Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Staarih]

we already talk about this last page, I don't trust loz18 that much, and 3 months without anything is too much.

He’s not saying there won’t be anything until November, just that there’s a Direct in November.

 

[Pyra]

Wait, so how does Chrom's model compare to Roy? Is there any drastic difference, aside from appearance?

Pretty sure the Marths all basically have the same physical structure.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Wait, didn't Pac-Man have a son in the cartoons? Oh, cartoons back then were just weird. I swear I remember him having a child, but you can say it's not really canon.

Actually, yes, he had a son in the games as well. Two kids, at least, according to assorted spin-off games.

I don't blame you for not knowing though, given that in modern times (at least after the early 00s) Bamco is pretending that Ms. Pac-Man and the rest of the Pac-cast (like Professor Pac-Man and the Pac-Dog) never existed, leaving only Pac-Man and the ghosts, so it's a wonder that Smash's Pac-Land stage is allowed to acknowledge Ms. Pac-Man at all.

The Hanna-Barbera cartoon is still pretty darn weird regardless, though.

 

[Pakky]

What would make any of you legit mad at this point?

I think for me the absence of my last BIG pick would and that is, BWD.

That and or Shadow's music...jk

 

[Iridium]

Pretty sure the Marths all basically have the same physical structure.

So basically, I was wondering if they have the same height when it comes to their model. Pretty specific to analyze, but it's hard to tell for me.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Filling a quota != fulfilling a gimmick.

Ivy was added because Sakurai wanted a swtiching mechanic for starters, and it didn’t make sense to have all of them as heavies, so he put in Squirtle instead of Blastoise. And woth Charizard and Squirtle, Ivy made sense to finish the type effectiveness triangle and be a middle stage when the other two were there. I’m sure that if it came out where he said “I’m making a switching character using Charizard, Squirtle, and one other Pokémon. Who should be the third?” Ivy would be the obvious choice.

Gothitelle is a suggestion because “we totes should have a gen 5 rep and she’d fit Gardevoir’s skeleton as a tall thin woman!” And people are assuming Gardevoir would get added because again, “we don’t have a gen 3 rep!”

If he did add based on quotas, the Trainer would have had Charizard, Croconaw, and Treecko back in Brawl, and Zoroark would have joined in Sm4sh.

That doesn't disuade my point.

My point is that Sakurai added a full moveset of a Pokemon no-one was asking for, there's nothing to say he wouldn't make a Dark Pit/Dr. Mario for the sake of an ad line.

Plus Game Freak has been pushing the idea of Pokemon across all gens as of late. Pokken had pretty wacky Gen 5 + 6 reps when it was clear the devs hearts were in the first 4 gens.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Important details from loz18 that many will miss because they don't read:

View attachment 157795

Thanks for posting this, he further clarified there could (and probably will) be more beforehand.

This is an obvious prediction. I'm currently predicting quick reveal in September direct, announcment in October like Robin & Lucina, big Smash Direct in November and mayyyybe one more surprise reveal the week of the game. Would be cool but they never have before.

 

[T-Hell]

...People still trust Verg? I'd trust Loz over him

So you trust the guy who vaguely guessed like 1/3 of the Direct more than the guy whose sources made him correctly guess all the info he gave? Whatever man.

 

[Arcanir]

I don't think it was quite a real popularity poll, people voting knew there was going to be a distribution; that explains why many Legendaries scored so high. And because of this, we can't hold it against Gothitelle because it's unlikely people would want to vote for her when they can just find her in the wild.

At the same time though, we also had Pokemon like Krookodile, Luxray, Noivern, Hydreigon and Talonflame do much better despite being Pokemon more commonly found in the wild. Not to mention that the winner was Greninja, a starter that is handed out at the beginning of the game and was ridiculously common on Wonder Trade during Gen 6.

Even ignoring that, in general, Gothitelle has never been popular. Even among other Gen 5 Pokemon its results were very middling.

 

[Iridium]

Actually, yes, he had a son in the games as well. Two kids, at least, according to assorted spin-off games.

I don't blame you for not knowing though, given that in modern times (at least after the early 00s) Bamco is pretending that Ms. Pac-Man and the rest of the Pac-cast (like Professor Pac-Man and the Pac-Dog) never existed, leaving only Pac-Man and the ghosts, so it's a wonder that Smash's Pac-Land stage is allowed to acknowledge Ms. Pac-Man at all.

The Hanna-Barbera cartoon is still pretty darn weird regardless, though.

Interestingly, I actually have seen him in a cartoon, but I think only once. It might have been some sort of special, but otherwise, I have never seen him in any game at all before I was informed, so you're right when it comes to that.

 

[Michele]

Hm, so first Vergeben leaked, and now Loz is leaking...

It sounds like there is a war between Loz and Vergeben over who of the two is more right

 

[KMDP]

Actually, yes, he had a son in the games as well. Two kids, at least, according to assorted spin-off games.

I don't blame you for not knowing though, given that in modern times (at least after the early 00s) Bamco is pretending that Ms. Pac-Man and the rest of the Pac-cast (like Professor Pac-Man and the Pac-Dog) never existed, leaving only Pac-Man and the ghosts, so it's a wonder that Smash's Pac-Land stage is allowed to acknowledge Ms. Pac-Man at all.

The Hanna-Barbera cartoon is still pretty darn weird regardless, though.

Sounds an awful lot like what SEGA did with Sonic around 2008.

 

[Kuon]

I hope for her fans' sake that she's playable.
If I ever say something against it, it's usually just a hypothetical against Verg or something. But honestly, I feel like she's likely even without the "leaker boost".

Thanks. Some people, such as LittleRoyal, are saying:
"Ridley, Snake, and IC reveal was leaked Reset Era weeks before Vergeben. And Simon Belmont was leaked by Stealth way before Vergeben. Isabelle was heavily speculated since June and vergeben said she’s in in July. Vergeben has an originality report of 0%"
So some people think he's fake because all of the stuff he mentioned has been talked about before.

 

[QcSlayer]

I can see at least 2 big Smash Direct since this is Nintendo big game this year.

They still have to show Spirit mode and the Online Mode.

Having a Smash direct in november before release is logical since the game is coming very early December.

One after Nintendo presentation(details) on the yearly subscription.

We will probably see a newcomer in a normal Nintendo Direct.

The game announcement is so close to the release, we might very well have more then 1 newcomer per direct.

 

[MrSmashFour]

So you trust the guy who vaguely guessed like 1/3 of the Direct more than the guy whose sources made him correctly guess all the info he gave? Whatever man.

"no cuts" = not the same as "every character EVER coming back"

"Ridley" = a guess everybody and their mother has been making for years, this time, it turned out to be true

"Daisy" = as above

"Simon" = been expected since Brawl

These are all characters that have been fan favourite picks for YEARS, and that's WHY they're in the game, this game is tailored for fans. Verg spouted the typical claims everyone makes every year and this time it just happened to be true. Notice how he didn't "predict" Richter, who was revealed in the very same breath as Simon, because nobody was expecting Richter.

The nail in the coffin for me is his BS about the Gen 7 Pokemon. He just wants attention, if he knew what the Pokemon was, he would say it. He wouldn't keep stringing everyone along by saying "nope, it's not that one!".

He's full of BS, at first glance he seemed legit, and hell, maybe he was at one point, but I'm certain by now he's riding off coat-tails.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Sounds an awful lot like what SEGA did with Sonic around 2008.

Yes, though they eventually brought back the others anyway (and Tails was still around before that happened). Here, it's like Bamco suddenly hated the idea of Pac-Man having a nuclear family. Still less harsh than the whole One More Day deal stunt that was pulled in regards to Marvel's Peter Parker.

What would make any of you legit mad at this point?

I think for me the absence of my last BIG pick would and that is, BWD.

That and or Shadow's music...

The Rabbids showing up instead of Rayman. Bad enough that they have little reason to show up in Ubi's Smash clone...

 

[Pakky]

"no cuts" = not the same as "every character EVER coming back"

"Ridley" = a guess everybody and their mother has been making for years, this time, it turned out to be true

"Daisy" = as above

"Simon" = been expected since Brawl

These are all characters that have been fan favourite picks for YEARS, and that's WHY they're in the game, this game is tailored for fans. Verg spouted the typical claims everyone makes every year and this time it just happened to be true. Notice how he didn't "predict" Richter, who was revealed in the very same breath as Simon, because nobody was expecting Richter.

The nail in the coffin for me is his BS about the Gen 7 Pokemon. He just wants attention, if he knew what the Pokemon was, he would say it. He wouldn't keep stringing everyone along by saying "nope, it's not that one!".

He's full of BS, at first glance he seemed legit, and hell, maybe he was at one point, but I'm certain by now he's riding off coat-tails.

I didn't see him or Loz say anything about K Rool, or Dark Samus, funny.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Hm, so first Vergeben leaked, and now Loz is leaking...

It sounds like there is a war between Loz and Vergeben over who of the two is more right

There have been additional leaks?

 

[PlayerOneTyler]

we already talk about this last page, I don't trust loz18 that much, and 3 months without anything is too much.

That's why I put emphasis on the "probably don't read" part. lol.

 

[StormC]

I didn't see him or Loz say anything about K Rool, or Dark Samus, funny.

loz's "heroes vs. villains" theme was just footage of the beginning of K. Rool's trailer. He did say he thought K. Rool was probably in, but only speculated.

 

[MrSmashFour]

I didn't see him or Loz say anything about K Rool, or Dark Samus, funny.

For the record, I don't religiously trust Loz either.

 

[Michele]

There have been additional leaks?

I'm just pointing out that - I've noticed there's a tread when it comes to Vergeben vs Loz in terms of leaks and credibility. I imagine them teaming up for leaks, but that's unlikely.

The additional leak is that there a new Smash Direct on November

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Edit: Wrong thread

 

[ZephyrZ]

I can't believe people are seriously comparing Gothitelle's popularity to Ivysaur. Yeah the Bulba line is constantly overshadowed by the Squirtle and Charmander lines, but they're still among the most recognizable Pokemon of all time.

 

[Pakky]

For the record, I don't religiously trust Loz either.

Your avatar us great by the way

loz's "heroes vs. villains" theme was just footage of the beginning of K. Rool's trailer. He did say he thought K. Rool was probably in, but only speculated.

As is your avatar, I like it!

 

[Kuon]

He’s not saying there won’t be anything until November, just that there’s a Direct in November.

Yeah, the title of his thread is 'Next Nintendo Direct', but he says that it may not be the only one and that we'll probably get more sooner than that because of the online service. Then he apologizes for the misleading title, so chances are there will be one before November and, if he's right, there will be another one in November (possibly before Black Friday)

 

[SonicMario]

I do think whenever the next Smash Direct comes by whether it's in October or November, they'll be revealing all the newcomers they have left. It's going to make things tense for everybody watching. For the first time we'll be having live reactions to the full base game roster (Well technically we know most of it already but in terms of all the newcomers in the base game known) in real time in officially released information rather then it steadily spreading across the internet in the final week(/s) prior to release.

Though I suppose at least no one will say someone is a photoshopped Little Mac again since it will all be officially revealed.

 

[Dixie Kong]

I do think whenever the next Smash Direct comes by whether it's in October or November, they'll be revealing all the newcomers they have left. It's going to make things tense for everybody watching. For the first time we'll be having live reactions to the full base game roster (Well technically we know most of it already but in terms of all the newcomers in the base game known) in real time in officially released information rather then it steadily spreading across the internet in the final week(/s) prior to release.

Though I suppose at least no one will say someone is a photoshopped Little Mac again since it will all be officially revealed.

I’m going to be tense as heck until Dixie shows up on screen as a new fighter.

 

[Michele]

Guys, not to be or seem rude, but why are peoples suddenly talking about this 'Gothitelle' leak? What or who is he or she? And why is it suddenly surfacing up? First peoples were talking about Simon and this story mode, but then like a minute or so later, they are talking about this thing.

I'm just confused, that's all. It was like a sudden shift.

 

[Deleted member]

"Simon" = been expected since Brawl.

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I have no memory of anyone saying Simon was expected until Verge leaked him.

Is he a pretty solid choice in hindsight? Due to history, yeah, he is. Even with that though, I don't remember anyone bringing him up in the Brawl days (granted, I didn't look at that stuff much back then) and he was barely talked about at all during Wii U. Saying he was obvious is kind of a stretch, it's like saying Cloud was a shoe-in before he happened.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

I can't believe people are seriously comparing Gothitelle's popularity to Ivysaur

People are doing WHAT?

Guys, not to be or seem rude, but why are peoples suddenly talking about this 'Gothitelle' leak? What or who is he or she? And why is it suddenly surfacing up? First peoples were talking about Simon and this story mode, but then like a minute or so later, they are talking about this thing.

I'm just confused, that's all. It was like a sudden shift.

There was a leak, 4chan I think could be wrong, saying that we're getting Gardevoir and Gothitelle as an echo.

 

[Michele]

There was a leak, 4chan I think could be wrong, saying that we're getting Gardevoir and Gothitelle as an echo.

4chan leaks are almost likely fake, so why are peoples talking about that leak exactly? This is what confuses me exactly.

 

[PeridotGX]

What would make any of you legit mad at this point?

I think for me the absence of my last BIG pick would and that is, BWD.

That and or Shadow's music...jk

Dark Matter, a new Gen 1 Pokémon, or Goku.

"no cuts" = not the same as "every character EVER coming back"

"Ridley" = a guess everybody and their mother has been making for years, this time, it turned out to be true

"Daisy" = as above

"Simon" = been expected since Brawl

These are all characters that have been fan favourite picks for YEARS, and that's WHY they're in the game, this game is tailored for fans. Verg spouted the typical claims everyone makes every year and this time it just happened to be true. Notice how he didn't "predict" Richter, who was revealed in the very same breath as Simon, because nobody was expecting Richter.

The nail in the coffin for me is his BS about the Gen 7 Pokemon. He just wants attention, if he knew what the Pokemon was, he would say it. He wouldn't keep stringing everyone along by saying "nope, it's not that one!".

He's full of BS, at first glance he seemed legit, and hell, maybe he was at one point, but I'm certain by now he's riding off coat-tails.

Ah yes, Ridley was a safe guess, hence the 15% or so on the Rate their chances thread. Some people have forgotten how suprising Ridley was, concidering he was "Too Big" for the past two games. And Simon was hardly a safe guess, we didn't even know if Snake would be back.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

4chan leaks are almost likely fake, so why are peoples talking about that leak exactly? This is what confuses me exactly.

Again, could be wrong, but if I remember correctly he previously predicted Ritcher

 

[Kuon]

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I have no memory of anyone saying Simon was expected until Verge leaked him.

Is he a pretty solid choice in hindsight? Due to history, yeah, he is. Even with that though, I don't remember anyone bringing him up in the Brawl days (granted, I didn't look at that stuff much back then) and he was barely talked about at all during Wii U. Saying he was obvious is kind of a stretch, it's like saying Cloud was a shoe-in before he happened.

People are saying some guy named Stealth leaked Simon before Vergeben did though

 

[Lodestar65]

4chan leaks are almost likely fake, so why are peoples talking about that leak exactly? This is what confuses me exactly.

No idea why anybody is taking it seriously, it would require somebody to have stolen a demo Switch, datamined it, and for that data to have disappeared by the time anyone asked him for proof.

 

[KMDP]

Yes, though they eventually brought back the others anyway (and Tails was still around before that happened). Here, it's like Bamco suddenly hated the idea of Pac-Man having a nuclear family. Still less harsh than the whole One More Day deal stunt that was pulled in regards to Marvel's Peter Parker.

I will never truly understand One More Day (I mean, understand academically why and how it happened).

"How dare Peter Parker grow up and have a family! He should just stay a loser forever and ever and ever. That's what the fans want!"

Stuff like this is what happens when Fans get to run the Asylum, and make decisions based on their own Nostalgic Bias without considering the opinions of the fans who don't get to make sweeping decisions in the company.

I don't even read Marvel Comics and One More Day frustrates me.

And that is why we are blessed to have Sakurai developing Smash. (I can't believe I managed to tie this comment into Smash Bros. so it's not 100% off topic!)

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I do think whenever the next Smash Direct comes by whether it's in October or November, they'll be revealing all the newcomers they have left. It's going to make things tense for everybody watching. For the first time we'll be having live reactions to the full base game roster (Well technically we know most of it already but in terms of all the newcomers in the base game known) in real time in officially released information rather then it steadily spreading across the internet in the final week(/s) prior to release.

Though I suppose at least no one will say someone is a photoshopped Little Mac again since it will all be officially revealed.

I won't lie, the day of this month's Smash direct was pretty damn tense for me. It definitely paid off by the end of the presentation, though.

I can't imagine how I'll feel when the final one comes.

 

[ZephyrZ]

People are doing WHAT?

The logic goes "if Sakurai added a pokemon no one asked for like Ivysaur, he'd do it for Gothitelle to!"

I'll admit Sakurai isn't predictable, and popularity is not the sole reason he chooses the characters he does, but the Bulbasaur line is still extremely iconic, Ivysaur included.

 

[Michele]

No idea why anybody is taking it seriously, it would require somebody to have stolen a demo Switch, datamined it, and for that data to have disappeared by the time anyone asked him for proof.

You make a good point, I don't get why peoples are suddenly talking about it. Like, what does that has to do?