Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

Link please?

Yeah, he was confirmed yesterday in a surprise Twitter reveal.

 

[Pyra]

All I'm saying it's a digital mock-up
View attachment 164452

M...missingno confirmed for Smash?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Since there's the whole other side. Isabelle might eventually fill in one of those spots next to K. Rool leaving to debate we might get three more characters then if the other side too has two empty spots. If I had to guess it'd be Ken, Incineroar and Geno.

 

[Nethermoosen]

Box Art Theory has these things against it for me so far:

-Consistency of logic when paired with Smashdown. "72 works with it! Nevermind that we're forgetting about Mii Fighters!"
-Consistency of logic when paired with Vergeben. ''He obviously knows of Square Rep because they are DLC! Not base roster! Obviously!"
- Not acknowledging that it's artwork that can be changed or modified at any given time and that most assuredly if Nintendo felt it'd spoil anything they'd simply have just made the sides of the box all black and left the characters off, etc, etc.
- Not acknowledging using 72 to promote the box art would be weird when the website already promotes the number 72. This already is confusion in promotion and gives the public multiple numbers of what to expect in game.

I mean it still could be right, but I feel like when you account for these things it's like trying to cram a puzzle piece into a part of the puzzle that doesn't fit.

I would say it’s less like the pieces don’t fit and more like people are taking two different puzzles and trying to fit them together.

The problem is there is the Box puzzle and then the Vergeben puzzle.

They really shouldn’t be crossed since they are two different subjects and Vergeben cannot be objectively proven to have accurate info(even if he does).

The Box Theory, at least, is based on official products. But, it’s missing pieces, and people are putting pieces in that DO fit, but they’re from completely different puzzles.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

View attachment 164449

You're basically saying you're afraid of how people will react to this roster? Saying it like this honestly puts it into perspective. Anyone who would genuinely complain about this has no sense of the value of what they're being given (seriously, the roster is already absurd and has been ever since E3).

On a side note, if this is the final roster and the layout, I really like how line up at the end. It just feels appropriate to me.

People are still going to moan, regardless of whether this is the final roster or not, because in the moment they always focus on what isn't there rather than what actually is. Once they sit down and take it in I think it'll blow over relatively quickly compared to Brawl and Smash 4, but there will definitely be a lot of negativity with the initial reaction, that's just how it goes when people have characters they're hoping for right until the very end.

 

[mynameisBlade]

Here you go:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

If there are 36 on each side...why did Nintendo purposely use the side with 2 empty spots for the picture? Seems intentional.. We have no clue what is left to be added. If they can jam 5 fighters into a single Smash Direct...then we are getting more than 2 in the final Direct guaranteed.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So then for all we know we could be getting three more characters. The other side could be two empty spots for all we know. I'd put my bets on Geno or Isaac.

I don't think you understood what I said but there being more empty spaces on the other side wouldn't add up because if you try fitting every confirmed character on the other side in the same pattern then only one space would be empty, which Ken would fill up if he's an echo

Wait...was Ken ever confirmed?

He's the only real lock because Vergeben has yet to be wrong about a single Smash thing and said Ken's in

 

[drag0nscythe]

If there are 36 on each side...why did Nintendo purposely used the side with 2 empty spots for the picture? Seems intentional.. We have no clue what is left to be added. If they can jam 5 fighters into a single Smash Direct...then we are getting more than 2 more in the final Direct guaranteed.

The major theory is that Ken being an Echo would have an awkward hole on the other side. Best to show the side with newcomers because hiding them is a given, and does not give out information.

 

[Pyra]

Yeah, he was confirmed yesterday in a surprise Twitter reveal.

My uncle is Twitter, can confirm.

If there are 36 on each side...why did Nintendo purposely used the side with 2 empty spots for the picture? Seems intentional.. We have no clue what is left to be added. If they can jam 5 fighters into a single Smash Direct...then we are getting more than 2 more in the final Direct guaranteed.

Well if we were to assume that the box theory holds weight, it'd be because either way the sides would have a blank spot, yeah? The blank spots on the side they show aren't directly implicit of anything other than there's a unique newcomer still to come, which is a safe bet anyone could have made anyway. On the other side, it would be implicit that someone there is getting an echo.

Not that I particularly feel some sort of way about it.

 

[Darkraid]

Supposedly on the other side of the box.

I feel like Crazy Hand is a semi-clone...

Its so weird tho that OG8+1 is on the right side of the box instead of the left. It is something that really irks me

 

[osby]

More than five pages under one hour?

You guys won't calm down, will you?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Well that's enough box talk from me now. We can probably agree though that among the last reveals will be Ken and Incineroar.

 

[Nethermoosen]

I think this is the only thing we can get out of the box for sure, even though lots of people will disagree.

Don't see why in a mock-up they would leave a space in the pattern on the other side, especially if they were just gunna fill the last row with blank spaces anyway.

Product accuracy.

 

[Pyra]

Its so weird tho that OG8+1 is on the right side of the box instead of the left. It is something that really irks me

Actually, wouldn't they be on the left? The right side is shown in the picture, yeah?

 

[Will]

More than five pages under one hour?

You guys won't calm down, will you?

You could say we're boxman.

man that's some old ass nostalgia

 

[dezeray112]

The box theory, as of right now, cannot be proven or disproven. There's not really much left to discuss about it.

Pretty much how I feel about the box situation. Best route forward now is to wait and see what the next three months will unravel.

 

[Iridium]

You could say we're boxman.

man that's some old *** nostalgia

And now I'm sad again. That was too good.

 

[T-Hell]

Holy **** you guys went aggressive over a ****ing box. I'm honestly not believing that, I don't believe there's just one echo left.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Product accuracy.

Legitimate question, I don't understand what you mean by that. They could just have stuck with the 9 pattern all the way down.

Unless you were agreeing and saying they intentionally left a space there then whoops.

 

[ChronoBound]

Honestly, with a 70+ character roster, I don't know what more do people want. The roster is already absolutely huge as is and if the currently known roster was the final, it would already be an insane roster. But we're getting more and potentially even more through DLC and other updates. I don't think anyone here is appreciating the magnitude of that.

After Smash 4's release, there were only three things people were upset about:
1. No Ridley
2. No K. Rool
3. The cuts (and lack of returnees)

If this is indeed the final base roster, we got every veteran ever to come back, as well as both Ridley and K. Rool. After Smash 4, I was very pessimistic on Ridley ever making it in. We got the two most highly requested newcomers during much of pre-Smash 4, Castlevania joining the fray (with a lot of content to boot), and not a single veteran being cut (with even the likes of Pichu and Young Link returning).

I bet if you went back in time four years ago, (when Smash 4 was first released) and told your past self that this would be the base roster for the next game and that it was causing outrage because "it was not enough", I bet most of your past selves would view the Smash Bros. fanbase of 2018 as being filled with the most petulant and spoiled babies of all gaming fandom.

Every veteran ever. Ridley. K. Rool. Castlevania. New icons like Inkling and Isabelle. And bones thrown to fanbases that did not lead the back (but were certainly there), Daisy, Chrom, and Dark Samus. Even Ken (assuming he is in) himself is an all-star especially for a franchise with as much clone characters as the Smash Bros. series. Sakurai did the best he could with only an allotment of 11 newcomers and only five truly unique newcomer slots, and yet created something very satisfactory.

There are no potential newcomers that had the level of support that K. Rool and Ridley did back during Smash 4 that did not end up making it in. The closest is maaaaaaybe Bandanna Dee and that is only on the Japanese side of things. Isaac is the closest one on the Western side, and even then he falls short of what Ridley, K. Rool, and Mewtwo were during pre-Smash 4 (both Ridley and K. Rool had support topic views into the MILLIONS).

Inkling and Isabelle covered things from the casual perspective (though Inkling certainly did have a ton of requests from core Smash Bros. fans), while Ridley and K. Rool were obviously the biggest (pun intended) guys left after Smash 4. Castlevania is the one third-party franchise that is as connected to the Nintendo brand of consoles as Mega Man is. Daisy, Chrom, Dark Samus, and Ken (assuming he is in) are delicious free desserts for many.

Even if there are only two more fighters, this is a fantastic base roster.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Holy **** you guys went aggressive over a ****ing box. I'm honestly not believing that, I don't believe there's just one echo left.

I can. I see so much money in DLC echos.
Give us the taste and then make us want more.

It will be like drugs. The first one is free, but then you have to pay up.

 

[DraginHikari]

Incineroar and Ken would be kind of like Isabelle for me frankly, an apathetic meh. Never really been a huge fan of most Pokemon entrees in the Smash Series. As for Ken, he's an obvious echo fighter since he kind was the original clone character but I don't know, just seems so basic.

If the whole thing is true then it will basically be that my excitement for the actual roster ended with K Rool announcement and will be waiting to see what else the game is offering beyond the roster itself.

 

[osby]

People are still going to moan, regardless of whether this is the final roster or not, because in the moment they always focus on what isn't there rather than what actually is. Once they sit down and take it in I think it'll blow over relatively quickly compared to Brawl and Smash 4, but there will definitely be a lot of negativity with the initial reaction, that's just how it goes when people have characters they're hoping for right until the very end.

Sit down and take it in? Smash fandom? That's a nice one, can I write it down?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

BTW too. Gonna throw in my two cents.

Dante/Geno/Isaac
Ken
Incineroar

That's my final bet. The Dante thing maybe true but at the same time might not be. I'll take that risk I guess.

 

[Darkraid]

Actually, wouldn't they be on the left? The right side is shown in the picture, yeah?

Ouch you're right.

My bad

 

[Dragoncharystary]

While I agree there will be a new pokemon rep, I can't believe everyone is so set in stone on it being Incineroar. Vergeben himself said he wasn't too confident in the validity of that claim. I still think the door is wide open when it comes to potential pokemon characters.

Just goes to show how much people are fools for Vergeben these days.

 

[Amtoj]

I just saw the box art theory. We shouldn't forget that the bundle comes out a month before the game itself. There's no reason every fighter has to be featured like with all the past promotional material released for this game. Nobody would care if the box art is missing someone at the game's launch.

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

I just want Rayman and Shadow. That's all I really want. Is that so much to ask, Sakurai? ;-;

 

[Nethermoosen]

Legitimate question, I don't understand what you mean by that. They could just have stuck with the 9 pattern all the way down.

Unless you were agreeing and saying they intentionally left a space there then whoops.

I’m not sure I understand what you’re saying, but I’ll elaborate for clarity, my good sir.

I’m saying they would follow the pattern that would include the possible echo on the other side because it most accurately represents the product people are preordering.

The art on the box should accurately reflect a product being purchased, even when they are not allowed to show certain pieces of it. They chose the side with the unique fighters because the echo placement on the other side is a dead giveaway of who it would be.

People can sue for stupid reasons because the box is a part of their purchase and if they don’t get more or less what they think they are paying for, people can be ***** and try to sue or cause issues.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I just want Rayman and Shadow. That's all I really want. Is that so much to ask, Sakurai? ;-;

That's where DLC is your saving grace. My only hopes for Banjo-Kazooie, Black Shadow and Medusa.

 

[Darkraid]

After Smash 4's release, there were only three things people were upset about:
1. No Ridley
2. No K. Rool
3. The cuts (and lack of returnees)

If this is indeed the final base roster, we got every veteran ever to come back, as well as both Ridley and K. Rool. After Smash 4, I was very pessimistic on Ridley ever making it in. We got the two most highly requested newcomers during much of pre-Smash 4, Castlevania joining the fray (with a lot of content to boot), and not a single veteran being cut (with even the likes of Pichu and Young Link returning).

I bet if you went back in time four years ago, (when Smash 4 was first released) and told your past self that this would be the base roster for the next game and that it was causing outrage because "it was not enough", I bet most of your past selves would view the Smash Bros. fanbase of 2018 as being filled with the most petulant and spoiled babies of all gaming fandom.

Every veteran ever. Ridley. K. Rool. Castlevania. New icons like Inkling and Isabelle. And bones thrown to fanbases that did not lead the back (but were certainly there), Daisy, Chrom, and Dark Samus. Even Ken (assuming he is in) himself is an all-star especially for a franchise with as much clone characters as the Smash Bros. series. Sakurai did the best he could with only an allotment of 11 newcomers and only five truly unique newcomer slots, and yet created something very satisfactory.

There are no potential newcomers that had the level of support that K. Rool and Ridley did back during Smash 4 that did not end up making it in. The closest is maaaaaaybe Bandanna Dee and that is only on the Japanese side of things. Isaac is the closest one on the Western side, and even then he falls short of what Ridley, K. Rool, and Mewtwo were during pre-Smash 4 (both Ridley and K. Rool had support topic views into the MILLIONS).

Inkling and Isabelle covered things from the casual perspective (though Inkling certainly did have a ton of requests from core Smash Bros. fans), while Ridley and K. Rool were obviously the biggest (pun intended) guys left after Smash 4. Castlevania is the one third-party franchise that is as connected to the Nintendo brand of consoles as Mega Man is. Daisy, Chrom, Dark Samus, and Ken (assuming he is in) are delicious free desserts for many.

Even if there are only two more fighters, this is a fantastic base roster.

Best post ever. Completely agree

 

[ThatOneAnon]

I can. I see so much money in DLC echos.
Give us the taste and then make us want more.

It will be like drugs. The first one is free, but then you have to pay up.

You're saying this as though them doing that would be a good thing and not them partaking in a horrendous business practice.

 

[Iridium]

If Lucario got Aura Storm back, it needs to extend this far:

Seriously though, it should.

 

[Spinosaurus]

If there are 36 on each side...why did Nintendo purposely used the side with 2 empty spots for the picture? Seems intentional.. We have no clue what is left to be added. If they can jam 5 fighters into a single Smash Direct...then we are getting more than 2 more in the final Direct guaranteed.

The other side has Ken, who is harder to hide. (a blank next to Ryu would be uh, obvious)

 

[drag0nscythe]

After Smash 4's release, there were only three things people were upset about:
1. No Ridley
2. No K. Rool
3. The cuts (and lack of returnees)

If this is indeed the final base roster, we got every veteran ever to come back, as well as both Ridley and K. Rool. After Smash 4, I was very pessimistic on Ridley ever making it in. We got the two most highly requested newcomers during much of pre-Smash 4, Castlevania joining the fray (with a lot of content to boot), and not a single veteran being cut (with even the likes of Pichu and Young Link returning).

I bet if you went back in time four years ago, (when Smash 4 was first released) and told your past self that this would be the base roster for the next game and that it was causing outrage because "it was not enough", I bet most of your past selves would view the Smash Bros. fanbase of 2018 as being filled with the most petulant and spoiled babies of all gaming fandom.

Every veteran ever. Ridley. K. Rool. Castlevania. New icons like Inkling and Isabelle. And bones thrown to fanbases that did not lead the back (but were certainly there), Daisy, Chrom, and Dark Samus. Even Ken (assuming he is in) himself is an all-star especially for a franchise with as much clone characters as the Smash Bros. series. Sakurai did the best he could with only an allotment of 11 newcomers and only five truly unique newcomer slots, and yet created something very satisfactory.

There are no potential newcomers that had the level of support that K. Rool and Ridley did back during Smash 4 that did not end up making it in. The closest is maaaaaaybe Bandanna Dee and that is only on the Japanese side of things. Isaac is the closest one on the Western side, and even then he falls short of what Ridley, K. Rool, and Mewtwo were during pre-Smash 4 (both Ridley and K. Rool had support topic views into the MILLIONS).

Inkling and Isabelle covered things from the casual perspective (though Inkling certainly did have a ton of requests from core Smash Bros. fans), while Ridley and K. Rool were obviously the biggest (pun intended) guys left after Smash 4. Castlevania is the one third-party franchise that is as connected to the Nintendo brand of consoles as Mega Man is. Daisy, Chrom, Dark Samus, and Ken (assuming he is in) are delicious free desserts for many.

Even if there are only two more fighters, this is a fantastic base roster.

Agreed. Like I always say, I have no reason to complain. i have ridley. That day, E3 was the day I forfeited the right to be angry about the roster size. He was the one I mainly wanted. I have him. Everything else is more cheese on my complete pizza.

72 is astounding and with DLC a very real option, we are truely set.
---
I was upset for Isabelle being the next newcomer because I really wanted to see Bandana Dee, but she has so much charm. I like her more every time I watch her in action. I think people need to understand not every character is going to be Ridley/K rool heights of awesome. Isabelle is a perfect addition and is just to darn cute.

 

[Deleted member]

I just saw the box art theory. We shouldn't forget that the bundle comes out a month before the game itself. There's no reason every fighter has to be featured like with all the past promotional material released for this game. Nobody would care if the box art is missing someone at the game's launch.

Isn't "The Box" the box for the special edition and not the console bundle?

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I just saw the box art theory. We shouldn't forget that the bundle comes out a month before the game itself. There's no reason every fighter has to be featured like with all the past promotional material released for this game. Nobody would care if the box art is missing someone at the game's launch.

The Switch dock comes out in November, the Steel Book collection comes out on December 7th

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I’m not sure I understand what you’re saying, but I’ll elaborate for clarity, my good sir.

I’m saying they would follow the pattern that would include the possible echo on the other side because it most accurately represents the product people are preordering.

The art on the box should accurately reflect a product being purchased, even when they are not allowed to show certain pieces of it. They chose the side with the unique fighters because the echo placement on the other side is a dead giveaway of who it would be.

People can sue for stupid reasons because the box is a part of their purchase and if they don’t get more or less what they think they are paying for, people can be ***** and try to sue or cause issues.

I think we are more or less saying the same thing, you with some more healthy skepticism.

I definitely think there is an echo in those 8 characters, and while I speculate Ken, there's no 100% guarantee.

 

[ThatOneAnon]

BTW too. Gonna throw in my two cents.

Dante/Geno/Isaac
Ken
Incineroar

That's my final bet. The Dante thing maybe true but at the same time might not be. I'll take that risk I guess.

I'm going to laugh so ****ing hard if (let's be honest here, WHEN) Dante gets in. I remember Matt Walker saying he wasn't in and everyone just taking that as "welp, he's deconfirmed" and I can imagine the salt that would come from people who didn't want him.
It'd be like how I felt about Bayonetta getting into Sm4sh all over again, except this time with less of a chance of me regretting him ever getting in the game because he ends up being super OP.
I know I sound like kind of an asshole when I say this, but I can't help but take some sort of sadistic glee in seeing a character I want get confirmed and characters other people want get deconfirmed.

 

[Murlough]

While I agree there will be a new pokemon rep, I can't believe everyone is so set in stone on it being Incineroar. Vergeben himself said he wasn't too confident in the validity of that claim. I still think the door is wide open when it comes to potential characters.

Just goes to show how much people are fools for Vergeben these days.

I wouldn't call us fools considering he's been right every single time so far. I just want Incineroar over the rest at this point. There are other newcomers who have potential but I like what he could add more. (If I'm being honest though, I'd sacrifice every other newcomer for just a Pikachu-Echo of Mimikyu if I had the option. )

I don't 100% believe Verg either, but once again, he kinda hasn't gotten anything wrong yet...at this point I'd say actively disbelieving everything he says just because he said it is foolish.

On a side note: me and my roommate have been playing Minecraft a ton out of the blue. I still don't want Steve in this game.