Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Rhus]

Star Fox I feel offers the most variety. Fox and/or Falco could both be playable, the Arwing and Landmaster could be made into karts, and the Walker could possibly be turned into a bike. Not to mention the plethora of places in the Lylat System for a Star Fox track to take place in.

Let's see, for different planets/areas (not counting the various "sectors" in the Lylat System) with fleshed out environments there is:

• Corneria (Earth-like)
• Titania (Desert, wasteland)
• Zoness (Previous Cornerian base, now an acid pool, thanks Andross)
• Macbeth (Venom army supply)
• Aquas (Under da sea)
• Fichina (Snowy)
• Fortune (primordial forest)
• Solar (literally the sun)
• Venom (wasteland - a teleportation device in Zero)
• Sauria (dinos)
• Sargasso (Mercenary hideout - dilapidated debris left from the Lylat Wars)
• Aparoid homeworld (HIVEMIND)
• Katina (Desert like, military base)

Man. I wish we had more Star Fox representation in smash.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Only if Lucario counts as blue-haired.

I counted him, so they can be counted aswell

Skyworld

The entire Temple of Palutena and/or the Labyrinth of Deceit would be better

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This, if it was the gardevoir/mewtwos echo then it was fake.

I think it also spelled Kazooie as “Kazzoie”. If you’re gonna make a leak at least spellcheck it.

Didn’t it use a mix of romaji and English naming conventions too? That’s suspicious to say the least

 

[Dixie Kong]

Would Mew work as a fighter?

 

[CosmicQuark]

CommanderZaktan what did the leak say though, do you remember? Did anyone get to screencap it and/or archive.is it?

Searching the link, I found a Gamefaqs thread talking about it (that was deleted too so I used a cached version), and this is the image it was referring to. Same one the video talks about.

https://i.imgtc.com/LRtmvi8.png

I mean, it's most likely fake. I wish it were true tho...

(Also apologies if I'm not supposed to post the link, given other threads on other websites have been deleted, wanted to clear up the confusion)

 

[MasterOfKnees]

It's kind of ironic that you put Greninja and Lucina as unpopular, bottom-of-the-barrel advertisements considering both of them were incredibly popular in the Pokémon and Fire Emblem fandoms long before they got into Smash.

Greninja was somewhat popular, but mostly because its ability was crazy in competitive play, it was still considered a massive surprise and a lot of question marks were raised as to why it was picked over the other two starters. Its popularity only peaked quite some time after Smash 4 released as its role in the anime grew, its inclusion makes much more sense in hindsight than it did back when it was first revealed.

I agree on Lucina though, and on top of that she was a last minute clone too, so there's little to complain about in that regard.

 

[Opossum]

but that could be any generic castle map which is exactly what he used

I mean Altea IS very conveniently shaped like a race track...

Start in the top right, head left toward Samson and Arran's villages, head down toward the shops, right toward the prison, drive through the prison and end up at the start again. A battle wages on as you drive, but on the final lap the music changes to the Map Clear theme and instead of going through the prison you drive toward the finish line at the castle.
Marthio Karth.

Would Mew work as a fighter?

I mean, in theory it could. I think it's better as a rare summon though, personally.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Searching the link, I found a Gamefaqs thread talking about it (that was deleted too so I used a cached version), and this is the image it was referring to. Same one the video talks about.

https://i.imgtc.com/LRtmvi8.png

I mean, it's most likely fake. I wish it were true tho...

(Also apologies if I'm not supposed to post the link, given other threads on other websites have been deleted, wanted to clear up the confusion)

Oh this one. Yeah it was fake. Incineroar and Banjo were found to be other game models already.

 

[Onua]

Tbh the picks people have for echoes in their "leaks" are almost always the fastest way to know if theyre BS (but I still believe every leak so far has been BS and ppl like LOZ and Verge have only gotten lucky)

The characters that we would see as echoes are p limited realistically and we know sakurai wouldnt just throw in a character for the sake of throwing one in.

So whenever I see ppl clamor over a "leak" and it has something dumb in the echo section its the fastest and easiest way to dismiss it.

Tho I think leaks are a waste of time to talk unless they have actually interesting things such as images, but images are very very very easy to fake. So is video based stuff.

So I think its better to just wait for official announcements

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Searching the link, I found a Gamefaqs thread talking about it (that was deleted too so I used a cached version), and this is the image it was referring to. Same one the video talks about.

https://i.imgtc.com/LRtmvi8.png

I mean, it's most likely fake. I wish it were true tho...

(Also apologies if I'm not supposed to post the link, given other threads on other websites have been deleted, wanted to clear up the confusion)

I think it is, they checked the renders against pre existing ones

I’m curious what the other characters were in it though

 

[KMDP]

Everyone's talking about who hyped them the most, I'll do you all one better and list my reactions across every series.
With Smash 64, because of the fact that I didn't have it, I'll state my hypothetical reactions instead, the same applies to Melee, which was the first game of the series I played, and I didn't follow it online.

Characters after the | are the "literally who?" characters, the ones I couldn't have had a reaction to, because I had no idea who they were. This doesn't reflect on my later opinion of them, and they are organised by number instead. I'll also include how old I was when the game came out.
Smash 64 [Age 8]: |
Melee [Age 11]: |
Brawl [Age 17]: |
Smash 4 [Age 23]: ultcorrin:
Ultimate [Age 27]:

The beauty of Smash is that it can introduce you to new franchises you've never heard of (or you've only ever heard of) and help make you a fan.

 

[WolfCypher]

Now, why everyone want Decidueye over Incineroar?

Why else? I like Decidueye...a LOT more than Incineroar. Why wouldn't I want a character I'm a fan of over other thing/character in Smash?

 

[cmbsfm]

Tbh the picks people have for echoes in their "leaks" are almost always the fastest way to know if theyre BS (but I still believe every leak so far has been BS and ppl like LOZ and Verge have only gotten lucky)

The characters that we would see as echoes are p limited realistically and we know sakurai wouldnt just throw in a character for the sake of throwing one in.

So whenever I see ppl clamor over a "leak" and it has something dumb in the echo section its the fastest and easiest way to dismiss it.

Tho I think leaks are a waste of time to talk unless they have actually interesting things such as images, but images are very very very easy to fake. So is video based stuff.

So I think its better to just wait for official announcements

Verge claims Simon is in way before e3
Loz accurately predicts everything in the e3 direct and several gameplay mechanics

And they both are lucky?

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Searching the link, I found a Gamefaqs thread talking about it (that was deleted too so I used a cached version), and this is the image it was referring to. Same one the video talks about.

https://i.imgtc.com/LRtmvi8.png

I mean, it's most likely fake. I wish it were true tho...

(Also apologies if I'm not supposed to post the link, given other threads on other websites have been deleted, wanted to clear up the confusion)

Again, its the character positioning that gets to me. (that and Banjo just looks really off.) Did they already establish chars would be ordered by when they were added to the game?

 

[Heracr055]

Greninja was somewhat popular, but mostly because its ability was crazy in competitive play, it was still considered a massive surprise and a lot of question marks were raised as to why it was picked over the other two starters. Its popularity only peaked quite some time after Smash 4 released as its role in the anime grew, its inclusion makes much more sense in hindsight than it did back when it was first revealed.

I agree on Lucina though, and on top of that she was a last minute clone too, so there's little to complain about in that regard.

With respect to Greninja it waa a bit of a no-brainer compared to the other 2 starters. Chesnaught was not well received and maybe only Delphox had a shot. However, Greninja was definitely the darling even before Protean became the meta-defining thing.

 

[AlphaSSB]

Let's see, for different planets/areas (not counting the various "sectors" in the Lylat System) with fleshed out environments there is:

• Corneria (Earth-like)
• Titania (Desert, wasteland)
• Zoness (Previous Cornerian base, now an acid pool, thanks Andross)
• Macbeth (Venom army supply)
• Aquas (Under da sea)
• Fichina (Snowy)
• Fortune (primordial forest)
• Solar (literally the sun)
• Venom (wasteland - a teleportation device in Zero)
• Sauria (dinos)
• Sargasso (Mercenary hideout - dilapidated debris left from the Lylat Wars)
• Aparoid homeworld (HIVEMIND)
• Katina (Desert like, military base)

Man. I wish we had more Star Fox representation in smash.

So many places. Shame that only one would be chosen. Not to mention all the combat missions in space. A track could easily take place in one of the Sectors, with the track weaving through an active battlefield. Maybe even use some of the larger ships as part of the track. Literally so much that can be done.

As for Star Fox representation in Smash, I feel the same. If the next Smash game isn't a reboot, maybe the series will receive a bit more love. There's so much more within the series that could be added. Characters, stages, music, trophies, etc.

 

[Impa4Smash]

In regards to the leak, but not actually about the leak:

Man, I really hope we can change the CSS so that it's arranged by series. Same with stages. The whole arranged by order of appearance is gonna be so annoying

 

[IronTed]

With respect to Greninja it waa a bit of a no-brainer compared to the other 2 starters. Chesnaught was not well received and maybe only Delphox had a shot. However, Greninja was definitely the darling even before Protean became the meta-defining thing.

I mean I agree with most of this, but Greninja was selected way before X and Y released, so it was more a matter of assumed popularity than anything.

 

[CommanderZaktan]

Here's the leak I mentioned here https://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/429143349

 

[Captain Shwampy]

I had a dream last night that Miyu and Fay were revealed in a new smash direct and my reaction was mostly "wow i didnt expect that"

I dont know why specifically them but its interesting to think about since Star Fox 2 isnt a dead game anymore

 

[Rhus]

So many places. Shame that only one would be chosen. Not to mention all the combat missions in space. A track could easily take place in one of the Sectors, with the track weaving through an active battlefield. Maybe even use some of the larger ships as part of the track. Literally so much that can be done.

Personally, I'm hoping that they add more music from other Star Fox games than just 64 and Star Fox SNES. We have gotten bits and pieces of Assault, but nothing else from the other games. Ideally, I would like to see a reorchestration medley of Fox and Falco's character themes from Command.

The Sector Omega theme from Zero would be perfect for Lylat Cruise, as would Sector Beta, but we can only hope.

 

[Deleted member]

Let's see, for different planets/areas (not counting the various "sectors" in the Lylat System) with fleshed out environments there is:

• Corneria (Earth-like)
• Titania (Desert, wasteland)
• Zoness (Previous Cornerian base, now an acid pool, thanks Andross)
• Macbeth (Venom army supply)
• Aquas (Under da sea)
• Fichina (Snowy)
• Fortune (primordial forest)
• Solar (literally the sun)
• Venom (wasteland - a teleportation device in Zero)
• Sauria (dinos)
• Sargasso (Mercenary hideout - dilapidated debris left from the Lylat Wars)
• Aparoid homeworld (HIVEMIND)
• Katina (Desert like, military base)

Man. I wish we had more Star Fox representation in smash.

Aparoid Homeworld legit needs to be a stage.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Here's the leak I mentioned here https://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/429143349

It would have been perfect...if it wasn’t missing Elma...

Also no mention of the Minecraft representation Verge mentioned (which isn’t playable Steve). If it’s a stage I can understand why it wouldn’t be listed there

Was the original ESRB leak post deleted or no? I don’t remember

 

[MasterOfKnees]

With respect to Greninja it waa a bit of a no-brainer compared to the other 2 starters. Chesnaught was not well received and maybe only Delphox had a shot. However, Greninja was definitely the darling even before Protean became the meta-defining thing.

Might just be my memory being a bit off then, but I remember there being a lot of criticism over how Greninja just completely dropped the bubble theme that its previous two evolutions had going on, I feel like Delphox got a lot more praise just because it wasn't another Fire/Fighting starter after three straight generations of them. But again, I might be wrong on that.

 

[GunBlaze]

Might just be my memory being a bit off then, but I remember there being a lot of criticism over how Greninja just completely dropped the bubble theme that its previous two evolutions had going on, I feel like Delphox got a lot more praise just because it wasn't another Fire/Fighting starter after three straight generations of them. But again, I might be wrong on that.

The hated one was Delphox. People found it mad ugly, and apparently Fire/Psychic is a really bad typing or something.

Incineroar was who got praise for not being Fire/Fighting.

 

[Rhus]

@TotsBS Yes! That theme is stunning! They could also use the fantastic final boss music from Assault for that stage as well.

Spoiler: Music

 

[IronTed]

The Kalos starter popularity basically went like this

"OMG, Fennekin and Chespin are adorable!"

Then the mid stages were revealed

"Well, at least Frogadier looks cool I guess"

In general yes, people appreciated no more fire/fighting starter, but the direction the Fennekin line went was not at all super popular, same goes for the Chespin line. From Frogadier onwards the Froakie line was most popular.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Everyone's talking about who hyped them the most, I'll do you all one better and list my reactions across every series.
With Smash 64, because of the fact that I didn't have it, I'll state my hypothetical reactions instead, the same applies to Melee, which was the first game of the series I played, and I didn't follow it online.

Characters after the | are the "literally who?" characters, the ones I couldn't have had a reaction to, because I had no idea who they were. This doesn't reflect on my later opinion of them, and they are organised by number instead. I'll also include how old I was when the game came out.
Smash 64 [Age 8]: |
Melee [Age 11]: |
Brawl [Age 17]: |
Smash 4 [Age 23]: ultcorrin:
Ultimate [Age 27]:

Where’s Rosalina and Bowser Jr...anywho...Can’t top this, but here I goes (based on when I unlocked and saw for the first time)

64 (Age Unborn): not even gonna count this one
Melee (2, but didn’t play until 5-6): (who)...was my first video game ever, so I get an excuse
Brawl (9): |(who I ended up loving as a character and series)(whom I grew to love as a character)(didn’t know Samus was a female until the SSE showed the booty and name)(when air started to know more about Pokémon)(thought he was Ash)(wow he speaks weird...didn’t know better)(fire sword)
3DS/Wii U (15):(Uprising Pit being counted because **** you)|(knew of him, but not too much)(only knew of thanks to him getting cut from Brawl and being made fun of...wasn’t into FE much yet)|(they got me to try out Awakening and FE overall for a 2nd time...never looked back)(a weird Pokémon name, a murderer, a thing, and...Cloud)
Ultimate (19): |(knew a bit of both)|...who

 

[Paperchampion23]

It would have been perfect...if it wasn’t missing Elma...

Also no mention of the Minecraft representation Verge mentioned (which isn’t playable Steve). If it’s a stage I can understand why it wouldn’t be listed there

Was the original ESRB leak post deleted or no? I don’t remember

No, but people immediately called it fake due to Shulk looking like Little Mac's render lol. However, this one looks like an already made Banjo and Incineroar (even though they aren't exactly the same)

 

[Rie Sonomura]

No, but people immediately called it fake due to Shulk looking like Little Mac's render lol. However, this one looks like an already made Banjo and Incineroar (even though they aren't exactly the same)

I think the only details changed were the direction the eyes were looking in, with some simple Photoshop Magic(TM)

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I think the only details changed were the direction the eyes were looking in, with some simple Photoshop Magic(TM)

It’s another Little Mac render that’s been changed

 

[Noipoi]

Incineroar was despised until we saw it in game, the sheer personality in it's animations really won a lot of people over.
Not to mention it wasn't fire/fighting type, which is a plus.

 

[Pacman High Tier]

An echo I thought of that I have not seen mentioned much... what if Claus was just a regular Lucas echo? They are Identical Twins in universe and it really wouldn't be a stretch. it would avoid spoilers too, not that that seems to be cared about in Smash. If they did what they did for Metroid and introduced a villain (Porky) and an Echo... that would be really cool.

And yeah I'm not denying Incineroar would be a cool fighter. I just don't like how it looks.

 

[RileyXY1]

An echo I thought of that I have not seen mentioned much... what if Claus was just a regular Lucas echo? They are Identical Twins in universe and it really wouldn't be a stretch. it would avoid spoilers too, not that that seems to be cared about in Smash. If they did what they did for Metroid and introduced a villain (Porky) and an Echo... that would be really cool.

And yeah I'm not denying Incineroar would be a cool fighter. I just don't like how it looks.

Claus/Masked Man is still a Lucas alt, so it's not happening.

 

[ZephyrZ]

You know what I think is the real reason Delphox and Incineroar get so much hate within the pokemon fandoms? It's because they look nothing like their base forms. Look at the Kanto starters. You can kind of guess what they'll be like when they're fully evolved - bigger, meaner versions of themselves with some new accessories attached. But now look at Fennekin and Litten. There is nothing to indicate that they'll be anthropomorphic in their final forms, so it's jarring to a lot of the fans of their base forms who liked them because they were more animal like. Even I was disappointed by Incineroar at first, even if I eventually came to on that one (still a Silvally supporter though).

I remember Samurott actually getting some of that hate back in the day to. It's actually my favorite Unova starter, even though Oshawott is my least favorite of the base forms. But I remember a lot of Oshawott fans who were upset that Samurott looked absolutely nothing like its predecessor.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

An echo I thought of that I have not seen mentioned much... what if Claus was just a regular Lucas echo? They are Identical Twins in universe and it really wouldn't be a stretch. it would avoid spoilers too, not that that seems to be cared about in Smash. If they did what they did for Metroid and introduced a villain (Porky) and an Echo... that would be really cool.

And yeah I'm not denying Incineroar would be a cool fighter. I just don't like how it looks.

I think Claus would work better as an Alph/Koopalings styled alt. Although, I could better imagine

Spoiler: Mother 3 spoilers, not that anyone really cares about this spoiler anymore

the Masked Man, but he should have some things to differentiate, like PK powers AND a beam sword

If Final Smashes aren't hard deconfirmations I could see Kumatora as a Lucas echo with some Ness properties.

 

[AlphaSSB]

Personally, I'm hoping that they add more music from other Star Fox games than just 64 and Star Fox SNES. We have gotten bits and pieces of Assault, but nothing else from the other games. Ideally, I would like to see a reorchestration medley of Fox and Falco's character themes from Command.

The Sector Omega theme from Zero would be perfect for Lylat Cruise, as would Sector Beta, but we can only hope.

I know. That's one issue I have with the Star Fox tracks in Smash, most of them are variations of the same theme, and stem from Star Fox SNES and Star Fox 64. The only other game we've gotten music from is Star Fox: Assault, and only three at that.

In Smash 4, Star Fox had 14 tracks, and the direct showed that the series now has 17 tracks. Assuming that they've all been added already. If I had to guess, they're probably taken from Star Fox Zero.

Corneria, Return to Corneria, Sector Omega, and Star Fox Zero's rendition of the Star Wolf Theme are all likely candidates. As well as a few others, I'm sure. Personally, I'd love to see the Titania theme make it in. It's a bit slower than the rest, but I think it'd still fit.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Claus/Masked Man is still a Lucas alt, so it's not happening.

And we all know if they’re an alt for someone, they’re deconfirmed...wonder if this pattern will die

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Here's the leak I mentioned here https://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/429143349

They listed Richter as an echo but forgot Simon

Silly boy/girl.

 

[Deleted member]

@TotsBS Yes! That theme is stunning! They could also use the fantastic final boss music from Assault for that stage as well.

Spoiler: Music

This right here is definitive proof that Star Fox: Assault is the best Star Fox game.