Dude do you even realize how bad that argument is?
Considering the fact that MK has multiple jumps and his shuttle loop it does not matte rhow high Snake will go because MK can follow him well.
No. He can't. If you DI properly (which is upwards and at an angle, depending upon the move you were hit with), 90% of the time Meta Knight will not reach you until you begin to drop. From there, you have Air Dodges and Grenades to keep you safe. Meta Knight, even with his five jumps, cannot reach you most of the time.
Let us also not forget the fact that Snake's aerial game is complete crap to MK. He loses in both speed and priority aerially.
Totally irrelevant. Snake doesn't use his aerials to combat almost any of his opponents, and it isn't needed to prevent Meta Knight from follow ups when recovering anyway.
Let us also remember thef act that MK has much higher attack speed than Snake and has many methods of getting apst the grenade spam.
No. He doesn't. If you drop a grenade down in front of you, Meta Knight cannot attack without going past it, which he then gets hit by FTilt or UTilt. If Meta Knight jumps over it, he gets ***** by both, since his aerials do not have nearly as much reach as his FTilt and DTilt do. This limits Meta Knight a lot. While camping behind a dropped grenade, Snake can use a plethora of options to set up for approaches or counter attack (Mortar Slide, Nikita, et cetera). Spamming grenades doesn't mean you're mindlessly throwing them.
If MK properly spaces his attacks Snake is incapable of punishing nor capable of responding properly to MK's attacks.
Again, also false. The only attacks Meta Knight can truly rely on to out space Snake is FTilt and DTilt, which I just covered above. FTilt and UTilt for Snake stop everything else Meta Knight has; Fair, Glide Attack, Mach Tornado, et cetera.
Snake being big and heavy does not aid him because he has a slower attack speed, no reliable aerial move, no method of truly outranging MK without leaving himself vulnerable.
First off, big and heavy =/= slower attack speed. Snakes are very fast for the range and power they pack. Aerial move is irrelevant, and although very useful, would not be used in the conventional way most aerials would be used for other characters. No method of out ranging him? You
really underestimate FTilt and UTilts range, and the speed they have on both start up and cool down.
He gets zoned. He gets dominated aerially, his recovery is very vulnerable.
Zoned? Are you kidding? Meta Knights best zoning tool, Fair, gets him shield grabbed. If he tries to space it, FTilt out ranges it, along with UTilt. Snake won't voluntarily go aerial, and his recovery, as explained, is only as vulnerable as you make it. If you DI properly so you do not use your Cypher low, and you use Cypher immediately after double jump to give it a fast momentum, Meta Knight will almost never be able to take advantage of you until you're off the cypher and falling. From there, you still have viable options.
Grenade camping only works on MK who are overly aggressive which they should not be to begin with.
Um... Meta Knight has to approach, otherwise he will get spammed from Grenades. That doesn't mean Snake is going to just start hucking them for no reason. He can drop them to create a wall of hitboxes and traps Meta Knight cannot get around unless Snake messes up, he can use them during Shields or simply hold them so Meta Knight blows up with Snake if he hits him... You're acting as if the only thing you can do with Grenades is just throw them.
This is true but unlike MK he doesn't necessarily have an extremely reliable way of killing MK.
He doesn't have any overly reliable methods of killing, no. But the ones he has do work well, even if Meta Knight surpasses him in that department.
He also gets zoned by MK badly on ground and in the air. Once MK has gotten close Falco has no guaranteed method of getting MK away without placing himself in risk of getting zoned.
Meta Knight has to zone at a spaced distance to avoid getting grabbed. Falco can simply retreat with SHDL when that occurs. He has SH Phantasm, which is very hard to punish for Meta Knight, to reset the spacing. Standard A, grabs and DSmash at higher percents work very well when Meta Knight is in close.
It is not just ledge camping its the speed, range and mobility of MK that causes issues for Falco and Snake.
And the sky is blue. Your point?
Sorry... no.
Dtilt outranges utilt, dropped grenades, and the first hit of the ftilt (second hit requires him to be asleep in order to hit, it's way too slow, MK will do SOMETHING before it's an issue).
All he can do is lay mines, which only cover one side, and is unsafe.
Um... What? First off, Meta Knight can't DTilt dropped Grenades.
They blow up. In order to get past dropped grenades, Meta Knight has two options. Run past them and get ***** by FTilt/UTilt, or jump over them and get ***** by UTilt. DTilt and FTilt are the only methods Meta Knight has to properly out space Snake on the ground, and Grenades nullify that advantage by a great margin. Laying mines only aids this, and it will cost Meta Knight much more if he is struck by one than if Snake does. It is all part of proper stage control, which any good Snake should have.
Oh, and to gimp, follow up with a dair while snake is offstage. It forces him to use cypher low because of it's gimpy angle.
I'm tired of hearing this gimping strategy. Snake will not, I repeat,
will not use his Cypher low under and circumstances, whatsoever, any day of the week, vs any character at all, unless he messes up his DI. With that in mind, Meta Knight will almost never reach him, and at best, could maybe under rare circumstances hit him while in his cypher with a soft Shuttle Loop, which does nothing.
Please don't make that argument again.
Because MK has much better rushdown and Snake is crap in the air, the option to follow up with a dtilt is not unusual.
I already refuted this. DTilt only becomes an option if Meta Knight gets past the Grenades. If Meta Knight gets that close, he'll get Shield Grabbed, due to the low Shield Stun of his moves.
The chaingrab is unimportant, Falco doesn't have the range to make it a real issue.
You're right, Meta Knight is going to sit back and outspace those lasers right? Meta Knight has to follow in close because of the spam. If he does, he risks getting grabbed. And don't say he can get around the lasers easily, he's not Marth. His aerial speed is terrible unless he's gliding, and if he approaches up high, Falco has more than enough vertical jumping ability to follow him with his gun.
Beyond that, it's basically the Marth v. Falco match-up
No. It's not. IT'S NOT. Marth cannot be Chain Grabbed. Marth has a significantly better Fair and Bair. Marth has a 0 - Death combo on Falco. Marths aerial maneuverability is
significantly better. Marth has Dancing Blade to punish and win every spot dodge war, something Meta Knight
cannot do, even with DSmash. Marth hits a hell of a lot harder with tips, and dies later than Meta Knight too.
It isn't the same **** match up.
Falco is totally unsafe from a certain range, and MK is totally safe from said range. If MK plays safely, your only option is hoping to mindgame your opponent into doing something stupid. And if you can consistently get him into a good range, you're much better anyway.
Even if Meta Knight is safe from a specific range, Falco can reset the spacing between them. DTilt isn't as effective in this match up due to how much Falco is short hopping around. Fair will get him punished, most likely through a grab. FTilt is a problem however. Between lasers and Phantasm, Meta Knight has a hard time coping with the spam unless he predicts accordingly. Even at close quarters, Meta Knight has to properly pick and choose his attacks to avoid either getting grabbed, or at higher percents, Smashed.
Again, why does MK counter-pick ICs?
Dair Camping, Tornado, DThrow, BThrow/FThrow at ledges, spaced/paused FTilts, and DTilt totally distort the bond of Nana and Popo, and seperate them very effectively. From there, it's a simple Shuttle Loop or DSmash. And unfortunately for the IC, the CPU can't effectively DI all the time. This match up is very easy if you stick to a strick regime of Dairs, Tornado and Throws to seperate with the occasional Tilt until they split. Then the match is yours.
