Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Deleted member]

Charizard doesn't have Rock Smash anymore cause it'll be Feraligatr's, its Echo Fighter, Side B
Remember, you heard it here first folks.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Err

Anybody got a character that starts with Z?

Zero, Zangief, Zack (Dead or Alive).............. toon Zelda?

 

[Abha]

Err

Anybody got a character that starts with Z?

Here we are
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ctf-LYaVpBg

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Err

Anybody got a character that starts with Z?

Zeraora?

 

[andres22]

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/431265882

this is real?

 

[Nethermoosen]

How toxic is the internet where saying your full name is equivalent to ALL OF THOSE? Jesus Christ!!!

Maybe it’s just witchcraft.

Spoiler

[SPOILER/]

 

[Zinith]

People mocking the fact that I used my real name on this site when I never even attempted to hide it

 

[Shroob]

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/431265882

this is real?

How should we know? You'd have to ask Loz himself.

 

[MBRedboy31]

Hmm, what if Flare Blitz could be aimed downward, similar to how After Burner Kick can be aimed downward? Then you could use it to call out an opponent’s anti-air, sorta like how you could use Rock Smash as a landing option. It’d be more risky of course and it overall would be more situational, but it would be an interesting mixup (and potentially a destructive yet ultra risky edgeguard option too ahaha)

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/431265882

¿esto es real?

nmms wey, ¿como voy saber?

 

[Capybara Gaming]

All I can do when watching Inkling matches is yell at my screen fruitlessly

"REFILL YOUR FREAKING INK!"

And then they do in the last three seconds before getting KO'd after a dozen moves didn't work out for them and instead of doing it in a safe position while the enemy is offstage they do it right in front of them. It legitimately pisses me off.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Rock Smash is a laggy, heavy commitment move that doesn't change Zard's positioning and isn't safe on shield in the slightest. It's not comparable to Diddy's fantastic Monkey Flip in the slightest. The only times it's safe is on a hard read where you know your opponent is going to go for an attack. It had it's uses, but if you used it as your main way of getting out of juggles against a halfway competent player, you're going to get punished for it constantly.

Monkey Flip was brought up as an example of how even with such an amazing move there's nothing you can rely on constantly to get out of disadvantage, so saying it's a "mixup" is meaningless. As for Rock Smash, it was a move that has frame 5 super armor and produced a huge disjointed hitbox with projectiles, it was essentially a counter that didn't require your opponent to actually hit you to activate and couldn't just wait around to punish it, while providing a high knockback hit at high damages or potentially a very high damage hit at low damages, making it quite the risk for the opponent to get hit by. If spammed of course you're going to get punished hard, but it certainly allows you to break combos and get out of juggle situations where Zard would have been helpless or left to do an even riskier Fly, while with Rock Smash's existence even without being used it forces your opponent to give Charizard some respect in disadvantage and not just rush him blindly like they can do to DK, adding at least some sort of obstacle to reading Zard to extend their advantage.

 

[osby]

Hmm, what if Flare Blitz could be aimed downward, similar to how After Burner Kick can be aimed downward? Then you could use it to call out an opponent’s anti-air, sorta like how you could use Rock Smash as a landing option. It’d be more risky of course and it overall would be more situational, but it would be an interesting mixup (and potentially a destructive yet ultra risky edgeguard option too ahaha)

If you are going to use it strategically, why are you even using Flare Blitz at all?

 

[Nethermoosen]

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/431265882

this is real?

loz18 Is this real? Lol

 

[Idon]

They're not though, just switch back to the character you're best with or take the time to master all 3.

Switching out is much more flexible and useful than rock smash ever was and would be if it made a return. It's on the players if They don't maximise on the switching out mechanics potential and yes that would involve taking the time to master all 3 Pokemon.

That's the thing, you don't get.

I don't want to have 3 tools, but only have one of which I actually like. And I don't like that my favorite tool is inferior to my other 2 tools, and that the optimal way to use them is to rely on using the tool I don't like more than any of my other tools and only rarely switching to the others on occassion. I'd much rather not use the other 2 tools AT ALL and have the tool I actually LIKE be improved.

Saying that switching into an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT CHARACTER makes Charizard better is like saying Zelda isn't bad in Melee because you could just press down+B and instantly become a better character. That entirely misses the point of playing the character you like.

It's purely personal taste.

 

[SirCamp]

Err

Anybody got a character that starts with Z?

Wasn't the main character of the last story named Zael or something?

 

[ZephyrZ]

All I can do when watching Inkling matches is yell at my screen fruitlessly

"REFILL YOUR FREAKING INK!"

And then they do in the last three seconds before getting KO'd after a dozen moves didn't work out for them and instead of doing it in a safe position while the enemy is offstage they do it right in front of them. It legitimately pisses me off.

It's hilarious watching a Pokemon Trainer match where someone uses an extremely competent Squirtle, switches to Charizard for the kill, and then throws out an extremely dangerous Flare Blitz and dies.

Charizard has Fair, Bair, Uair, U-Smash, and U-throw as solid kills moves and you opt for a random unsafe Flare Blitz? If I was watching incompetent For Glory scrubs do this it'd be one thing but these are actually competent players who seem to have some clue what they're doing with Squirt.

I wonder how many people are going to declair Zard bad again without ever learning how to actually play him first.

 

[Shroob]

loz18 Is this real? Lol

Let's be honest.

He ain't coming back.


He dropped in to say "Lower your expectations" all mysterious-like and got the hell out of dodge.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

If you are going to use it strategically, why are you even using Flare Blitz at all?

To **** on 6 people simultaneously in a single match to make them go "**** IS SHE AIMING AT ME?"

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

All I can do when watching Inkling matches is yell at my screen fruitlessly

"REFILL YOUR FREAKING INK!"

And then they do in the last three seconds before getting KO'd after a dozen moves didn't work out for them and instead of doing it in a safe position while the enemy is offstage they do it right in front of them. It legitimately pisses me off.

I managed to find one match where the player was smart enough to do that apparently.

However, my theory why we don't see peeps refilling ink is because they just don't know how - since if they're just casual fans or just missed the Direct entirely, they might not know the button inputs to do a refill.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Wasn't the main character of the last story named Zael or something?

Yeah it was Zael, not entirely sure how his “hey everyone attack me” gimmick would even work in smash.

Not that he has any chance mind you.

 

[Fenriraga]

Don't take a Discord text wall as anything other than fake unless it's posted by Loz himself or can be backed up by someone else.

It's literally as easy to make as a fake tweet.

 

[perfectchaos83]

I'm still ****ing confused on just how much stuff was skipped by the blog.

I was under the assumption that we were missing:


134-The Blog has been updated
135-Newcomer reveal trailer
136-Newcomer gameplay snippet
137-Character Memories


But now I'm hearing we missed an entire goddamn WEEK of blogposts?


Like, are we actually getting several Echo fighters now as well?

Looks like someone on GFAQs did some compiling

https://pastebin.com/G5fg5dRs

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76993099

Pretty interesting stuff.

 

[SirCamp]

As for this first initial character choice, I'm finding J kind of hard for some reason. I feel like I'm probably missing an obvious choice, but I guess I'll go with either Jack Frost from SMT or Jack from the original Harvest Moon games. This game needs a Jack. =D

 

[Nethermoosen]

Let's be honest.

He ain't coming back.


He dropped in to say "Lower your expectations" all mysterious-like and got the hell out of dodge.

It was an attempt at irony more than anything.

 

[Shroob]

Looks like someone on GFAQs did some compiling

https://pastebin.com/G5fg5dRs

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76993099

Pretty interesting stuff.

Yeah, now that I see this, I'm not feeling the whole 'skipped a week' thing that people are saying.

It looks like they moved Pikmin up in advance to replace whatever song we were getting, but that's about it.

 

[SirCamp]

Yeah it was Zael, not entirely sure how his “hey everyone attack me” gimmick would even work in smash.

Not that he has any chance mind you.

TBH I've never actually played the game, so I had no idea that was a thing. I just knew I'd heard his name on these boards at some point.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Don't take a Discord text wall as anything other than fake unless it's posted by Loz himself or can be backed up by someone else.

It's literally as easy to make as a fake tweet.

Nah, a fake tweet would need some minor editting, a fake discord post doesn't even need that

 

[Jedisupersonic]

It was an attempt at irony more than anything.

More like an attempt to squeeze attention where he could, and it seems to be working since we’re still talking about him.

 

[Nethermoosen]

More like an attempt to squeeze attention where he could, and it seems to be working since we’re still talking about him.

I meant me asking him as if he’d be likely to bother.

 

[SirCamp]

More like an attempt to squeeze attention where he could, and it seems to be working since we’re still talking about him.

He's referring to his post tagging Loz, not Loz's post on this board I think.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

I meant me asking him as if he’d be likely to bother.

Oh oops, I misread you!

 

[MBRedboy31]

If you are going to use it strategically, why are you even using Flare Blitz at all?

Because it’s in Zard’s moveset already and I’m suggesting it be given more flexibility to make up for the lack of a fourth special move?
Also, if we just gave Zard Rock Smash back, we’d miss the crazy Flare Blitz reads / edgeguards / string enders.

 

[Jeck]

Question: Where will all the freakin' custom moves go?

If someone said they weren't reusing any characters from Smash 4, we'd all say it was stupid and unrealistic. If someone said the same thing about all the custom moves... well that's still a decent chunk of each character's development time out the window.

I think we might get custom moves come back but they'll be used on either echoes or new characters. Nairo has some great, compact showcase vids you can check out if you snoozed on them like most people. (Custom moves were implemented really stupidly, I don't blame anybody for skipping them.)

Ness only picture it's Ninten.
Olimar except it's literally any rock Pikmin user.
Mega Man any version of him you prefer, especially with his recovery options.

 

[WaxPython]

'd much rather not use the other 2 tools AT ALL and have the tool I actually LIKE be improved.

Saying that switching into an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT CHARACTER makes Charizard better is like saying Zelda isn't bad in Melee because you could just press down+B and instantly become a better character. That entirely misses the point.

He has been improved with the mechanic changes.

End of the day Charizard players can still play Charizard

 

[Nethermoosen]

Question: Where will all the freakin' custom moves go?

If someone said they weren't reusing any characters from Smash 4, we'd all say it was stupid and unrealistic. If someone said the same thing about all the custom moves... well that's still a decent chunk of each character's development time out the window.

I think we might get custom moves come back but they'll be used on either echoes or new characters. Nairo has some great, compact showcase vids you can check out if you snoozed on them like most people. (Custom moves were implemented really stupidly, I don't blame anybody for skipping them.)

Ness only picture it's Ninten.
Olimar except it's literally any rock Pikmin user.
Mega Man any version of him you prefer, especially with his recovery options.

It would be cool to see Echoes with changes as big as some of these on specials.

 

[SirCamp]

Okay now that the idea's in my head, I can't help but really want Jack from Harvest Moon in this game. I can't believe I hadn't thought about this before. Granted it will never happen, especially with all the legal drama about the name. But geez it would be sweet. Now I need to go replay Harvest Moon 64

 

[WaxPython]

Because it’s in Zard’s moveset already and I’m suggesting it be given more flexibility to make up for the lack of a fourth special move?
Also, if we just gave Zard Rock Smash back, we’d miss the crazy Flare Blitz reads / edgeguards / string enders.

Switching out makes up for the lack of ancient special move. having 3 Pokemon to adapt to any situation is a huge huge plus

 

[ZephyrZ]

Monkey Flip was brought up as an example of how even with such an amazing move there's nothing you can rely on constantly to get out of disadvantage, so saying it's a "mixup" is meaningless. As for Rock Smash, it was a move that has frame 5 super armor and produced a huge disjointed hitbox with projectiles, it was essentially a counter that didn't require your opponent to actually hit you to activate and couldn't just wait around to punish it, while providing a high knockback hit at high damages or potentially a very high damage hit at low damages, making it quite the risk for the opponent to get hit by. If spammed of course you're going to get punished hard, but it certainly allows you to break combos and get out of juggle situations where Zard would have been helpless or left to do an even riskier Fly, while with Rock Smash's existence even without being used it forces your opponent to give Charizard some respect in disadvantage and not just rush him blindly like they can do to DK, adding at least some sort of obstacle to reading Zard to extend their advantage.

It's not spamming Rock Smash that's risky though, it's using that move in the first place. It's makes Charizard's awful disadvantage state only slightly less worse by giving him one occasionally useful option, especially if you're fighting against a patient player. Every time you use that move you're taking a huge risk. Even if you really don't want to learn Squirtle for some reason, switching to him and then looking for an opening to switch back to Zard still seems way more practical to me.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So far. The rest is us assuming that what we’ve seen is what we get. But Chrom happened and now that changed to allow at least one move be derived from another character.

What about the next echo? Will that one also surprise us? What if an echo is exactly like one character, but all their specials come from other characters? You could call that an echo, but you won’t until Sakurai does.

A character with the same overall bodyshape and a move that works nearly identically otherwise. We don't know how much it means. Could it mean they can rerig a move from another character if they already share a bodyshape? Does it mean we could see a tiny select few unique moves(like we had with Dark Pit's Final Smash being a retool of Zelda/Sheik's)? Right now, this doesn't really suggest an Echo can have super unique moves. It just means they can take from another source if they also share the same body type. It's more or less meaningless when it comes to helping determine how unique one can be.