Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[DeniroSerafim]

Go back in the thread and read through it yourself, come up with your own conclusions.

"The backgrounds been changed" = "Shulk is a photoshopped little mac"

Most of us have probably watched the video, literally that's what we've been going back and forth over for the last couple hundred pages.

So then why can't you make a counter point? Why would the leaks background be missing details that have been present up until now, that have no functional reason to be changed?

 

[AzureFlame4]

There are two kinds of people. The kind of people that look at the facts of how the leak came to be and the kind of people who look at Wario's missing eye imo.

Also, most of the stuff that guy is pointing out in the video proves the leak more real. Look at how the blue with Isabelle's popper is gone. The stuff he points out tends to be blue. The lighting and pixelation is very much so taking out the blues with this video. I guess the faker forgot to keep Isabelle's popper blue?

 

[Paperchampion23]

Some of the changes in the background are too significant to explain away with just that though. Besides, if pixelization is at fault, why aren't we seeing equally significant differences in the characters themselves then?

Ill say a possible, simple, logical reason.

The background is old. Before June old. You'd be surprised but many companies receive promotional material months before promotion ramps up. This company could have been printing smash art for months and we wouldn't know it. They could also have the current background and we wouldn't know.

I'm just saying, this is probably the ONE detractor for the whole leak, but only because none of us can logically explain why it's actually there, save for someone guessing like I am.

 

[zeldasmash]

This is turning into a court case that even court cases themselves would be "This is turning into a real mess". We are in serious need of Phoenix Wright right now.

 

[Kagrenac]

So then why can't you make a counter point? Why would the leaks background be missing details that have been present up until now, that have no functional reason to be changed?

In the latest wendy tour bus trailer, the background of the banner shown off was changed from the current one.

In addition to this. The background has changed a lot since E3

 

[Wiziliz]

can we standardize the leak name? I've heard Grinch leak, banner leak, mural leak, French leak, printing leak, and a few variations of those being thrown around. Let's just pick 1. My choice would be banner leak.

PapaGenos calls it the banner leak, I think that's a good title for everyone to use. But I'll keep referring to it as the Grinch leak, because that name's great. Those two are definitely the best titles, though.

 

[Ring-a-Sheep]

So then why can't you make a counter point? Why would the leaks background be missing details that have been present up until now, that have no functional reason to be changed?

Because we've been through this already, like i said go back in the thread and read it yourself.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Been more lurking than anything else lately. I’m personally disappointed for Sakurai that this leaked - he hates that and tried so hard...but then again if there were this many characters, why wasn’t there any reveal this month?

Based on the story about how this came up, I think it’s probably real. It does seem like way too much effort to do for the lulz, but does seem perfectly natural (if not horribly career-ending) that someone could do this. Digging through a blurry picture for minor changes seems inconclusive, and the statements from various people (including the company in question) seem more damage control than anything else.

I remember when ESRB came out. This really gives me that same gut feeling, and most of the arguments against it sound the same. Then again, I think several people got the ESRB stuff, which included videos...

I’m happy for those who did get a character they wanted. Can’t say that any of the leaked ones have much value to me personally, and the lack of Tails or any unique Zelda character is a bit disappointing, but hopefully we get a load of DLC as well. Still, Squirtle returning and Ridley and K. Rool joining are fantastic beyond reason.

 

[SoccerStar9001]

With potentially two Nintendo direct in November. Do you guys want a Smash focused direct first or last?
Also, WHY IS THERE STILL TWO WEEKS LEFT UNTIL NOVEMBER 7TH?!?!?!?! I AM SO BORED.

 

[Das Koopa]

On the subject of Mach Rider... There's this.
Warning: Slightly NSFW.
https://imgtc.com/i/Bg7Cys6.jpg

No one knows where this is from, but there's an official Nintendo trademark down below if you look carefully, so it's pretty much official. I think this confirms Mach Rider is indeed female?

Regardless, do you want him to be male or female in this game?

Female, for completely innocent reasons not at all related to getting similar fanart

 

[Untouch]

With potentially two Nintendo direct in November. Do you guys want a Smash focused direct first or last?
Also, WHY IS THERE STILL TWO WEEKS LEFT UNTIL NOVEMBER 7TH?!?!?!?! I AM SO BORED.

I'm going to die if we get 2 directs, but the Smash one is late November.

 

[zeldasmash]

Is it established Mach Rider is female? As in seriously established? I just to know for sure.

 

[Midget Master]

This is turning into a court case that even court cases themselves would be "This is turning into a real mess". We are in serious need of Phoenix Wright right now.

About five minutes after bringing him in here he'd be cross examining either the leaker's pet parrot or the Grinch's dog.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

This is turning into a court case that even court cases themselves would be "This is turning into a real mess". We are in serious need of Phoenix Wright right now.

Here, i'll post this... Just to make the thread feel more like a court...

 

[Deleted member]

PapaGenos calls it the banner leak, I think that's a good title for everyone to use. But I'll keep referring to it as the Grinch leak, because that name's great. Those two are definitely the best titles, though.

Grinch leak is the only acceptable name.

 

[Untouch]

In the latest wendy tour bus trailer, the background of the banner shown off was changed from the current one.

In addition to this. The background has changed a lot since E3

It has not changed.
The comparisons people are making are against the Isabelle banner.

 

[vottiking]

I don't understand why people are bothering to go through every little detail of the blurry mess of a wristband. Of course there will be discrepancies given it's from a pixelated snapchat video with bad lighting.

This is a bad argument because even if you record with a potato, it won't remove clouds and crystals in only some parts of the background--exactly those parts where a leaker missed information by not having the official background.

 

[DeniroSerafim]

In the latest wendy tour bus trailer, the background of the banner shown off was changed from the current one.

In addition to this. The background has changed a lot since E3

Yeah I saw a brief comparison of the Wendy Bus banner, and I'm still not convinced. Mega man for example was moved, obstructing crystals that were previously present. Yeah, that's a change, but that's not the same kind of change that the leak has. Parts of the background that had no reason to be changed are different and look worse now then they did before and there is no functional reason for it to be changed. That means the leaker probably made educated guesses and filled in the blanks that they thought were behind the characters.

 

[AzureFlame4]

I hate to bring this up, but blue black dress and white gold dress. Analyzing a bad photo isn't going to do anything. Colors get washed out which causes some things to get lost.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

On the subject of Mach Rider... There's this.
Warning: Slightly NSFW.
https://imgtc.com/i/Bg7Cys6.jpg

No one knows where this is from, but there's an official Nintendo trademark down below if you look carefully, so it's pretty much official. I think this confirms Mach Rider is indeed female?

Regardless, do you want him to be male or female in this game?

I want the female version, as she predates Samus by a year...
Though I'm scared to Google "Mach Rider" after she's revealed

 

[Paperchampion23]

So then why can't you make a counter point? Why would the leaks background be missing details that have been present up until now, that have no functional reason to be changed?

I could say the same thing about 30 points made for why people think it's real. People against it have not logically explained how this leak came into legitimate circulation if it was at all fake. The company and background is all real, and the leaker attempted to remove the only thing that allowed us to trace it back to where the pic was taken, and they failed.

Or are you telling me that someone masterfully created all of this hard work (creating new art, moving 40+ characters, creating new art for moved characters), decided to use their job to print it all, and purposefully failed to scrub out a name associated with the workplace, which allowed people to believe the leak even more after the fact?
That all of this was a massively intricate papertrail designed to let the internet catch the leaker?

Because that's some next level "thinking" right there and the alternative to it being simply real.

 

[Deleted member]

Is it established Mach Rider is female? As in seriously established? I just to know for sure.

Hard to say. There’s evidence for both sides, really. Mach Rider is whatever gender you want until it’s confirmed either way.

 

[IMainKingKRool]

I spent all of five minutes making this profile picture, I'm obligated to continue calling it the Grinch leak

 

[ZephyrZ]

There are two kinds of people. The kind of people that look at the facts of how the leak came to be and the kind of people who look at Wario's missing eye imo.

I'll have you know I was an ESRB leak believer, but okay, whatever. I'm one of "those people" I guess.

Ill say a possible, simple, logical reason.

The background is old. Before June old. You'd be surprised but many companies receive promotional material months before promotion ramps up. This company could have been printing smash art for months and we wouldn't know it. They could also have the current background and we wouldn't know.

I'm just saying, this is probably the ONE detractor for the whole leak, but only because none of us can logically explain why it's actually there, save for someone guessing like I am.

When you start having to come up with explanations like this is when I start finding even believable leaks really fishy.

And why are they sending unfinished background art to some outside company in the first place anyway?

I hate to bring this up, but blue black dress and white gold dress. Analyzing a bad photo isn't going to do anything. Colors get washed out which causes some things to get lost.

Or, you know, flip a crystal around so it's facing in the opposite direction somehow! This is exactly like that dress! /s

...Ah I'm starting to get cranky. That's probably I sign I should probably put down the computer and go to bed.

 

[Untouch]

It's clear that it isnt the same background, there's no arguing against that, any attempt looks like grasping and misdirection.
While I'm leaning towards #TeamFake, I don't think it 100% debunks the leak, they could have been given a new background for whatever reason.

 

[Blu99]

Reputable source has just told me that Ultimate is actually just a Brawl HD Remake

Sorry to disappoint you all

 

[Ring-a-Sheep]

Grinch leak is the only acceptable name.

Grinch is in and it would be a crime if we undersell his inclusion, so i agree Grinch leak is the only acceptable name

 

[Untouch]

Reputable source has just told me that Ultimate is actually just a Brawl HD Remake

Sorry to disappoint you all

Did he say that Incineroar is in though?

 

[TheAnvil]

Been more lurking than anything else lately. I’m personally disappointed for Sakurai that this leaked - he hates that and tried so hard...but then again if there were this many characters, why wasn’t there any reveal this month?

Based on the story about how this came up, I think it’s probably real. It does seem like way too much effort to do for the lulz, but does seem perfectly natural (if not horribly career-ending) that someone could do this. Digging through a blurry picture for minor changes seems inconclusive, and the statements from various people (including the company in question) seem more damage control than anything else.

I remember when ESRB came out. This really gives me that same gut feeling, and most of the arguments against it sound the same. Then again, I think several people got the ESRB stuff, which included videos...

I’m happy for those who did get a character they wanted. Can’t say that any of the leaked ones have much value to me personally, and the lack of Tails or any unique Zelda character is a bit disappointing, but hopefully we get a load of DLC as well. Still, Squirtle returning and Ridley and K. Rool joining are fantastic beyond reason.

I have absolutely no sympathy for anyone at Nintendo that it leaked.

Whoever's decision it was to sit on 7 characters by the time the game goes gold and doesn't reveal them in this day and age is asking for a leak.

 

[Deleted member]

Reputable source has just told me that Ultimate is actually just a Brawl HD Remake

Sorry to disappoint you all

Wouldn’t even be mad.

 

[osby]

Reputable source has just told me that Ultimate is actually just a Brawl HD Remake

Sorry to disappoint you all

Disappoint? It was about damn time!

 

[Nekoo]

Hard to say. There’s evidence for both sides, really. Mach Rider is whatever gender you want until it’s confirmed either way.

What If I want it to be a trap?

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I can take the leak is still alive

And yea I know the slight difference in the background help for team fake but it’s definately inconclusive due to lighting and blurryness and it does get slight changes as we progress threw the roster

 

[Zinith]

Reputable source has just told me that Ultimate is actually just a Brawl HD Remake

Sorry to disappoint you all

Only if they give my boi his parry back

 

[CosmicQuark]

Is the only thing he's comparing the background? Because we already went over it 1000 times already.

While I haven't been keeping up with "what's new on the background" front (the nitpicks are less substantial to read into it in depth)--I actually found Artsy Omni's video very informative and compelling. It's much easier to see what he's talking about, as he changed the perspective to make it as close to one-to-one as possible, and I feel like some of the criticisms (macro-details missing, particularly in places where a faker would have to use their judgement) compelling. That being said, I think that equally balances out other details (some macro-details would be easily seen by a faker, and yet so many micro-details are correct without anything substantial to make it conclusive). So, I still find the leak compelling, but not conclusive, and I don't find the nitpicks conclusive either.

What would have made the leak conclusive to me is if the leak contained macro-details that would have been hidden by characters and only known through looking at the E3 screen. Their absence isn't critical, but notable.

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

https://www.instagram.com/p/BoC5NmIB5OD/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=uym8r9j0yads Don’t know if this has been talked about yet, but doesn’t the waterfall behind daisy on this look more like the waterfall in the leak than the one we’re used to?

I'd like to remind everyone that the background may have changed between the E3 demo and now.

 

[Wiziliz]

I don't care for either race or gender, since that's never been set in stone.

But if more clues are starting to show that Mach's a she, then awesome!
I want her to be brash and fierce. But likeable too.

I want her/him to keep an 80s feel. I'll be heaps happy with however their personality turns out to be, though!

 

[CantGetRidOfTheRidley]

Since people are bringing up about some inconsistancies in crystals and clouds that can't be written off by a bad camera and compression, what about the other details that the leaker got right about the background? Other areas that were obscured by characters that are right in the leak? Did he just guess right there? I think it's more likely the background had revisions since it was first revealed. Art revisions happen all the time. I think the most likely theory is not all the character art was done yet so placements weren't finalized, and when they finished the latest newcomers and added them they decided to make tweaks to the background as well, possibly to help them better contrast. (For example, the waterfall looks a bit more detailed in one of the blank images and not when the characters are added)

Another potential theory is the background shown at E3 and the background given to promo-people aren't the same and aren't intended to be. Basically the inverse of above, they have the blank background and touched it up to make it look more appealing on its own.

 

[Burb]

There are two kinds of people. The kind of people that look at the facts of how the leak came to be and the kind of people who look at Wario's missing eye imo.

Or there's the people who ignore the issues with the leak because they want it to be real, and the people who aren't willing to overlook said problems just because it'd be a good outcome.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Maxoxpower]

after a good sleep.
the only thing in favor of a Golden sun item ( the sprout)
is that sakurai revelead all items previous direct
and keep the "items for new series one a la Death's Scythe
or assist trophy squid sisters for splatoon .
otherwise it's only a generic sprout one.
(but the bubble thing seems indicate that its a magic item)