Project M Social Thread

[makoforce]

in theory he is

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Well yeah... This is a tier list, not a popularity contest.

 

[Dark Sonic]

I disagree with Falco having an advantage over Marth on yoshi's story and battlefield <_<.


But other than that...yeah Falco is better overall than Marth. Anyone Marth beats, Falco beats harder (except for Peach and I guess Jiggs, even though Marth Jiggs still isn't that great).


Still, I think Marth has room to grow if players were willing to get more technical <_<. Shield dropping is the most underused advanced tech ever, and Marth is one of the characters that would benefit most from it.

 

[ETWIST51294]

I disagree with Falco having an advantage over Marth on yoshi's story and battlefield <_<.

i was thinking of Fox, >_______________> Major **** up on my part.


And I can't find the post soooooo I can't prove anything so I guess you're right. He might've been ****ing around anyways.

 

[MonkUnit]

woah woah woah
this is the Project M thread not the discuss melee tier list thread
if you want to discuss melee's tier list, go post in here.

anyways, please get back on the topic of project m. thank you.

 

[Juushichi]

What buffs did samus's moveset/game get? Is her upsmash usable now?

Also, I remember that Wolf was one of the more solidly worked on characters in the past, anything new with him? He's been strangely under hyped.

Last but not least, anything new on Diddy, Lucario, DeDeDe? What sort of playstyles does the PM team see for them? DDD in particular.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

I'm not sure they did much with Samus, but I would use the Melee Samus parameters, KB settings, and moveset as a template, give her 64 Usmash, Brawl fair, and maybe a touch more damage/shield damage on the bombs and that should do for the time being.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I'd really like if she had a normal short hop

 

[Shenanigans]

/sigh

Maybe it's just me using sonic then. Hard time killing characters with a not so gimpable recovery. I have ***** fox and falco, and would imagine I am using him rather well. Maybe the people I play against have beastly DI.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

If by beastly you mean Brawl DI, then yes.

I think Samus could live without a good short hop.
Provided they would implement what I said in my previous post, she can work around it.

Her floatiness was implemented that way to emulate how Samus takes a while to land on the ground after jumping in the 2D games, and the subpar short hop is part of the package.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Yeah... I'm just biased because I really like her play-style in Brawl...

 

[CORY]

how about if she could bomb cancel rolls? trollface.jpg

 

[Shadic]

..That would be SO COOL.

 

[Ecks]

Everyone's been really quiet about wolf. I sooo wanna see some wolf.

And someone should touch up mario's fsmash animation. When he moves his arms back he does some wierd *** movement with his hand that should render his arm useless for the rest of his life. It's not noticeable unless you pause so it isn't a big deal.

 

[Caleb Wolfbrand]

On the latest build I played on, Wolf had those jump shines like Fox had in 64, you know, the move ends when he lands on the ground? was a fantastic addition... hope it stays.

 

[standardtoaster]

On the latest build I played on, Wolf had those jump shines like Fox had in 64, you know, the move ends when he lands on the ground? was a fantastic addition... hope it stays.

Yeah, Wolf's shine currently works like Fox's did in 64.

 

[moleman915]

Am I the only one that thinks the wind is too strong and happens way too often on dreamland 64?

 

[Ghost392]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEY6iwMhbUw&feature=player_embedded#at=46

Wat the hell?

 

[FireBall Stars]

Sonic has trouble killing, however, different from brawl, he has ways to ovecome this.

Great recovery, the best movement in the game, great comboing potential and even hard shield pressuring.

He can gimp well most characters thanks to his recovery and can use well finishing aerials such as Nair and Bair ando also homing attack near the horizontal blast zones, which compensate his low killing power.

He's even isn't a light character, is only lighter than Ganondorf, Snake, Link, Falcon and Mario for a little extent.

 

[ETWIST51294]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEY6iwMhbUw&feature=player_embedded#at=46

Wat the hell?

That's just cool. That's actually I nice buff to Ganon. :D

 

[KirbyKaze]

Falcon Sheik is winnable at high level for Falcon. I think I trust Hax on this one... it's really not that awful for him if you just don't tech a lot and use his chase game on her effectively. Stubbornly I still think it's 60-40 or so in Sheik's favour but I've certainly heard the argument for it being fair. He does have a good combo suite on her (execution can be hard but everything works if you have the tech skill for it) and he comes with one of the best edgeguard games on her in the entire game (only another Sheik and Jigglypuff do it better).

Sheik has an advantage over Marth. About 60-40, maybe more, maybe less. I'm not sure what 60-40 even means, since some people think 60-40 is horrible **** and others think it's pretty close to even. Unwinnable is a bit dated. Marth's low percent game on Sheik is actually fairly respectable, especially regarding edgeguarding and racking damage. Crouch cancel grab is also a nuisance and shuts her jabs and tilts down for a while. Mostly what ruins Marth in the MU is just being forced to do everything first because of how his moves work, the needles, and how easily she kills him if she gets a decent combo started.



On that note, Peach vs Falco is largely considered to be Falco's favour by a hefty portion of the community. And by hefty, I mean more than just noobs. A lot of really good, well-informed people think that he beats her.

 

[FireBall Stars]

You could use the old system of +1 up to +5, it's more objective.

In 1upsmash we still use that system because of many different opinions of the 100-0 system.

 

[Shenanigans]

Meh, at the moment the ranking of characters seems to be something like this:
Zelda/Sheik
Falco
Fox
Marth
Link
Ganondorf
Jigglypuff
Mr. Game & Watch
Lucas
Mario
Sonic
C. Falcon
Snake

Fixed for what i thought the list would be as of right now.

Snake is hilariously funny to play with, so on a scale of pure awesome he is second only to Falcon.

 

[ajajayjay]

i always look at the list of demo characters and think, who's the worst? But I can never decide, there all so even. is zelda really considered that good? I mean, above fox and falco?

 

[ETWIST51294]

I think Link or Lucas is the worst but this is all up to opinion at the point we're at atm.

 

[KirbyKaze]

You could use the old system of +1 up to +5, it's more objective.

In 1upsmash we still use that system because of many different opinions of the 100-0 system.

0 = even
+1/2/3/4/5 are advantage numbers increasing incrementally?

In that case I'd say Sheik is either +1 or +2 on Falcon and Marth, probably +1 though

 

[ajajayjay]

lucas??? lucas???? LUCAS?!!? WTFFFFFF

yeah probably. but maybe ganondorf also.

I also originally thought zelda, but grim put her at the top, so...... I AM WRONG

 

[Juushichi]

I think Link might be the worst. Lucas can get kinda silly.

Meh, at the moment the ranking of characters seems to be something like this:
Zelda/Sheik
Fox
Falco
Ganondorf
Marth
Jigglypuff
Mr. Game & Watch
Mario
Sonic
Lucas
Snake
Captain Falcon
Link

Also, I thought of some stuff from Samus.

I think she should get a shorter SH + either a stronger super missile or charge shot as a kill move. I notice how weak Melee's charge shot is.

Her kill moves are nair, dtilt, fsmash, bair and sometimes dsmash, right?

One of her projectiles should kill. Maybe back throw? I think it would give that move a use.

 

[FireBall Stars]

0 = even
+1/2/3/4/5 are advantage numbers increasing incrementally?

In that case I'd say Sheik is either +1 or +2 on Falcon and Marth, probably +1 though

Exactly, forgot about 0 in my post but it's 0=even and the other numbers are advantage increasing.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Her kill moves are nair, dtilt, fsmash, bair and sometimes dsmash, right?

One of her projectiles should kill. Maybe back throw? I think it would give that move a use.

Samus' charge shot DEFINITLY has kill power in Melee. It's her strongest move KB wise.

And her dash attack is used for kills sometimes also. That and Dsmash are used wayyyyyy more than dtilt in melee (dtilit is very good in melee TBH, dsmash comes out on the same frame IIRC so it isn't even a better CC option).

I think her homing missile should be as fast as her super missiles in terms of start up. That would make her camping game less predictable.

 

[Juushichi]

Samus' charge shot DEFINITLY has kill power in Melee. It's her strongest move KB wise.

And her dash attack is used for kills sometimes also. That and Dsmash are used wayyyyyy more than dtilt in melee (dtilit is very good in melee TBH, dsmash comes out on the same frame IIRC so it isn't even a better CC option).

I think her homing missile should be as fast as her super missiles in terms of start up. That would make her camping game less predictable.

Huh, I guess Melee's CS only looked wonky to me. I agree with the homing missile bit.

I guess I see dtilt used when fresh, given samus' frequent use of dsmash.

Overall, I think I'd like to see a hybrid of Melee Samus and Brawl Samus' play style I think. I don't think characters having to get through walls of **** from Samus is that bad...

With a few tweaks.

 

[AMKalmar]

how about if she could bomb cancel rolls? trollface.jpg

No, that's no good. Samus might actually have a reason to use roll then. Samus should never roll ever.

 

[ajajayjay]

really like the idea of a shorter short hop, even if only slightly. her super missile definitely needs NO more killing power. If up smash, fair, and bombs are all improved, and she has the nice and useful new z-air, shes fine.

If that still wasn't enough, i like the idea of less landing lag after up b. In melee she could be punished even if it hit the opponent

 

[AeonClock]

Samus should be able to change the direction of her roll once mid roll and bomb cancel on the last vulnerable frames of it. Her roll is too damn useless.
Well, if that's code-able of course.

Oh, and her bombs should be bigger for more shield pressure shenanigans.

 

[FireBall Stars]

Morph Ball should be bigger because it's too damn small.


waitwat

 

[ETWIST51294]

I guess I see dtilt used when fresh, given samus' frequent use of dsmash.

... you gotta get that brawl outta ya mind man. Moves don't stale in melee. LOL

and if you give Samus a shorter SH you do know that you take away one of Samus' best camping strats in the game (not to mention it's fun as hell to do) right?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

... you gotta get that brawl outta ya mind man. Moves don't stale in melee. LOL

Only the really powerful moves stale with any kind of noticeable effect in melee. Do nothing except rest bowser and that move will be incredibly stale after the 2nd or 3rd rest.

 

[FireBall Stars]

All moves stale in damage in melee.

You give less damage, you give less knockback, it's much less noticeable than Brawl since there's not actual reduction of knockback values.

 

[ajajayjay]

I would only want short hop a LITTLE shorter, so her shffl is a tad faster. short hop super missile should obviously still be possible.

But honestly, really doesn't need anything. didn't the backroom say that, in terms of balance, they just didn't want any match ups worse than 65-35? samus does well against everyone i think

 

[ETWIST51294]

I would only want short hop a LITTLE shorter, so her shffl is a tad faster. short hop super missile should obviously still be possible.

But honestly, really doesn't need anything. didn't the backroom say that, in terms of balance, they just didn't want any match ups worse than 65-35? samus does well against everyone i think

She's really bad against Sheik, Falcon, and REALLY REALLY bad against Marth. I think she loses to ganon to but don't take my word for it. She goes even-ish with Fox IIRC.

And I'm not talking about SH Missile (that's not even good and it's extremly hard if you want to FF it) I'm talking about her platform Missile cancels on YS and PS. You know, SH missile, drop though missile, repeat.

All moves stale in damage in melee.

You give less damage, you give less knockback, it's much less noticeable than Brawl since there's not actual reduction of knockback values.

It doesn't stale to the point where dtilt is better than dsmash though. I mean, I knew it staled but people never really aknowledge it at all.