this point. There are only four new stages for Ultimate, by far the least amount of the entire franchise (though the game has a whopping 103 stages altogether). Ridley and K. Rool were both characters who have been very heavily requested for over ten years, and it was fitting that both Chrom and Dark Samus were revealed together (both characters who seemed to have missed their chance forever when they failed to get into Smash 4 and Brawl respectively).

 

[Zinith]

You forgot Gex...
Or is he an aphimbian?
Are geckos reptiles or amphibians?
I'm gonna sound so stupid if I'm wrong...

Geckos are reptiles...

Also I forgot Gex was owned by Square Enix

 

[Electrick_EEL]

Can anybody link me the source where Hitagi said "no Fire Emblem"?

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I've seen some people who would have rather gotten Terra or a Black Mage over Cloud. I don't know what they're thinking.

I mean, I definitely don't dislike Cloud, not at all. But I have to admit, I would have rather gotten have Terra...

 

[Idon]

You'd be surprised. I've seen some people who would have rather gotten Terra or a Black Mage over Cloud. I don't know what they're thinking.

Terra Branford would be cool, you shut your mouth.

 

[Deleted member]

Here's a condensed version of what NSG usually weighs in about Sora, Luigi The President

I noticed that a lot of mentions I've gotten on my break was about my opinions on Sora's chances so I'm going to go ahead and point out why that probably is.

Sora is a miracle. A character that exists for the sole purpose of being the crossover character between Square's World of Final Fantasy and Disney's Magical Kingdom. He's a character that exists as the bridge between those two. As such both parties have a say so in where he goes. So, if we're going by the usual Square Copyright fiasco, that means they'll have to contact ALL of the copyright owners of Sora the design artist, the concept artist, Nomura, and Disney. Now that's where it comes to a head. Let's say they do get the approval for Sora's inclusion to all the owners sans Disney. They're on the right track but when Cloud was seemingly as big of a deal to get as he was, having all the right parties come together to make it happen, it's surprising that Sora would even make it that far.

But then, there is Disney. I've said this before. We're not talking about a little studio that can get things done. We're talking about the BIGGEST entertainment conglomerate in the world. This is a company that has multiple representatives from multiple aspiring companies today that come offering mega tons of money and percentages of their stock in the Hope's to even get a tiny licensing deal for their product. This is NOT something that Nintendo will do. Not only do they not need Disney characters to sell a product they're stock is also not at all worth giving up to a larger company. But this is something that Disney REQUIRES. If you're coming to ask Disney for something you better have something SUBSTANTIAL to give. Now you may say, what about Thanos in Fortnite? Well, that one is simple. Marvel is Marvel. Marvel is owned by Disney but Marvel still does it's own thing. On top of that, Marvel has never been an incredibly hard company to work with. A more reasonable people sit at Marvel than at Disney. What about Wreck-It Ralph in Sonic and All-stars Racing? Well, it's a lot easier to ask something from Disney if they are asking you for something first hence why Sega probably threw out the idea of Ralph in Sonic during negotiations. Disney was making a VG movie so they went to get VG characters, Sonic one of them. If the timing had been any different, if the movie wasnt coming out, if that game was coming out later, it wouldn't have happened. I've taken law and business classes since I started college as a back up in case my dream job of being a Director didn't work out. I can safely say that if Sora happens. If the stars align and Disney decides to drop their guard. If Square somehow gathers everyone to approve if this happening on top of that. It will be a business miracle. People don't realize that just because two people said they were ok with it means that he can happen without a hitch. No. It still has to go up the Disney Corporate Ladder and if it isn't making them a LOT of money, in their eyes, they're losing money. That's just how Disney is.

There IS a slim, SLIM possibility of Sora happening but if I'm being logical. Using my education. It doesn't seem all that feasible. Could it happen? Sure. Anything is possible. Probable? Not in the slightest.

 

[AugustusB]

We are within 3 weeks til the game releases! Time is truly flying by and I cannot wait to get to playing. Got the weekend off and just gonna get lost in the game.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Post was clearly exaggerating
If you're gonna nitpick and single out Geno fans I'd be happy to find you some posts by the Piranha Plant Gang I myself am a part of mocking people who didn't get in, memeing or not. Because if you're willing to nitpick and focus solely on the bad apples like that, so am I.

Obviously OP up there is a ****ing moron though.

I couldn't tell whether the OP was being sarcastic or not since sarcasm is hard to detect on the internet sometimes. It's true that every fandom has bad apples that spoil the bunch. I just love seeing ungrateful and entitled fans not getting what they want, though. I can't help it. Sakurai works so hard and people still find any reason they can to attack the man.

 

[Deleted member]

You forgot Gex...

****. I lied when I said Eight was my preferred Square character. It's this guy, no question.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Terra Branford would be cool, you shut your mouth.

No where near as cool as Cloud though.

 

[Luigi The President]

I couldn't tell whether the OP was being sarcastic or not since sarcasm is hard to detect on the internet sometimes. It's true that every fandom has bad apples that spoil the bunch.

Yeah, so don't single them out like that, right? It makes the whole fandom look bad; like I said, even the Piranha Plant gang has fellas like that.

 

[Idon]

No where near as cool as Cloud though.

Yeah you're right.
She's way cooler.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Yall are dumb we all know Cecil Harvey is the coolest FF Protagonist.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Im sure even layton fans have a few bad apples somewhere, but they are too busy crying to Unwound Future
That game gave me feels I didnt ask for

 

[Luigi The President]

Im sure even layton fans have a few bad applessomewhere, but they are too busy crying to Unwound Future
That game gave me feels I didnt ask for

Y'all seem pretty flawless actually

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Yeah, so don't single them out like that, right? It makes the whole fandom look bad; like I said, even the Piranha Plant gang has fellas like that.

Yeah. I should realize the whole fandom isn't like that. It really sucked seeing so many people hate on the plant just because it got in over other characters though. So what if it's "just a generic enemy"? It has a really unique moveset and is unlike any other fighter in the roster. I honestly like it more than any other newcomer in the game and am happy it got in over more obvious fan-requested characters. We already got K. Rool and Ridley, yet it seems like most fans are still ungrateful. Doing nothing but pander to fans is a bad idea anyways, because it limits the creativity of the developers.

 

[AugustusB]

Honestly, EVERY fan base has bad apples. So lets just leave it at that and not target particular ones, K?

Being civil is nice once in awhile...right?

Nah be evil!!! Muwhahahahahha

 

[Luigi The President]

Yeah. I should realize the whole fandom isn't like that. It really sucked seeing so many people hate on the plant just because it got in over other characters though. So what if it's "just a generic enemy"? It has a really unique moveset and is unlike any other fighter in the roster. I honestly like it more than any other newcomer in the game and am happy it got in over more obvious fan-requested characters. We already got K. Rool and Ridley, yet it seems like most fans are still ungrateful. Doing nothing but pander to fans is a bad idea anyways, because it limits the creativity of the developers.

To be honest I've barely seen any PP hate. You're preachin' to someone who plans on maining the guy haha

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Yeah you're right.
She's way cooler.

Sorry, but I respectfully disagree.

 

[Noipoi]

Honestly, EVERY fan base has bad apples. So lets just leave it at that and not target particular ones, K?

Being civil is nice once in awhile...right?

Nah be evil!!! Muwhahahahahha

NO!
EVERY SINGLE MUDDY MOLE FAN IS A GARBAGE HUMAN!!1!

 

[AugustusB]

NO!
EVERY SINGLE MUDDY MOLE FAN IS A GARBAGE HUMAN!!1!

Oh don't even get me started on the Met Fans!! /s

(Yes, the Mega Man enemy)

 

[Zinith]

Honestly, EVERY fan base has bad apples. So lets just leave it at that and not target particular ones, K?

Being civil is nice once in awhile...right?

Nah be evil!!! Muwhahahahahha

I learn from my role model

 

[Deleted member]

The FF characters for Smash tier list has always been this:
Celes
Cecil
Terra
Black Mage
Chocobo
A ****ing moogle
Cloud
Noctis or Squall theyre literally the same to me
Literal trash

I love Cloud but man, he really doesn't do anything to me as a character as I have actually played the SNES games.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Y'all seem pretty flawless actually

Thanks, We woke up like this

 

[KingofKoopas]

Oh don't even get me started on the Met Fans!! /s

(Yes, the Mega Man enemy)

you wanna take this outside? cuz ill go buddy i will

 

[Idon]

Cloud is pretty easily beat in "Cool Final Fantasy characters." Even in his own games, Sephiroth has style in spades.
Like, do you know what BARTZ can do?

Tell me this dumb anime bull**** isn't the hypest

 

[Graizen]

A interesting find...

Pokémon Pikachu, also known as Pocket Pikachu (ポケットピカチュウ) in Japan, is a series of portable Pokémon digital pets (similar to Tamagotchi) featuring the famous yellow electric-type Pokémon, Pikachu. Released on March 27, 1998, in Japan (November 2, 1998,[1] in North America),

Digimon Virtual Pet are toys devolpoed by Bandai, way back in 1997.

Funny.

 

[AugustusB]

So since we are getting a "Fighters Pass" I bet we will be getting other Passes. Like Spirit Pass 1 or Mii Costume Pass.

Thoughts?

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Opinions on this leak?
http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/439086053

I feel like the first comment on the thread sums up my thoughts pretty well.

"kys" is a bit extreme for my tastes, but it truly reflects my disdain towards people who make ****ty fake "leaks."

 

[Luigi The President]

A interesting find...

Pokémon Pikachu, also known as Pocket Pikachu (ポケットピカチュウ) in Japan, is a series of portable Pokémon digital pets (similar to Tamagotchi) featuring the famous yellow electric-type Pokémon, Pikachu. Released on March 27, 1998, in Japan (November 2, 1998,[1] in North America),

View attachment 177931

Digimon Virtual Pet are toys devolpoed by Bandai, way back in 1997.

View attachment 177932


Funny.

Is Pikachu gonna be in Ultimate? Oh ****

 

[Deleted member]

Is Pikachu gonna be in Ultimate? Oh ****

No way would The Pokemon Company allow that.

 

[Luigi The President]

I feel like the first comment on the thread sums up my thoughts pretty well.

"kys" is a bit extreme for my tastes, but it truly reflects my disdain towards people who make ****ty fake "leaks."

Yo TPC, my resident smart and Sora loving boy, you seen this? Wanted to hear your thoughts.

https://smashboards.com/threads/sma...ulation-begins.434391/page-7904#post-22715659

 

[SuperSceptile15]

To be honest I've barely seen any PP hate. You're preachin' to someone who plans on maining the guy haha

People HATED the plant when it was initially confirmed though and blamed it for their characters not getting in even though it's just a bonus for those who get the game early. Some of them even acted like Sakurai was personally insulting them even though he just wanted to test his creativity by coming up with a moveset for something so wacky and unconventional. Once again, people tend to be really offended when their most wanted characters don't make it in even though we already have so many.

 

[Knight Dude]

... And you'll think Sakurai would waste resources making another final smash for Robin purely in the fringe case that he's fighting Chrom?
You reaaaaally think that?

Yeah, if he's gonna make someone new for using the FS against Chrom, it would likely stay for every character no? Not unless you use Lucina when it's against Chrom, but what happens when both are out? Chances are, Chrom shows up regardless of who's fighting who.

NO!
EVERY SINGLE MUDDY MOLE FAN IS A GARBAGE HUMAN!!1!

Damn, that Opossum ! Will his villainy know no bounds?