Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Sigran101]

Last one for the night.

Thank you sam☆jam for the Skull Kid stock icon
View attachment 159457

Made about 9 of these now. 7 are possible. 2 are goemon.
Might make more tomorrow. See if I can hunt down more speculated newcomers that were leaked.

These are awesome! It would make my day to see a black knight one. If you end up making one for him is there any chance you could @ me in the post? I don't read everything and I wouldn't want to miss it.

 

[SpiralGalaxies]

I feel that if someone managed to steal a demo of the game from CEO or wherever, and then Data Dump it, Why not show a picture of the Data? or something rather than giving the story and then saying Who's in it.

I think the Gardevoir/Gothitelle leak is like 98% fake. The entire series of events just seems so improbable. It's not impossible, but i highly doubt it.

 

[Bionichute]

The Gardevoir leak is as real as chemtrails

 

[Momotsuki]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

 

[Rie Sonomura]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

Sylvalum’s Lake Ciel from Xenoblade Chronicles X.

 

[Bionichute]

A Kirby stage that isn't just from Super Star

OR DREAMLAND GB

THAT STAGE SUCKS!

 

[Capybara Gaming]

While I don't think Mineta is all that good of character! I will just say this! At least Mineta isn't Katsuki Bakugo (Who I have dubbed the WORST PIECE OF HORRENDOUS ****ING SATAN AWFUL **** I HAVE EVER LAID EYES EYES ON IN MY ENTIRE LIFE, PLAIN AND SIMPLE AS THAT)!

Both are garbage tbh

 

[Shroob]

Pretty sure I covered why Verg would know what Pokemon isnt in smash while simultaneously not knowing which exact one is in, too.

I almost feel like the Gardevoir/Gothitelle leak is the most legitimate because it has a pick that NOBODY was expecting...as an echo no less....for another character that, while liked, did not have a huge vocal faction for...while having the stupidest explanation for HOW he got said information to begin with!

Like....it is so out there...so stupid....that nobody in their right mind would write it thinking its believable....not after everybody and their mother knows that the most credible ones (if you can call them that) are "I work in X department", "I'm on the ESRB committee", "I work for the translation team" excuses. They wrote it because it was the truth; not because they thought 'this is a believable reason!"

Anyway...gonna redirect people's attention slightly upward and restate, "I almost feel" as if this is the case...This explanation makes the chairs theory seem legit.

Regardless if the story behind it, Gothitelle would stick out like a sore thumb in terms of being in Smash, even as an echo.


So far, Echo fighters have either been highly requested (Dark Samus, Chrom, Daisy), or were protagonists in their own series(RIchter).


I just don't see someone as ho-hum as Gothitelle getting in.


Hell, even Isabelle being a Villager Echo makes more sense due to her being a huge money-maker and being pushed into the forefront of Animal Crossing.



And then beyond ALL this, she would stick out super hard in the Pokemon roster as well.

Every Pokemon we have in Smash has either been marketed to hell and back in their prime, or was hugely popular.

? The mascot.
? Was popular way back when, still here due to seniority.
? Was a cheap clone, but at the same time, Pichu was marketed like crazy during Gen 2.
? I don't even need to explain this one.
? Was Gen 4's poster boy.
? Was a gamble, but became HUGE in Gen6 due to it.
? *Etika.wav*


Gardevoir I get, but Gothitelle would literally be a "We need to fill a quota" pick, nothing more. It's not a highly marketed Pokemon, was never popular, and doesn't really 'have' anything to its name to begin with.

 

[CosmicQuark]

Here's something to consider.

In every Direct Sakurai puts on, a professional has to come in and help set up this specific setting.
Every bit of this set probably had to be approved and looked over.
Every specific little bit of it.

Why would Sakurai insist on having 2 chairs and a funky pillow?
Right after he had a barrel and ladder?

Just something to think about. I don't have much of an opinion on the pillow theory, but most people seem to think the set's just thrown together in 30 minutes.

Because he or the set designer liked the look of them? I'm not saying it's out of the question that they could be hints--but it's really stretching. It reminds me of the discussion on analyzing literature--An English teacher goes at lengths about why the author made the curtains green, what it symbolizes and what it says about the character. Whereas the author just liked green curtains.

EDIT:

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

I am worried now that it's the final count, but I really hope we get more than 4 new stages for what's supposed to be a new game. Even 9 seems sparse.

I'll pick 5:
- If Banjo's in, Spiral Mountain with Gruntilda as a boss would make the most sense.
- If Geno is in, one based on Super Mario RPG
- A Breath of the Wild stage taking place in a Divine Beast, where the stage periodically turn and new platforms come in.
- A Dr. Mario stage, as we desperately need one
- A R.O.B stage where the background is scaled so everyone is small, on a Famicom system.

 

[PSIGuy]

A Kirby stage that isn't just from Super Star

Hey, Great Cave Offensive isn't from Super Star!

According to Sakurai it's based on Super Star Ultra. So there.

 

[DarthEnderX]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

Personally, I wish we were getting more than 1 CV stage, since we're getting 2 characters from it.

I feel like there's too many CV monsters currently sharing the same stage.

I wish there was one stage that's the castle hallway, where you can find Medusa, Mummies, Werewolf, Frankenstein.

Then a 2nd stage set in the clocktower with gears and swinging pendulums and such where Death and Carmilla can be found.

 

[Deleted member]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

Wedding Hall stage from Odyssey would be pretty nice. If anything else, I'd like either another Final Fantasy stage, like at Gongaga with its ruined reactor (so we can have Tankceratops appear!)

Or

Stages representing characters that couldn't quite make the cut for smash. Like a Golden Sun stage for Isaac if he doesnt make it in, Ultra Space for Pokemon Sun/Moon if we don't get a 7th gen rep, or something like that.

Oh! and Bowser's castle. How have we not had a Bowser's Castle stage yet?! Should make it a stage that changes through the different styles (like you could do in Mario Maker) where it takes place in Bowser's castle as typically designed in Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario World, and then New Super Mario Bros.

 

[Luminario]

I will say one thing about the weird Gothitelle leak; him making up a dumb story as is when they have a different source for the information just to protect the source is not beyond unbelievable.

I don't really believe the leak, not just because of the dumb story, but because Gothitelle's own design makes it impossible for her to be an Echo of Gardevoir. On the surface they look similar, but their models are wayyyyyyyy different. Simply put, Gardevoir actually could be a clone/echo of Zelda and it'd fit better in comparison. As they both have similar models but more important, actual legs. Gothitelle doesn't have legs, just feet.

Gothitelle's legs only look super stubbly in the anime (It's STILL funny to look at) but in the games the legs seem to start quite a bit higher. Beyond that they're very similar when it comes to body type. Unless Gardevoir is doing some sorta Peach ftilt split kick it works fine.

 

[SSB4Dojo]

I don't think any Pokemon did well enough on the ballot to be recognized is my point.

No poll done on the ballot shows Pokemon scoring high, because at the end of the day Sceptile, Gardevoir, or any other Gen 3 Pokemon is not as popular as the likes of Inkling, King K. Rool, Ridley, Geno, Isaac etc

At about 3 a week (which is roughly the average right? Where's the guy who has been tracking that lol) we can expect about 10 more newcomers, which is basically what I'm expecting.

I have been tracking all the information beyond just fighters and what the date was to see if there ever is a pattern.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...3bfmOparag6F5Mt60DmWiE9Q8/edit#gid=1412020558

You can also look at the Smash Blog Updates tab to see which series are represented and which types of updates are happening.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Gothitelle's legs only look super stubbly in the anime (It's STILL funny to look at) but in the games the legs seem to start quite a bit higher. Beyond that they're very similar when it comes to body type. Unless Gardevoir is doing some sorta Peach ftilt split kick it works fine.

They're actually only similar if you don't really look much into their animations. They're pretty distinct overall. Still, Sakurai uses mostly the anime designs in a lot of cases, so I doubt this'll happen. Gothitelle is the closest thing to Gardevoir from Gen V, but that's like saying Moblin Ganon in ALTTP and Moblin Ganon in OOT are similar. Yes, to some degree, but are very very distinct otherwise. Gardevoir's actually able to fully outright kick and its dress does not hinter it at all. It's more like Peach's dress, bar the fact it has a cut out in the front portion. Gothitelle's is a full out dress much more like Zelda's instead.

Another example would be why Daisy isn't getting any non-dress alts. It's because her animations are based around the dress. Gardevoir doesn't even wear a dress, it's much more like a skirt when it comes to being able to move in it.

Also, where are these pictures or animations of Gothitelle having any remote legs?(as that's kind of important, as the claim seems to be unfounded. I hear of this, but I have yet to see this. I've seen the feet only pics. So I know they exist). Either way, my dress point does show they have the ability to work quite differently, though that isn't a good enough reason for Gothitelle to not use Gardevoir's body shape. The issue, on the other hand, is an echo won't work in that regard. It makes more sense for a clone/semi-clone by using the same body shape.

 

[WolfCypher]

Wedding Hall stage from Odyssey would be pretty nice. If anything else, I'd like either another Final Fantasy stage, like at Gongaga with its ruined reactor (so we can have Tankceratops appear!)

Or

Stages representing characters that couldn't quite make the cut for smash. Like a Golden Sun stage for Isaac if he doesnt make it in, Ultra Space for Pokemon Sun/Moon if we don't get a 7th gen rep, or something like that.

Oh! and Bowser's castle. How have we not had a Bowser's Castle stage yet?! Should make it a stage that changes through the different styles (like you could do in Mario Maker) where it takes place in Bowser's castle as typically designed in Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario World, and then New Super Mario Bros.

I don't understand why Square Enix content is so limited in this game. I'd prefer the Ancient City/Capitol as an alternative FF7 stage, or the Gold Saucer a la a stage tour like Delfino Plaza.

 

[ZephyrZ]

Protip: don't believe leaks that have any character you want. Just don't.

I say go a step further and don't even bother looking at them if you can avoid it. Most leaks are going to be fake anyway, so why bother rifling through them looking for characters you want like so many people seem to do for some reason?

 

[Icedragonadam]

I think I know what one of the new stages might be. Well if you remember Mute City 3DS had the SNES added on to it now which is pretty strange as Mute City Melee wasn't confirmed and it's likely we have all the returning Stages for the Base Game right now. Well I think know the most likely new F-Zero stage if there is one in that case.

Spoiler

Mute City GX. It makes sense if Mute City 64 isn't returning.

 

[Zinith]

Elma is in Xenoblade 2 now. Nice...

 

[Bionichute]

boy do i hope everyone is wrong about only ten more characters including echoes being in the game

 

[WolfCypher]

I just beat XB2 30 minutes ago. Debating whether to NG+ now or later, or Torna DLC. Such a delightful game.

 

[Arcanir]

Regardless if the story behind it, Gothitelle would stick out like a sore thumb in terms of being in Smash, even as an echo.


So far, Echo fighters have either been highly requested (Dark Samus, Chrom, Daisy), or were protagonists in their own series(RIchter).


I just don't see someone as ho-hum as Gothitelle getting in.


Hell, even Isabelle being a Villager Echo makes more sense due to her being a huge money-maker and being pushed into the forefront of Animal Crossing.



And then beyond ALL this, she would stick out super hard in the Pokemon roster as well.

Every Pokemon we have in Smash has either been marketed to hell and back in their prime, or was hugely popular.

? The mascot.
? Was popular way back when, still here due to seniority.
? Was a cheap clone, but at the same time, Pichu was marketed like crazy during Gen 2.
? I don't even need to explain this one.
? Was Gen 4's poster boy.
? Was a gamble, but became HUGE in Gen6 due to it.
? *Etika.wav*


Gardevoir I get, but Gothitelle would literally be a "We need to fill a quota" pick, nothing more. It's not a highly marketed Pokemon, was never popular, and doesn't really 'have' anything to its name to begin with.

What makes this worse for her is that even at Gen 5's peak Gothitelle wasn't really that popular and marketing-wise she lost out to multiple other Pokémon like the legendaries, starters, Hydreigon, Haxorus, Zoroark and the like. She was basically the 'just there' Pokémon of the bunch and you could probably find like 50 other Pokemon that fans of the games would rather see.

Nowadays? Gothitelle is so forgettable, Lumineon doesn't remember she exists.

 

[T-Hell]

Protip: don't believe leaks that have any character you want. Just don't.

You mean I shouldn't believe this fresh new leak I found saying Waluigi is in as Ridley's echo? God damnit..

 

[MrPowerfulJeans]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

Hmm...

1. A Sonic Stage. But one from the Sonic Adventure series. Personally, I'll be gunning for City Escape or Wild Canyon.
2. The Champion's Room in the Indigo Plateau from Pokemon. But more like it is in Fire Red & Leaf Green.
3. The Cascade Kingdom from Super Mario Odyssey. Favorite Kingdom in that game, and I'd love to settle fights in Smash there.
4. Bowser's Castle. Preferably something that isn't generic as hell. Maybe take inspiration from Odyssey or 3D World, or something, that makes Bowser's Castle have more character.
5. Since Mario Kart has representation, why not throw in a Mario Party stage? Maybe something like Castaway Bay or Neon Heights or Shy Guy's Perplex Express. As long as it's a stage that looks pretty or nice, I'm down with whatever.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Both are garbage tbh

Well atleast Bakugo tries to be a hero (in a bad way yeah, but he’s focused on being no.1)...and has some sort of compassion

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

Bowser Kingdom!

 

[praline]

If 103 isn't the final count (I'm not trying to start the debate of whether it is or not.) what NEW stages would you want to see? I'd personally love to see a Wedding Hall stage from Mario Odyssey!

An Advance Wars stage, StarTropics stage and (if Isaac is not playable) then also a Golden Sun stage

 

[Jedisupersonic]

You mean I shouldn't believe this fresh new leak I found saying Waluigi is in as Ridley's echo? God damnit..

The mental image of this terrified me lmao.

 

[WolfCypher]

boy do i hope everyone is wrong about only ten more characters including echoes being in the game

Ehhh...I look at it like, this is a phenomenal roster, I'd be surprise if there WERE ten more characters left, and you're saying it like "only ten more" would be a bad thing. With the additions of Ridley, Ink girl, fake Peach, Symbiote Samus, Marth no.9, King K. Rool, Simon Belmont, and blue Simon Belmont, ten more newcomers brings the new fighter tally to 18, and the final roster would be 83! Where does the number need to be to make you satisfied?

 

[Bionichute]

Ehhh...I look at it like, this is a phenomenal roster, I'd be surprise if there WERE ten more characters left, and you're saying it like "only ten more" would be a bad thing. With the additions of Ridley, Ink girl, fake Peach, Symbiote Samus, Marth no.9, King K. Rool, Simon Belmont, and blue Simon Belmont, ten more newcomers brings the new fighter tally to 18, and the final roster would be 83! Where does the number need to be to make you satisfied?

actually new characters and not echoes

 

[Luminario]

They're actually only similar if you don't really look much into their animations. They're pretty distinct overall. Still, Sakurai uses mostly the anime designs in a lot of cases, so I doubt this'll happen. Gothitelle is the closest thing to Gardevoir from Gen V, but that's like saying Moblin Ganon in ALTTP and Moblin Ganon in OOT are similar. Yes, to some degree, but are very very distinct otherwise. Gardevoir's actually able to fully outright kick and its dress does not hinter it at all. It's more like Peach's dress, bar the fact it has a cut out in the front portion. Gothitelle's is a full out dress much more like Zelda's instead.

Another example would be why Daisy isn't getting any non-dress alts. It's because her animations are based around the dress. Gardevoir doesn't even wear a dress, it's much more like a skirt when it comes to being able to move in it.

But that depends entirely on whether Gardevoir would actually kick or not. If Gardevoir's legs are all over the place for attacks like ZSS or if the long trail of its dress is used as an attack then you're right, but its animations could easily be more subdued like Zelda's. A simple sweeping kick for down tilt or a stomp for dair is something that Gothitelle's dress also allows, and any other theatrical animations could just be toned down for Gothitelle as long as they dont intefere with accurately expressing the hitboxes on attacks.

 

[Zinith]

So what happened besides Elma in Xenoblade 2? I picked up where we were talking about music updates an "THICC Yoshi" don't ask

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

But that depends entirely on whether Gardevoir would actually kick or not. If Gardevoir's legs are all over the place for attacks like ZSS or if the long trail of its dress is used as an attack then you're right, but her animations could easily be more subdued like Zelda's. A simple sweeping kick for down tilt or a stomp for dair is something that Gothitelle's dress also allows, and any other theatrical animations could just be toned down for Gothitelle as long as they dont intefere with accurately expressing the hitboxes on attacks.

Gardevoir's not just a kicker, but has a completely different dress design. It fully has a cut-out opening. It doesn't flow remotely the same way that Gothitelle does at all.

Gardevoir moves like a dancer, not a completely restricted Zelda. They're severely different Pokemon animation-wise. Gothitelle has a completely different animation set bar, say, using Dark Pulse. You also missed my edit. Where are these pictures that prove Gothitelle has legs? Those are a requirement for same to share the same basic skeletons. They otherwise are very very different bar the top half, which is kind of similar.

 

[DarkFalcon]

What have I missed in the last 7 hours?

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

People are still talking about the Gardevoir leak?

Let me spell it out:

IT. IS. FAKE.

IT IS AS REAL AS ANY OTHER 4CHAN LEAK, WHICH IS FAKE.

PLEASE STOP TALKING ABOUT IT.

This has been a Public Service Announcement.

 

[Bionichute]

we desperately need actual new info

 

[drag0nscythe]

These are awesome! It would make my day to see a black knight one. If you end up making one for him is there any chance you could @ me in the post? I don't read everything and I wouldn't want to miss it.

Sigran101

 

[Dee Dude]

Speaking of dresses and legs.

Am I the only one slightly disappointed we still haven’t had Peach and Zelda alts with pants/without dresses.

Especially since they have modeled legs? (Not counting Smash 4 since they were mostly cover by black voids)

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Speaking of dresses and legs.

Am I the only one slightly disappointed we still haven’t had Peach and Zelda alts with pants/without dresses.

Especially since they have modeled legs? (Not counting Smash 4 since they were mostly cover by black voids)

No, but to be fair, the animations all use the dresses. That'd require a ton of work to do. Though I will say it would be a good excuse to make another character playable using Zelda's skeleton as a base(without the dress), heh.

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

Apparently we may be getting a Smash Bros Switch bundle. Pretty cool also someone zoom in and try to see if there's any unannounced characters.

This BETTER be a reality when its on pre-orders for Black Friday or around Christmas season. Can't...wait...any...longer. Oh the pain, it f-ing burns!