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Sleepy's Super Awesome Birthday Bash(Battleaxe Chronicles) September 18th, Durham, NC

Mariabattleaxe

Mariabattleaxe

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 9, 2010
Messages
946
Location
Greenville, NC
Dark Hart said:
I think top4 for this tourney is enough, and I also think 5th-8th should be played out
Click to expand...
uh YES

If there is not enough money to pay out to top 4, I will throw some money in the pot.
Top 4 payout is still going to depend on the amount of people that show.
I am expecting ~30 for each game though, so there will be a top 4 payout if that happens.
Regardless of what I pay out too, 5th-8th are going to be played out

I HAVE SPOKEN
:)

edit: Yes at the Halo Reach team holy shiii
 
Dark Hart

Dark Hart

Rejected by Azua
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
Messages
11,251
Location
Death Row, North Carolina
Mariabattleaxe said:
uh YES

If there is not enough money to pay out to top 4, I will throw some money in the pot.
Top 4 payout is still going to depend on the amount of people that show.
I am expecting ~30 for each game though, so there will be a top 4 payout if that happens.
Regardless of what I pay out too, 5th-8th are going to be played out

I HAVE SPOKEN
:)
Click to expand...
:bee:

_kadaj_ said:
Shut up Yay lose to my ganon more
Click to expand...
 
TheLastCacely

TheLastCacely

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 10, 2009
Messages
6,937
wow look at the scrubs.

Lozr is alreading planning to make a halo reach team, and he wrecked in halo 3.

so while u scrubs scrub it up, me and him will **** face and get all the *****es.

KTM gettin it in.
 
lord karn

lord karn

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 18, 2004
Messages
4,324
Location
Raleigh, NC
Dr Peepee said:
Except playoffs are basically tournament matches in that they determine your placing in the tournament and potentially can be for money anyway.
Click to expand...

And challenge matches are basically money matches in that they affect your placing on the prs. It's the same thing.

And I'm assuming that the playoffs are not for money. I've already stated that. I'm just talking about playoffs where money is not concerned. If there is money involved, the matches should be played out and it should count for prs. If there is no money involved, then the matches shouldn't be played out.

I mean, I'm personally going to try even in the playoffs, because I care. But it's still a different environment and it destandardizes the prs if you count them.
 
Ocean

Ocean

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 19, 2007
Messages
3,810
Slippi.gg
OCEAN#0
if money is your only motivation for playing well, then you have no place in this community.
 
lord karn

lord karn

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 18, 2004
Messages
4,324
Location
Raleigh, NC
But it is still a possible factor that is within the idea of a tournament. If you take that factor away, it will affect different people differently, thus not being exactly the same as a normal tournament match. It still skews data. It doesn't matter what people should or shouldn't do, it just matters that it's different.
 
Mariabattleaxe

Mariabattleaxe

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 9, 2010
Messages
946
Location
Greenville, NC
lord karn said:
And challenge matches are basically money matches in that they affect your placing on the prs. It's the same thing.

And I'm assuming that the playoffs are not for money. I've already stated that. I'm just talking about playoffs where money is not concerned. If there is money involved, the matches should be played out and it should count for prs. If there is no money involved, then the matches shouldn't be played out.

I mean, I'm personally going to try even in the playoffs, because I care. But it's still a different environment and it destandardizes the prs if you count them.
Click to expand...
I feel like it is still a tournament set and if people throw it then that's on that particular person. It is still a tournament match being held for a placing in tournament the same as every other match held in the bracket.
Even if people know they are not going to place in the money, they still try for a higher placing in bracket. I do not really see the difference between those matches and playoffs, but what do I know..

Would playing out 5th and 7th feel more legitimate if we played them out before winners/grandfinals?

That way we could avoid that feeling of "oh the tournament is over but I still have to play a match." and replace it with "oh I have another chance to improve my placement in this tournament."
 
lord karn

lord karn

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 18, 2004
Messages
4,324
Location
Raleigh, NC
Mariabattleaxe said:
I feel like it is still a tournament set and if people throw it then that's on that particular person. It is still a tournament match being held for a placing in tournament the same as every other match held in the bracket.
Even if people know they are not going to place in the money, they still try for a higher placing in bracket. I do not really see the difference between those matches and playoffs, but what do I know..

Would playing out 5th and 7th feel more legitimate if we played them out before winners/grandfinals?

That way we could avoid that feeling of "oh the tournament is over but I still have to play a match." and replace it with "oh I have another chance to improve my placement in this tournament."
Click to expand...
I don't think it really matters if it is after the tournament or not. The thing that is important is that the player's placing in the tournament has already been limited. If you have been eliminated from the tournament, it is no longer possible for you to get 1-4 (as for fifth place ties). If you're playing in tournament, you have the potential to get first place. That seems to be part of what a tournament match is. Less rides on the playoff match than a tournament match, because there is no further potential. The playoff and the normal tournament match definitely seem to have different characteristics.

Now, the other type of matches (other than tournament) that we include in power rankings are money matches. A playoff is solely a contest between two players. There is nothing after that match. A money match is solely a contest between two players. There is nothing after that match (well, they could money match again, but that has no causal relation to the previous money match). Now, it seems that a playoff seems to be pretty much the same thing as a money match. The reason a money match is considered comparable to tourney sets is because there is money on the line. Is it stupid that we make this the benchmark for determining that money matches count? Perhaps. But either way, we still count them.

So it seems that there are two things that validate whether or not matches count for prs. The first is if it is a tournament match. As I defined earlier, a tournament match is a match where the result has an affect on future matches (a causal relation). The second is if there is money on the line.

So it seems that the only way to make playoffs count for prs is to either put money on the line or make it have some kind of causal effect on the other matches. Seeing as the two players are already out of the tournament, you can't really do the first. So the only option left is to put money on the line. This is why I think we should not count them. Unless, of course, we change what we accept, and also include challenge matches (which I think is stupid for other reasons).

Now, the main thing that people will disagree with me on is my definition of a tournament match. I suppose a simple definition like: 'Any match that happens in tournament' is what you guys are thinking of. However, it seems stupid to me that every match (with the possible exception of grand finals) follows one structure and this one particular match (a playoff) in a tournament is different.


Either way, it doesn't matter too much to me if you do playoffs or not. Playing more serious matches is fun, and I think that I should try either way. I'm bringing this up from a pr perspective. I think counting these matches without money being on the line corrupts the data.
 
B

Bl@ckChris

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 4, 2009
Messages
7,443
Location
Greensboro, NC
This is what i've been saying the entire time, but maybe they'll listen to karn because he's better than me/is assumed to be smarter than me.

*awaits replies*
 
DJRome

DJRome

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 29, 2007
Messages
5,557
Location
GA all dai
here's the solution

pay out to 4th

play it out for 6th and 8th

allow 1 challenge match per tournament

str8 ****
 
SleepyK

SleepyK

Banned via Administration
Joined
Mar 26, 2006
Messages
5,871
uhh, so can anyone house us at really late friday/really early saturday o clock?
 
SleepyK

SleepyK

Banned via Administration
Joined
Mar 26, 2006
Messages
5,871
are we going to have to battle dj's hardwood floor
or was that a jokey joke and not a serious joke
 
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