Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[monadoboy]

Last character reveal already had his island blown up... What do you got against DK man!?

Oof, I didn't realize, I just chose Donkey Kong 'cause of gorilla vs. gorilla and he's one of the original 12. Sorry DK

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

You forgot Pikachu lol

I was gonna put him, but I thankfully didn't see many lewds of it and it's also just an iconic face of gaming that it's almost assured they have porn

 

[Noipoi]

Is Gothitelle even similar in structure to Gardevoir?

...does Gothitelle have feet? It just looks like a tower with bows and a head on it.

But I mean I guess it could work. But why Gothitelle when I'm sure the moveset could transfer to someone more popular like Alakazam

Gothitelle has legs, but they're stubby and hidden under it's "dress".

And I suppose the reasoning would be that both Gardevoir and Gothitelle are feminine looking psychic types, while Alakazam's body type is different.

 

[Will]

Is Gothitelle even similar in structure to Gardevoir?

...does Gothitelle have feet? It just looks like a tower with bows and a head on it.

how do you think it moves, by hopping around?
It has feet.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

Quick reminder that Gardevoir is a pokéball Pokemon in both Brawl and Smash4...still not seem in Smash Ultimate.

Just read the leak. Honestly wouldn't mind Gardevoir. Omega Ruby was the Pokemon Game i have the most fond memories of.

 

[Nazyrus]

Like, I'd be fine with Gardevoir.

Gothitelle though would be a very hard sell.


Even Dark Pit is more iconic as far as Echo Fighters are concerned, and it'd literally be "Because we need to represent Gen5 but don't want to give it a unique fighter."


The rest of the leak is fine. Mario2 is odd, but I legit expect a 3rd Mario at this point.

So Mario 2… probably the Wart thing is true since he appears in Super Mario 2… I just wished it was someone else rather than him. Not that i would complain, but hey…

 

[New_Dumal]

Is Gothitelle even similar in structure to Gardevoir?

...does Gothitelle have feet? It just looks like a tower with bows and a head on it.

But I mean I guess it could work. But why Gothitelle when I'm sure the moveset could transfer to someone more popular like Alakazam

Gothitelle is kind of a "dark girl".
People love this stuff. It's why Shadow is more popular than Tails, Eggman and Knuckles.
I can see people who even don't know Pokemon going "I'll try this this one out".

 

[Mc.Rad]

What.... What if... What if they don't add a Pokemon in this game?

 

[Noipoi]

About Gardevoir, it's one of my top favourite Pokémon; I'd love it as a Fighter in Smash.

Yeah me too, honestly i'm not even mad at this leak, just confused. I would love if it were true.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I can see Gardevoir being a potential fighter (although it's probably unlikely at this point), but not Gothitelle.

 

[Roberk]

When I read about Gardevoir being mentioned in a leak that guessed Richter as a clone with other pieces of proven info I think to myself "yes".

When I read about Gothitelle being mentioned in a leak that guessed Richter as a clone with other pieces of proven info I think to myself "no".

 

[Noipoi]

What.... What if... What if they don't add a Pokemon in this game?

Blasphemy.

 

[Mc.Rad]

Gothitelle is kind of a "dark girl".
We all know people love this stuff. It's why Shadow is more popular than Tails, Eggman and Knuckles.
I can see people who even don't know Pokemon going "I'll try this this one out".

You mean goth?

Because that's exactly the word you're looking for

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Like I said earlier, something like Mario2 almost surely will exist in Ultimate's code and not actually reference a real character. What makes that leak hard to believe is that, if he really stole the demo, he should have been able to easily run it and post detailed screenshots and video of everything. It also doesn't make sense that there would be data for Richter but not Simon or really that the demo would contain some partial but slightly more expansive roster. Realistically either the demo contains data for only the 30 characters and was carefully scrubbed for all other data or it contains the entire character roster and those outside of the 30 are just flagged not to be unlocked yet. From a practical standpoint, this leak's story doesn't make sense, and I don't think the plausibility of the characters is even worth considering until you can answer questions like "if you stole the demo, why don't you have detailed direct capture footage of gameplay?".

 

[Will]

What.... What if... What if they don't add a Pokemon in this game?

They will.
If it's not base, it will be DLC.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

What.... What if... What if they don't add a Pokemon in this game?

As much as I love Pokemon, I'd actually be ok with this.

 

[Polan]

Disney doesn't really care about Sora, but Mickey?

I mean Disney has shown interest in Mickey meeting Mario.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/06/16/e3-2015-disney-wants-to-see-mickey-mouse-meet-mario
Smash Bros is the only place where I could see this realistically happening (maybe Mario Kart). Def not as his own fighter tho, but having him as part of Sora's final smash would be cool.

 

[Starbound]

Like, I'd be fine with Gardevoir.

Gothitelle though would be a very hard sell.


Even Dark Pit is more iconic as far as Echo Fighters are concerned, and it'd literally be "Because we need to represent Gen5 but don't want to give it a unique fighter."


The rest of the leak is fine. Mario2 is odd, but I legit expect a 3rd Mario at this point.

If Echoes can borrow a few moves from other characters, I could see Paper Mario be an echo of Mario. It's a stretch (and doesn't represent the best two games in the series which is a shame) but:
- Mario as a base. Apply the Game & Watch 2D effect to his model (as G&W is a 3D model also, with a line in the coding that makes him 2D. Paper Mario would have this too.)
- Swap Fludd for Dr. Tornado, calling it Tornado Jump.
- Swap Smash attacks with Ice Climbers to get the Hammer attacks.
- Retexture cape to look like a Tanooki tail, with a new animation (which they give for everyone else)

It would suck but I would honestly rather see it than the 3rd Mario being "Polygonal Classic Mario".

Metal Mario would be cool as a nod to past games though. But I don't know what would make him different from Doc, other than being Doc to the extremes.

 

[ZephyrZ]

Pft, who says we gotta reduce their speed? I want to see a 60 mph turtle tank flying at you with death in its eyes.

And Charizard has one of top 10 fastest run speeds in Smash 4. That wasn't my point. The problem with super heavies isn't just speed, it's that their massive size and weight make extremely easy to land hits on. Squirtle is the perfect counterpart to Zard because, as well as having better frame data and air speed, he's also much better at escaping from combos and juggles. But his lack of raw strength makes it harder for him to get kills and his leightweight that helps him escape combos also makes him die early, which is where a superheavy like Zard will come in handy.

I don't think Blastoise and Charizard could really have that same synergy. Both would probably struggle from being comboed or juggled and would thus have the same general weaknesses.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

So Mario 2… probably the Wart thing is true since he appears in Super Mario 2… I just wished it was someone else rather than him. Not that i would complain, but hey…

Or rather Birdo, seeing as Wart probably has less support.

 

[BlueMagician]

I think we stopped thinking popularity mattered when we saw all of Dr. Mario, Wii Fit Trainer, Corrin and Dark Pit

For what it's worth, I know the Japanese requested Dark Pit quite a bit before Smash 4 came out.

 

[Green_Pikmin*]

When I read about Gardevoir being mentioned in a leak that guessed Richter as a clone with other pieces of proven info I think to myself "yes".

When I read about Gothitelle being mentioned in a leak that guessed Richter as a clone with other pieces of proven info I think to myself "no".

Same, Im trying to leave my personal bias out when I look at "leaks" and take time to see why this would be the case to determine if its real or fake in my opinion.

 

[New_Dumal]

You mean goth?

Because that's exactly the word you're looking for

I'm aware of the existence of this word, but thanks.
I used dark instead because it's a bigger scope. I can say Shadow is dark and edgy, but not goth.
Since goth is exactly the best term to Gothitelle, I opted for double quotes.
I am sorry to make you confused

 

[perfectchaos83]

I'd love to see Gardevoir in Smash. It's my 2nd favorite Pokemon. I just don't think it'll happen, Especially not with a Gothitelle Echo.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

Now that K. Rools in smash...I really gotta finish Donkey Kong Country.

 

[Noipoi]

I'm aware of the existence of this word, but thanks.
I used dark instead because it's a bigger scope. I can say Shadow is dark and edgy, but not goth.
Since goth is exactly the best term to Gothitelle, I opted for double quotes.
I am sorry to make you confused

Shadow is absolutely goth.
He shops at Hot Topic on the daily.
My Immortal is his bible.

 

[New_Dumal]

Shadow is absolutely goth.
He shops at Hot Topic on the daily.
My Immortal is his bible.

I thought he was more in the nu-metal movement.
I'm sure he listen HybridTheory/Meteora almost everyday.

 

[P.Kat]

Oh they all are, trust me. The only one that is really meh and random is reoded, but the rest are totally canon (and super important). Now the usual question I have about Sora in Smash is… which version of Sora would we get? I think Sora from KH1 ( and chain of memories) is the safest bet. For a few reasons… he is currently SO DAMN OP in the current games and the upcoming one, it's not even funny how strong this boy is. But something tells me that Sakurai will do something similar like with King K Rool… we would get a Sora that gathers the best of each of his games for his moveset. Man… I really want a Disney rep in Smash, and Sora is definitely the best choice, nevermind how famous he is everywhere and specially Japan… plus KH3 coming just makes it so convenient to appear in smash a month before the newest game...

Funny note… Why would Sora not want a "Sora" character in Smash anyway? lol

I'd like for him to at least use KH2 Sora, so Sora could use Drive form to change his way of fighting, or provide permanent buffs until Sora changes again, and add in anti-form Sora for players who relies too much on it.

Did Gardevoir do well in the ballot? Gardevoir is a popular Pokemon but so are a million others, I don't see why Sakurai would pick this one specifically.

Popular enough for a Mega-form
The Kalos Champion's main Pokémon
Had a decent role in the last Kalos movie similar to how incineroar had a role in a movie
Distributed as an event Pokémon from the movie it appeared in
Her Pokéball has yet to appear n ultimate to disconfirms her

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Metal Mario would be cool as a nod to past games though. But I don't know what would make him different from Doc, other than being Doc to the extremes.

You can temporarily play as Metal Mario by having Mario pick up a Metal Box.

Anyway, the biggest dilemma that keeps Metal Mario from being a separate entity is the fact that metal fighters are 4.5x heavier than normal, and they reduce the BKB of opposing hitboxes by 30 units; that basically enables them to survive well beyond 300% damage if you don't find a way to send them flying off-stage.

At least the game can get around this by giving Mario a permanent metal status, and increase the amount of knockback that he takes from attacks.

 

[Darkraid]

This leak is quite strong.
Ritcher as a clone was something almost nobody would bet on. A echo of a third party.
Another thing, Nintendo absolutely would care more about hiding Simon than most of characters.
What colds this one is that K.Rool is explicit here, I don't see why would they hide Simon but let K.Rool in.
Anyway, it has Dark Samus, Ritcher and K.Rool. I think this is impressive. Maybe a lucky guess, but a very lucky one at least.

This leak is bs. He got Richter right, but he said Simon is not in the game.

 

[Cosmic77]

If think Pokemon is the one exception where Sakurai should focus more on relevancy instead of popularity. Everyone already assumes that we're getting Pokemon from the latest Gen, and that makes speculation a lot easier on us. Opening the gate to 800+ Pokemon can cause a lot of division and controversy, especially when everyone wants a different Pokemon.

I'd imagine you have.

Let me do it for you though:

Lucario
Lopunny
Gardevoir
Lurantis
Bounsweet's evo, if I remember what it looks like correctly.
Salazzle
Blaziken
Charizard
Delphox (forgot the final evos name)
Any of the Eeveelutions + Eevee itself
Arcanine
Ninetails
Mewtwo
Lugia
Solgaleo
Feraligatr
Typhlosion
Scrafty
Dragonite
Nihilego is interesting
Buzzwole too
The Tapus
Mew
Serperior
Keldeo
Infernape
Machamp
Incineroar
Primarina
Meowth/Persian
Luxray

I feel like I'm forgetting a few, but there's lots and these are the first that came to mind and it's already getting too long.

****! Goodra!

That's quite an extensive list for someone who hates all that Gardevoir "exposure".

 

[Reality_Ciak]

This leak is bs. He got Richter right, but he got simon wrong.

He "didn't see" Simon in the "datamine". Same with Chrom. Omission isn't exactly wrong. Not that it isn't suspicious...

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Lady Byakugan

Castlevania hasn't had a game in fifteen years, you say?

Hmmmm.

Smooth Criminal

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

This leak is bs. He got Richter right, but he said Simon is not in the game.

This is the umpteenth time I've said this, but it was a demo build, which explains why he thought Simon wasn't in the game. If the "leak" is fake, it's not because of the reason you listed.

 

[Starbound]

You can temporarily play as Metal Mario by having Mario pick up a Metal Box.

Anyway, the biggest dilemma that keeps Metal Mario from being a separate entity is the fact that metal fighters are 4.5x heavier than normal, and they reduce the BKB of opposing hitboxes by 30 units; that basically enables them to survive well beyond 300% damage if you don't find a way to send them flying off-stage.

At least the game can get around this by giving Mario a permanent metal status, and increase the amount of knockback that he takes from attacks.

For obvious balance reasons, Metal Mario as a separate entity wouldn't apply the usual metal effect to him because Sakurai actually does care about balancing. Applying multipliers to weight, speed and jump height would be all that would be needed to make a convincing echo. And maybe when he gets a Metal Box, he turns Gold instead.

 

[Green_Pikmin*]

So far combining the demo miner, Verge, loz18, subtle hints from the direct, a "few" newcomers left, and if the stage total is set in stone this is what I think is left of the roster:

•Gardevoir
•Skull Kid
•Geno
•Dixie Kong (E)
•Impa (E)
•Isabelle (E)
•Shadow (E)
•Gothitelle (E)
•Ken (E)

*If this were the case I would feel DLC at this point would be a given, especially with the blurred out menu option to the right completely ignored in the direct thats probably a shop icon, and the fact that theres atleast 6 available slots on the stage select screen. (Assuming they dont make a seperate tab for DLC stages like done in the past).

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Is this the same guy who had a Discord dedicated to attempting to datamine, or no?

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I don't get why everyone thinks Gothitelle is gonna be an echo all of a sudden. Gothitelle has has nothing' on Gardevoir. And i don't think she was very recognizable.

 

[Starbound]

Just saying but if we're going to start considering the demo miner leak legit, can we also take the GAF leak more seriously for predicting Simon, K. Rool and Chrom as Roy's echo?

Mostly because I can't deal with talking about Gothitelle every 5 minutes.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

For obvious balance reasons, Metal Mario as a separate entity wouldn't apply the usual metal effect to him because Sakurai actually does care about balancing. Applying multipliers to weight, speed and jump height would be all that would be needed to make a convincing echo. And maybe when he gets a Metal Box, he turns Gold instead.

Metal Mario is supposed to be slower and fall like an anchor though, so it would make little sense for him to be an Echo Fighter.