JediKnightTemplar
Smash Lord
Snake has a gun now?
-
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Project M Social Thread
- Thread starter Project M
- Start date
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Wavebuster
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2002
- Messages
- 261
It was a terrible looking thing that wasn't supposed to be seen by anyone. Not even other PMBR members.
Mattnumbers
Smash Master
One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die.
JediKnightTemplar
Smash Lord
Hopefully that part of the stream gets recorded then. I'm intrigued.
huehuehuehue
I always love coming up with weird ideas for characters:
[collapse="Ivysaur"]Ivysaur
Jab vBrawl ftilt. Can be mashed.
Dash Same as vBrawl.
Ftilt Long range poke with vines. Two part natural combo. Has an up-angled version. 45 degree knockback.
Dtilt Low long range poke with short cooldown. 0 degree knockback.
Utilt "Uppercut" with vine. 85 degree knockback.
Fsmash Same as vBrawl. Maybe more knockback growth. Maybe a bit less start-up.
Dsmash Same animation as vBrawl. Not much knockback, but enough to get knockdown.
Usmash Same animation as vBrawl, but larger hitbox. Causes lip's stick effect on hit.
Nair Vertical spin around z axis with vines fully extended. Flub hitboxes close, but 70 degree knockback at tips.
Dair More or less the same as vBrawl. Causes lip's stick effect on hit. Does not stop horizontal momentum, but has less vertical bounce.
Fair More or less the same as vBrawl. Maybe hit a little lower, do more knockback.
Bair More or less the same as vBrawl. More knockback on tips of vines.
Uair Same animation as vBrawl. Causes lip's stick effect on hit.
Grab Match the animation for crying out loud.
Fthrow Low enough knockback that it doesn't tumble to start out with.
Dthrow Something of a tech chase starter.
Bthrow An alternate tech chase starter.
Uthrow High enough knockback and long enough cooldown that it doesn't really combo well on many characters, but not going to kill until aroun 170%.
Nspec Seed Bomb - Shoot out single seed that floats on a trajectory based on input in first few frames. Afterward, trajectory cannot be changed, but animation ends before seed bomb explodes. Explosion causes stun on grounded, and has vertical knockback on airborne. Lots of damage. (15-18%?)
Dspec Sleep Powder - Make a puff of smoke from the bud that floats in front of Ivysaur for most of the animation. Same priority as ZSS's dsmash (not a projectile). Causes sleep on grounded and knocks away with low knockback at 20 degrees on airborne. Not much damage (2-3%?)
Fspec Razor Leaf - Same as vBrawl.
Uspec Vine Whip - Same as vBrawl.[/collapse]
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
[collapse="Olimar Synthesis"]
Making it possible to pluck specific pikmin is extremely hard to code and it's been looked into.
My ideas, with credit to GH:V and some other guy who was in the podcast
1: Reduce Olimar's Pikmin count to 3.
2: Increase the health of all Pikmin by [VALUE]
3: Have Pikmin not switch place after attacks. If you have Red, Blue, Purple, and use fair, the red Pikmin simply returns to his place for use again. Side B would still act like vBrawl for obvious reasons
4: Have Down-B change the Pikmin order, speed up the move, and remove the super armour on it
5: New F-smash- Pikmin "bat" swing
6: Differentiate Pikmin more, don't make them homogenized*1
7: Cause Side-B Pikmin Toss to cause knockback when most*2 pikmin hit, as well as attach*2 afterward for additional no knockback hits
8: Slow down Pikmin Pluck to [VALUE] frames
9: "New" up-B. Olimar chains his Pikmin up, then pulls along them, ala IC's. Afterward he can press Up-B again to use his vBrawl tether. If the first use of the move is within tether reach, it will also do so.
*1: Red Pikmin: Medium BKB, Medium KBG, Medium-High Damage, Medium Angle
Yellow Pikmin: Medium BKB, Medium-High KBG, Medium Damage, High Angle
Blue Pikmin: Low BKB, Medium KBG, Medium Damage, Low angle
Purple Pikmin: High BKB, Low KBG, High damage, Medium Angle
White Pikmin: Low BKB, Medium KBG, Very High Damage, Medium Angle
*2: Red Pikmin: Knockback and Attach
Yellow Pikmin: Knockback and Attach
Blue Pikmin: Knockback, does not Attach, and hits at a low angle
Purple Pikmin: Knockback, does not Attach, and has good knockback
White Pikmin: Does not Knockback, but Attaches and does high damage
[/collapse]
[collapse="Ivysaur part1"]I always thought Petal Dance would be nice for Ivysaur's down B. I can't quite explain what the move does, but the idea is in my head, so I'll try to explain it the best I can.
From the ground: Using the shedding leaf effect things Ivy has, leaves spin around her. The move has a 1 frame hitbox that pushes enemies up and away weakly. After this, leaves continue to spin around her for a few seconds. If the move is used again while leaves are still spinning around her, a larger hitbox with moderate knockback appears, as the leaves spread out in a larger area. The stored leaves then disappear and the next use of the move will have the weak hitbox. Frame data: Weak- Total: 30; Start-up: 1; Active: 2; Recovery: 3-30; IASA: 20;; "Stored leaves" last for 6 seconds before disappearing on their own;; Strong- Total- 30; Start-up: 1; Active: 2-16; Recovery: 17-30; IASA: 25; Invincibility: 1-2
From the air: If Ivysaur does not already have stored leaves spinning around her, the move creates a weak,~20 degree hitbox around her, she has a slight stop in her fall, and then goes into a noticeable endlag which can just barely be saved by her tether, or shortened by landing. No leaves continue to rotate around her after the move, and the move is intended to be used as a gimp. If she has leaves stored when she uses this move in the air, she has about a DJ's lift upward as multiple weak leaf hitboxes rotate around her. These leaves have moderate ~70 degree hit angles. After using this case of the move, Ivysaur has much less recovery time than the unsorted version, but can not use it to gimp the opponent. However, if the hits link properly, the move can be followed up with an IASA aerial. The gimp version could only be used by using up a jump as it would not IASA into the weak version inherently. Stored leaves disappear upon use. Frames- Weak- Start-up: 1; Active: 2; Recovery: [PLACE HOLDER FOR WHAT EVER WOULD BE LONG ENOUGH TO GET PUNISHED BUT JUST SHORT ENOUGH TO RECOVER AFTERWARD BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW HER FALL SPEED DATA];; Strong: Startup: 1; Active: 2, 5, 9, 15; recovery: 16-36; IASA into all but itself: 20
The move would be most comparable to a fusion of Shine (In the weak hitboxes sense) and Luigi Cyclone (in the charge-up as a recovery move sense), but it really shouldn't be compared to anything since it is it's own thing.
I hope this explanation made sense. I'll put it in bold after typing this sentence.
Whoa, that was pretty meta.
EDIT: Hrm, actually thinking about it more, the move seems a little faster than what I was imagining with that frame data. I'll think about it more.[/collapse]
[collapse="Ivysaur part2"]
Sure, some theorysmash examples. Also as a change, the weak aerial version does "charge" the move, as opposed to just the grounded version charging it.
Terminaligy: G1: Grounded down-B, first use, AKA Weak Grounded
G2: Grounded down-B, second use, AKA Strong Grounded
A1: Aerial down-B, first use, AKA Weak Aerial
A2: Aerial down-B, second use, AKA Strong Aerial
Situation: Ivysaur has the momentum and is in a situation where she can safely land nair. She SHFFL's nair, then uses G1 to send the enemy into the air, then uses the IASA to land grounded Up-B, which I personally think should hit horizontally with strong knockback, but that's a different topic.
Situation: Ivysaur's opponent, Ganondorf, has the momentum and Ivy is pushed into a shielding situation, Ganondorf SHFFL's a fair, and on recovery, Ivy jumps out of shield, then uses A1 to push Ganondorf back away. She then lands, canceling the end lag of A1, and can reset the spacing between her and Ganon, meaning she really has an advantage since at neutral spacing she outranges Ganon. A small while later, Ganondorf has made his way in, and Ivy uses G2 against Ganon jumping in to knock him a good deal away.
Situation: Ivy has comboed her opponent, Jiggypuff to the ledge using her bair. She uses a SHFFL'd nair, and it links into G1. Now, with leaves stored, Ivy jump cancels G1, uses A2, and finishes the move with an IASA Uair, star KO'ing Jiggz.
Sitation: Ivy's opponent, Falcon, is recovering from a horizontal knockback and jumps early to recover high. Ivy, having used G1 after knocking back the enemy with F-smash, jumps after the opponent, uses A2, then uses the IASA of A2 to jump and use A1 to gimp Falcon, then edgehogs by tethering and pulling up as Falcon tries to Up-B back.
Situation:
Coming soon: Olimar ideas.[/collapse]
Making it possible to pluck specific pikmin is extremely hard to code and it's been looked into.
My ideas, with credit to GH:V and some other guy who was in the podcast
1: Reduce Olimar's Pikmin count to 3.
2: Increase the health of all Pikmin by [VALUE]
3: Have Pikmin not switch place after attacks. If you have Red, Blue, Purple, and use fair, the red Pikmin simply returns to his place for use again. Side B would still act like vBrawl for obvious reasons
4: Have Down-B change the Pikmin order, speed up the move, and remove the super armour on it
5: New F-smash- Pikmin "bat" swing
6: Differentiate Pikmin more, don't make them homogenized*1
7: Cause Side-B Pikmin Toss to cause knockback when most*2 pikmin hit, as well as attach*2 afterward for additional no knockback hits
8: Slow down Pikmin Pluck to [VALUE] frames
9: "New" up-B. Olimar chains his Pikmin up, then pulls along them, ala IC's. Afterward he can press Up-B again to use his vBrawl tether. If the first use of the move is within tether reach, it will also do so.
*1: Red Pikmin: Medium BKB, Medium KBG, Medium-High Damage, Medium Angle
Yellow Pikmin: Medium BKB, Medium-High KBG, Medium Damage, High Angle
Blue Pikmin: Low BKB, Medium KBG, Medium Damage, Low angle
Purple Pikmin: High BKB, Low KBG, High damage, Medium Angle
White Pikmin: Low BKB, Medium KBG, Very High Damage, Medium Angle
*2: Red Pikmin: Knockback and Attach
Yellow Pikmin: Knockback and Attach
Blue Pikmin: Knockback, does not Attach, and hits at a low angle
Purple Pikmin: Knockback, does not Attach, and has good knockback
White Pikmin: Does not Knockback, but Attaches and does high damage
[/collapse]
[collapse="Ivysaur part1"]I always thought Petal Dance would be nice for Ivysaur's down B. I can't quite explain what the move does, but the idea is in my head, so I'll try to explain it the best I can.
From the ground: Using the shedding leaf effect things Ivy has, leaves spin around her. The move has a 1 frame hitbox that pushes enemies up and away weakly. After this, leaves continue to spin around her for a few seconds. If the move is used again while leaves are still spinning around her, a larger hitbox with moderate knockback appears, as the leaves spread out in a larger area. The stored leaves then disappear and the next use of the move will have the weak hitbox. Frame data: Weak- Total: 30; Start-up: 1; Active: 2; Recovery: 3-30; IASA: 20;; "Stored leaves" last for 6 seconds before disappearing on their own;; Strong- Total- 30; Start-up: 1; Active: 2-16; Recovery: 17-30; IASA: 25; Invincibility: 1-2
From the air: If Ivysaur does not already have stored leaves spinning around her, the move creates a weak,~20 degree hitbox around her, she has a slight stop in her fall, and then goes into a noticeable endlag which can just barely be saved by her tether, or shortened by landing. No leaves continue to rotate around her after the move, and the move is intended to be used as a gimp. If she has leaves stored when she uses this move in the air, she has about a DJ's lift upward as multiple weak leaf hitboxes rotate around her. These leaves have moderate ~70 degree hit angles. After using this case of the move, Ivysaur has much less recovery time than the unsorted version, but can not use it to gimp the opponent. However, if the hits link properly, the move can be followed up with an IASA aerial. The gimp version could only be used by using up a jump as it would not IASA into the weak version inherently. Stored leaves disappear upon use. Frames- Weak- Start-up: 1; Active: 2; Recovery: [PLACE HOLDER FOR WHAT EVER WOULD BE LONG ENOUGH TO GET PUNISHED BUT JUST SHORT ENOUGH TO RECOVER AFTERWARD BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW HER FALL SPEED DATA];; Strong: Startup: 1; Active: 2, 5, 9, 15; recovery: 16-36; IASA into all but itself: 20
The move would be most comparable to a fusion of Shine (In the weak hitboxes sense) and Luigi Cyclone (in the charge-up as a recovery move sense), but it really shouldn't be compared to anything since it is it's own thing.
I hope this explanation made sense. I'll put it in bold after typing this sentence.
Whoa, that was pretty meta.
EDIT: Hrm, actually thinking about it more, the move seems a little faster than what I was imagining with that frame data. I'll think about it more.[/collapse]
[collapse="Ivysaur part2"]
Sure, some theorysmash examples. Also as a change, the weak aerial version does "charge" the move, as opposed to just the grounded version charging it.
Terminaligy: G1: Grounded down-B, first use, AKA Weak Grounded
G2: Grounded down-B, second use, AKA Strong Grounded
A1: Aerial down-B, first use, AKA Weak Aerial
A2: Aerial down-B, second use, AKA Strong Aerial
Situation: Ivysaur has the momentum and is in a situation where she can safely land nair. She SHFFL's nair, then uses G1 to send the enemy into the air, then uses the IASA to land grounded Up-B, which I personally think should hit horizontally with strong knockback, but that's a different topic.
Situation: Ivysaur's opponent, Ganondorf, has the momentum and Ivy is pushed into a shielding situation, Ganondorf SHFFL's a fair, and on recovery, Ivy jumps out of shield, then uses A1 to push Ganondorf back away. She then lands, canceling the end lag of A1, and can reset the spacing between her and Ganon, meaning she really has an advantage since at neutral spacing she outranges Ganon. A small while later, Ganondorf has made his way in, and Ivy uses G2 against Ganon jumping in to knock him a good deal away.
Situation: Ivy has comboed her opponent, Jiggypuff to the ledge using her bair. She uses a SHFFL'd nair, and it links into G1. Now, with leaves stored, Ivy jump cancels G1, uses A2, and finishes the move with an IASA Uair, star KO'ing Jiggz.
Sitation: Ivy's opponent, Falcon, is recovering from a horizontal knockback and jumps early to recover high. Ivy, having used G1 after knocking back the enemy with F-smash, jumps after the opponent, uses A2, then uses the IASA of A2 to jump and use A1 to gimp Falcon, then edgehogs by tethering and pulling up as Falcon tries to Up-B back.
Situation:
Coming soon: Olimar ideas.[/collapse]
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
You click on the show button to expand the collapsed text.
Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
Eh, I'll repost my junk in the morning if this is still the topic of discussion…
That first part was directed at neko's post. You'd think with 1000+ posts that I would know how to see collapsed stuff lol.
`dazrin
Smash Champion
I approve of this idea
G
genkaku
Guest
pikmin switching should be really really fast or maybe jump-cancelable because hitting with different pikmin mid-combo would be so **** and actually make the character exciting and creative.
Jonny Westside
S4mus Fiend
I think someone back in the previous pages(I'm too lazy to find/quote) suggested that Olimar should be able to footstool(automatically without the need for up taunt+jump) his Pikmin. It's probably impossible to code this but here goes:
[COLLAPSE="New Recovery Option"]What if Olimar could turn his up B(when he's trying to recover)into an aerial Pikmin stair case? After up B off stage, his Pikmin would form the stairs as they plummet to their deaths. Olimar throws them at an upward angle so they would keep that formation all the way down.
Assuming this is possible to code, the first footstool would be automatic and should jettison Olimar upwards(high enough for the player to react fast enough) and to the right at a 45 degree angle, the rest of the jumps would be left for the player to decide. Olimar won't be sent into his helpless state after he's finished footstooling, this type of recovery should function like Sonic's or Snake's. In other words, he can perform an air dodge for a small and final boost or an attack. This feat would only be possible if the user is too far from the ledge or he/she doesn't have enough Pikmin to successfully tether before initiating the "new" up B, but if the user is close enough to ledge, then the regular tether recovery is activated instead.
The falling speed of the Pikmin could vary from the type Olimar has with him when attempting this option, or they could all have a fixed fall speed regardless of type. Naturally, they would have to fall slightly faster than Olimar for this idea to work so that he can swiftly hop from one Pikmin to the next without being overwhelmed by their fast fall speed. I'd say the player has about 10 seconds or so to recover using this method before the Pikmin die.
The Pikmin should also sustain their respective properties to help ward off anyone trying to gimp the recovery. An increase in health for the Pikmin would suffice[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="New Recovery Option"]What if Olimar could turn his up B(when he's trying to recover)into an aerial Pikmin stair case? After up B off stage, his Pikmin would form the stairs as they plummet to their deaths. Olimar throws them at an upward angle so they would keep that formation all the way down.
Assuming this is possible to code, the first footstool would be automatic and should jettison Olimar upwards(high enough for the player to react fast enough) and to the right at a 45 degree angle, the rest of the jumps would be left for the player to decide. Olimar won't be sent into his helpless state after he's finished footstooling, this type of recovery should function like Sonic's or Snake's. In other words, he can perform an air dodge for a small and final boost or an attack. This feat would only be possible if the user is too far from the ledge or he/she doesn't have enough Pikmin to successfully tether before initiating the "new" up B, but if the user is close enough to ledge, then the regular tether recovery is activated instead.
The falling speed of the Pikmin could vary from the type Olimar has with him when attempting this option, or they could all have a fixed fall speed regardless of type. Naturally, they would have to fall slightly faster than Olimar for this idea to work so that he can swiftly hop from one Pikmin to the next without being overwhelmed by their fast fall speed. I'd say the player has about 10 seconds or so to recover using this method before the Pikmin die.
The Pikmin should also sustain their respective properties to help ward off anyone trying to gimp the recovery. An increase in health for the Pikmin would suffice[/COLLAPSE]
hotdogturtle
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,503
I kinda wish that the Pikmin footstool idea would stop being brought up every few weeks, to be honest.
Its true. MK is a great maverick hunter. Whether he'll stay one or not is up to the higher ups.
Huehuehuehue
:: Tapatalk Android App
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
You're alright.
When Demo 2 is released, the "Known issues" section should have an additional part added with "Issues resolved since Demo 1." It would be very interesting to see just how much absurd amount of work has been done since the first public hands-on.
9Kplus1
Smash Master
A Melee to P:M ratio, for both the Demo and second coming, would be much easier to write up and read. I honestly doubt that anyone is going to sit around for an hour, reading a big *** list of 'updates', when they could be playing P:M.
The Demo is definitely 8:2, btw
The Demo is definitely 8:2, btw
`dazrin
Smash Champion
This has been stated countless times in this thread already lol and shanus already said that he tried it and didn't like it (or something of that sort).
My suggestion is just for olimar to keep his tether recovery but make the tether length always the longest it can possibly be (6 pikmin) regardless of how many pikmin olimar has out at a time. Just make it independant of how many pikmin are following olimar and there we go.
G
genkaku
Guest
give olimar luigi's moveset
JCaesar
Smash Hero
Give Olimar Mewtwo's moveset ... and model.
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
Make Olimar's Up B call out shachō! And then the president comes in and beats everyone up.
Archangel
Smash Hero
Replace Olimar with Pichu
9Kplus1
Smash Master
Replace Olimar with shanus
he has better MUs with most of the cast, anyway
he has better MUs with most of the cast, anyway
I have (another) question about Bowser. How do the OverB bites figure into the move queue? As in, do they make the OverB throws do less damage, or would they improve OverB throw damage if it's already been used a lot? Or do they do not figure into the queue at all?
ds22
Smash Lord
MonkUnit
Project M Back Roomer
Bowser: M's sideB Klaw does not have the ability to bite before a throw like you can in melee, Flayl. Unless you're talking about something else?
jalued
Smash Lord
is it not possible to code in?
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
Anyway to make him bite automatically and cause damage during the hold? Since the bites were canceled by the throws in Melee the result would be the same just without the inputs.
Oh, nevermind then.
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
Again, just saying, making his side B hold animation be a looping bite animation with hitboxes doesn't sound like it would be impossible.
Jiangjunizzy
Smash Lord
I really like the simplicity of this.
hotdogturtle
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,503
GP&B
Ike 'n' Ike
Yes, yes, yes. Glad to see ds22 got to help them finish that up.
And the Brawl body doesn't even look half bad with Melee Fox's head on it.
And the Brawl body doesn't even look half bad with Melee Fox's head on it.
Supreme Dirt
King of the Railway
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2009
- Messages
- 7,336
Was never much a fan of Melee Fox's model. Melee Falco, on the other hand... had a cool jacket.
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
I hate Brawl luigi's a**. I hate it so much it fills me with so much rage for some inexplainable reason.
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