Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Retroend]

We're at 66 now, so your wish is already fulfilled.

i meant the final roster.

 

[PeridotGX]

The Great Cave Offensive was originally an Epic Yarn stage, but got changed to the GCO when Sakurai learned of Wooly World and didn't want two stages with the yarn aesthetic.

So he abandoned a stage based on Modern Kirby once he found out about a game releasing one year later that would be similar? Seems biased to me.

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

Here's where the whole lining up by number of appearance makes totally no sense, okay? When Sakurai said you'd start with the original Smash 64 roster, he either means we'll start with the original 8 or the original 12. But, if it's the original 12, the CSS is going to end up looking like this with the new order.

View attachment 149892

Is this the future you want?

The thing is: We don't know how many can fit in a row. What was the row limit in Sm4sh? 12? With each game they seem to only be getting higher but I mean, I could be wrong given whatever the f*** Melee's was as well as Sm4sh's post-DLC additions ruining an otherwise orderly roster

How many were in a row on the demo?

This means Brawl was the only other game sans 64 to have a passable organization.

 

[Shroob]

i meant the final roster.

Problem is the random button.

The roster can't be symmetrical unless we get either 7 or 11 more newcomers.

So you can have an even number, but it won't be symmetrical.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So he abandoned a stage based on Modern Kirby once he found out about a game releasing one year later that would be similar? Seems biased to me.

tbf he wouldn't know about a delay. That being said, why go back to GCO?

 

[Retroend]

Problem is the random button.

The roster can't be symmetrical unless we get either 7 or 11 more newcomers.

So you can have an even number, but it won't be symmetrical.

wasn't a problem with smash 4's roster. i think its possible.

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

Problem is the random button.

The roster can't be symmetrical unless we get either 7 or 11 more newcomers.

So you can have an even number, but it won't be symmetrical.

So 7 really does seem like the magic number...

 

[RileyXY1]

tbf he wouldn't know about a delay. That being said, why go back to GCO?

Sakurai has a bias towards Kirby games that he worked on. That is why no elements from modern Kirby are used in Smash.

 

[Shroob]

wasn't a problem with smash 4's roster. i think its possible.

I mean, with the random button, it was 57 spots.

I think a lot of people are predicting a 6x12 rectangle atm.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

So he abandoned a stage based on Modern Kirby once he found out about a game releasing one year later that would be similar? Seems biased to me.

Upon finding out about Wooly World he decided to make the Wooly World stage we have now in Smash 4.

tbf he wouldn't know about a delay. That being said, why go back to GCO?

Probably because the Epic Yarn stage was built like the GCO stage we have (e.g. a giant maze-like stage), so when he decided to change it because of the incoming Wooly World stage, he changed it into a setting that was still fitting and recognizable, instead of just throwing the work spent on the stage away.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

This is pure conjecture, but "not too many" would imply anything. In the main roster (without the unrevealed hidden characters)? In the entire roster without DLC (if DLC is considered)? In the roster with said DLC attached? It's so nebulous as it is.

Sakurai has a bias towards Kirby games that he worked on. That is why no elements from modern Kirby are used in Smash.

In other words, one probably shouldn't get their hopes too high for Magolor and Bandana Dee.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

The ironic part is that Chrom actually does. He gets Aether in Awakening and uses a high jump with a spinning somersault landing in one of the cutscenes.

Always wondered if that was just a lack of research by the Treehouse team or an error that existed in the Japanese version too.

The jumping somersault spin is even one of his charge attacks in Fire Emblem Warriors.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

This is pure conjecture, but "not too many" would imply anything. In the main roster (without the unrevealed hidden characters)? In the entire roster without DLC (if DLC is considered)? In the roster with said DLC attached? It's so nebulous as it is.



In other words, one probably shouldn't get their hopes too high for Magolor and Bandana Dee.

I think people are just reading way too much into the "don't expect too many newcomers" thing. "Not too many" is so subjective itself (how many is exactly "too many"?), and I've pointed out earlier in the thread how he we had pretty much the same exact thing happen in Smash 4, where shortly after its first unveiling Sakurai made some statements in an interview that implied the roster wouldn't be so big (such key words being "we're at the upper limit of what's feasible" and "a change in direction may be needed"), which then lead to people claiming we were going to get barely any newcomers (especially with many people believing the Gematsu leaks was it) and a significant amount of people thinking the whole roster would be smaller than Brawl's; there were even "news" sites reporting that "Sakurai said Smash 4's roster will be smaller than Brawl's". Yet in the end Smash 4's newcomer count and roster expansion was inline with Brawl's in the base game, despite having to make the game for two very different systems simultaneously and having to make the jump to HD, while Sakurai confirmed several more characters were planned but had to be scrapped because of time constraints.

So I'll again reiterate I'm going to take Sakurai's statement at face value of "not as many newcomers as Brawl and Smash 4 had", and that it was more of a statement to quell wild expectations like 20+ newcomers.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I think people are just reading way too much into the "don't expect too many newcomers" thing. "Not too many" is so subjective itself (how many is exactly "too many"?), and I've pointed out earlier in the thread how he we had pretty much the same exact thing happen in Smash 4, where shortly after its first unveiling Sakurai made some statements in an interview that implied the roster wouldn't be so big (such key words being "we're at the upper limit of what's feasible" and "a change in direction may be needed"), which then lead to people claiming we were going to get barely any newcomers (especially with many people believing the Gematsu leaks was it) and a significant amount of people thinking the whole roster would be smaller than Brawl's; there were even "news" sites reporting that "Sakurai said Smash 4's roster will be smaller than Brawl's". Yet in the end Smash 4's newcomer count and roster expansion was inline with Brawl's in the base game, despite having to make the game for two very different systems simultaneously and having to make the jump to HD, while Sakurai confirmed several more characters were planned but had to be scrapped because of time constraints.

So I'll again reiterate I'm going to take Sakurai's statement at face value of "not as many newcomers as Brawl and Smash 4 had", and that it was more of a statement to quell wild expectations like 20+ newcomers.

Ultimate has a slightly her chance in having less newcomers due to them bringing back all the cut characters of old and reworking 60+ characters (excluding future dlc of course), but overall I agree with what you say (still only thinking 7-8 more newcomers excluding echoes will be left)

 

[Lisbon Mapping]

I'd be fine with only a handful more newcomers if it means we get a new Subspace Emissary

 

[Jedisupersonic]

I personally expect more Echoes than I do newcomers, I still don't think the term would be introduced without the intent of using it at least a little bit.

 

[Shroob]

I think people are just reading way too much into the "don't expect too many newcomers" thing. "Not too many" is so subjective itself (how many is exactly "too many"?), and I've pointed out earlier in the thread how he we had pretty much the same exact thing happen in Smash 4, where shortly after its first unveiling Sakurai made some statements in an interview that implied the roster wouldn't be so big (such key words being "we're at the upper limit of what's feasible" and "a change in direction may be needed"), which then lead to people claiming we were going to get barely any newcomers (especially with many people believing the Gematsu leaks was it) and a significant amount of people thinking the whole roster would be smaller than Brawl's; there were even "news" sites reporting that "Sakurai said Smash 4's roster will be smaller than Brawl's". Yet in the end Smash 4's newcomer count and roster expansion was inline with Brawl's in the base game, despite having to make the game for two very different systems simultaneously and having to make the jump to HD, while Sakurai confirmed several more characters were planned but had to be scrapped because of time constraints.

So I'll again reiterate I'm going to take Sakurai's statement at face value of "not as many newcomers as Brawl and Smash 4 had", and that it was more of a statement to quell wild expectations like 20+ newcomers.

I think it's fair to ask then, how many do you think we'll get?

 

[monadoboy]

Does this mean you'll be cool with Dampe? I feel like he's the true Zelda one-off MVP.

At this point, a Goomba or a Lakitu with a Triforce symbol and Zelda victory music would be hype as ****

 

[Enchess]

I personally expect more Echoes than I do newcomers, I still don't think the term would be introduced without the intent of using it at least a little bit.

I agree, but also wouldn't be surprised if they introduced the term just to avoid backlash from Daisy and the return of Dark Pit and Lucina. I'm only expecting a couple more Echoes.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

I agree, but also wouldn't be surprised if they introduced the term just to avoid backlash from Daisy and the return of Dark Pit and Lucina. I'm only expecting a couple more Echoes.

Yeah only a few, but more than those 3.

It's the main way I can even hope for Shadow until that is dashed by an AT set of reveals and shows the Knuckles one was a red herring.

 

[Noipoi]

Is there a chance we get a new Subspace Emissary? I feel like there wasn't enough dev time...

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Is there a chance we get a new Subspace Emissary? I feel like there wasn't enough dev time...

This is why I think they should use it as a DLC idea, that way they can launch the game then work on it and do whatever they want with it.

Release it piece at a time or something.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I have a question for people who have played Xenoblade 2. What abilities to Shulk and Rex share and what abilities do they not? Relating to both special moves and smash attacks?

 

[Lisbon Mapping]

This is why I think they should use it as a DLC idea, that way they can launch the game then work on it and do whatever they want with it.

Release it piece at a time or something.

I feel like a whole Subspace Emissary mode would be too big to be DLC, and I don't think they would release it in parts either, since presumably DLC characters would be being added as well, so it would be strange for them be absent from it

 

[Jedisupersonic]

I feel like a whole Subspace Emissary mode would be too big to be DLC, and I don't think they would release it in parts either, since presumably DLC characters would be being added as well, so it would be strange for them not to be in the story

Perhaps the story could heavily involve those characters as they release.

 

[Pakky]

That is heavily opinionated. DK doesn't "need" a new character any more than any other franchise.

True but of franchises with multiple characters with different abilities DK is a little short on reps.

 

[Lisbon Mapping]

Perhaps the story could heavily involve those characters as they release.

I suppose a few characters did suddenly appear halfway through Brawl's Subspace

 

[Slavic]

I have a question for people who have played Xenoblade 2. What abilities to Shulk and Rex share and what abilities do they not? Relating to both special moves and smash attacks?

Basically no abilities are shared aside from wielding a special sword.

At least, until you resonate Shulk with Rex as a Blade, then Rex gains Shulk's abilities.

But as for what you mean they fill a similar gameplay role but really don't share any abilities at all.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

I suppose a few characters did suddenly appear halfway through Brawl's Subspace

Yeah they kinda did, also mind you my idea is kind of silly, I just figured it'd be the best way for those who liked subspace to get it and have everyone involved.

But it might be a flawed method (also I loved Subspace, i'm a huge nerd of old school beat em ups and Subspace was basically that combined with Smash).

 

[Will]

Is there a chance we get a new Subspace Emissary? I feel like there wasn't enough dev time...

Unless Sakurai's been working on it since 2014, it would take too long to bring them in + DLC. Of course they could always just add a handful as post-game unlockables (TL, Wolf, and Jiggs), but I feel that was only done under extreme time constraints.

 

[Enchess]

I have a question for people who have played Xenoblade 2. What abilities to Shulk and Rex share and what abilities do they not? Relating to both special moves and smash attacks?

I'm not super far in, but Rex and Shulk really shouldn't play similarly at all. The counter is based on Shulk's future vision, which I don't think Rex has. The Monado Arts is also exclusive to Shulk. To capture XC2, I imagine Rex would change Blades similarly to how Shulk changes Monado Arts, but instead of changing his stats, it would change his other specials. Like Pokemon Trainer light I guess. Switching just changes 3 moves instead of entire character.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Basically no abilities are shared aside from wielding a special sword.

At least, until you resonate Shulk with Rex as a Blade, then Rex gains Shulk's abilities.

But as for what you mean they fill a similar gameplay role but really don't share any abilities at all.

So Rex's sword is incapable of performing Rex's smash attacks or back slash?

 

[Zinith]

So Rex's sword is incapable of performing Rex's smash attacks or back slash?

Rex does have an art that does more damage in the back of an enemy, similar to Back Slash. But they don't have the same animations

 

[Will]

I have a question for people who have played Xenoblade 2. What abilities to Shulk and Rex share and what abilities do they not? Relating to both special moves and smash attacks?

All of the Xenoblade games share separate stories. They're not related in the slightest.
Shulk also steals a move or two from his parties, especially Reyn.

 

[Enchess]

So Rex's sword is incapable of performing Rex's smash attacks or back slash?

Smash attacks should be good because they both have the energy dealy that varies in size. Back Slash is a specific ability in XC that's heavily associated with Shulk. I don't remember if Rex can do it. I need to get back into XC2...

 

[Zinith]

What's funny is that Xenoblade Chronicles X has more in common in gameplay with the first game than 2 does...

 

[TMNTSSB4]

At this point, a Goomba or a Lakitu with a Triforce symbol and Zelda victory music would be hype as ****

This makes me want a Goomba/Koopa Troopa combo character for Smash

 

[Will]

What's funny is that Xenoblade Chronicles X has more in common in gameplay with the first game than 2 does...

What's funnier is if another Xenoblade character gets in, they'll have to share the You Will Know Our Names victory theme.

 

[MaestroDavros]

I mean, with the random button, it was 57 spots.

I think a lot of people are predicting a 6x12 rectangle atm.

Honestly I'd take any predictions on how the CSS will end like with a huge grain of salt. Symmetry has never seemed to be an end goal for Sakurai, just a result of how many characters he decided to add. He'll add as many characters as he wants/has time to. If it's symmetrical, great! If not, that's okay too.

 

[Zinith]

What's funnier is if another Xenoblade character gets in, they'll have to share the You Will Know Our Names victory theme.

Well some characters like Rosalina have different victory themes separate from the others in their series...