Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[IronTed]

The funniest thing about ARMS trolling is how transparent these people are. The game shipped 1.15 million in 2 weeks, so based on the charts people said "Nintendo overshipped, it only sold like 600k". Next quarter the game ships 200k, and the same people say "ARMS has no legs".

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

You left ARMS alone by saying up into 2015, and then took a stand at it at the end for no reason.

Do people really think it didn't do well? Unless the developers decide to move on I don't see why they wouldn't continue the series, they're clearly passionate about it and it did well.

In all fairness, ARMS shouldn't even have been mentionned in his post at all, since it was released in 2017

 

[Idon]

It ****ing sold more than the entire EO series did in 10 years lmao how does Atlus keeps this thing alive I'm gonna go cry in a corner over there.

Siphoning funds out of Persona spinoffs.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

It ****ing sold more than the entire EO series did in 10 years lmao how does Atlus keeps this thing alive I'm gonna go cry in a corner over there.

Cause the games have a budget that's less than dollar.

 

[DarkFalcon]

I still find it incredibly silly to act like Smash 4 "focused on new characters" when the characters who debutted before Brawl were:
-Villager
-Wii Fit
-Mega Man
-Little Mac
-Miis
-Rosalina and Luma
-Palutena
-Pac-Man
-Bowser Jr.
-Duck Hunt

And half of those debutted before Smash 64 itself.
Greninja, Robin, Lucina, Shulk and Dark Pit were the only "new" characters in terms of age.

To be fair that didn't stop me from thinking the newcomer list was pretty poor.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, ARMS actually did pretty well. I was kinda surprised to see that myself though, as I was one of the people that thought it didn't do well.

Guess it goes to show that doing your own research into things is always the most beneficial rather than going by word of mouth. Misinformation spreads like crazy nowadays...

 

[Kuon]

I feel more modern characters should be a thing, I'm tired of seeing kids get **** on for liking things so they should be fed some bones too imo. Like, yesterday I saw a bunch of old neckbeards whine about that "Kids have dancing classes for Fortnite dances" and there's always how Minecraft was hated because kids like it, They got Inklings so far but maybe another casual friendly newcomer is in order

I think DLC will be for the modern characters, honestly, which makes the most sense to me and would sell well because of relevancy

 

[Chrono.]

Cutting one of my mains Wolf... *cries*

I like him too, honestly there's no real characters I dislike being in the roster.

Dr Mario is probably my least favorite and I don't even dislike him.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I still find it incredibly silly to act like Smash 4 "focused on new characters" when the characters who debutted before Brawl were:
-Villager
-Wii Fit
-Mega Man
-Little Mac
-Miis
-Rosalina and Luma
-Palutena
-Pac-Man
-Bowser Jr.
-Duck Hunt

And half of those debutted before Smash 64 itself.
Greninja, Robin, Lucina, Shulk and Dark Pit were the only "new" characters in terms of age.

On the other hand, Ultimate has already equalled Smash 4's number of newcomers that debuted before the 2000s at a whopping 5 characters, at least discounting Smash 4's DLC. In the broader perspective of Nintendo history Smash 4 definitely cattered more towards the newer generation, especially when you consider that even some of the older characters like Little Mac and Palutena had recently had revivals around that time.

 

[lightdrago]

Speaking of modern characters and DLC, I hope we get one of the characters from Octopath Traveler as a fighter. Olberic, Cyrus, or Therion would be awesome.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

"ARMS has no legs".

Bull****, have you SEEN Twintelle??

 

[Kirby Dragons]

How about a game until a new major leak pops up? (I have an odd hunch we'll know everything about the game by late September and a September or October direct will confirm some big controversial leak)

You can add up to 4 new characters, literally anyone you want that has appeared in a video game before (yes, even shrek or Goku, but preferably from a Nintendo console game or handheld), but you have to axe a character from each previous SSB game.

To get your first character, you must remove someone from Smash for Wii U/3DS. That character will also no longer appear in Ultimate so choose carefully!! To get your second character, you now also have to remove a character from Brawl (and they wouldn't appear in any future games, including Ultimate!). To get your third character, go back to Melee, and if you want that final character you need to axe an original 12.

You can choose to add up to 4, but don't need to add 4. I'll go now as an example:

Character 1: Banjo-Kazooie
Character to Cut for Banjo-Kazooie (reminder, first character cut is from Wii U/3DS and is also removed from Ultimate): Dark Pit
Character 2: Doom-Guy
Character to be cut for Doom-Guy: Toon Link
Character 3: Sylux
Character to be cut for Sylux: Pichu
Character 4: N/A
Character to be cut for N/A: Not Applicable (Never want to cut an original 12 personally)

I want to see who you guys would want to add and who you would remove to get them.

I'm gonna go ahead and go all fourth-parties.

Character 1: Luffy (game: Jump Super Stars)
Cut Character:
Character 2: Mordecai (game: Cartoon Network: Battle Crashers)
Cut Character:
Character 3: Ben 10 (game: Ben 10: Protector of Earth)
Cut Character:

No character 4.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

What? We were the kids who got **** on, lady!

Don't swear to the elderly 20 year old, leave Gwendy Oldbag alone you darn whippersnapper

 

[Deleted member]

"add character you want but cut an existing one" games are bad because there's no price to pay when you can just cut your least favorites so I'll make this more interesting.

You can add as many characters you want BUT you must cut one of your mains in return(as seen in your main list, no cheating).
All I'd have to say is: goodbye Falcon and Shulk.

Cause the games have a budget that's less than dollar.

Hey, give them some credit the chains they use to keep Yuji Himukai locked in a dungeon and the one banana they use to feed him cost at least 10 bucks

To be fair that didn't stop me from thinking the newcomer list was pretty poor.

That's, like, your opinion, man.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

It might be specifically because of Sakurai's comment not to expect too many characters

I wish people would stop reading too much into what he says. The speculation scene is becoming a warzone, since people don't freely allow themselves to think more openly about their predictions.

 

[IronTed]

Sorry for the derail, but my point stands. Nintendo's weak output during the 3DS/Wii U era limits the amount of fresh characters people can support for Smash.

On the other hand, Ultimate has already equalled Smash 4's number of newcomers that debuted before the 2000s at a whopping 5 characters, at least discounting Smash 4's DLC. In the broader perspective of Nintendo history Smash 4 definitely cattered more towards the newer generation, especially when you consider that even some of the older characters like Little Mac and Palutena had recently had revivals around that time.

Also characters like the Miis were conceived not long before Brawl came out, and also came out post-2004, aka within a decade of 4. Rosalina and Luma is another example of this.

 

[Deleted member]

"add character you want but cut an existing one" games are bad because there's no price to pay when you can just cut your least favorites so I'll make this more interesting.

You can add as many characters you want BUT you must cut one of your mains in return(as seen in your main list, no cheating).

I'll add no one so I can keep Shulk. Cutting Shulk is too steep a price for the dumb characters I want.

 

[Deleted member]

I think when it comes to "newer" releases getting represented in Smash Ultimate, I don't think it's gonna end at Super Mario Odyssey and Breath of the Wild (if we're talking about mainly the Switch era). I feel that franchises and games that were shown at the January 2017 Switch Presentation will get representation in Smash Ultimate in some shape or form whether release or post-release.

- Super Mario Odyssey: CONFIRMED as "New Donk City Hall" stage, Wedding Mario costume, music, etc.
- The Legend of Zelda ~ Breath of the Wild: CONFIRMED as "Great Plateau Tower" stage, music such as the Main Theme, Link redesign, etc.
- Snipperclips: CONFIRMED as "Noisy Notebook" song
- Splatoon 2: CONFIRMED-ish (Lil' Judd appears in Moray Towers)

- ARMS: TO BE CONFIRMED
- Xenoblade Chronicles 2: TO BE CONFIRMED
- Octopath Traveler: TO BE CONFIRMED
- Fire Emblem Warriors: TO BE CONFIRMED
- The Elder Scrolls V ~ Skyrim: TO BE CONFIRMED
- Shin Megami Tensei: TO BE CONFIRMED
- No More Heroes: TO BE CONFIRMED

In regards to NMH, SMT, and Skyrim, it could happen, though I will be surprised if they don't even appear in trophy form. Fire Emblem Warriors and Octopath Traveler I feel could be very good candidates for good song selection. Releases like Splatoon 2, ARMS and Xenoblade 2, though, I feel will be in no matter what, whether it be characters, music, etc.

 

[THE 6r]

_Unless...

 

[ColietheGoalie]

I still find it incredibly silly to act like Smash 4 "focused on new characters" when the characters who debutted before Brawl were:
-Villager
-Wii Fit
-Mega Man
-Little Mac
-Miis
-Rosalina and Luma
-Palutena
-Pac-Man
-Bowser Jr.
-Duck Hunt

And half of those debutted before Smash 64 itself.
Greninja, Robin, Lucina, Shulk and Dark Pit were the only "new" characters in terms of age.

I'd consider maybe five of those characters "retro" picks of any kind, and two of them are Third Party.
By and large, the roster focused on Gamecube-era and forward.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I wish people would stop reading too much into what he says. The speculation scene is becoming a warzone, since people don't freely allow themselves to think more openly about their predictions.

**** you man my dad was killed by a speculation scene , it's serious business

 

[WertQuadNine]

The pain I feel reading the same generic Smash Ultimate roster fanlists since the 8.8 direct as a Paper Mario fan cannot be expressed.

HOT TAKE: SHADOW IS IN!!!!!11!!!1!11!!!! HERE'S WHY (part 1/12)

 

[Noipoi]

**** you man my dad was killed by a speculation scene , it's serious business

If you die in Smash speculation you die for real!

 

[Dee Dude]

I'd consider maybe five of those characters "retro" picks of any kind, and two of them are Third Party.
By and large, the roster focused on Gamecube-era and forward.

I’m pretty Villager and Jr were the only Gamecube era characters added in and even then, the rest were Retro, Wii, 3DS era.

 

[Next Door Dog]

I mean I definitely tend to lean more towards the retro side of things, but I do feel like there should be more emphasis on older picks and fan favorites in the base game, and newer characters for DLC. I know they say they don't have DLC planned but come on now, it's not like they're going into the thing completely blind either. Unless it's some 3rd party heavy hitter, it doesn't really make sense to add an older character as DLC, seeing as we don't have any cut veterans this time around. I just don't see a character like Isaac selling as well as a new Pokemon character, or even a Xenoblade character (might be out of my depth here tbh, I'm assuming that series is more popular than niche status). Retro picks aren't much of a selling point on their own, and they could sell their newer characters whenever.

 

[DarkFalcon]

The only reason I think Mario and Link got updated even if slightly is because their games were in development long before the project plan happened. All Mario got was a Cappy cameo and a couple outfits and Link did get updated but his moveset is still pretty much the same barring a few tweaks to match BoTW Link. They weren't complete reworks.

So I think any NEW character from after 2015 isn't likely. Mayyyybe a new Pokemon, but what the 3 series I mentioned all have in common is they're all major franchises for Nintendo, which probably gives Sakurai insider knowledge beforehand. Xenoblade became big, but we already know when concept art for Rex and Pyra was finished, so they don't seem likely at all, which opens up the door to Elma who was relevant at the time, and still is thanks to the DLC for XC2.

 

[Nethermoosen]

Don't swear to the elderly 20 year old, leave Gwendy Oldbag alone you darn whippersnapper

I uh....what? I’m 28, ya “old bag”

 

[Cutie Gwen]

If you die in Smash speculation you die for real!

Hit Like on this post to die instantly! Also RIP anyone not appearing in the game, they got retconned out of the new Smash

 

[P.Kat]

On the topic of fan favorites, while Phoenix Wright and Amaterasu are usually mentioned left and right when it comes to Capcom reps, I always play with them in Ultimate Marvel VS. Capcom 3. Though there was more character I had in my team that was a CLASSIC on the Wii...

C'mon, Sakurai.

Spoiler

Here's hoping for Ammy.

Who here's waiting for someone totally out there to be revealed so they can blow all these safe Geno, Skull Kid, Shadow, etc rosters out of the water?

Kat from Gravity Rush would be a dream come true.

Outside shots but feasible: General Scales, Tricky, Marcus McCloud, Amanda, Miyu, that other SF2 gal

Her name's Fay

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Kat from Gravity Rush would be a dream come true.

SegaNintendoUbisoft alt detected

I uh....what? I’m 28, ya “old bag”

**** I mean 200

 

[Nethermoosen]

SegaNintendoUbisoft alt detected

**** I mean 200

Oh, well pardon me, Ancient One.

 

[Deleted member]

The only reason I think Mario and Link got updated even if slightly is because their games were in development long before the project plan happened. All Mario got was a Cappy cameo and a couple outfits and Link did get updated but his moveset is still pretty much the same barring a few tweaks to match BoTW Link. They weren't complete reworks.

So I think any NEW character from after 2015 isn't likely. Mayyyybe a new Pokemon, but what the 3 series I mentioned all have in common is they're all major franchises for Nintendo, which probably gives Sakurai insider knowledge beforehand. Xenoblade became big, but we already know when concept art for Rex and Pyra was finished, so they don't seem likely at all, which opens up the door to Elma who was relevant at the time, and still is thanks to the DLC for XC2.

Honestly Xenoblade has the worst timing out of any franchise in Ultimate when it comes to receiving what new content to add on from Smash 4 lmao

I think no doubt there'll be another Pokemon to represent Sun & Moon, though.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I wish people would stop reading too much into what he says. The speculation scene is becoming a warzone, since people don't freely allow themselves to think more openly about their predictions.

Becoming implies it hasn't always been

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

You can add up to 4 new characters, literally anyone you want that has appeared in a video game before (yes, even shrek or Goku, but preferably from a Nintendo console game or handheld), but you have to axe a character from each previous SSB game.

To get your first character, you must remove someone from Smash for Wii U/3DS. That character will also no longer appear in Ultimate so choose carefully!! To get your second character, you now also have to remove a character from Brawl (and they wouldn't appear in any future games, including Ultimate!). To get your third character, go back to Melee, and if you want that final character you need to axe an original 12.

You can choose to add up to 4, but don't need to add 4. I'll go now as an example:

.

Im going to assume we're going just for uniques here as I refuse to cut anybody for an echo so

Character 1: Rayman
Cutting Corrin: I think FE can take the cut better than anyone else, they still have plenty of people to pick from.

Character 2: Shovel Knight
Cutting Wolf: This one would probably sting a lot of people, but the only other choice for me was Lucas, and I'd rather Mother and Star Fox have 2 reps than 3 of SF and 1 of Mother

Character 3: Link&Midna (just barley edges out Skull Kid for me)
Cutting Dr. Mario: The echo before echos were a thing

Character 4: Bomber Man
Cutting Jigglypuff: End her reign of terror before it ever began, go back in time and save Melee.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly Xenoblade has the worst timing out of any franchise in Ultimate when it comes to receiving what new content to add on from Smash 4 lmao

The timing is ripe for Black Tar, so I fail to see the issue.

 

[Deleted member]

I just find extremely funny female representation was shut down because "Sakurai doesn't fill quotas" but now half of this thread DEMANDS a focus on old characters.

 

[DarkFalcon]

Honestly Xenoblade has the worst timing out of any franchise in Ultimate when it comes to receiving new content lmao

I think no doubt there'll be another Pokemon to represent Sun & Moon, though.

It's definitely one of those franchises for sure, but I think others have it worse. At the very least Elma from XCX was, and still is relevant.

I think Pokemon's timing is really odd, but Sakurai probably got some sheets of reference for potential Pokemon newcomers. I don't think we're getting a new Pokemon but I could always be wrong and we get a Greninja situation where Sakurai was given reference sheets.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Becoming implies it hasn't always been

Granted, but one should at least avoid adding fuel to the fire, even by accident.

Also, for the record, I'm in the early 30s, so does that make me Cranky Kong by that metric?

Who here's waiting for someone totally out there to be revealed so they can blow all these safe Geno, Skull Kid, Shadow, etc rosters out of the water?

Ooh, me! My sig has some choices that don't seem too noticed by people.

 

[PeridotGX]

The pain I feel reading the same generic Smash Ultimate roster fanlists since the 8.8 direct as a Paper Mario fan cannot be expressed.

Yeah, they're all painfully generic. Incineroar, Skull Kid, Banjo, Issac, and Geno as uniques, while Ken, Shadow, Isabelle, and maybe the Black Knight are the echoes. Where's the flavor? Honestly I'm not all that keen on Blaziken's chances, but I have him on my roster just so there's something unique.

 

[**Gilgamesh**]

I don’t think we’d die if there are two more chracaters like Elma and a Gen 7 Rep and have like 3-4 more be from the ballot.

For instance if we get Isaac, Geno, Banjo, A LOT of fans will be extremely be happy with the roster, and they probably won’t care for characters like Elma or a Gen 7 Pokémon if they got added, which if they also get included can at least make Elma fans and whatever Gen 7 Pokémon fans happy.

My question is, what audience is Smash directed at. Is it directed at kids? Is directed at teens? Why the E10 rating then?