Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[StupendousMike]

Other M did incredible damage to the Metroid franchise. It's fine to like it but it can't be denied it put the Metroid series into hibernation.

What really did damage to the Metroid franchise was the internet's lengthy, overwrought reaction to the game. It was crucified on the level of actual disasters like Sonic 06 when it's biggest sins were being a solid if unremarkable action game that botched some of its presentation elements.

 

[staindgrey]

Other M did incredible damage to the Metroid franchise. It's fine to like it but it can't be denied it put the Metroid series into hibernation.

I'm not entirely positive that Other M's disappointing sales put Metroid on the back burner on its own. Something to remember is that Other M had already been given over to Team Ninja to produce, meaning that Nintendo was willing to test the waters of outsourcing one of its most popular IPs, in much the same way they had with Star Fox Assault before that franchise also went into hibernation, or F-Zero GX before it did.

Other M wasn't so much a test of Metroid, but a test of Team Ninja's Metroid. And since it underwhelmed, any sort of followup was nixed. But Nintendo had already been willing to give up its development to a third party, so it's not like they were itching to make one themselves. Even Samus Returns had to be pitched by a Spanish developer before Nintendo said, "Okay, fine."

In short, I think if Other M had sold well, we just would've gotten Another M on Wii U. And I kind of prefer how history turned out.

 

[DarkFalcon]

Says DarkFalcon as Federation Force and Samus Returns suddenly stop existing and there's a new Mandela effect worldwide
wait then that means AM2R would still be up wouldnt it?

Yep, Federation Force. No new Metroid game in 6 years and that was the next new title. I heard it's not that bad but the timing of it was horrendous. It's not what people wanted after Other M.

Just because a wait isn't 10+ years it doesn't mean it's not a long time. Do you know how soul crushing it was year after year hearing nothing about Metroid? Stuck with Other M being the last major title in the franchise? It was hell.

 

[KMDP]

My god, you're right...

Speaking of that game...

If it wasn't obvious enough, I've been on a bit of a TFS binge lately...

Just in time for Episode 60!

 

[Knight Dude]

Maybe they'll just make a sequel to punch out? next level games haven't done anything since federation force anyway

Either that or luigi's mansion 3 I guess, or both

That'd be really cool, though I kind of doubt if that'll happen. Punch-Out seems like the kind of series that only has a new game every once in a while.

 

[Will]

but I wonder how they'll put any DS games on the Switch.

We're waiting to find out.

 

[ReeseBalaski]

Fire Emblem Let's Go Marth and Let's Go Roy.

 

[BlondeLombax]

Just in time for Episode 60!

I only just now got to the Frieza saga. If I keep this up, I might just have to watch the actual show.

Not that it'd sway me towards Goku's inclusion, of course...

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

That'd be really cool, though I kind of doubt if that'll happen. Punch-Out seems like the kind of series that only has a new game every once in a while.

It has been nearly 10 years since wii came out, and little mac has his newfound smash popularity, it'd make sense to capitalize on that

 

[Noipoi]

Instead of Pokemon Let's Go, when are they gonna make Fire Emblem Let's Go where the gameplay is watered down but the graphics look amazing.

But who'd be the characters on the box?
Fire Emblem Let's Go Lucina? Let's Go Camilla? Let's Go Henry?

 

[ZephyrZ]

Well rather then games I beat, here's games I did full completion on.


I've got a full living Gen 7 national dex, minus a few mythicals.
I cleared all the challenge boards in Kid Icarus: Uprising and beat boss battle mode on its highest difficulty.
I beat Conquest Lunatic without any DLC or online assistance. I also did a hard mode iron man.
I've got 200% completion on Tropical Freeze. I don't think I've every played a platformer as much as I have that one. Sorry Mario.
I cleared all the shrines in BotW. You're crazy if you think I went for the Korok seeds though. And well, I didn't complete the DLC either, and I never finished its Master Mode because I personally thought it was poorly implemented.


I'm not really a competitionist, so this goes to show how much I really love those games (well, love-hate in Conquest's case).

 

[Misery Brick]

The MvC/DBFZ and Pokemon team analogy doesn't work, as you're restricted to 1v1 combat with no assisting. That super-overlevelled Charizard you're fighting? You're not using a whole team to take it down, you're fighting it 1v1 while your team shares a lifebar.

Well, that's exactly how Pokémon is. You're still in a 1v1 setting, and if your single Charizard is your only strong suit while the rest of your team isn't on the same level to help balance out your matchups, you're still going to get steamrolled once he's down, especially against someone who has better matchups against you. Like I said, you can try to power through against a team, and it might work, but you're at a bigger detriment than having a well composed team.
Same with old Marvel games like MvC (Outside of having limited assists), XvSF, and even Marvel Infinite outside of Soul Stone, once your best character got blown back and you weren't up to par with your secondary, you're still going to lose that match. And that can be equated to stocks, as using your weaker character against someone who's more skilled with their selection will cause you to lose one immediately.
Also, you have to remember health management factors into Smash, especially with PT, alongside being vitally important in Marvel games. Despite showing two separate health bars, it's practically one as you need to keep synergy between your team and have your options open.

My point is with using a singular Pokémon is more of a detriment than going in and learning how to use all three and the timing in which to use them. That's why so many people will drop , only because they want to individually use one of the three and it may not work out for them.
I just said people used to team fighters would probably be more accustomed to the idea of learning all three and the advantages and disadvantages that come with them and composing a strategy around them, rather than relying on 1/3 of the unit.
I feel like there was a slight misunderstanding, maybe it was the way I worded it, but that was the point I was trying to get across.
But I agreed with your original point, just wanted to elaborate that some may be successful with the character moreso than others.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I'm still waiting on that next Pikmin game.

The wait and lack of news hasn't been as bad as it was for Pikmin 3 quite yet, but I'll be darned if it isn't shaping up to be.

 

[Starbound]

Seeing the "downloadable Gamecube" comment really makes me wish we could go further into the Classics line.

The N64 lineup would be pretty weird if they couldn't get licenses for Rare's games (Banjo, Conker, Tooie and the first Diddy Racing are console staples), but you could probably still make it work with a narrower lineup:

1. Super Smash Bros
2. Mario Kart 64
3. Super Mario 64
4. Paper Mario
5. Mario Party 3
6. Zelda: Ocarina of Time
7. Zelda: Majora's Mask
8. Yoshi's Story
9. Donkey Kong 64
10. Kirby 64: Crystal Shards
11. Star Fox 64
12. F-Zero X
13. Pokemon Snap
14. Wave Race 64
15. 1080 Snowboarding
16. Sin and Punishment
17. Excitebike 64
18. Ogre Battle 64
19. Harvest Moon 64
20. Bomberman 64

(Just went off of the list of 64 games on Virtual Console). As the bonus, akin to StarFox 2, I think it'd be cool if we got actual footage from Earthbound 64.

GameCube classic would be a lot harder to pare down, but the essentials are, imo:

• Super Smash Bros. Melee
• Zelda: Wind Waker
• Super Mario Sunshine
• Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance
• Pikmin
• Animal Crossing
• Mario Kart: Double Dash
• Kirby Air Ride
• Metroid Prime
• Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door
• Pokemon XD: Gale of Darkness
• Ribbit King

 

[staindgrey]

Same, because "played" could mean anything. Could just mean that you picked up the game this character comes from, ****** around for an hour or two, and then never touched it again.

Yeah, that's what I was getting at.

I've played two of Snake's games. Didn't like them or come close to finishing them. I've played Little Mac's game to do some multiplayer then never touched it again. I've played Greninja's game but honestly don't even remember how long I lasted in it.

Being a nerd surrounded by lots of other nerds, I have a tendency to try anything when a controller is handed to me. But the list of things I fell in love with is much shorter.

 

[Noipoi]

I've got a full living Gen 8 Pokedex, minus a few mythicals..

You got a full gen 8 pokedex?
What's the future like?

 

[Will]

Fire Emblem Let's Go Marth and Let's Go Roy.

Aw man they chose the worst Lords possible for this

 

[KMDP]

Instead of Pokemon Let's Go, when are they gonna make Fire Emblem Let's Go where the gameplay is watered down but the graphics look amazing.

...
*sheds a tear*

I've got a full living Gen 8 Pokedex

Gen 7.

Unless you're a filthy leaker!

 

[Zinith]

I've played 10 of the 13 Metroid games (completed them as well, the series kinda encourages 100% completion) and I have to say that Other M is more towards the middle for me instead of the end...

 

[Knight Dude]

We're waiting to find out.

I forgot that had a Switch version in the works, though isn't that based more on the mobile version that uses 1 screen? The touch controls don't have me worried, since you'd just use the handheld mode, but two screens do worry me.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I'm still waiting on that next Pikmin game.

The wait and lack of news hasn't been as bad as it was for Pikmin 3 quite yet, but I'll be darned if it isn't shaping up to be.

remember when miyamoto said it was nearly done back in 2015...and we still have yet to even get a glimpse of it...sick...

 

[KMDP]

Aw man they chose the worst Lords possible for this

...
Fire Emblem: Let's Go Eirika and Camilla
(I like Camilla, but she's controversial)
There you go.

 

[Will]

It has been nearly 10 years since wii came out, and little mac has his newfound smash popularity, it'd make sense to capitalize on that

Two problems with that:
1. Little Mac retired, story's over.
2. What can you even do after that? Punch-Out has a pretty simple formula, there's not really any new things you could spice things up
Unless you wanna bring this guy and reboot him.

 

[Starbound]

Never played TWEWY. Is it good?

I've just heard the music is good but I haven't found any that jives with me yet.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

I've played 10 of the 13 Metroid games (completed them as well, the series kinda encourages 100% completion) and I have to say that Other M is more towards the middle for me instead of the end...

The reason Other M was branded worse than Hitler is because it's immediately compared to the Prime series which people were hoping more of

 

[RandomAce]

remember when miyamoto said it was nearly done back in 2015...and we still have yet to even get a glimpse of it...sick...

I honestly forgot about it, that’s how quiet they’ve been about it.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the game was on hold.

 

[ZephyrZ]

You got a full gen 8 pokedex?
What's the future like?

Gen 7.

Unless you're a filthy leaker!

Oh no, my covers been blown! Uh...uh...

It was a brain fart, probably 'cause it's 2018 right now. Went and fixed it.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Did I see people say that a Dpad for 3D movement which is objectively terrible and also personally hurt my thumb isn't bad? And the ****ty point and click sections weren't bad? and the fact you have a ridiculously limited moveset in a game that's trying to be more action oriented isn't bad? Other M's problems go beyond the writing, it's the forgettable music and dull at best gameplay too

 

[StupendousMike]

That'd be really cool, though I kind of doubt if that'll happen. Punch-Out seems like the kind of series that only has a new game every once in a while.

I'd like to see a new Punch Out with all new opponents except for Glass Joe, King Hippo and Bald Bull. Let the team go nuts coming up with new characters for Mac to fight.

 

[staindgrey]

It has been nearly 10 years since wii came out, and little mac has his newfound smash popularity, it'd make sense to capitalize on that

I honestly think the work put into ARMS will translate into a Punch-Out!! game announced next year.

It just seems too easy of a transition to make. They have the physics and JoyCon software in place, and ARMS wasn't necessarily a smash hit that needs an immediate sequel (sadly), so why not recycle their work and tailor it to a Little Mac game after Smash releases?

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I've played Super Metroid and that's it.

I regret to say that because many of the other games interest me as well. Samus Returns is on my radar, and if I could easily pick up the Prime games, I would do it in a hot minute.

remember when miyamoto said it was nearly done back in 2015...and we still have yet to even get a glimpse of it...sick...

Pikmin is almost like Nintendo's equivalent of Half-Life at this point. Except we actually got the third game, and a fourth is in the works......even if for a very long time, again.

"Pikmin 4 is very close to completion."

Yeah, SURE, suuuuuuuure it is.

At least we can better hope what we'll eventually get is a high quality sequel in about every aspect. In the man's own words, a delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad.

 

[DarkFalcon]

Did I see people say that a Dpad for 3D movement which is objectively terrible and also personally hurt my thumb isn't bad? And the ****ty point and click sections weren't bad? and the fact you have a ridiculously limited moveset in a game that's trying to be more action oriented isn't bad? Other M's problems go beyond the writing, it's the forgettable music and dull at best gameplay too

I was typing and deleting long responses for a while, but I really can't be bothered. This is about as much as Other M deserves in terms of a response.

 

[Will]

I've played Super Metroid and that's it.

I regret to say that because many of the other games interest me as well. Samus Returns is on my radar, and if I could easily pick up the Prime games, I would do it in a hot minute.

I only own Prime 1 at the moment (i got that ***** and path of radiance for 3 buckaroos each im proud of that). I hope they rerelease Prime Trilogy in some port fashion. I don't know how good the Prime games would look in HD though, may take away from that aesthetic atmosphere or whatever critics get crazy over.

 

[Blargg888]

I just found out that the longest literature work in history is a Smash Bros Brawl fanfic with like 4.5 million words.

Actually, Subspace Emissary Worlds Conquest is only 4.1 million words long, and is the former longest work.

The current longest work is a Kancolle Fanfic known as "A Fleet Symphony" at 4.5 Million words.

SSEWC is weird, because most of it honestly isn't that great, but there's a small arc in the latter quarter of the fic that was actually really enjoyable to read (The Escape + TWEWY Arc). That said, it went back to being rather meh after the fact.

Speaking of the NES Classic and SNES Classic... I wonder what the N64 Classic and GCN Classic are going to have on them (assuming they even get made).

Hm...
Super Mario 64
Mario Kart 64
Mario Party 3
Paper Mario
Ocarina of Time
Majora's Mask
Kirby 64
F-Zero X
Excitebike 64
1080 Snowboarding
Pilotwings 64
Wave Race 64
Star Fox 64
DK64
Pokemon Snap
Yoshi's Story
Super Smash Bros.
+A few more.

This would be good IMO.

I've played 10 of the 13 Metroid games (completed them as well, the series kinda encourages 100% completion) and I have to say that Other M is more towards the middle for me instead of the end...

Which 3 have you not played?

 

[Idon]

I'm still waiting for Little Mac x Hajime no Ippo.

And for the mod that gives Little Mac the Dempsey Roll or the Gazelle Punch.

 

[KMDP]

Two problems with that:
1. Little Mac retired, story's over.
2. What can you even do after that? Punch-Out has a pretty simple formula, there's not really any new things you could spice things up
Unless you wanna bring this guy and reboot him.

You say Little Mac retired.

And then claim you can reboot... using the other guy.

...Wha-?

Just reboot the series with Little Mac.

Also, there are characters Punch-Out!! Wii didn't use.

 

[Noipoi]

The following number is exactly how many Metroid games i've played.







it's funny because i've never played a Metroid game.

 

[Will]

Just reboot the series with Little Mac.

Why would you do a Spider-Man and reboot him TWICE? Give the other guy a shot.

I never said reboot the series without Mac, I meant reboot the character you dingle dong.

 

[Zinith]

Which 3 have you not played?

Metroid Prime Pinball, Metroid Prime: Hunters and Metroid Prime: Federation Force...

 

[staindgrey]

Did I see people say that a Dpad for 3D movement which is objectively terrible and also personally hurt my thumb isn't bad? And the ****ty point and click sections weren't bad? and the fact you have a ridiculously limited moveset in a game that's trying to be more action oriented isn't bad? Other M's problems go beyond the writing, it's the forgettable music and dull at best gameplay too

It's still not a bottom-of-the-barrel awful game, except when held up to Metroid standards. I remember still having fun at parts.

But yeah. 6/10 at best. And what's sad is that other than the weird primary color pallet they went with, it may have been one of the best looking games on the Wii. So much potential for an all-time great wasted by whoever decided that using only the Wiimote was an important feature and whoever wrote the script.