[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[ChronoBound]

Unfortunate thing is we have the E3 presentation and two roundtables. Soo all in all we have Tuesday morning, Tuesday evening, and a special second roundtable Wednesday evening. That's too much! @_@

Well, the Tuesday morning conference will at least tell us the Cafe's true name which will pretty much either confirm or deny the "Paradise" rumor. So two days...

 

[AetherEch0s]

Too much?
Tuesday morning - announce Cafe and showcase some 3DS and Wii games
Tuesday evening - further detail Cafe and announce some games for it
Wednesday evening - announce SSB4 separately from the other games and take time to make it feel right. Its going to be awkward for them to announce a new game when the previous one was to some, such a letdown. They shouldn't try to overdo the announcement, but they shouldn't lacklusterly spit it out. Still, its their most dominant franchise so they need to make it seem important.

 

[Starphoenix]

Well, the Tuesday morning conference will at least tell us the Cafe's true name which will pretty much either confirm or deny the "Paradise" rumor. So two days...

That is true, I was just meaning all the information we will be receiving in the two day period between Tuesday and Wednesday will be crazy!

BTW, on the subject of Megaman a VERY reliable source has come out saying Capcom is prepping a new game for commemorating Megaman's 25th Anniversary. No word on what it is but something might be in the works: http://protodudesrockmancorner.blogspot.com/2011/06/mega-man-at-e3-2011.html

Notice how many series are having 25th's this year.

Zelda
Metal Gear
Sonic
Megaman
Dragon Quest

Quite a bit.

 

[refugee]

That is true, I was just meaning all the information we will be receiving in the two day period between Tuesday and Wednesday will be crazy!

BTW, on the subject of Megaman a VERY reliable source has come out saying Capcom is prepping a new game for commemorating Megaman's 25th Anniversary. No word on what it is but something might be in the works: http://protodudesrockmancorner.blogspot.com/2011/06/mega-man-at-e3-2011.html

Notice how many series are having 25th's this year.

Zelda
Metal Gear
Sonic
Megaman
Dragon Quest

Quite a bit.

It's the 20th for Sonic not the 25th.

 

[AetherEch0s]

and what better way to commemorate it than allowing them into one of Nintendo's best selling franchises.
Although i dont know who they would pick to represent Dragon Quest. Including spin-offs, the only reoccuring player character is Terry. But they could always go with one/some of the monsters. Slime and Dracky are their most popular and well known.

 

[Weyard]

That is true, I was just meaning all the information we will be receiving in the two day period between Tuesday and Wednesday will be crazy!

BTW, on the subject of Megaman a VERY reliable source has come out saying Capcom is prepping a new game for commemorating Megaman's 25th Anniversary. No word on what it is but something might be in the works: http://protodudesrockmancorner.blogspot.com/2011/06/mega-man-at-e3-2011.html

Notice how many series are having 25th's this year.

Zelda
Metal Gear
Sonic
Megaman
Dragon Quest

Quite a bit.

Hopefully they're finally getting around to ending the X series. The last 2 games weren't canon because they woke Zero up. They need to go ahead and do the Elf Wars and have Zero put back into stasis so it is all uniform and canon again.

 

[Deleted member]

Okay, so I decided to do some math and decide how the SSBP (Paradise) rumor correlates with new playable characters.

Brawl had four (Five if you count Zero Suit Samus) new playable characters revealed at E3 2006 trailer. There were fifteen (Sixteen) new characters overall. While this won't end up indicating the entire roster overall, if only one new character is revealed at E3 2011, we should expect three to four new characters for the game. And if Mega Man Volnutt is confirmed, we will have at least two or three more new characters left. Which one do you think it'll be?

I'm absolutely certain that if only three to four new characters are going to be in the next game, there will be only three third-party characters max, possibly losing one of {Snake, Sonic}.

Which leaves us with only Nintendo characters. Any one of {Ridley, Little Mac, Ray MK III, Issac/Matthew, Saki/Isa Jo , Bowser Jr., King K. Rool} could be in as I suspect that the new characters will be either villains and/or characters from new series. I think we'll get one new villain and three new protagonists. The latter I pick Little Mac, Ray MK III and Issac/Matthew, thought less likely choices such as Starfy, 5th Gen Pokemon, Krystal, new Fire Emblem character and Samurai Gorah (Last one is slightly contradicting, since he's a rival of Captain Falcon, but he's not a true villain either, plus he's also a popular request, so he has a chance) are also possible. As for villains, I think it's going to be Ridley since he's the most requested villain IIRC, but if he doesn't work, King K. Rool or Bowser Jr. are also strong candidates for the one villain.

So overall, I predict {Ridley, Issac/Matthew, Ray MK III, Little Mac}.

 

[ChronoBound]

The only guaranteed newcomer for Smash 4 is some sort of Pokemon newcomer. Game Freak has a heavy hand in determining Pokemon content in Smash Bros. So any list for newcomers for Smash 4 must at least have some sort of Pokemon newcomer.

 

[UberMario]

If a 4th Kirby slot was formed, it should be Rick. Gooey would just be a Kirby-Yoshi fusion moveset-wise and Knuckle Joe, as has been said, is a common enemy. Sure, you could say that the Pokemon franchise is represented by characters that are "generic", but it just seems doubtful that Knuckle Joe would be anything other than an assist trophy, though he does have moveset potential.

 

[AetherEch0s]

I think among the newcomers you listed, Lucario would be swapped for Zoroark and Falco removed.

 

[Weyard]

If it's only 5, I'm calling Isaac, Ridley, Little Mac, Zoroark, and BowserJr/Toad.

However if it's only 5, I would want all of the melee and Brawl characters to return, excluding Pichu and DrMario.

 

[UberMario]

I think among the newcomers you listed, Lucario would be swapped for Zoroark and Falco removed.

They wouldn't remove Falco, he's the 2nd most popular Star Fox character out there. Lucario and Ike are the most likely to leave, though.

 

[AetherEch0s]

And completely unneeded. Not to mention he frequently leaves in the series, so it would actually be canon for him to leave at least once, to return in a later smash.

Forgot about Ike. Yeah, hes gone too.

 

[Starphoenix]

It's the 20th for Sonic not the 25th.

Whoops, my bad. Point is we have a lot of big anniversaries, two of those series happen to already be in the Smash universe. The other two are also plausible. Mainly though I was just pointing out all the anniversaries.

 

[Deleted member]

They wouldn't remove Falco, he's the 2nd most popular Star Fox character out there. Lucario and Ike are the most likely to leave, though.

Lucario I can see being removed (Although would not want), but Ike makes no sense. He has an unique moveset and is a starter. Based off last Smash, they'll kick off the unlockable characters before they think about the starters. Ike will very likely stay.

The fact that Roy was unlockable and a clone were reasons why he wasn't in Brawl. Ike doesn't have those two reasons.

 

[refugee]

Whoops, my bad. Point is we have a lot of big anniversaries, two of those series happen to already be in the Smash universe. The other two are also plausible. Mainly though I was just pointing out all the anniversaries.

Lol I was just being a perfectionist there. I know what you meant.

If it's only 5, I'm calling Isaac, Ridley, Little Mac, Zoroark, and BowserJr/Toad.

However if it's only 5, I would want all of the melee and Brawl characters to return, excluding Pichu and DrMario.

Completely agree. They can even make Dr. Mario a alternative costume for Mario for all I care.

 

[Weyard]

Lucario I can see being removed (Although would not want), but Ike makes no sense. He has an unique moveset and is a starter. Based off last Smash, they'll kick off the unlockable characters before they think about the starters. Ike will very likely stay.

The fact that Roy was unlockable and a clone were reasons why he wasn't in Brawl. Ike doesn't have those two reasons.

I don't think Ike is going anywhere. The only reason he would go is if his moveset was passed off to Ganondorf. There is no way Sakurai is going to think to do this without someone specifically giving him the idea to do so. I doubt anyone has or will, so Ganondorf will in all likelihood remain a semiclone and Ike will stay.

Since Roy and Mewtwo were the farthest along before being cut, we might just get Roy back with an edited moveset. He'll probably remain as similar to Marth as Falco is to Fox now. Sharing a few moves but most are new animations/attributes.
Leaving us with 3 Fire Emblem reps.

If we get the announcement and it turns out to be Paradise, my new roster will be like:

Veterans:
Mario
Luigi
Peach
Bowser
Wario
Yoshi
Link
Toon/young Link * I'm fairly confident he will return as Young Link as advertisement for OoT3ds.
Zelda
Ganondorf
Samus/zss
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Kirby
Metaknight
DDD
Ness
Lucas
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
Pikachu
PT
Jigglypuff
*Lucario. Might be replaced, might stay
Marth
Ike
Captain Falcon
Olimar
Ice climbers
Rob
G&W


Previously cut veterans to return:
Mewtwo
Roy

Newcomers:
Isaac
Ridley
Little Mac
Zoroark
*bowser Jr/Toad possible but are an afterthought compared to the above.

3rd party:
*Sonic-Might be dropped
*Snake- Might be dropped, less likely than Sonic though
Megaman Volnutt

Giving us around 43 characters not counting transformations and around 50 or so at the most counting transformations, assuming no Brawl characters are cut.

6 newcomers counting Megaman.
Roy and Mewtwo return as veterans with slightly altered movesets.

 

[augustoflores]

Hopefully they're finally getting around to ending the X series. The last 2 games weren't canon because they woke Zero up. They need to go ahead and do the Elf Wars and have Zero put back into stasis so it is all uniform and canon again.

you just had to go and say that... I'm also the one who has the most knowledge on the main series of megaman (eg... not nt warrior/battle network, and starforce)

the end of megaman x5 shows a moment in the future of X and Zero. this moment happens after the events of Megaman X6, Megaman X7, Megaman X8, and Megaman X: Command Mission. to back up the canonity, how do you explain Axl becoming a biometal in ZXAdvent? would you consider Advent non canon?

i would love to have the elf wars, it was told that the event was one of the most brutal events in all history.

 

[AetherEch0s]

Roy was removed because he had served his purpose as advertisement, as Ike has done. I expect he will be removed because Marth will be the one representing their newest game(remake) and the series as a whole.
Plus, his unique moveset would partially go to Ganondorf, so Ike mains wont have to give up their favorite play style.

 

[Weyard]

you just had to go and say that... I'm also the one who has the most knowledge on the main series of megaman (eg... not nt warrior/battle network, and starforce)

the end of megaman x5 shows a moment in the future of X and Zero. this moment happens after the events of Megaman X6, Megaman X7, Megaman X8, and Megaman X: Command Mission. to back up the canonity, how do you explain Axl becoming a biometal in ZXAdvent? would you consider Advent non canon?

i would love to have the elf wars, it was told that the event was one of the most brutal events in all history.

You aren't the only one with some knowledge of the Megaman franchise.

It isn't stated anywhere in the games that that scene takes place at an undetermined point in the future. That's just something fans came up with to "canonize" everything after 5.

According to Keiji Inafune, the series artist and producer, x5 was the last game in the x series. Everything after x5 was made by a different director and is thus not canon.

If I recall correctly, Model A relates to Albert and has nothing to do with Axl, it just has a similar copying ability. Model A doesn't contain any traces of Axl. Because Axl doesn't exist in the canon of the Megaman Zero series and in continuation, the XZ series. The first game with Axl wasn't released until after MMZ1, so they never took the time to add him into the background story of any game past that point in the series.

From the megaman wiki:

Though the design of the biometal is heavily based on Axl, a character from the Mega Man X series, the in-story explanation is that it is a backup system for Albert as the Zero series does not acknowledge or allude Axl's existence at all. This is most likely because Mega Man Zero was released two years earlier than Mega Man X7, the game in which Axl made his debut. Also, Biometal Model A is the only Biometal who has different sprites for each main protagonists.

The elfwars could be a series to itself. It would do best with a different less anime-like artstyle I think.

 

[•Col•]

Roy was removed because he had served his purpose as advertisement, as Ike has done. I expect he will be removed because Marth will be the one representing their newest game(remake) and the series as a whole.
Plus, his unique moveset would partially go to Ganondorf, so Ike mains wont have to give up their favorite play style.

Roy was removed because they didn't have enough time to finish him for Brawl... *cough*

 

[AetherEch0s]

yeah, thats an excuse for the people who like him. There are also people who claim Geno almost made it, but was cut because of time, but you know how that goes.

 

[•Col•]

yeah, thats an excuse for the people who like him. There are also people who claim Geno almost made it, but was cut because of time, but you know how that goes.

But... Unlike Geno, there's actually data or w/e left for Roy on the actual Brawl disk.... o.O

 

[Deleted member]

Roy was removed because he had served his purpose as advertisement, as Ike has done. I expect he will be removed because Marth will be the one representing their newest game(remake) and the series as a whole.
Plus, his unique moveset would partially go to Ganondorf, so Ike mains wont have to give up their favorite play style.

Ike served in two games before Brawl and has a unique moveset, plus he's a starter. Ike is most certainly not in the game for advertisement and will probably stay cement. And being a starter and not being a clone is more then enough for me to think that he'll stay. It helps that he has had better luck in tiers then Mewtwo in Melee.

 

[Weyard]

Ike served in two games before Brawl and has a unique moveset, plus he's a starter. Ike is most certainly not in the game for advertisement and will probably stay cement. And being a starter and not being a clone is more then enough for me to think that he'll stay. It helps that he has had better luck in tiers then Mewtwo in Melee.

I found Mewtwo to be one of the worst characters on Melee. His reason for returning won't be that he was a good character lol. He was unique and awesome despite being kinda weak.

 

[AetherEch0s]

Sakurai : tiers? *laughs*

 

[Starphoenix]

Is there anything that says we cannot include Roy and keep the other two?

 

[AetherEch0s]

nope, nothing at all. Its just my opinion that Marth will be the only one.

 

[augustoflores]

i mixed up a few things... was it X6 that had zero going into that hyperbolic time chamber? also... i still haven't played X7 and i lost my X collection so i can't pass X6... also... ive got memory problems as i have constantly stated... you're right about the albert thing. i was testing you, and you passed. ^^

 

[Starphoenix]

i mixed up a few things... was it X6 that had zero going into that hyperbolic time chamber? also... i still haven't played X7 and i lost my X collection so i can't pass X6... also... ive got memory problems as i have constantly stated... you're right about the albert thing. i was testing you, and you passed. ^^

Yes it was X6. It was during Zero's ending of the game.

 

[Steam]

for the same reason they aren't bringing back mewtwo, they won't bring back roy. if they didn't have enough time to include them before, they won't have enough time to include them again because they still have that entire roster that beat them plus even more newcomers and nothing has boosted their popularity since brawl. I think ike might stay because of how popular he generally is in usage in brawl. though he'll probably end up like roy from melee to brawl unless there isn't a new FE character XD.

 

[augustoflores]

haven't played megaman games in 2 years... must emulate...

also... i noticed you people putting Megaman Volnutt on a roster... are you insane? are you following this cactus priick around? what makes you think he's got all the answers? because he says it without questioning himself as if it is hard facts?

 

[Deleted member]

haven't played megaman games in 2 years... must emulate...

also... i noticed you people putting Megaman Volnutt on a roster... are you insane? are you following this cactus priick around? what makes you think he's got all the answers? because he says it without questioning himself as if it is hard facts?

Even thought I still question the rumor's vitality, it's the best that we've gotten so far in terms of evidence regarding Super Smash Bros. 4's existence and how the character roster will be done.

 

[•Col•]

for the same reason they aren't bringing back mewtwo, they won't bring back roy. if they didn't have enough time to include them before, they won't have enough time to include them again because they still have that entire roster that beat them plus even more newcomers and nothing has boosted their popularity since brawl. I think ike might stay because of how popular he generally is in usage in brawl. though he'll probably end up like roy from melee to brawl unless there isn't a new FE character XD.

They can't be included because you're saying there won't be any time to include them in the next game...?That doesn't make any freaking sense.

Hey, guess what. Snake was going to be in Melee but they didn't have enough time to include him... I guess that's why he wasn't put in Brawl either....

Spoiler

ohwaitlol

 

[Starphoenix]

haven't played megaman games in 2 years... must emulate...

also... i noticed you people putting Megaman Volnutt on a roster... are you insane? are you following this cactus priick around? what makes you think he's got all the answers? because he says it without questioning himself as if it is hard facts?

Nobody is seriously taking what is stated as actual fact. We are just having some fun with the idea.

Tsk tsk tsk, I played Megaman not but a couple weeks ago. Not a real Megaman fan son. Have a lot of work to catch up with Blue Bombers such as I.

 

[augustoflores]

can you believe megaman is my favorite franchise? and i don't own a single game... i used to own classic anniversary and x anniversary as well as X8... i emulated all of Zero series and ZX series and i played and passed legends 1 and 2... i haven't played misadventures... as stated before, i didn't get a chance to pass X6... my brother "lost it" while his friends came over one day.

anyways... Im gonna analyze cactus a little more. see if i can find any chinks.

 

[Starphoenix]

Hate to double post, but I've got some news for everyone. There is some major Project Cafe rumbling over at NeoGAF. Look's like they might have uncovered the name for the system! Get ready, the Nintendo Beem! Seriously... Look for yourselves...

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=28298124&postcount=7230

 

[augustoflores]

WHYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!! *sobs*


...
i got over it. "so anyways... beem... gonna come over? i got the new Beem and Smash bros paradise?"... uhh... i got used to the wii.

 

[Starphoenix]

WHYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!! *sobs*


...
i got over it. "so anyways... beem... gonna come over? i got the new Beem and Smash bros paradise?"... uhh... i got used to the wii.

Actually if this is true (which chances are very well might be) then the Smash Bros. Paradise rumour is nothing more than gutter trash.

 

[Jaklub]

Dear God this is horrible.
Beem?
It wouldn't be all that bad if the logo (I assume this is what attached image is) didn't look like a sign of cheap Chinese PS2-styled famiclone.

I just hope it won't happen (the logo at least).