Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[TMNTSSB4]

We don't. All we know is his gentleman.

That said, I'd personally that echoes get the Falco treatment than the Dark Pit treatment.

So not an echo?

View attachment 156994
So I saw this on 4chan and I've been thinking about it for a while, but why does Mario have two icons here? I don't see a reason to why they couldn't fit all the mario songs together.

Mario must have more songs that every other series...idk

Waitaminute, so the new icons are in for Ultimate Mains, but not on the website yet to use in messages?

Smashboards plz

Smashboards is wanting us to suffer

 

[vaanrose]

I still feel like if Dixie were in she'd have been seen in K. Rool's trailer.

It was the Kongs versus their greatest nemesis.

The only thing I can think of is Sakurai has made her a semi-clone or something and she's getting her own trailer later where she has to save Diddy and Dixie from K. Rool like in DKC3.

I had the same thought, in the moment. But I've come back around now. I think you keep her out of the trailer for the same reason you keep Dark Samus out of Ridley's. You want the original character to be the big focus, and the echo is the extra dessert you get later. With Richter, he and Simon were designed from the ground up to exist together, which isn't the case with Dark Samus/Ridley and (potentially) Dixie/K.Rool, so it makes more sense to announce him alongside Simon.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Eh, I don't think that's necessary. I honestly feel like Echoes can be shown off separate from their main series, like Dark Samus, or how Daisy was the first Echo shown but we still think Geno's in.

Dark Samus has no correlation with Ridley besides them both being villains in Samus's life. They're totally unconnected.

Daisy likewise has even less to do with Geno. She's not even MENTIONED in Super Mario RPG as far as I remember.

Dixie literally fights alongside Donkey and Diddy frequently against K. Rool. It's how she debuted.

It makes sense for her to be in a Kongs vs K Rool trailer if she was in.

 

[Pyra]

I think the second Mario icon on the sound test is "Mario (other)" for the Mario Kart/RPG songs

I initially mused it would be a placeholder icon for a Mario (RPGs) category for things like Paper Mario and SMRPG songs, but I mean, the Paper Mario stage uses a Mushroom. Not that it's impossible that they could change it (a star would work better for this imo) but it's more than likely just an "other" or "spin-off" category.

Wart? As in the villain of Mario 2?
...
I wouldn't even be mad.

Yep. The one and only. A SMB2 theme would also make sense for a Toad reveal, if there was going to be one.

 

[Enchess]

Personally, Quote is the indie rep I would love to see the most, since Cave Story is the game that kind of ushered in the golden age of indie games, his games have been consistently released on Nintendo consoles, and he's got tons of moveset potential.

I don't want indie characters in Smash, but would be particularly salty if we got an indie character who isn't Quote. If any indie has earned it, it's him.

 

[Idon]

So not an echo?

Mario must have more songs that every other series...idk

Smashboards is wanting us to suffer

Yes, not an echo.
It would take, so, so very little compared to what they've already done.

 

[Noipoi]

Personally, Quote is the indie rep I would love to see the most, since Cave Story is the game that kind of ushered in the golden age of indie games, his games have been consistently released on Nintendo consoles, and he's got tons of moveset potential.

I am 152% down for Quote, too bad it's never happening.

 

[KMDP]

My friend and I were talking about what if they pull a complete curveball and reveal Toad after all- in Wart's reveal trailer.

Well, they'd be revealing a toad in Wart's reveal trailer.
---
Okay, F-Zero fans. Assuming Black Shadow would be a Ganondorf Echo, who would you pick to be Falcon's Echo?

You can't say Blood Falcon.

 

[Shroob]

Dark Samus has no correlation with Ridley besides them both being villains in Samus's life. They're totally unconnected.

Daisy likewise has even less to do with Geno. She's not even MENTIONED in Super Mario RPG as far as I remember.

Dixie literally fights alongside Donkey and Diddy frequently against K. Rool. It's how she debuted.

It makes sense for her to be in a Kongs vs K Rool trailer if she was in.

True, but at the very end of the trailer, DK and Diddy get 'captured' by K.Rool

:BigThink:

 

[Will]

Well, they'd be revealing a toad in Wart's reveal trailer.
---
Okay, F-Zero fans. Assuming Black Shadow would be a Ganondorf Echo, who would you pick to be Falcon's Echo?

why the **** would black shadow have a sword

 

[Starbound]

Speaking of Indies, I was watching a recent Source Gaming video and they were talking about indies and apparently Sakurai visited both Yacht Club Games (Shovel Knight) and WayForward (Shantae).

If I can find it, I'll post it but I would honestly be okay with Shantae as an assist trophy.

 

[Noipoi]

why the **** would black shadow have a sword

Because he's another anime swordsman.

 

[Pyra]

Screw it, let's put ALL the indie characters in.
Would make for a good use of popcorn in the community I think

Who wants to ditto match me as... uh...

...Shuffles cards...

Sans Undertal-- Damn it, these damn cards are rigged.

Well, they'd be revealing a toad in Wart's reveal trailer.

Well, you could argue it's *the* Toad from SMB2, like you could argue about "that" specific Magikoopa from Yoshi's Island

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I don't really understand how or why they'd have a ''Mario (Other)". It'd be a little cluttered no? There's no ''Pokemon (Other)" and I'm fairly sure it has music from various spin-offs as well, no?

 

[Mc.Rad]

why the **** would black shadow have a sword

He actually used the 10 Billion Space Credits on a "cursed sword" that Don Genie put on Future Ebay as a joke.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I am 152% down for Quote, too bad it's never happening.

Yeah, the fans clearly want a Cave Story 2, yet Daisuke Amaya is desperately trying to get people on other games he makes in the meantime.

 

[KMDP]

why the **** would black shadow have a sword

...We know now Echoes don't have to have all their originals attacks.

If they took Ganondorf's attributes and gave Black Shadow Falcon's animations, he'd be Ganondorf's Echo (same attributes). No Sword needed.

 

[Deleted member]

I really hope this song makes a return. Was it in Smash 4?

 

[Noipoi]

Screw it, let's put ALL the indie characters in.
Would make for a good use of popcorn in the community I think

Who wants to ditto match me as... uh...

...Shuffles cards...

Sans Undertal-- Damn it, these damn cards are rigged.

Freddy Fazbear vs Sans Undertale vs Monika vs Baldi.
Match of the century.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Smash 4 isn't nearly as bad as some people make them out to be, but this game is making Smash 4 seem tiny in comparison.
Is there even a reason to use my Wii U anymore?

My wii u only exists to play wii games nowadays, and Xenoblade X until it's hopefully ported

 

[Will]

He actually used the 10 Billion Space Credits on a "cursed sword" that Don Genie put on Future Ebay as a joke.

Funny how Chrom is an echo of an OG echo, Black Shadow having the same would be funny.
But he'd probably just be a Falcon echo who's more buff.

...We know now Echoes don't have to have all their originals attacks.

If they took Ganondorf's attributes and gave Black Shadow Falcon's animations, he'd be Ganondorf's Echo (same attributes). No Sword needed.

There's a difference here. We all know Chrom shattered the expectations of what Echoes could be, but get this:

IT'S ONE MOVE

Four moves makes it a big ****in' difference.

 

[Starbound]

Well, they'd be revealing a toad in Wart's reveal trailer.
---
Okay, F-Zero fans. Assuming Black Shadow would be a Ganondorf Echo, who would you pick to be Falcon's Echo?

You can't say Blood Falcon.

I would honestly just make Black Shadow a Falcon echo.

He would basically be Falcon with all of Ganondorf's properties (except with more speed maybe?) and basically Melee Ganondorf.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Freddy Fazbear vs Sans Undertale vs Monika vs Baldi.
Match of the century.

I made a long Freddy Fazbear thread full of jokes and pictures and a moveset to support before realizing FNAF isn't on a Nintendo system and never posted it

 

[Will]

I really hope this song makes a return. Was it in Smash 4?

If I didn't know this was Pokemon I would've guessed this was a Mother song. It just sounds like one.

 

[Deleted member]

I really hope this song makes a return. Was it in Smash 4?

It was. With the new music selection though, I'll finally be able to use it on a stage that makes sense. It's been on Spear Pillar and Kalos League so far.

 

[vaanrose]

why the **** would black shadow have a sword

I swear I'm not being facetious here, but... why not? If literally everything Falcon does is invented for Smash, why not invent a cool space sword for Black Shadow?

 

[Noipoi]

It was. With the new music selection though, I'll finally be able to use it on a stage that makes sense. It's been on Spear Pillar and Kalos League so far.

It was? I never heard it when playing Smash 4...

 

[Will]

I swear I'm not being facetious here, but... why not? If literally everything Falcon does is invented for Smash, why not invent a cool space sword for Black Shadow?

I miss the elbow of darkness, let me live my fantasy.

 

[Deleted member]

It was? I never heard it when playing Smash 4...

It is unlocked from a random CD, so it may be that you just never unlocked it.

 

[cmbsfm]

Speaking of Indies, I was watching a recent Source Gaming video and they were talking about indies and apparently Sakurai visited both Yacht Club Games (Shovel Knight) and WayForward (Shantae).

If I can find it, I'll post it but I would honestly be okay with Shantae as an assist trophy.

Wait Sakurai visited Yacht Club and WayForward?

Aw ****, Shantae’s in, isn’t she...

 

[Pyra]

Man, I wish the Moon wasn't deconfirmed. He could have been a good Captain Falcon echo.
Except it's signature variance would be that it can only move toward its opponent. Like a gigantic celestial Falcon Punch.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

I miss the elbow of darkness, let me live my fantasy.

I mean, it'd technically be unique as well, since Falcon's FSmash is a back handed punch of sorts now? Something like that, all I know is that it's different

 

[KMDP]

I swear I'm not being facetious here, but... why not? If literally everything Falcon does is invented for Smash, why not invent a cool space sword for Black Shadow?

Also, Echoes don't have to have the same moves as the character they're echoing, just so long as the moves already exist.

Make Black Shadow Ganondorf's Echo, take away the sword and replace them with the Falcon moves Ganondorf used to have, and he'd still be a Ganondorf echo because he uses Ganondorf's weight and movement speed.

Also it gives F-Zero fans a chance to have three F-Zero characters (even if they'd all play the same. >_>)

 

[Will]

Wait Sakurai visited Yacht Club and WayForward?

Aw ****, Shantae’s in, isn’t she...

Probably, but we don't know in what shape she is in. It could be an Assist like Shovel Knight, which I'd be fine with.

Also, Echoes don't have to have the same moves as the character they're echoing, just so long as the moves already exist.

Make Black Shadow Ganondorf's Echo, take away the sword and replace them with the Falcon moves Ganondorf used to have, and he'd still be a Ganondorf echo because he uses Ganondorf's weight and movement speed.

Also it gives F-Zero fans a chance to have three F-Zero characters (even if they'd all play the same. >_>)

Again, ONE MOVE compared to four (that being the smash attacks and the F-Air) is a big difference. If they do indeed go through the lengths to make Black Shadow a character, make him and Echo, and give him four varying moves, this really ****s on what an Echo can be. Notably because Dr. Mario is in some magic limbo of why he wasn't treated similarly.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Screw it, let's put ALL the indie characters in.
Would make for a good use of popcorn in the community I think

Who wants to ditto match me as... uh...

...Shuffles cards...

Sans Undertal-- Damn it, these damn cards are rigged.

That'd be awesome, I'd be down for seeing Hat Kid, Esmyrelda from Cryamore, Brick from Starr Mazer and the Battle Princess Madelyn in there.

Now if only some folks could get Steven McCarthy to focus on Ghost Police again...

 

[Noipoi]

Wait Sakurai visited Yacht Club and WayForward?

Aw ****, Shantae’s in, isn’t she...

I'd love that. I actually voted for her during the ballot.
Though an Assist like Shovel Knight would be more than enough.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

EDIT: Another point I wanted to make despite it seeming as if most people have caught on. Echo fighters seems to be based on a character that comes from the same series. I don't see it often here, but there are plenty of people on other sites suggesting clones from completely different series.

If you ask me, Echo Fighters will be characters from the same series of their base series. So basically, no Jody Summer based on ZSS, or some other combination.

I thought this would be obvious, but apparently not. That isn't to say it COULDN'T happen, but I don't really see why it would at this point.

I'm not a fan of Echo Fighters being based on characters from completely different series. It comes off as "this character's moveset is so boring and generic, we could just give it to anybody!"

The one exception I've ever heard is Boshi as a Yoshi echo, and even then Yoshi is still apart of the connected Mario franchise.

 

[Apollo500]

I really hope this song makes a return. Was it in Smash 4?

Given that this game has 800+ tracks, I'll be genuinely shocked if even a single stage song from across the series is left out.

 

[Mutsukki]

Wait Sakurai visited Yacht Club and WayForward?

Aw ****, Shantae’s in, isn’t she...

Probably!

As an Assist Trophy.

Watch her be casually revealed in another AT montage just like Shovel Knight

 

[Shroob]

Nah guys, it's obvious.

Shantae's in, but Dixie is an echo fighter of Shantae, not Diddy.

/heavy sarcasm