Project M Social Thread

[@TKbreezy]

@Tmacc if you learn how to dacus you can turn most of those Freeze Bolts into Kills with it.

also more nair. that move is pretty godlike as far as pressure and approach.

 

[metroid1117]

Uploaded some new videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MX5fGchXoiE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CunAA25YvI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nieXWvvikfo

I think I show some good use of tricks I was mentioning earlier in these videos as well as using ftilt effectively and good stage control(which were all being talked about a few pages back)

Enjoy/critique if you want.

Thanks for the videos, Hylian. *subscribes*

I would also appreciate critique/comments...more so of my Lucas since he's the character I enjoy the most.

I never played Melee competitively, so I'm still in the process of refining the basics.

If you want critique, you're best off posting the videos on your character's respective forum at SmashMods; I don't think I've ever seen a serious critique be given in this thread and more people who play the character will be able to help.

@Tmacc if you learn how to dacus you can turn most of those Freeze Bolts into Kills with it.

also more nair. that move is pretty godlike as far as pressure and approach.

Just to elaborate, he means short-hop PK Freeze -> DACUS.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not many serious matches were recorded, but here are the videos from yesterday's Smashfest at Vro's. The full playlist is here.

Vro (Blue Ike) vs metroid (Ike) 1-3
Vro (Ike) vs metroid (Marth) 1-4 and 5-8
Kels (Falco) vs Vro (Ike)
Rat (Charizard) vs metroid (Snake) 1-2
Rat (Sonic) vs Tink (Snake) 1-3 and 4-6
Rat (Sonic) vs Tink (Sheik)
Rat (Sonic) vs metroid (Charizard) 1-2
Rat (Sonic) vs metroid (Wolf)
Rat (ROB) vs Tink (Luigi)
Rat (P1 Snake) vs metroid (P2 Snake)
Rat (Lucas) vs Tink (Luigi)
Rat (Ike) vs Tink (Snake) 1-2
Rat (Ike) vs Tink (DK)
Rat (D3) vs Tink (Snake)
metroid (Charizard) vs Tink (Luigi)
metroid (P2 Snake) vs Tink (P3 Snake)

 

[GHNeko]

And now.

Me and Kiri travel to MD.

School has been excused. No work. Final Destination.

 

[OmegaMuffin]

I would also appreciate critique/comments...more so of my Lucas since he's the character I enjoy the most.

I never played Melee competitively, so I'm still in the process of refining the basics.

Instead of shielding to cancel your dash, you can dash dance during initial dash or crouch afterwards. You used your shield a lot to cancel your dash animations and it seemed like the a lot of cooldown during the shield drop animation

 

[GHNeko]

I would also appreciate critique/comments...more so of my Lucas since he's the character I enjoy the most.

I never played Melee competitively, so I'm still in the process of refining the basics.

I don't play Snake competitively so take this with a grain of salt, but something you should start doing is learning all your C4 set ups. Especially from CCing. At low percents, it's very possible to get an early C4 in by CCing their attacks.

Ftilt 1 > Stick is also a great go-to set up provided you can actually space it right.

At high percents, Fthrow/Bthrow are better than Uthrow since you're moving them off stage. If you're too deep into the middle, use the D-Pad to drag them closer to the edge. With them focusing on recovering, you have time to create your traps and set ups for them to get past when they get back onto the stage.

Also, from the videos I watched, I didn't see you use the Knife version of Dtilt ie Diagonally Down+Forward + Attack button. That knife has some sweet set ups and I recommend you experiment with it.

Also, at low percents, Uthrow > Up B can link into C4 sticks, so be sure to keep an eye out for that too.

Up B is also cancelable into aerials pretty early, so another thing i suggest doing is learning how best use grounded up B > falling aerial, as that acts like a ghetto SH with a hitbox into falling aerials. Situational at best, but you never know.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Zard needs a better neutral B imo...Bowser's is just so good it makes his not look good.

I say give him a projectile fireball that can do Damage over time. Think of Ness's Side-B but without the stun. that would be cool.

Myself and several others have mentioned how having Flamethrower land cancel like lasers would reflect his aerial nature and improve his AtG and Spacing game, and I'm sure it has been or is going to be tested at some point, or something similar.

 

[iLink]

I would actually really like to see the uses for that.

 

[GP&B]

BR'd SH Flamethrower into jab or grab would be sick.

 

[standardtoaster]

what is rbr

 

[Kink-Link5]

A more accurate term for Wavebouncing.

Reversed B-Reversal.

From Reverse Bs (Turn around neutral B) and B-Reversals (That goofy Brawl momentum changing thing)

 

[MonkUnit]

@Monk
You should put me on the list too (and please make Brazil a country <3)

Added you and Dazrin to the PMBR Map and made Brazil its own country

 

[Stevo]

Not many serious matches were recorded, but here are the videos from yesterday's Smashfest at Vro's. The full playlist is here.

Vro (Blue Ike) vs metroid (Ike) 1-3
Vro (Ike) vs metroid (Marth) 1-4 and 5-8
Kels (Falco) vs Vro (Ike)
Rat (Charizard) vs metroid (Snake) 1-2
Rat (Sonic) vs Tink (Snake) 1-3 and 4-6
Rat (Sonic) vs Tink (Sheik)
Rat (Sonic) vs metroid (Charizard) 1-2
Rat (Sonic) vs metroid (Wolf)
Rat (ROB) vs Tink (Luigi)
Rat (P1 Snake) vs metroid (P2 Snake)
Rat (Lucas) vs Tink (Luigi)
Rat (Ike) vs Tink (Snake) 1-2
Rat (Ike) vs Tink (DK)
Rat (D3) vs Tink (Snake)
metroid (Charizard) vs Tink (Luigi)
metroid (P2 Snake) vs Tink (P3 Snake)

Going to editing this post later as I am at work right now. Just want to not have to go searching for this post later.

Also, thanks for sharing the matches

Edit: Actually, I was going to point out so many instances where it supported my Ike dash attack theory, but just watch any match of Vro's (including versus Kage for example). Either everyone sucks and needs to watch out for the dash attack more (very possible). or it is actually really good. It is seriously almost comical how often it is used and either works or is un-punished. It is the key to beating Ike right now I think. There are many instances where I go "oh, that should have been a dash attack and it would have worked."

I cheer inside when someone punishes a dash attack.

 

[9Kplus1]

And now.

Me and Kiri travel to MD.

School has been excused. No work. Final Destination.

MM me gdi. I need dinner money for Sunday night.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Why are you facing forward with Charizard metroid?

Also I need that video of your set with Rat's Charizard, the C4 Fly thing was hilarious.

 

[JediKnightTemplar]

ash must be some kinda of super powered being whose physical body reflects his mental age... he'll be a stupid kid for the rest of his life...

team rocket is getting better, though... they're still failing, but at least they're awezome while doing it now...

Actually he might be in a coma.

 

[metroid1117]

Going to editing this post later as I am at work right now. Just want to not have to go searching for this post later.

Also, thanks for sharing the matches

Edit: Actually, I was going to point out so many instances where it supported my Ike dash attack theory, but just watch any match of Vro's (including versus Kage for example). Either everyone sucks and needs to watch out for the dash attack more (very possible). or it is actually really good. It is seriously almost comical how often it is used and either works or is un-punished. It is the key to beating Ike right now I think. There are many instances where I go "oh, that should have been a dash attack and it would have worked."

I cheer inside when someone punishes a dash attack.

No problem, man .

Also, as an Ike main, I love the dash attack. It's not particularly fast (it comes out on frame 16), but has a very deceptive start-up animation because his initial step during start-up looks similar to his run animation. (As someone who's very familiar with the character and the attack, even I got hit by it a LOT during my matches with Vro, but that's also because Vro is extremely smart with how he uses it.) There's only 17 frames of lag on it (hitbox ends on frame 27 and IASA on frame 45, so 17 frames of cool-down from frames 28 to 44); coupled with it's enormous range and reduced hitlag on shield, it's also deceptively hard to punish.

For reference, Melee Sheik's dash attack has 23 frames of cool-down (hitbox ends on frame 12 and IASA on frame 36, so 23 frames of cool-down from frames 13 to 35) and Melee Falco's dash attack has 18 frames of cool-down (hitbox ends on frame 17 and IASA on frame 36, so 18 frames of cool-down from frames 18 to 35).

EDIT: Melee Peach's dash attack has 15 frames of cool-down (hitbox ends on frame 20 and IASA on frame 36, so 15 frames of cool-don from frames 21 to 35).

Why are you facing forward with Charizard metroid?

Also I need that video of your set with Rat's Charizard, the C4 Fly thing was hilarious.

I overrate approaching and Charizard's FAir. I need play more defensively in general .

I'm uploading that set onto Dropbox, I'll PM you a download link when it's done.

EDIT: Check your PMs, I sent you the link.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I found more benefits to using "Attack" stick - it allows you to jab from a crouch using the C-stick, so this means you can crouch cancel -> jab much more efficiently (in case your character's DSmash isn't fast enough) or run -> crouch (to cancel the run) -> jab. I can see the latter being very useful for getting jab resets that are slightly out of reach, but I have to play around with both of those benefits more.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Actually he might be in a coma.

Also Giygas is an unborn fetus.


And all the fairies are secretly just a poor crazy girl with split personality disorder living in Sensei-San's house.

 

[Tmacc]

@Tmacc if you learn how to dacus you can turn most of those Freeze Bolts into Kills with it.

also more nair. that move is pretty godlike as far as pressure and approach.

Yeah, this was from the first day I played Lucas, and I completely forgot he had a DACUS at that time haha. Primarily since then, I've worked on using his magnet, because I think that's one of his best tools. Magnet is a combo starter, and is super safe on hit since you can WD out of it, jump, AD>snake, and so many other things.
I've also been working on DDing more with him...his turn around skid animation is soooooooooo bad if you mess it up though

don't play Snake competitively so take this with a grain of salt, but something you should start doing is learning all your C4 set ups. Especially from CCing. At low percents, it's very possible to get an early C4 in by CCing their attacks.

Ftilt 1 > Stick is also a great go-to set up provided you can actually space it right.

At high percents, Fthrow/Bthrow are better than Uthrow since you're moving them off stage. If you're too deep into the middle, use the D-Pad to drag them closer to the edge. With them focusing on recovering, you have time to create your traps and set ups for them to get past when they get back onto the stage.

Also, from the videos I watched, I didn't see you use the Knife version of Dtilt ie Diagonally Down+Forward + Attack button. That knife has some sweet set ups and I recommend you experiment with it.

Also, at low percents, Uthrow > Up B can link into C4 sticks, so be sure to keep an eye out for that too.

Up B is also cancelable into aerials pretty early, so another thing i suggest doing is learning how best use grounded up B > falling aerial, as that acts like a ghetto SH with a hitbox into falling aerials. Situational at best, but you never know.

I usually sticky a lot more than those matches. I always find it hard to get in on Link to get them off (I think I got a total of two off in those matches?)...usually the only way I get them on him is to read a second jump and sticky, or I get lucky and get one out of an over tilt or a low % uptilt.
My favorite set up is usually SH Nair>sticky. It works a lot, regardless of if you hit with it or is they shield since it can go through the shield.
I didn't even think about CCing then stickying...I need to keep that in mind. Sometimes I forget how broken CC is since I was primarily a Brawl player.
i also forget Snake has the knife out of his crawl...seems to have a pretty set knock back, maybe you can sticky out of it.

Instead of shielding to cancel your dash, you can dash dance during initial dash or crouch afterwards. You used your shield a lot to cancel your dash animations and it seemed like the a lot of cooldown during the shield drop animation

Shieling is a very bad Brawl habit of mine...I definitely need to do it less in general, there are many situations where I shield and the cooldown causes me to be punished so much.

If you want critique, you're best off posting the videos on your character's respective forum at SmashMods; I don't think I've ever seen a serious critique be given in this thread and more people who play the character will be able to help.

I didn't even know there was a forum there...especially not a character specific one. Thanks!

 

[ph00tbag]

I overrate approaching and Charizard's FAir. I need play more defensively in general .

I think you just overrate facing forward with Zard. You can approach if you space well with RAR nairs.

Although against Sonic, you're probably better off just nairing in the middle of the stage if he's letting you get to the middle of the stage.

 

[Kink-Link5]

You also use bair where nair would be more appropriate in almost every case. Nair hits four frames faster, further out, and with one more active frame behind him, than bair, and is generally just a much, much better move to throw out. Bair is more of a follow up to another move. Like Nair.

You also glair every time you are gliding where doing a B-cancel would be much less laggy and give you more mobility on stages like Dracular's.

Also, Nair is not the only combo escape option Charizard has. Insta-Glair works as well.

 

[JediKnightTemplar]

Also Giygas is an unborn fetus.


And all the fairies are secretly just a poor crazy girl with split personality disorder living in Sensei-San's house.

And Totoro is the God of Death.

 

[cannedbread]

i was just watching some videos and i came to the conclusion that ganon vs ike isn't really as bad as i thought. cp small stages, wavelands, and space yourself really well. still in ike's favor but it's not hopeless.

 

[ph00tbag]

I've also found myself gravitating towards uair as a combo escape option with Zard. It's not superb, but it has its advantages.

 

[GaretHax]

Actually he might be in a coma.

Holy Cow that was long, kind of a cool theory to explain the direction they went with the show though. But so long... However it was better than the Red is Ash's brother theory imo. Also I thought it was becoming pretty commonly accepted that giygas was a fetus and that the gang performed an abortion on an unsuspecting and not sentient being...

 

[The Good Doctor]

I have no idea what I was saying, there is nothing here,

 

[Rikana]

Jigglypuff should get JC rest.

 

[UltiMario]

Oh god not this **** again.

 

[JCaesar]

http://www.twitch.tv/JCaesar

Everyone is here! (Eli, leelue, Ryoko, GuruKid, GHNeko, and many more)

 

[metroid1117]

I think you just overrate facing forward with Zard. You can approach if you space well with RAR nairs.

Although against Sonic, you're probably better off just nairing in the middle of the stage if he's letting you get to the middle of the stage.

You also use bair where nair would be more appropriate in almost every case. Nair hits four frames faster, further out, and with one more active frame behind him, than bair, and is generally just a much, much better move to throw out. Bair is more of a follow up to another move. Like Nair.

You also glair every time you are gliding where doing a B-cancel would be much less laggy and give you more mobility on stages like Dracular's.

Also, Nair is not the only combo escape option Charizard has. Insta-Glair works as well.

Thanks for the tips guys, I'll keep these things in mind.

 

[F. Blue]

http://www.twitch.tv/JCaesar

Everyone is here! (Eli, leelue, Ryoko, GuruKid, GHNeko, and many more)

For some reason Twitch is failing to display the chat, but is there nothing you can do about the game audio echoing?

EDIT: Personally, I would mute the direct audio and just settle for whatever the mic pics up. Better than living in a ****ing time warp.

 

[MaxThunder]

Actually he might be in a coma.

i keep forgetting that thing... i think i'm subconsciously repressing it cause it makes way too much sense...

 

[Kink-Link5]

For some reason Twitch is failing to display the chat, but is there nothing you can do about the game audio echoing?

EDIT: Personally, I would mute the direct audio and just settle for whatever the mic pics up. Better than living in a ****ing time warp.

You can always just mute the audio entirely and play your own music. It's pretty much a requirement any time JCaesar streams anyway.

 

[cannedbread]

shots fired?

 

[Kink-Link5]

Firing shots at common knowledge is a little redundant.

JC knows not everyone can have good .brstms like toasterbros.

 

[JCaesar]

Still shooting a horse that died months ago.

Yet I still get messages almost daily from different people asking when I'm gonna release my new music pack.

 

[Kink-Link5]

What's the name of that song that keeps changing every 5 seconds JCaesar?

 

[`dazrin]

Added you and Dazrin to the PMBR Map and made Brazil its own country

Freakin finally.

Thanks, Mon- HEY.
WTF? Add StarWaffle on there too! He's BC PMBR, and way more deserving of it than I am, IMO!!

Or at least, way more useful than I am. He is the frikin 3DSMax Wizard of the PMBR, afterall.
-and the PokePM Master, since he mains every single pokemon in the game... and he taught me how to be useful to the PMBR (model/animate/rig) in like 10 minutes haha

-Also, I request that I be put in front of Specks since he's basically dead ever since I sexposed him as a fraud.
>>> and that you change my name on there to `daze because that's my smashmods username.

 

[JCaesar]

What's the name of that song that keeps changing every 5 seconds JCaesar?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0GEHJEeTsw Looks like it just cracked 1 million views.

 

[Kink-Link5]

You should get a song that is a medley or whatever of every song ever made; Like every half second it changes to a new song so no one has to get bored. It would make a very complex and incohesive melody with plenty of reverb and gruff electric guitar sounds. You could even have a poly-rhythm with all the drum parts from all the songs playing over each other so you don't have to decide which one to use.

Popularity does not equate to quality.

Nerf Ike he's too scary and his sword is too yellow.

 

[JCaesar]

Thanks for your input, useful as always.