Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Deleted member]

It kind of bums me out that her and Ashley (Wario Ware) have become so readily dismissed as of late. I too think there's a lot to work with when it comes to Animal Crossing. It'd be easy enough to find new uses for the net, watering can, and even shovel but they haven't even incorporated the fishing rod or creatively bottomless leaves themselves yet. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Isabelle as accident prone drunken master style fighter would be hilarious. Throw in bugs, fish, and even fruit and flowers and I think they'd have a plethora of ways to pull this off.

What do people think is wrong with Ashley? I think she's decently likely all things considered. The Assist Trophy, Mii costume, relatively high popularity in Japan if the following image is anything to go off of, and her various cameos outside of WarioWare make me think she's got a real chance. Plus she'd have an entirely magic based moveset, complete with debuffs and some stage controlling elements if her AT is indicative of what she has to offer. I've always wanted Kamek but Ashley is far more likely while pulling off a similar niche.

Spoiler: SourceGaming Japanese Smash Ballot poll

 

[BlondeLombax]

What do people think is wrong with Ashley? I think she's decently likely all things considered. The Assist Trophy, Mii costume, relatively high popularity in Japan if the following image is anything to go off of, and her various cameos outside of WarioWare make me think she's got a real chance. Plus she'd have an entirely magic based moveset, complete with buffs(?) and debuffs if her AT is indicative of what she has to offer. I've always wanted Kamek but Ashley is far more likely while pulling off a similar niche.

Spoiler: SourceGaming Japanese Smash Ballot poll

Spoiler: I swear, when I see this...

I can't help but laugh at the fact that Bayo is at the lowest percentage on the graph, all things considered.

 

[Zinith]

Well.... I just had my mind blown over on Yoshi's Veteran Thread. Kapus brought up that of the 4 characters that eat enemies for their Neutral B's, Yoshi can't eat items/projectiles. I'm developing notoriety for being a Yoshi sperg, and that fact flew over even MY head. So......

Sakurai, if you're reading this, you've committed a grievous crime. Fix it!!!

 

[Zippo]

No Captain Toad either.

But at least it has Dixie Kong, King K. Rool, and Simon Belmont.

Honestly, that's what makes me go "hmm..." about this one. It doesn't feature "easy options" like Captain Toad, Bandana Dee, New Fire Emblem protag, Rex and Pyra, Decidueye, etc. A lot of this seems out of nowhere. But that's exactly the point. These choices sound exactly like the off the wall character reveals Sakurai would make. With most fake leaks, you have the leakers putting in all of these fan favorites like Isaac, Andy, Bomberman, etc. Not with this one, however. You cannot predict this madman's process. When people point out the flaws of leaks like this, and go "this doesn't make sense! Why is this character here?!" To me, I feel like it's giving the leak even more credibility. It's Smash Bros., for crying out loud, It's not supposed to make sense. It's a video game crossover. That's why I'm waiting to see if someone reputable will debunk it in the next few days or not. I'm still not convinced it's real, butttt, at the same time, i'm not going completely "fake!" on it either.

I'll say this, these next two weeks are going to be some of the most exciting, wild, fascinating times in the Nintendo community that we have ever had. Just a hunch I have.

 

[Polan]

Honestly, that's what makes me go "hmm..." about this one. It doesn't feature "easy options" like Captain Toad, Bandana Dee, New Fire Emblem protag, Rex and Pyra, Decidueye, etc. A lot of this seems out of nowhere. But that's exactly the point. These choices sound exactly like the off the wall character reveals Sakurai would make. With most fake leaks, you have the leakers putting in all of these fan favorites like Isaac, Andy, Bomberman, etc. Not with this one, however. You cannot predict this madman's process. When people point out the flaws of leaks like this, and go "this doesn't make sense! Why is this character here?!" To me, I feel like it's giving the leak even more credibility. It's Smash Bros., for crying out loud, It's not supposed to make sense. It's a video game crossover. That's why I'm waiting to see if someone reputable will debunk it in the next few days or not. I'm still not convinced it's real, butttt, at the same time, i'm not going completely "fake!" on it either.

I'll say this, these next two weeks are going to be some of the most exciting, wild, fascinating times in the Nintendo community that we have ever had. Just a hunch I have.

pretty much all the fake leaks nowadays throw in off-the wall choices to seem more legit. i really wouldn't use that as reasoning for why a leak may be real.

 

[NintendoKnight]

Honestly, that's what makes me go "hmm..." about this one. It doesn't feature "easy options" like Captain Toad, Bandana Dee, New Fire Emblem protag, Rex and Pyra, Decidueye, etc. A lot of this seems out of nowhere. But that's exactly the point. These choices sound exactly like the off the wall character reveals Sakurai would make. With most fake leaks, you have the leakers putting in all of these fan favorites like Isaac, Andy, Bomberman, etc. Not with this one, however. You cannot predict this madman's process. When people point out the flaws of leaks like this, and go "this doesn't make sense! Why is this character here?!" To me, I feel like it's giving the leak even more credibility. It's Smash Bros., for crying out loud, It's not supposed to make sense. It's a video game crossover. That's why I'm waiting to see if someone reputable will debunk it in the next few days or not. I'm still not convinced it's real, butttt, at the same time, i'm not going completely "fake!" on it either.

I'll say this, these next two weeks are going to be some of the most exciting, wild, fascinating times in the Nintendo community that we have ever had. Just a hunch I have.

I'm reminded of when the Brawl roster finally leaked before its Japanese release.

There were several things that pissed everyone off immediately:

-35 characters. (We wanted a lot more)
-Wolf over Krystal.
-The existence of R.O.B.
-"Toon" Link.

There was this huge divide of people whom believed it, and the rest (like myself) absolutely refused to see that as the case.

And then the game came out in Japan. One by one, each major part of the leak that we all disliked was proven to be reality.
It was off the wall, and completely unbelievable.

Nowadays, people are starting to realize that those off-the-wall picks are Sakurai's signature.

 

[HairMythe]

Like put Link next to Isabelle and tell me who has more moveset potential.

The problem with this example is that because Isabelle isn't a fighter, any moveset you come up with her would be less obvious. That obviousness of the moveset could hinder our perception of the relative potential Link and Isabelle have in their moveset. So you're comparing apples and oranges.
A better comparison would be Link and Marth. Link can do a lot of things in his games ; swordfighting, using other weapons and various objects, and some other silly things, like flying with a cucco. Marth, on the other hand, can only do a few different sword strikes. So Link has more moveset potential than Marth. And Link actually has even more moveset potential than ever as his BoTW self, precisely because he can do many different things.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't buy the Imgur rumor for a second. Why does this random guy know the entire roster when a much more credible leaker, Vergeben, only has 2 sources that know things that could plausibly be revealed at E3 (i.e more likely to be leaked since more people would know about it): 1 or 2 newcomers, Ice Climbers, and the return of all of Smash 4's characters. Even the Gematsu leak only knew a handful of newcomers and it still got some of them wrong. afaik the only leaks that have had the entire roster in them only got past the Nintendo ninjas very close to release, when more people would have the information at their hands. Plus the whole thing where he posts a collection of not so cryptic hints to a "hidden" image album online screams that the guy just wants attention.

Even if you give the guy a pass for all of that (which I don't), some of the choices don't make any sense, even in the crazy world that is Sakurai's mind. Like seriously, Samurai Goroh? Porky? Medusa? I'm sorry, but these characters are from dead franchises. Looking at past Smash games's newcomers, they're basically all characters with relatively recent appearances at the time the roster was decided, were 3rd parties, or were specifically retro picks. Even though Kid Icarus is on hold indefinitely I guess you could handwave Medusa away as Sakurai bias so I'll actually cut her some slack. Goroh and Porky though? They check none of those boxes, and are literally only included in this guy's rumors because he felt the need to meet some arbitrary villain quota to fit his fake theme.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

So, what's this "heroes vs villains" leak from Imgur? The link is dead on my end, all I'm getting is a bunch of random images on the site. Is there any way I could see it for myself?

I second this. Does anyone have a mirror of the imgur leak in question? I know it will probably be fake, but I'm willing to give it a look for the sake of it.

 

[Zeox]

How many times do I have to repeat myself that the ballot have changed the rules of the game of "guess what characters will be added"?
Sakurai have a list of the top characters more voted and wanted by players, he easily could look at it, discard the ones that are stupid memes (like shrek), look at the ones with more possibilities of having a good moveset, and more than half of the new roster could come from there.
Meanwhile the other half could come from recent titles so there is a mix between promotion and fanservice.
I voted for ridley but in the description of reasons why i wrote "because smash really need more villains" and I'm pretty sure I wasn't the only one.
Saying this... yeah, the leak is fake.

 

[Kirby Dragons]

I'm really not trying to be that guy but you make a list of characters that appeared in the last few years, which is a great idea, and then selectively choose to not include certain characters because there are people who seem to prefer Waluigi. What if she's more popular in Japan?

According to her wikia (which is apparently a thing....) she is the 2nd most prominant female character in video games. Only Peach has appeared in more. (Dunno how credible that is but I can't say I don't believe it.)

She appeared 4 times in 2014, 6 times in 2015, 5 times in 2016, and 5 times in 2017.

Out of curiosity, I decided to do some research. According to Mario Wiki, Daisy appears in 70 games.

Comparing that to other Mario characters:

• : 49 games
• : 24 games
  
• Waluigi: 55 games
• Pauline: 27 games

And also comparing it to other female game characters:

• : 43 games
  
• : 41 games
  
• Lara Croft: 33 games
• Jill Valentine: 31 games
• Chun-Li: 86 games
• Amy Rose: 70 games

If these are to be believed (I got most of them from counting the appearances listed on Giant Bomb), Daisy isn't the second most prominent female character, but she has the lead over the vast majority of them.

 

[Fatmanonice]

What do people think is wrong with Ashley? I think she's decently likely all things considered. The Assist Trophy, Mii costume, relatively high popularity in Japan if the following image is anything to go off of, and her various cameos outside of WarioWare make me think she's got a real chance. Plus she'd have an entirely magic based moveset, complete with debuffs and some stage controlling elements if her AT is indicative of what she has to offer. I've always wanted Kamek but Ashley is far more likely while pulling off a similar niche.

Spoiler: SourceGaming Japanese Smash Ballot poll

I like the idea of Ashley as a sort of "black magic" witch because Smash doesn't really have that yet. Our "magic users/mages" so far (Zelda, Robin, Ness, and Lucas) focus on elemental magic. We don't have anyone who use spells to warp reality (aside from Bayonetta and her Witch Time), affect their opponents' stats (again, except Witch Time), or create status affects like poison and paralysis. Both in Wario Ware and as an assist trophy she's been shown to focus on these types of spells so I think it'd be an easy enough fit if she made the jump to playable.

 

[MrGiggleBiscuits]

How many times do I have to repeat myself that the ballot have changed the rules of the game of "guess what characters will be added"?
Sakurai have a list of the top characters more voted and wanted by players, he easily could look at it, discard the ones that are stupid memes (like shrek), look at the ones with more possibilities of having a good moveset, and more than half of the new roster could come from there.
Meanwhile the other half could come from recent titles so there is a mix between promotion and fanservice.
I voted for ridley but in the description of reasons why i wrote "because smash really need more villains" and I'm pretty sure I wasn't the only one.
Saying this... yeah, the leak is fake.

IIRC there were official fan polls for almost all the smash games, even Melee, so I don't see why the ballot is a massive change. Like with previous polls, Sakurai will likely pick a few of the top choices who he likes but not base the entire roster on it.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

On the topic of Master Chief and Halo getting possibly represented, which stage and assist trophy would fit best in the role?

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

Why did people start talking about the imgur stuff again?

1. Ice Climbers
2. Mimikyu
3. Elma
4. Chorus Kids
5. Takamaru
6. Dixie Kong
7. Wolf
8. Ridley
9. K. Rool
10. Medusa
11. Porky
12. Samurai Goroh
13. Simon Belmont
14. Sora
15. Geno & Mallow
16. Snake

Personal reasons I don't believe it (obvious bias):

-No Captain Toad.
-Porky making it in.
-Samurai Goroh making it in too.
-A fourth Kid Icarus character? Isn't this franchise going to remain dead for a while?
-Four third-party characters

I mean it has some cool choices for me (Snake, Mimikyu, Ridley, Wolf, Porky). But it's some random user on the net that posted this...

IIRC there were official fan polls for almost all the smash games, even Melee, so I don't see why the ballot is a massive change. Like with previous polls, Sakurai will likely pick a few of the top choices who he likes but not base the entire roster on it.

Welcome my buddah.

 

[T-Hell]

After watching Delzethin's predictions, I could see how Steve would be on the radar. Minecraft is goofy popular across pretty much every platform it has been put on and pretty much THE Indie game breakout of the past decade. Not a fan but I don't think I've met anyone who calls themselves a gamer and hasn't played Minecraft at some point.

I'm a gamer and never played Minecraft, because I never found the appeal in that game, especially artistically. But I reckon it apparently set a mark in gaming history, for some reason.

 

[Munomario777]

The problem with this example is that because Isabelle isn't a fighter, any moveset you come up with her would be less obvious. That obviousness of the moveset could hinder our perception of the relative potential Link and Isabelle have in their moveset. So you're comparing apples and oranges.

It's comparing one candidate for a fighting game to another candidate for a fighting game. In that way, moveset potential is very relevant to both, regardless of whether or not Isabelle has it.

 

[Zeox]

"This leak is fake because it says mewtwo is not in the game, there is no way mewtwo is not in brawl!"
"ROB a playable character? so fake! he is already confirmed to be an enemy!"
"This leak is fake becaue Shulk is cleary a photoshop little mac"
Stop this, stop saying a leak is fake because "X" character is in it, that is an awful reason to dismiss a leak knowing past stuff, I'm gonna give you 3 better reasons why the leak is fake:
1. it doesn't comes from a reliable source, just from a total random new account from reddit
2. Is leaking the full roster, It would be more believable if it was just 2 or 3 characters, but having info of the full roster?
3. Not a single proof that is real, just a bunch of stock images, not a single image or video or anything.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

"This leak is fake because it says mewtwo is not in the game, there is no way mewtwo is not in brawl!"
"ROB a playable character? so fake! he is already confirmed to be an enemy!"
"This leak is fake becaue Shulk is cleary a photoshop little mac"
Stop this, stop saying a leak is fake because "X" character is in it, that is an awful reason to dismiss a leak knowing past stuff, I'm gonna give you 3 better reasons why the leak is fake:
1. it doesn't comes from a reliable source, just from a total random new account from reddit
2. Is leaking the full roster, It would be more believable if it was just 2 or 3 characters, but having info of the full roster?
3. Not a single proof that is real, just a bunch of stock images, not a single image or video or anything.

Legends say he writes what everyone already know, lol.

 

[KingBroly]

Who are reliable Smash or Namco leakers, anyway?

 

[Megadoomer]

IIRC there were official fan polls for almost all the smash games, even Melee, so I don't see why the ballot is a massive change. Like with previous polls, Sakurai will likely pick a few of the top choices who he likes but not base the entire roster on it.

From what I recall, the previous fan polls were exclusive to Japan, while the Smash Ballot was international. I can't see the whole roster being based on it, but at the very least, I feel like it will play more of a role in determining the roster, given that it's a much larger sample size.

 

[Zeox]

From what I recall, the previous fan polls were exclusive to Japan, while the Smash Ballot was international. I can't see the whole roster being based on it, but at the very least, I feel like it will play more of a role in determining the roster, given that it's a much larger sample size.

it cannot be all about the roster, the new pokemon have to be from the new gen, xenoblades 2 also happened, in general they have to promote new games.
But the ballot is the reason why characters like K. Rool or Geno have a bigger chance of being playable.

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

Sorry its been awhile.

Anyways; for me, I don't believe a single thing about those leaks when the game has barely been shown to the public just yet. Granted some of Smash 4's leaks tend to be true, but since Smash 5 isn't out yet, I'll like to wait and see until the game finally comes to E3. I don't mind others speculating and sharing thoughts on what content Sakurai has in mind, we just don't even know if its true or not; which I guess is the fun part.

 

[T-Hell]

Why is the E3 so close yet so far, god damnit!

 

[SvartWolf]

Well, not even image leaks or video leaks are bulletproof now

 

[92MilesPrower]

And yet we still don't know what the actual results of the ballot are. Either way, as I always say, I'm taking a grain of salt with this "leak" because there's no real proof or anything to truly back it up as legitimate, and the same goes for the other "leaks" it compliments.

 

[Geno Boost]

This is actually an older leak from earlier in the week that had been "answered" by the original "leaker".

1. Ice Climbers
2. Mimikyu
3. Elma
4. Chorus Kids
5. Takamaru
6. Dixie Kong
7. Wolf
8. Ridley
9. K. Rool
10. Medusa
11. Porky Minch
12. Samurai Goroh
13. Simon Belmont
14. Sora
15. Geno & Mallow (yes, both together)
16. Snake

With the theme being "heroes and villains".

i wouldnt be dissapointed with the choices as long as it has a SMRPG rep but Simon over Bomberman doesnt feel right to me since we could finally have jumpman, megaman, pac-man and bomberman fighting each other so i am hoping for future DLC characters also i believe that there would be last minute clones just like in every smash game which is why this leak sounds fake to me

 

[Lyndis_]

On the topic of Master Chief and Halo getting possibly represented, which stage and assist trophy would fit best in the role?

In this alternate universe:

The Halo Control Room would be easily the best choice for a Smash stage IMO. It's iconic and could have 343 Guilty Spark in the background as a stage hazard.

The best assist trophy would be Thel 'Vadam as the Arbiter, easily.

Any artstyle they choose to show is fine as long as it isn't Halo 4/5's because those games look more like power rangers than Halo ever did. They are likely going to end up replaced in Halo 6 since they're almost universally disliked, along with HW2 art director now being the lead art director at 343i.

Halo Wars 2 is the most recent and arguably best look for the tone of Smash.

 

[Megadoomer]

Well, not even image leaks or video leaks are bulletproof now

Were image leaks ever bulletproof? At least video leaks are harder to fake (though still possible, as anyone who remembers the Rayman for Smash 4 DLC "leak" can attest).

 

[Crap-Zapper]

Honestly, what's wrong with Samurai Goroh? Yes, F-Zero is dead, as of now, and so is Captain Falcon. Now what is this you say, C. Falcon is more of a Smash character? Hmm ... Ok. Let's talk Little Mac. From a dead series. Now what is this you say, he was an Assist Trophy, and therefore promoted to fighter? But ... His series is dead? How!?

This is the case with Goroh. Goroh was first seen in Melee, in the opening cinematic, together with Ridley and Wolf, who both are heavily wanted, Ridley because of the importance in Nintendo's history, and Wolf because he was a cut veteran from Brawl. Star Fox is not in a good shape, and the fail of Zero makes Star Fox just as bad as F-Zero and Punch-Out!, therefore, other than being a veteran, and Sakurai wanting to please the fans, what else makes Wolf appealing? He was last minute addition, just like Ganon in Melee. Ridley, declined both in Brawl and in Smash 4, people still clamoring for him, even if he was not relevant until recently, sounds familiar? (K .... Roooooool). Still, Yes, Wolf, Ridley and Goroh where all present in Melee's cinematic universe.

Brawl comes around. Ridley get's canned in favor of becoming a boss for Subspace Emissary, and Wolf just barely makes it as a semi-clone last addition. Goroh? The first Assist Trophy shown, to show of the concept. Sure, with a roster of 35, why would Goroh make it if Ridley would not?

Then comes Smash 4 Wii U/3DS. Ridley demoted?/promoted? to a Stage Hazard, being declined once more as a playable. Goroh? Yet again, the first Assist Trophy shown again in the game. That I guess is honoring? ... Wolf? Oh, he got cut completley, even Lucas and Roy got in as a DLC, not Wolf ...

So, with all of this in consideration. In Smash history, Goroh is perhaps just as important than Ridley and Wolf. Why is he getting the bash on him? All of the notable characters are from either dead franchises, or non healthy series. BUT, they all got history in Super Smash Bros. So, if Captain Falcon is relevant, so is Goroh. If Little Mac could somehow make the jump, so could Goroh! Even Isaac got canned, and that was a hit to the heart.

Goroh is possible, and if any F-Zero character would make the next jump, it could easily be Samurai Goroh. So, why all the trash talk lol? Not saying he is highly requested as Wolf or Ridley, but in terms of Smash, and franchise, Smash makes Goroh just as relevant as Little Mac, Captain Falcon, Ness to mention some.


Yes, I'm a huge fan of Samurai Goroh (my favourite F-Zero pilot)

 

[Cosmic77]

I think the problem most of us have with the odds of Porky and Samurai Goroh getting added is that Sakurai himself said that characters from inactive series usually don't get considered when making the roster. Both characters are great in their own rights, but to see them get in over the dozens of more recent and more heavily requested characters? I'm skeptical to say the least.

 

[Munomario777]

I'd hardly call Punch-Out dead. F-Zero is pretty safely considered dead because:
- It hasn't had a title since GameCube, skipping out on the immensely popular Wii
- This interview
- To address a counterpoint, it has made appearances in Nintendo Land and Mario Kart 8... but given that Takamaru's series and Excitebike (respectively) have about the exact same roles in each game, this is hardly an indication of much. (If anything, I wonder if F-Zero might be considered a "retro franchise" at this point?)

Contrastingly, Punch-Out had a title on the Wii, only skipping out on the Wii U (which is very understandable given the console's poor performance). Whether or not Nintendo plans to bring the series over to Switch later in the console's lifespan remains to be seen, but skipping an underselling console is hardly a reason to consider a franchise dead. Metroid is alive and kicking, after all. (In fact, that reminds me – along with Metroid and Mario, Punch-Out was one of the first three Wii games to appear on the Wii U eShop. Really speaks to that game's prominence, I reckon.)

If Punch-Out is, despite this, dead on the level of F-Zero, that doesn't mean much for Goroh either. The project proposal for Smash 4, which included the game's newcomers, was created in April 2012. That's just shy of three years after Punch-Out Wii's release, and hot off the tails of a console generation where Little Mac's franchise was making a splash. Little Mac got into Smash 4 because of Punch-Out Wii; even if his franchise were dead today, it certainly wasn't when they decided to add Mac into the game.

In the case of Smash 5, the project proposal would probably have been submitted around early-mid 2016. If we're generous and say the very beginning of 2016, that's roughly twelve years after the launch of F-Zero GX, which is Goroh's last major appearance outside of Smash. There is also a gap of two console generations (GC, Wii, Wii U, Switch) compared to Mac's gap of zero (Wii, Wii U).

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

As long as I get Ridley I'll be happy with the final roster, bring it on.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Out of curiosity, I decided to do some research. According to Mario Wiki, Daisy appears in 70 games.

Comparing that to other Mario characters:

• : 49 games
• : 24 games
  
• Waluigi: 55 games
• Pauline: 27 games

And also comparing it to other female game characters:

• : 43 games
  
• : 41 games
  
• Lara Croft: 33 games
• Jill Valentine: 31 games
• Chun-Li: 86 games
• Amy Rose: 70 games

If these are to be believed (I got most of them from counting the appearances listed on Giant Bomb), Daisy isn't the second most prominent female character, but she has the lead over the vast majority of them.

Nice to finally have that number checked.

Though what games did Daisy appear in that Waluigi didn't? Besides SML & Mario Kart 7 that is.

 

[Zeox]

What if they make a port / remake of an f-zero game? would that be a good excuse to put Samurai Goroh added?
or make Samurai Goroh and Capt. Falcon as extra characters in that new star fox racing game.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Honestly, what's wrong with Samurai Goroh? Yes, F-Zero is dead, as of now, and so is Captain Falcon. Now what is this you say, C. Falcon is more of a Smash character? Hmm ... Ok. Let's talk Little Mac. From a dead series. Now what is this you say, he was an Assist Trophy, and therefore promoted to fighter? But ... His series is dead? How!?

This is the case with Goroh. Goroh was first seen in Melee, in the opening cinematic, together with Ridley and Wolf, who both are heavily wanted, Ridley because of the importance in Nintendo's history, and Wolf because he was a cut veteran from Brawl. Star Fox is not in a good shape, and the fail of Zero makes Star Fox just as bad as F-Zero and Punch-Out!, therefore, other than being a veteran, and Sakurai wanting to please the fans, what else makes Wolf appealing? He was last minute addition, just like Ganon in Melee. Ridley, declined both in Brawl and in Smash 4, people still clamoring for him, even if he was not relevant until recently, sounds familiar? (K .... Roooooool). Still, Yes, Wolf, Ridley and Goroh where all present in Melee's cinematic universe.

Brawl comes around. Ridley get's canned in favor of becoming a boss for Subspace Emissary, and Wolf just barely makes it as a semi-clone last addition. Goroh? The first Assist Trophy shown, to show of the concept. Sure, with a roster of 35, why would Goroh make it if Ridley would not?

Then comes Smash 4 Wii U/3DS. Ridley demoted?/promoted? to a Stage Hazard, being declined once more as a playable. Goroh? Yet again, the first Assist Trophy shown again in the game. That I guess is honoring? ... Wolf? Oh, he got cut completley, even Lucas and Roy got in as a DLC, not Wolf ...

So, with all of this in consideration. In Smash history, Goroh is perhaps just as important than Ridley and Wolf. Why is he getting the bash on him? All of the notable characters are from either dead franchises, or non healthy series. BUT, they all got history in Super Smash Bros. So, if Captain Falcon is relevant, so is Goroh. If Little Mac could somehow make the jump, so could Goroh! Even Isaac got canned, and that was a hit to the heart.

Goroh is possible, and if any F-Zero character would make the next jump, it could easily be Samurai Goroh. So, why all the trash talk lol? Not saying he is highly requested as Wolf or Ridley, but in terms of Smash, and franchise, Smash makes Goroh just as relevant as Little Mac, Captain Falcon, Ness to mention some.


Yes, I'm a huge fan of Samurai Goroh (my favourite F-Zero pilot)

I swear some of yall just like to forget punch out wii exists

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I'd hardly call Punch-Out dead. F-Zero is pretty safely considered dead because:
- It hasn't had a title since GameCube, skipping out on the immensely popular Wii
- This interview
- To address a counterpoint, it has made appearances in Nintendo Land and Mario Kart 8... but given that Takamaru's series and Excitebike (respectively) have about the exact same roles in each game, this is hardly an indication of much. (If anything, I wonder if F-Zero might be considered a "retro franchise" at this point?)

Contrastingly, Punch-Out had a title on the Wii, only skipping out on the Wii U (which is very understandable given the console's poor performance). Whether or not Nintendo plans to bring the series over to Switch later in the console's lifespan remains to be seen, but skipping an underselling console is hardly a reason to consider a franchise dead. Metroid is alive and kicking, after all. (In fact, that reminds me – along with Metroid and Mario, Punch-Out was one of the first three Wii games to appear on the Wii U eShop. Really speaks to that game's prominence, I reckon.)

If Punch-Out is, despite this, dead on the level of F-Zero, that doesn't mean much for Goroh either. The project proposal for Smash 4, which included the game's newcomers, was created in April 2012. That's just shy of three years after Punch-Out Wii's release, and hot off the tails of a console generation where Little Mac's franchise was making a splash. Little Mac got into Smash 4 because of Punch-Out Wii; even if his franchise were dead today, it certainly wasn't when they decided to add Mac into the game.

In the case of Smash 5, the project proposal would probably have been submitted around early-mid 2016. If we're generous and say the very beginning of 2016, that's roughly twelve years after the launch of F-Zero GX, which is Goroh's last major appearance outside of Smash. There is also a gap of two console generations (GC, Wii, Wii U, Switch) compared to Mac's gap of zero (Wii, Wii U).

I wouldn’t say Punch Out is dead, but they definitely got a conclusion to their trilogy (like Kid Icarus)

Out of curiosity, I decided to do some research. According to Mario Wiki, Daisy appears in 70 games.

Comparing that to other Mario characters:

• : 49 games
• : 24 games
  
• Waluigi: 55 games
• Pauline: 27 games

And also comparing it to other female game characters:

• : 43 games
  
• : 41 games
  
• Lara Croft: 33 games
• Jill Valentine: 31 games
• Chun-Li: 86 games
• Amy Rose: 70 games

If these are to be believed (I got most of them from counting the appearances listed on Giant Bomb), Daisy isn't the second most prominent female character, but she has the lead over the vast majority of them.

The only thing that really surprises me is how equal Daisy is to Amy and how close she is to Chun-Li

 

[SvartWolf]

Hey, can i be a leaker too? my cat works at nintendo (pest control) and she revealed me the whole roster, i will put it on cryptic images since i dont want to be discovered though.

Spoiler: If you dont want to spoil yourself the roster

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

8

9*insert obvious picture of a snake here but i got lazy*

10

the last one may be a little obtuse, but lets see if someone can guess it :3

BTW, this leak is fake cause i dont have a cat...

 

[Zeox]

Hey, can i be a leaker too? my cat works at nintendo (pest control) and she revealed me the whole roster, i will put it on cryptic images since i dont want to be discovered though.

Spoiler: If you dont want to spoil yourself the roster

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

8

9*insert obvious picture of a snake here but i got lazy*

10

the last one may be a little obtuse, but lets see if someone can guess it :3

BTW, this leak is fake cause i dont have a cat...

The problem with the first one is that it could either be King K. Rool as Kaptain K. Rool or Ridley.
also 10. is cleary a Spy.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

What if they make a port / remake of an f-zero game? would that be a good excuse to put Samurai Goroh added?
or make Samurai Goroh and Capt. Falcon as extra characters in that new star fox racing game.

*Insert "Shut up and take my money" meme here*

I would love that. All I need is a new port of F-Zero GX, really. With online possibility. Perhaps a better "create a machine" mode. And better voice acting <3

Still, if that Star Fox racing thing is a thing, I could easily see F-Zero characters join the roster as antrophomorphic characters. Just like James McCloud and Octoman from Star Fox did in F-Zero. I could see that happen.