Should Metaknight be Banned? **Take 2** (Post-podcast)

[hyperhopper]

1.Yes you should get it, not just for hacking brawl, but because it's awesome and lets you store any game data on an SD card (even if the game doesn't come with said option)
2.No it will not kill your Wii, but you should back up your data on an SD card just in case (I've heard of it deleting data sometimes, but mostly when it was installed improperly)
3.Brawl+ is brawl with the competitve hacks installed Hitstun, no tripping, your choice of L-canceling or S-canceling (most prefer L-canceling), and your choice of normal gravity or slightly increased gravity.
4.No, I'm not on the development team. I just think it's interesting. It's just that hackers are generally faster than the companies they're trying to hack, or else you would not even hear about said company having to deal with them in the first place (Nintendo's trying to keep up, but there's already been major success with the homebrew channel and finding ways to get around Nintendo's "fixes")

ok got an sd card, and everything is backed up (exept brawl data, i cant copy it....)

so how do i get it?

also, once it is installed and i use a hack (for example the larger gravity)
can i play without the hack ever again?

 

[Atomsk_92]

LolMaster is the best XD

 

[Turbo Ether]

lolmaster Is The Best Xd

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH

cats

 

[brinboy789]

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Mm, spam tastes good.

 

[Turbo Ether]

Mm, spam tastes good.

Not spam, secret code language making fun of people in this thread.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Mm, spam tastes good.

spam > you

 

[ShadowLink84]

ok got an sd card, and everything is backed up (exept brawl data, i cant copy it....)

so how do i get it?

also, once it is installed and i use a hack (for example the larger gravity)
can i play without the hack ever again?

All hacks are temporary except for a select few.

 

[Ulevo]

1. the only reason MKs are losing right now is because they are being predictable...

I like how you take away the credit of both the Meta Knight main in question, but the opposing player who is using another character. You're flat out wrong on this. You cannot sit here and explain to anyone how every Meta Knight that loses is just because they're predictable, or how anyone that ever beats a Meta Knight only won because they're opponent was predictable.

Tell that to any good player not using Meta Knight who beat them on a regular basis, or even any good Meta Knight main. See what they're reply is.

Edit: Oh, and last time I checked, every player or character loses more matches then they win if they're predictable.

 

[brinboy789]

spam > you

...wtf?

10wtfs

 

[gantrain05]

meh, i dunno, if a MK main is good with more than just MK i'll give them credit...if not they suck.

 

[wWw Dazwa]

It's true. Atlantic North has all the best mains. Even Mewtwo (Dazwa).

What happened to Taj?

Unless Chillin and Cort are the best Snakes, we might not have Snake in Brawl, but we got the other characters on lockdown for the most part lol.

For the record, I actually stopped playing Mewtwo and started playing Zero Suit Mewtwo

Unfortunately the joke flew over Inui's head. =(

 

[Lord Yawgmoth]

spam > you

....gheb, i think i might be willing to admit you are sexy now

 

[GofG]

This thread is clearly the culmination of the incredible intelligence of the general smash community.

 

[gantrain05]

This thread is clearly the culmination of the incredible intelligence of the general smash community.

i agree, but have you been to the sonic boards lately >.> this thread is filled with very intelligent people if you compare it to that.

 

[ShadowLink84]

i agree, but have you been to the sonic boards lately >.> this thread is filled with very intelligent people if you compare it to that.

ironically some of the most intelligent and logical posts came from Sonic mains.
Sonic mains=bored

 

[gantrain05]

ironically some of the most intelligent and logical posts came from Sonic mains.
Sonic mains=bored

oh i know, some of you are very intelligent posters and defend your character well....but you can't deny the existance of the "others" lol.

 

[da K.I.D.]

are you talking about top tiers?

 

[gantrain05]

are you talking about top tiers?

i was talking about those sonic mains that don't do any good for their character and are pretty much one of the big reasons nobody listens to the sonic mains when they try to defend their character.

 

[Anther]

2 issues with this quote

1. the only reason MKs are losing right now is because they are being predictable...

That's every player's flaw. You can't take that away, and the fact that a lot of people are playing the same character just kind of makes it worse because people that are improving get better responses to the general trends of MK play. You just break down your own predictability by playing to get better and getting more responses to different situations. If other players are being predictable, then skill is a much bigger factor than character brokenability if predictability is what's making Meta's lose.

And even so, I'm not gonna do any better learning and maining MK as I am with Pikachu, especially knowing the fact that I have a lot more fun with this other character. I almost did quit Pika in favor of MK when my roommie was beating me very often, and knocked me out of one of my first brawl tourneys with MK, and my options felt very limited compared to his. But I just kept playing him and got better at brawl and the matches eventually evened out to the point where I just don't feel like MK's broken anymore. In fact, I almost think he sucks, I'm jk about this sentence though. (jk once or twice though -.O?)
Anywaysies, just play with a no johns attitude, if you're gonna get too bitter and have to declare you're fighting a broken character everytime the match starts, you're gonna just quit upset and probably not get much better because of where your focus is lying.

I just woke up and could be speaking completely out of my *** though, or might still be asleep, which would suck because I have class in 13 minutes.. and it's a 15 minute walk..

Still not saying that he's not broken, but I seriously don't think it's awwh that bad.

 

[da K.I.D.]

@train
oh...

yea those guys bother me...
its annoying when ppl are still going off of misconceptions that were dismissed like 5-6 months ago.


its hard out here for a sonic main...

:Mmacstylespriteshowingsonicfacepalming:
...crap it didnt work lol
EDIT for anther
i do the same thing that you did basically but slightly altered.
ive been losing to MKs ever since i got back from college in may.
and as a matter of fact it got me to the point where i dont even like playing lucario as much because its not fun to play against MK and lucario is the only character that give me a chance. and i go to the point where even though i still lose to MKs its usually very close. but i still feel like im not losing to the player but that i only lose because its MK or because i eff something up at the end of the match. even still, even as close as i can make it, i still feel that hes broke because as hard as i have to work for the two stocks that i get off him i never feel like the MK is putting any effort into the match. and its just like "meh, im going to tornado and shuttle loop and f-air and tilt alllll efffing day and eventually you are going to get hit by a down air off stage and die. so since we both know thats going to happen ill just keep spamming broken till it works" and thats not right.
sorry if im rambling.
oh, and when i do play MKs, im SO REDICULOUSLY obstinate that all i do is get pissed and john the entire match just so i can feel better when/if i do win

p.s. i like how this poll is turning out

 

[Rykoshet]

Dead horse here but the character stifles the metagame as it is, but that might just be as much the fault of the community as a whole as it is the fault of a rather blatantly overpowered character. I'm sorry, as it stands the only character with even close to as many favorable matchups is essentially the same **** character only without wings. The way it is the character doesn't involve a huge learning curve, the reason some people are doing so well with him is because he does one of the few things not most other characters are capable of: He covers your bad habits by making you able to capitalize on them. The only character in this game I can think of who has that luxury is game and watch and I still stand by the notion that it requires about as much skill to wipe one's *** as it does to play that character competently (this is where a bunch of disgruntled gdub mains get all uppity but whatever). Banning him would likely make the game more enjoyable on a whole for a large majority of the community, regardless of just how vulnerable he is against the right hands.

 

[_Phloat_]

Dead horse here but the character stifles the metagame as it is, but that might just be as much the fault of the community as a whole as it is the fault of a rather blatantly overpowered character. I'm sorry, as it stands the only character with even close to as many favorable matchups is essentially the same **** character only without wings. The way it is the character doesn't involve a huge learning curve, the reason some people are doing so well with him is because he does one of the few things not most other characters are capable of: He covers your bad habits by making you able to capitalize on them. The only character in this game I can think of who has that luxury is game and watch and I still stand by the notion that it requires about as much skill to wipe one's *** as it does to play that character competently (this is where a bunch of disgruntled gdub mains get all uppity but whatever). Banning him would likely make the game more enjoyable on a whole for a large majority of the community, regardless of just how vulnerable he is against the right hands.

Your use of the word "gdub" has not been sanctioned by the greater GAW community >=[

 

[Justblaze647]

:Mmacstylespriteshowingsonicfacepalming:
...crap it didnt work lol

its just like "meh, im going to tornado and shuttle loop and f-air and tilt alllll efffing day and eventually you are going to get hit by a down air off stage and die. so since we both know thats going to happen ill just keep spamming broken till it works" and thats not right.

OMG! K.I.D., please make logic babies with me!

 

[da K.I.D.]

^^ the 2nd person to say that to me ^^

 

[Zankoku]

ive been losing to MKs ever since i got back from college in may.

This might be because people started getting good when the game wasn't extremely new any more and they're using a top tier character like Meta Knight so they had an automatic head start?

and as a matter of fact it got me to the point where i dont even like playing lucario as much because its not fun to play against MK and lucario is the only character that give me a chance. and i go to the point where even though i still lose to MKs its usually very close.

I dunno, it sounds more like an attitude problem. Yeah, you have to play really gay against Meta Knight using some characters, but that's how it goes.

but i still feel like im not losing to the player but that i only lose because its MK or because i eff something up at the end of the match. even still, even as close as i can make it, i still feel that hes broke because as hard as i have to work for the two stocks that i get off him i never feel like the MK is putting any effort into the match.

I mained Peach in Melee and played against Marths quite a bit. Every single time it felt like I should never actually get a hit in if the Marth player didn't screw up majorly because my range is worse, my attack speed (for the most part) isn't as great, and it just feels like the Marth can punish twice as easily as I can. It's ****ed annoying, and thanks to the way Peach moves I can't even do some crazy 0-death combo unless the Marth was god-awful at DI, too. Still, it's not a reason for a ban or anything. It's just something you either deal with or pick a different character for. Even if it's the same character (no, I don't play Marth dittos).

and its just like "meh, im going to tornado and shuttle loop and f-air and tilt alllll efffing day and eventually you are going to get hit by a down air off stage and die. so since we both know thats going to happen ill just keep spamming broken till it works" and thats not right.

Wow I wish this were the case. I have a tendency to pick any straightforward and easy character in fighting games because I hate consciously thinking about what I'm doing when I could be better spending that time thinking about what the other guy is doing. Meta Knight is a character where you have to know what you're doing and you'll do really awesome when you do, but you can't really do much else besides that. The character in and of itself is a combination of ridiculously strong yet limited options. Kinda sucks for me.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

 

[Overswarm]

I mained Peach in Melee and played against Marths quite a bit. Every single time it felt like I should never actually get a hit in if the Marth player didn't screw up majorly because my range is worse, my attack speed (for the most part) isn't as great, and it just feels like the Marth can punish twice as easily as I can. It's ****ed annoying, and thanks to the way Peach moves I can't even do some crazy 0-death combo unless the Marth was god-awful at DI, too. Still, it's not a reason for a ban or anything. It's just something you either deal with or pick a different character for. Even if it's the same character (no, I don't play Marth dittos).

And if every match was like Peach vs. Marth?

 

[Zankoku]

Then I'd go Sheik. Obviously.

Yes, I know that's not the answer you're looking for, nor even the question you're asking. I don't care, I can't wrap my head around the question you're asking because I haven't played that game yet.

 

[Overswarm]

Then I'd go Sheik. Obviously.

Yes, I know that's not the answer you're looking for, nor even the question you're asking. I don't care, I can't wrap my head around the question you're asking because I haven't played that game yet.

Clever, but you know I wasn't asking you.

 

[K 2]

This is mainly a physcological barrier for most players. They have in their minds that everytime they see a Metaknight, its some godly character controlled by M2k or Dojo and they give up. They have lost the mental battle with themselves before the match has even started.

If you approach the matchup with a "omg, MK is broken. He's so cheap. I can't beat him" attitude, you'll never win. (I'm sure many (but not all) of the pro-banners have this attitude). Of course, MK is the best character in the game, for obvious reasons. He's No. 1 for a reason, but he's still beatable. When I play MK's of similar skill level to me, the end result is often very close (1 stock, medium-high percent). You just have to approach this matchup carefully and patiently. You have to concentrate on this matchup. This is a hard matchup for everyone, but not impossible (with exceptions). He does have 3 or 4 tight matchups that could cause him trouble (55:45), which isn't heavily in MK's favor.

 

[Sephiroth27]

It should be stickied at the top of the page that pro-banners don't think Metaknight should be banned because he's "unbeatable."

 

[ptealixpaint]

This game would benefit with something magical... PATCHES

nobody can make the game perfect the first time... it requires updates. It really invalidates the entire GAME in a competitive sense because of how broken it is bound to be.

 

[viparagon]

This game would benefit with something magical... PATCHES

nobody can make the game perfect the first time... it requires updates. It really invalidates the entire GAME in a competitive sense because of how broken it is bound to be.

yeah, but the game is a party game and the wouldn't make any money!

 

[DanGR]

Hey Overswarm, I changed my mind. I voted against the ban.

I realized that this game isn't about fun. It's about winning money from the new generation of players that this game tends to attract. And I want to win, so I use MK. Go ahead. Call me a scrub. w/e. I still win. That won't change.

Oh, and when people complain about how they can't beat me, I just pull the skill card and declare that they just need to get better. -that they need to find some sort of character that has a decent chance of beating MK and train with that character enough to surpass my skill with MK.

But guess what they don't realize at first? They have to use a secondary. They have to practice withtwo characters to do better. This splits the time they have practice between...
1.) time devoted to practicing and studying MK. You know, in order to make up for the inherent disadvantage their character has?
2.) their main against the rest of the cast
3.) their secondary against the characters their main doesn't do well against

So in theory, I don't even have to practice as often as they do to have an advantage over them. I can just use MK.

And I almost forgot. You know all those people that are actually trying to find a character that supposedly does well v MK? Well... I just prove that the character doesn't do well, and then they have to find a new character. While they do that, I'm progressing my MK game even further while they have to start all over again.

I've got a friend that's gone through Falco, Fox, Bowser, and D3 to try and fight MK. I've just stayed with MK the whole time. Even if he does find a good matchup, I'll still have much more experience with my character.

Really, it's a win-win for me. Don't ban MK...please?

 

[XienZo]

Hey Overswarm, I changed my mind. I voted against the ban.

I realized that this game isn't about fun. It's about winning money from the new generation of players that this game tends to attract. And I want to win, so I use MK. Go ahead. Call me a scrub. w/e. I still win. That won't change.

Silly Dan, noobs aren't going to keep playing a game dominated by one character. You'll win against victims more, but you'll run out of victims.

 

[Justblaze647]

So in theory, I don't even have to practice as often as they do to have an advantage over them. I can just use MK.

*pukes*

10vomits

 

[Sephiroth27]

Hey Overswarm, I changed my mind. I voted against the ban.

I realized that this game isn't about fun. It's about winning money from the new generation of players that this game tends to attract. And I want to win, so I use MK. Go ahead. Call me a scrub. w/e. I still win. That won't change.

Oh, and when people complain about how they can't beat me, I just pull the skill card and declare that they just need to get better. -that they need to find some sort of character that has a decent chance of beating MK and train with that character enough to surpass my skill with MK.

But guess what they don't realize at first? They have to use a secondary. They have to practice withtwo characters to do better. This splits the time they have practice between...
1.) time devoted to practicing and studying MK. You know, in order to make up for the inherent disadvantage their character has?
2.) their main against the rest of the cast
3.) their secondary against the characters their main doesn't do well against

So in theory, I don't even have to practice as often as they do to have an advantage over them. I can just use MK.

And I almost forgot. You know all those people that are actually trying to find a character that supposedly does well v MK? Well... I just prove that the character doesn't do well, and then they have to find a new character. While they do that, I'm progressing my MK game even further while they have to start all over again.

I've got a friend that's gone through Falco, Fox, Bowser, and D3 to try and fight MK. I've just stayed with MK the whole time. Even if he does find a good matchup, I'll still have much more experience with my character.

Really, it's a win-win for me. Don't ban MK...please?

This post sooo doesn't help the anti-ban side lmao.

 

[Overswarm]

Hey Overswarm, I changed my mind. I voted against the ban.

I realized that this game isn't about fun. It's about winning money from the new generation of players that this game tends to attract. And I want to win, so I use MK. Go ahead. Call me a scrub. w/e. I still win. That won't change.

Oh, and when people complain about how they can't beat me, I just pull the skill card and declare that they just need to get better. -that they need to find some sort of character that has a decent chance of beating MK and train with that character enough to surpass my skill with MK.

But guess what they don't realize at first? They have to use a secondary. They have to practice withtwo characters to do better. This splits the time they have practice between...
1.) time devoted to practicing and studying MK. You know, in order to make up for the inherent disadvantage their character has?
2.) their main against the rest of the cast
3.) their secondary against the characters their main doesn't do well against

So in theory, I don't even have to practice as often as they do to have an advantage over them. I can just use MK.

And I almost forgot. You know all those people that are actually trying to find a character that supposedly does well v MK? Well... I just prove that the character doesn't do well, and then they have to find a new character. While they do that, I'm progressing my MK game even further while they have to start all over again.

I've got a friend that's gone through Falco, Fox, Bowser, and D3 to try and fight MK. I've just stayed with MK the whole time. Even if he does find a good matchup, I'll still have much more experience with my character.

Really, it's a win-win for me. Don't ban MK...please?

That's why I main MK.

I don't even play the game and I just waltz in and win money. I'm always a threat, even if I don't win singles. Weird how that works.

 

[XienZo]

Hey Overswarm, I changed my mind. I voted against the ban.

I realized that this game isn't about fun. It's about winning money from the new generation of players that this game tends to attract. And I want to win, so I use MK. Go ahead. Call me a scrub. w/e. I still win. That won't change.

Oh, and when people complain about how they can't beat me, I just pull the skill card and declare that they just need to get better. -that they need to find some sort of character that has a decent chance of beating MK and train with that character enough to surpass my skill with MK.

But guess what they don't realize at first? They have to use a secondary. They have to practice withtwo characters to do better. This splits the time they have practice between...
1.) time devoted to practicing and studying MK. You know, in order to make up for the inherent disadvantage their character has?
2.) their main against the rest of the cast
3.) their secondary against the characters their main doesn't do well against

So in theory, I don't even have to practice as often as they do to have an advantage over them. I can just use MK.

And I almost forgot. You know all those people that are actually trying to find a character that supposedly does well v MK? Well... I just prove that the character doesn't do well, and then they have to find a new character. While they do that, I'm progressing my MK game even further while they have to start all over again.

I've got a friend that's gone through Falco, Fox, Bowser, and D3 to try and fight MK. I've just stayed with MK the whole time. Even if he does find a good matchup, I'll still have much more experience with my character.

Really, it's a win-win for me. Don't ban MK...please?

Anyhow, how'd you pick up the, "We need to do things that are good for the metagame. Mk helps me win. Uhhh.... the metagame is about winning, so if it helps me, it must help the metagame, cuz I'm totally the metagame, WOOT, I win!" logic? Just because it helps you doesn't mean it helps the metgame.

 

[HeroMystic]

Epic Failure?

 

[salaboB]

Anyhow, how'd you pick up the, "We need to do things that are good for the metagame. Mk helps me win. Uhhh.... the metagame is about winning, so if it helps me, it must help the metagame, cuz I'm totally the metagame, WOOT, I win!" logic? Just because it helps you doesn't mean it helps the metgame.

There are some echoes of M2K in that post...