Smash Back Room Weekly Character Discussions! FINAL UPDATES: Ness + Lucas. All done!!

[wWw Dazwa]

Spoilers for entire puzzle

Spoiler

It's not Mewtwo. It's not Mewtwo. It's not Mewtwo. It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.

It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo. It's not Mewtwo. It's not Mewtwo. It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.

It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.It's not Mewtwo.

 

[infomon]

^^ I looked Dazwa spoiled everything!

 

[XienZo]

Hmmm... since Overswarm keeps saying that we need to work together, the hint is (probably) a insanely hard puzzle that's impossible for a person to do unless they are a genius, or it requires people specialized in certain things, like mains or something. Its probably the former, but I'd say to keep your eyes on the latter if the leads for the former start to dry out.

Anyhow, who could possibly be saying this?

Ok, time to rephrase hints and see if that gets us anywhere.

The I is...
One who is not always certain(I guess...) and is also not fighting. The not fighting and the un-sureness of the "I guess..." makes them seem kinda timid.
Knowledgable about a chain of events therapeutic, so the speaker was likely involved in a chain of events that involved him/her/it.
The speaker knows about a chemical romance, orignially doubted it, and then was proven wrong. Also shows some timid-ness.

The we are...
people that have tried, not neccesarily succeded, and often goes back to it on thoughts and conversations. However, has mixed thoughts about reflection and wonders if they should reflect back on their past actions any longer.
They have tried to remove residue from past actions, but has not neccesarily suceeded, and the "all" indicates comething complex.

The me is...
Doors can open or close, so there is somewhat of a variable on how the "me" thinks, either closed or open. however, now they are bolted down, so that ideas cannot move around in "my" mind as well.

I probably overanalyzed things that weren't supposed to be, considering these came from songs, but I just basically rephrased and put a little thought into them. This is all assuming that some of the speakers are the same and that finding the speaker will lead us somewhere.

 

[CR4SH]

OK, I did a quick review of the posts since I've been gone,and the only post near where overswarm said "someone got the first step" that appears at all to be able to be built upon is this.

Try looking at it these ways...


This was a therapeutic chain of events...
Guess I’m not the fighting kind...
...Will we always say we tried?
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...

_____________________________________

Doors inside my head, bolted from within...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
...Will we always say we tried?
Guess I’m not the fighting kind...
This was a therapeutic chain of events...

______________________________________

This was a therapeutic chain of events...

Guess I’m not the fighting kind...

...Will we always say we tried?

And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...

We tried to wash our hands of all of this...

Doors inside my head, bolted from within...

___________________________________

Doors inside my head, bolted from within...

We tried to wash our hands of all of this...

And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...

...Will we always say we tried?

Guess I’m not the fighting kind...

This was a therapeutic chain of events...

This could actually BE a STEP in a process to solve this hint. Also, it addresses bevedere's obsession with the elipses. They're referring to the fact that the lines aren't in order, and we need to rearrange them to get the hint right.

So what's the order?

Or does anyone else have a better idea as to what the first step could be. If you aren't thinking along those lines, try again.

And I think OS and youko have made it fairly obvious that the bands have nothing to do with this (thinking too laterally anyone?)

And hylian keeps yelling at us to LOOK at the HINT. Which would suggest that there's some sort of visual cue inside the hint itself. The obvious choice seems to be the elipses.


Edit: I'll start with the simplest permutation, that puts the "leading into" elipses at the begining or the end, keeping the actual order of the lines intact. Since one of these things is not like the others


...Will we always say we tried?
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...
Guess I’m not the fighting kind..

or


And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...
Guess I’m not the fighting kind..
...Will we always say we tried?

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Wash OuR hanDs?

 

[Callumm]

This is the scent of dead skin on a linoleum floor
I was fighting but I just feel too tired to be fighting
Will we make a mark, this time
I can't stop itching at the thoughts of tarnished hope
We never talk of our lack in relationships
Every drop of flame lights a candle in memory of the one who lived inside my skin

What character has a lot to do with skins? 'Dead Skin on Linoleum Floor', 'One who lived inside my skin', 'can't stop itching'. This reminds me of the power suit, which reminds me of Zamus (power suit becomes dead skin when it breaks after the final smash, and I'm sure it's gotta be itchy). 'Lack in relationships' could also be Zamus, since she's basically in for fanservice towards desparate teenage males. Then there's this bit:' I was fighting but I just feel too tired to be fighting; Will we make a mark, this time.' I've never played Metroid, but could this refer to something that happens in the game? ie - was Zamus axed from the metroid games recently but Brawl is her chance to make a fresh start?

 

[The Halloween Captain]

BolteD fROm Within?
DROW, but not WORD, like Wash OuR hanDs

 

[Overswarm]

First hint?

Why sure!

Well that'd be the first level of Bloom's taxonomy if you just asked us what it was, where it was from, or something like that.

Yes, I know that isn't very deep. But you need it!

 

[Demenise]

OK I just got back from work and I think I'm really on to something here. The hint overswarm gave that said "everything you need is in panda's hint" tells me, with certainty, that all the puzzle BS, the bands, the extra lyrics, are just a red herring. On top of that, it doesn't seem to be SBR's style. They're not nearly that esoteric.

Well, ok maybe they're extremely esoteric, but there hints don't seem to be. Even the most out there stuff, was straightforward and right in front of you. The ICs hint was still exactly describing the ice climbers, just not the brawl ones. The DK stuff was the effing chorus of the song. So we need to stop complicating things (thinking like rembrandt anyone?)

So what I really really think, is that the "poem" is a direct description of the character. So I went about trying to figure that out. But all I could really remember was the first line lol, but I feel fairly confident that I figured it out.

This was a therapeutic chain of events
The way I see it, it's referring to brawl itself, from the character's perspective. Specifically, a character that got buffed from melee to brawl. Or, a character that had a major flaw, that got fixed. I don't remember all the characters that made it, that are still left. So thats your thing.

And then, he said follow the bread crumbs, which suggests, that one line might lead into another, or maybe just to listen to him. But I feel fairly confident that each line is just a discriptor of the character themself, fairly directly, but through the use of symbolism and metaphor.


Guess I’m not the fighting kind...
...Will we always say we tried?
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...

So yeah. I'm not sure of the rest, but I really really think the first line refers to a buff the character received from melee to brawl.

Edit: general ideas without a specific character in mind.
Doors inside my head, bolted from within... Possibly a secret character, unlockable that is.

Using your logic, Luigi.

1) Therapeutic chain of events - Received considerable buffs in Brawl, mainly in recovery and ability to kill.

2) Not the fighting kind - Always preferred to stay back and cower in fear.

3) Always say we tried - Referring to either trying to be as good as Mario or trying to always get better in the games. Or trying to actually fight instead of being afraid.

4) Lost doubt in a chemical romance - Referring to Fireballs, I think. Not sure.

5) Wash hands - Tried to become the fighting type instead of, once again, cowering in fear.

6) Doors in the head, bolted from within - A vague reference to the Negative Zone, the fact that he has to be unlocked, or the fact that he's in an inescapable state of mind that he's too afraid to do anything. Immense power that he can't unleash.


I tried.

 

[CR4SH]

Important:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloom's_taxonomy

First hint?

Why sure!

Well that'd be the first level of Bloom's taxonomy if you just asked us what it was, where it was from, or something like that.

Yes, I know that isn't very deep. But you need it!

In other words. Pay some ****ing attention to people with more information than you have. Blooms is the "educational taxonomy" anyway. On top of that, pay attention to the actual hint.

 

[Hylian]

Comparisons won't get you anywhere.

The first step is right in front of you. Someone already found it. It's so obvious that most ignored it.

BUT IT'S A STEP NOT THE ANSWER.

 

[Hit973]

Hint is lines from various songs.
Jiggly Puff sings.
/week

1+1=win

I believe I posted quite possibly the most obvious answer to the hint pages ago...

 

[ftl]

Ok, so have we figured out what that first step is? I don't think so, I just went through and looked at what it might be from before OS said that someone'd found it...

Could be http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5457635&postcount=8830 . Subsequent/previous lines, as indicated by ellipsis. Not that particular interpretation, perhaps, but the idea.

Could be this. http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5459517&postcount=8886 . An indication that the hint is talking about this thread/the whole process/something like that.

Perhaps http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5461050&postcount=8923 . Try to find the speaker of the poem first.

Think through metaphors. http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5461531&postcount=8941 .

Not only that, but the first half of the hint could easily come from a different narrator than the second, if you double check how its worded.

That might be a first step? Or is that what Hylian just vetoed by saying to ignore the I/we thing?

Maybe http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5462615&postcount=9019 . No clue what to make of that though.

And that's all the posts before OS says "someone found the first step already" that I can see that might be a first step.

...ok, he just posted something about Bloom's Taxonomy, gonna go look at that now, then maybe go look at those posts again...

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

So it's not the lyrics that matter but the fact that they're from songs?

 

[CR4SH]

OK, so throw out comparison. And get obvious.

They're frustrated that we're "looking at the moon through a microscope".

What's the most obvious incongruity in this hint? It's all uniform except for one part. The elipses in front of the third(?) line.

If anyone can think of something more obvious and forgettable, please speak up.


Addition. The incongruous line is also the only one with punctuation.

Blooms taxonomy is telling us to passively observe the hint, just at the same time hylian is yelling at us to LOOK at it. So let's take a gander, eh?


This was a therapeutic chain of events...
Guess I’m not the fighting kind...
...Will we always say we tried?
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...

Another thing that's obvious, all the first letters are capitalized.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

That's been pointed out multiple time. But what is the PURPOSE? Is it that LINE that matters is it that SONG? And what about the significance of the word....word?

 

[Overswarm]

hahaha... no one has guessed it again in a while :\

 

[Hylian]

hahaha... no one has guessed it again in a while :\

I know .

Everyone can take a word out of something.

 

[XienZo]

I wish they'd at least say what it was NOT.

Oh I see now.


The first step is...


...joining the SBR

OK, lets LOOK at it then...

the text seems to be in a 2x1 rectangle, except there is a small ledge with a cave under it at the top right...

 

[The Halloween Captain]

It was mentioned, and somewhat ignored, that the hint should be considered as a whole, and not broken apart into 6 little hints.

 

[CR4SH]

okie. So blooms taxonomy step 1.

# Knowledge: arrange, define, duplicate, label, list, memorize, name, order, recognize, relate, recall, repeat, reproduce state.

Knowledge of terminology; specific facts; ways and means of dealing with specifics (conventions, trends and sequences, classifications and categories, criteria, methodology); universals and abstractions in a field (principles and generalizations, theories and structures):
Knowledge is (here) defined as the remembering (recalling) of appropriate, previously learned information.

* defines; describes; enumerates; identifies; labels; lists; matches; names; reads; records; reproduces; selects; states; views; writes;.

Remembering: can the student recall or remember the information? define, duplicate, list, memorize, recall, repeat, reproduce state


****it there are more than one version of this stupid education theory. Which taxonomy are you ****ing talking about?

I'm gonna say knowlege, arrange, order, label, list. OK, so rearranged into alphabetical order? GO!

And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...
Guess I’m not the fighting kind...
This was a therapeutic chain of events...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
...Will we always say we tried?

Ummm, nothing jumping out. hmm. this is frustrating.

 

[ftl]

Well, at least we know what it's NOT now. It's something that hasn't been guessed in a while, which eliminated everything said within the past couple of pages.

That means NOT next line/prev line by ellipsis, at least, that's been bandied back and forth. I think we can safely ignore that now. I think we can also ignore I/we shenanigans.

I'll go through the hints before OS said someone had found it with

It was mentioned, and somewhat ignored, that the hint should be considered as a whole, and not broken apart into 6 little hints.

in mind... perhaps second time's the charm.

 

[DanGR]

Lolz, great hint Panda man. It's Olimar this time.

Edit: Guys, don't pay attention to their "hints". Just look at the one hint in the OP.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Line 1 is the exercise. line two is where the first of the five steps begin, three where step two begins, four where step 3 begins, 5 is step 4, and 6 is step 5.

Taxamony of eduational objectives... FTW?

 

[Hylian]

123 bottles of beer on the wall!

9 bottles of beer!

 

[infomon]

Ergh, stop with these new "hints", true or false they may be. We've got plenty of thinking left to do with our current batch :-)

 

[jber4life]

OK

The First step is really Simple

1) The speaker is somebody describing the character

Or

2) The speaker is the character, talking about there inner most thoughts/ The speaker is a character realated to The Character.

Or

3) The speaker is SP, and he is discribing diffrent aspects of the SWF, and we need to "Follow the Bread crumbs" Thru the SWF and find the answer.



Now Hylian and OS keep telling us to work together. So intellegent posters, which of those three idea's do you think would be the best idea to explore?

Personally i am leaning towards the 2nd

Also, STOP BREAKING THE HINT INTO SIX LINES, That is wrong. Youko also said that rearaning the lines is a bad idea aswell. SO stop doing that also.

 

[CR4SH]

Well, one thing people haven't talked about in a while is the whole PKLUVA/CARTTS thing. Maybe thats what they're talking about? I can't imagine they would though, because that would contradict them quite a bit.

 

[JLynn943]

sorry, I've been busy doing work, so I've missed the last couple hours...

I'm gonna read over everything and try to help figure this out

 

[idontgottaname]

ok, im not sure, but i think i can see jigglypuff there. dont focus on the words, just look at the shape it makes. maybe im crazy. probably. anyone else see it? and it would make sense with some of the hints. dont break it up into 6 lines, look at what is written etc.

edit: actually, forget that. i can definately see olimar in there.

This was a therapeutic chain of events...
Guess I’m not the fighting kind...
...Will we always say we tried?
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance...
We tried to wash our hands of all of this...
Doors inside my head, bolted from within...

ah god, i dont know....

 

[Sir Bedevere]

The first step is probably so incredibly simple, we'll pass over it 5 times before we even notice it. Grr...

Has anyone thought that maybe one of the SBR members themself posted the first step? They've never specified whether it was a normal member or not, so it's possible...I guess...

BTW, I doubt it's PK Luva. Hylian said most people ignored the first step, while PK Luva was widely praised and most certainly was not ignored, at least in its time, anyways.

 

[infomon]

I'm still looking for plausible candidates for the "solution to the first hint", which apparently is fairly simple and obvious from the hint, but is only one step in the right direction.

On a completely separate note, just to throw this out there...... "The next step lies inside the word." is Hylian's hint that OS says is "putting us on the wrong track with the right line of thinking."

"inside the word" could mean letter. Not necessarily letters of a word (that whole PK LUVA thing >.>), but a letter you might mail. The hint is not a poem, it's a letter.... a suicide letter, perhaps? Letter might become "note". A music note?

But this is all novel. I need to find the solution to the first step. The first step might even be the first line of the poem, in which case we might have "therapeutic chain of events" referring to Olimar's Pikmin chain, which was brought up a couple times before OS said the first step had been solved. Note that a Pikmin chain reference does not mean that the hint has been solved.

I kinda think that's wrong, though, so I'll keep digging for this first answer.....

 

[JLynn943]

First hint?

Why sure!

Well that'd be the first level of Bloom's taxonomy if you just asked us what it was, where it was from, or something like that.

Yes, I know that isn't very deep. But you need it!

ok, so what's the first hint? where's it from?

 

[Overswarm]

*faceplant*

You've all just hung onto conclusions that we haven't sanctioned.

 

[MarKO X]

Hylian once said something about the lyrics having nothing to do with the character.

I'm going to assume this is correct.

OS said something about how they give us the moon and we look at it with a microscope.

So I'm looking at the moon...

Lyrics from songs.... who sings?

Jigglypuff! It has to be Jigglypuff!

 

[Tenki]

Checkpoint! - looking back at the thread-

In the beginning...
[guess]: Lucas
[guess]: Lucas
[guess]: Lucas
[guess]: Lucas
[guess]: Ike
[guess]: Sonic

*giggles like a school girl*

Does giggling like a school girl mean anything?

Ha! Don't party just yet. We've only just begun.

later on,
[guess list]: Lucas (more), Peach, Sonic (revote), GlaDOS (hahahaha), 1 ["I know it!"] from a ZSS main who didn't actually post his guess, not to imply anything.

how bout you guys stop guessing and figure out what the hint is about?

[guess list]: PT, Luigi, EmoNESS, Mario

You know the answer 100% when you know it. There is no doubt.

several BR members:
Moon, heaven, yellow brickroad, all sky (ish) references.

Overswarm made that one Starfox references as well, but it could have been a trap/nothing to do with the hint.

Anyway, it was just something interesting to point out.

And remember, Samulai Prada said something about this week's hint needing a bit of setup. Whether it means setting it up via SBR members, or by using the existing hint as a "step"/setup for a more obvious hint is up to you to decipher.


Total list of characters left:

Mario
Luigi
Peach
Wario
Zero Suit Samus
Pokemon Trainer
Ike
Jigglypuff
Ness
Lucas
Sonic

Oh and of course,

anyway, I'll come up with a real guess some time soon xD

almost all my previous posts were for fun xD

 

[DanGR]

Red = Samurai
Blue = Tenki

This was a therapeutic chain of events......This is the scent of dead skin on a linoleum floor
Guess I’m not the fighting kind......I was fighting but I just feel too tired to be fighting
Will we make a mark,this time......Will we always say we tried?
And I’ve lost all doubt in a chemical romance......I can't stop itching at the thoughts of tarnished hope
We tried to wash our hands of all of this......We never talk of our lack in relationships
Doors inside my head, bolted from within... ...every drop of flame lights a candle in memory of the one who lived inside my skin

Assuming the ellipses mean something, I pieced them together.

Reading these lyrics, I keep thinking
"Dead metagame"
"No hope"

This^. It's either PT or Olimar. Notice the reference to "we".

 

[JLynn943]

OK
Also, STOP BREAKING THE HINT INTO SIX LINES, That is wrong. Youko also said that rearaning the lines is a bad idea aswell. SO stop doing that also.

*faceplant*

You've all just hung onto conclusions that we haven't sanctioned.

sorry if I'm getting this wrong, but I'm thinking that what OS is saying means we shouldn't assume what Youko said is true. or we should drop the speaker thing, at least for now.

I like the idea rearranging the lines, actually. It would make sense of why one line starts with an elipsis and ends with punctuation (aka that line would become the last line)

feel free to shoot that down though

 

[Tenki]

^ I think that's more of uh... about the ellipses and the taxonomy thing, haha

This^. It's either PT or Olimar. Notice the reference to "we".

In all seriousness, I think that's the wrong direction.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Jigglypuff is possibly from the moon in Pokemon legend. Also she evolves with a Moon Stone. =P

Anyway I think the WORDS matter but not the lyrics if that makes sense.