[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[ToiseOfChoice]

Who in the world needs Paradise Line when you can have Cave of the Past with all the final boss scenes from each mother game?

Meh, final bosses are overrated and trains are a sweet deal, especially if they do a better job showing off the game itself.

Wanting to expand PT To have his most popular pokemon of most generations isn't exactly mis-representation. I'd put that in It's own category. "Different Representation; Can be viewed as better in some categories, worse in others"

...But when it comes down to it, If Sakurai and the Pokemon Co thought having PT Only represent one generation rather than Three then the bottom line is that It probably won't change.

If you're replacing the original starters with anyone else, then yes, that's mis-representation.

If you're keeping PT as he is but adding in random starters as alt models, that's getting into over-representation territory (good luck trying to match up the movesets).

If you replace Red but keep the Pokemon, that's still mis-representation.

If you add another trainer like Blue or Gold with three random Pokemon AND you keep Red, that's over-representation.

If you keep the trainer but make an alt model trainer... now that's fine IF the alt makes sense thematically (in this case Leaf, as she's the very definition of an alternative to Red).


Sakurai doesn't care about repping the gens with playable characters, I don't know why people here do.

 

[oceanic--ice]

i just got an idea..... how about custo-miis? u put different movesets on the mii coming from other chars.....

example: u put kirby hammer and mario hat on a mii and he gets mario B and kirby <B>.... or u put pika cheeks and link boomerang and he gets pika B and link boomerang.... this will allow A LOT of customization without needing many different chars....

 

[DekuBoy]

Uh, Toise I think a stage from Spirit Tracks has a higher chance of getting in than Paradise Line, though I like the idea. However Mother 1 is criminally ignored by Nintendo.

 

[Pieman0920]

Hmmm.....When did they change this topic's board?

And yeah, is very hard to top a train level going to Zelda. Its like having a boxing ring stage and giving it to the Kirby stage instead of Punch Out.

...Well not quite, but you get what I mean. Zelda's a bigger series with a whole game based around the concept, while Mother and WL are much less so in their train-y goodness.

 

[DekuBoy]

That is a very good comparison. Have any of you seen the newest Spuirit Tracks trailer? I want to talk about Toon Zelda's chances.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Meh, final bosses are overrated and trains are a sweet deal, especially if they do a better job showing off the game itself.

I beg to differ. Music wars time.

PT Stuff

We should add PT Alts just so I can have the "Lucas" From the fourth gen just to have my name in brawl...
...Twice.

The bottom line is: Having three pokemon each from different "Regions" Wouldn't do any harm as long as those are worthwhile. But the point is, It's only different representation. You're not really gaining anything asides from pleasing more regions and you're at a cost with taking out unique movesets.

So thus being different representation and not changing anything itself (Or debatable misrepresentation) It's simply not worth changing, and chances are as I said It won't be changed.

And speaking on the mother topic, I just found this on this laptop:

It actually fits far better in picture than in discussion.

Uh, Toise I think a stage from Spirit Tracks has a higher chance of getting in than Paradise Line, though I like the idea. However Mother 1 is criminally ignored by Nintendo.

Spirit Tracks does If It's TL's most recent game (Or one of the most) By Smash 4. Paradise Line just seems far to obscure. If I was to take anywhere from Mother 1, I think Mt. Itoi as Gamenerd suggested fits the bill.

Tho personally, when it comes to train levels, give me excess express (Or SOMETHING From TTYD) or the train level from Mario Party 8.

That is a very good comparison. Have any of you seen the newest Spuirit Tracks trailer? I want to talk about Toon Zelda's chances.

...So, who wants to be the first one to bring back up the tingle debate?

 

[SmashChu]

Hmmm.....When did they change this topic's board?

And yeah, is very hard to top a train level going to Zelda. Its like having a boxing ring stage and giving it to the Kirby stage instead of Punch Out.

...Well not quite, but you get what I mean. Zelda's a bigger series with a whole game based around the concept, while Mother and WL are much less so in their train-y goodness.

Makes no sense to me, seeing as other threads like this are under the workshop.

 

[Reb]

That is a very good comparison. Have any of you seen the newest Spuirit Tracks trailer? I want to talk about Toon Zelda's chances.

I'm kind of against this. I think the four Zelda characters we've got now are good enough. D: I don't think I'd like it if she were simply to Zelda as TL is to Link. Even if she weren't, does she have enough canon abilities to warrant an original moveset? I think the reason TL's in there is to independently represent all of his games, which (I guess) can be considered separate from the normal Link games. They're kind of a sub-category within Zelda, so do they really need two reps? I think the main character will suffice.

Tho personally, when it comes to train levels, give me excess express (Or SOMETHING From TTYD)

On that note, I'm kinda irked that Paper Mario was basically non-existent in SSBB, aside from...stickers. With three popular games out, you'd think they could get at least some music.

 

[Damien = God]

Read earlier here.... RAIDEN!!!

My new favorite character if they added him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R61cCBUWNQM

Think about it!!! Fast sword wielder. Slower than MetaKnight. Stronger.

That made my day thinking about him being in it.

 

[Neo Exdeath]

^I think you may like this:http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=7681968&postcount=1966

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Zelda's a bigger series with a whole game based around the concept, while Mother and WL are much less so in their train-y goodness.

The point of a Mother train is to show off all the towns themselves in the backround, not so much for the fact that you're riding on a choo-choo.

As for Zelda, I'm kinda doubting a Spirit Tracks stage but I wouldn't mind. Stages aren't my bag though, so meh.


@Koops: I honestly can't even tell if you're agreeing with me or trying to convince me of something at this point. Probably doesn't help that you keep bringing up Mother for no reason. But here's a non-blurry Ness icon for you.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

On that note, I'm kinda irked that Paper Mario was basically non-existent in SSBB, aside from...stickers. With three popular games out, you'd think they could get at least some music.

You're going to love this thread then.

Anyways, PM and the Mario RPG's Did actually get a few references: (Credits to SmashWiki for some of this stuff)

- Paper Mario/Luigi/Bowser/Peach + Goombella/Fracktail are trophies along with Wedding Peach/Bowser
- Bowser's Blue alternative color scheme represents the color scheme of Rookie/Is very similar.
- The Frying Pan of Peach's foward smash is from SMRPG.
- During Melee, SMRPG Was the only game with peach using a Parasol.
- Mario's Final Smash may be loosely based on "Ultra Flame", where he had the ability to fire off a barrage of giant fireballs that damage all foes on the screen.
- Mario's Up tilt in Brawl may have been influenced by his "Mega Glove" attack, where he would punch upward with a large glove.
- Peach's neutral combo may have been based on "Super Slap", where Peach slaps her enemies.
- Bowser's neutral combo, as well as his other clawing attacks, may have been influenced by "Drill Claw", where Bowser claws his enemies.
- Peach's Final Smash may be loosely based on "Sleepy Time", where she had the ability to put enemies to sleep.
- Bowser's back throw, when slowed down, looks similar to how he threw Mario at enemies with the "Hurly Gloves".
- 28 stickers from the Mario RPG Games are in altogether.
- While it didn't happen in the final cut, "Forest Maze" And "Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time Boss Battle Theme" Both were found as music files in the listings.

And actually, Geno and Paper Mario are still requested a lot, even to this very day.

With that said: We need Music/Stage/Assist Trophy representation for the 7 RPG Games. Pennington or Dimentio would fill in perfectly as AT's. Music...I've written up a music list in the Stage Discussion group. Stage; The Thousand Year Door, It's one of those places like New Pork City in Mother 3 that you WILL Remember with playing this game all the way through.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Hate double posting but...

@Koops: I honestly can't even tell if you're agreeing with me or trying to convince me of something at this point. Probably doesn't help that you keep bringing up Mother for no reason. But here's a non-blurry Ness icon for you.

Pokemon: In an odd way, I'm agreeing and disagreeing with you. I believe that asides from popularity, replacing PT's pokemon wouldn't be misrepresentation, It'd just be different, but considering you aren't gaining a lot, there's really not much of a use in changing them.

Mother: I brought it up with the Paradise Line/Final Boss discussion with stages. It had to do with our discussion because It shows that fans can't always have the roster directed straight at them, but I must admit, it fits VERY Well.

+ I'm a huge fan of Mother as I am with the Mario RPG's as you can obviously tell.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

No, I meant the Mother roster stuff. We're discussing stuff like replacing iconic Pokemon and you're talking about including important Mother characters. It'd be a better parallel if you were talking about replacing Ness or Lucas.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

No, I meant the Mother roster stuff. We're discussing stuff like replacing iconic Pokemon and you're talking about including important Mother characters. It'd be a better parallel if you were talking about replacing Ness or Lucas.

ninten for ness replacement

As in: When it comes to fans, Replacing =/= Including sometimes?

Makes sense.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Pretty much. The only time "replacing" is cool is when it's a different design, like with Zelda characters. Even then you can't stray too far.

 

[Pieman0920]

Well its possible if the design is too far away from the classic, and is disliked by a good deal of people, yet still important in its own right, you may get two characters instead of one. (For instance, Toon Link there, though that could be based around him replacing Young Link)

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Well Toon Link and Young Link are interchangeable (except for those "I want a MM Link moveset" people), but obviously not the case with big Link and little Link. I'm pretty sure if the size difference wasn't there, the two Links would be alt costumes of each other like with Wario. If that.

 

[DekuBoy]

Well, Toon Link represents the games in which Link is a child as well as representing the bold cel-shaded style. Big Link represents the games which he is older and uses a more realistic style.

 

[Arcadenik]

No, Jiggs isn't a dud. Not even close. She's still among the most popular Pokemon after all this time and more than enough people play as her. Even her character boards here have more activity than Bowser and DK, so it's not just little girls who don't post on message boards.

A dud is a character that no one really asked for and doesn't take off. No one asked for Doc and Pichu and no one really misses them. Compare that to someone like Roy or Pit, who few people knew about (or zero people in Roy's case) but still ended up being really popular.


Now that's not to say she's a lock for the next game (I wouldn't consider anyone other than Pikachu and PT to be guaranteed when there's time restrictions afoot), but she's clearly not as low priority as you want her to be. The fact that he had Mewtwo sit out instead of her should've made that obvious.

Keep in mind that I believe Sakurai doesn't see Pokemon or FE as "cyclical," as a series where characters deliberately replace each other with each installment. Unless there's a dud like Pichu, it appears he won't be dropping anyone intentionally. He wanted Mewtwo and Roy in Brawl alongside everyone else after all.

He also wanted Dr. Mario in Brawl, too. Does that mean he was not a dud? Oh, and if we didn't need a fifth Mario character, why was Sakurai trying to add Dr. Mario in Brawl? Dr. Mario was going to be a filler clone again. By SSB4, I hope there is a 5th Mario character who is not a filler clone like Toad (I am sorry but Bowser Jr. is a candidate for a filler clone like Dr. Mario is and Toad could not possibly end up a clone of anyone)

I also think Sakurai added Jigglypuff over Mewtwo because he was trying to fix/improve Mewtwo but ended up with time constraints after he had to stop working on Mewtwo and start working on Sonic but he still wanted one more Pokemon to fill out the fourth slot but couldn't finish Mewtwo so he probably decided to run with Jigglypuff since she is very simple to animate and quicker to program. Also, don't forget that Sakurai had to come up with four new movesets for four new Pokemon and that would take a lot of time.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

He also wanted Dr. Mario in Brawl, too. Does that mean he was not a dud? Oh, and if we didn't need a fifth Mario character, why was Sakurai trying to add Dr. Mario in Brawl? Dr. Mario was going to be a filler clone again. By SSB4, I hope there is a 5th Mario character who is not a filler clone like Toad (I am sorry but Bowser Jr. is a candidate for a filler clone like Dr. Mario is and Toad could not possibly end up a clone of anyone)

1) Unlike Roy/Mewtwo, he was not found to have any victory theme. Also let us note that nobody knows why those folders are there. It's blank folders. Could've been used to make Mario have attributes similar to Doc, no one has any idea, BUT OF COURSE WE MUST SPECULATE BECAUSE THOSE FILES ARE THERE FOR SOMETHING...

*Is prepared to scream out to anyone who adds "Forbidden" onto the number*

2) Trying =/= Considered. Ever think he could've went
3) So just because you like the character makes it available for it not to be clone worthy?

+ Filler Clone =/= Clone. A Filler Clone is someone added meant to only bulk the roster, like how Doc was for his music. A clone is suppose to be a character who has REALLY Similar attributes to another character (Mainly Toon Link).

If Jr was added as a clone, he'd fall under the second one, partly filler but meh.

edit: Yay...Back into the mario discussion territory.

 

[Arcadenik]

Yes, because victory music = better chances to be playable in the next game.

Also, contrary to popular belief, Roy is a filler clone. He was added only to advertise his game that would come out months after Melee came out. He has no other purpose in Smash. He is a dead weight and he would have been still a filler clone in Brawl again.

Also, the reason Ganondorf was a clone in Melee was because Sakurai said he had a similar body build to Captain Falcon. And Ganondorf never used a sword in Ocarina of Time so he did not get the sword in Melee. He only used dark magic so Sakurai just made Ganondorf use magic to power up his Falcon Punch.

So if we go by Sakurai's logic, characters who are physically similar to each other are more likely going to be clones first before they become semi-clones. We saw this in SSB with Luigi. We saw this in Melee with Dr. Mario, Ganondorf, Falco, Young Link, Pichu, and Roy. We saw this in Brawl with Toon Link, Wolf, and Lucas and we would have seen it with Toon Zelda, Toon Sheik, and possibly Plusle & Minun (probably a decloned Pichu times two, assuming they are Pra_Mai).

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Yes, because victory music = better chances to be playable in the next game.

Also, contrary to popular belief, Roy is a filler clone. He was added only to advertise his game that would come out months after Melee came out. He has no other purpose in Smash. He is a dead weight and he would have been still a filler clone in Brawl again.

Filler Clone in melee? Yes. Filler Clone in Brawl? We don't know, but he wouldn't be filler to his series. For Fire Emblem, Roy's game/Roy is one of the most popular FE Characters and still has a leading role, thus not being "Filler" To his series.

Anyways; Victory Music actually means the character could have been considered more. Note: The could have.



Also:

Boredom - Good? Thinking of a new character icon style but I didn't put much time or a name on this one. Yes I know about the black part above his ear. I'll fix that later.

 

[Arcadenik]

Filler Clone in melee? Yes. Filler Clone in Brawl? We don't know, but he wouldn't be filler to his series. For Fire Emblem, Roy's game/Roy is one of the most popular FE Characters and still has a leading role, thus not being "Filler" To his series.

Anyways; Victory Music actually means the character could have been considered more. Note: The could have.

No, note the word "more", not "could have". All of the Forbidden Seven could have been considered but apparently according to you, having victory music means Roy and Mewtwo were considered more as if Sakurai wanted them more than the rest.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

No, note the word "more", not "could have". All of the Forbidden Seven could have been considered but apparently according to you, having victory music means Roy and Mewtwo were considered more as if Sakurai wanted them more than the rest.

II put more earlier instead of could have. My bad. Anyways, it can mean that Sakurai considered them above the rest, but then you run into the possibilities like them having unique victory themes but just never being implemented or in the files.

 

[Arcadenik]

Ahh, now that's better. You know what? I think that Sakurai probably added Mewtwo and Roy in the original Brawl roster before the Brawl poll started. I think that after Sakurai saw how Ike and Lucario were the most wanted Fire Emblem and Pokemon characters, respectively, he probably decided to scrap them in favor of the newer characters. It could probably explain the victory music.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Ahh, now that's better. You know what? I think that Sakurai probably added Mewtwo and Roy in the original Brawl roster before the Brawl poll started. I think that after Sakurai saw how Ike and Lucario were the most wanted Fire Emblem and Pokemon characters, respectively, he probably decided to scrap them in favor of the newer characters. It could probably explain the victory music.

Of all the theories I've heard, this one sounds like one of the more logical ones to an extent.

Anyways, I really don't know and It's hard for anyone to have an accurate answer here.. Fire Emblem and Pokemon are just awkward to discuss. I mean, I can see what will happen to every other "Installed" Franchise by the back of my hands. Like If we get a Mario newcomer, It'll probably be Jr or Toad. We've discussed it to death.

But these two lead to interesting ones because after rounding up the most popular ones and placeholders no one really has a clear answer. It's like almost all the characters from FE And Pokemon who are in Brawl/Melee are in Purgatory.

I'm however indifferent on both. Both are cool, other Pokemon and Fire Emblem characters can also be cool so meh.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

Filler Clone in melee? Yes. Filler Clone in Brawl? We don't know, but he wouldn't be filler to his series. For Fire Emblem, Roy's game/Roy is one of the most popular FE Characters and still has a leading role, thus not being "Filler" To his series.

Anyways; Victory Music actually means the character could have been considered more. Note: The could have.



Also:

Boredom - Good? Thinking of a new character icon style but I didn't put much time or a name on this one. Yes I know about the black part above his ear. I'll fix that later.

I don't believe much of this is true. Roy does not have an active role, as the series is non continuing so his game is over and he is not recent, so he does not have a leading role.

Also, regarding his game popularity, as I recall the generally accepted oreder of FE games are: 5/4, 1/2/3, 7, 6, 9, 8, 10, 11...more or less. There are still 4 games in front of it, with only one represented (I counted 1-3 as the same game) leaving characters from the more popular fire emblems (ths the more popular characters) with the playable spot.

I want to see Leaf personally

 

[SmashChu]

Ahh, now that's better. You know what? I think that Sakurai probably added Mewtwo and Roy in the original Brawl roster before the Brawl poll started. I think that after Sakurai saw how Ike and Lucario were the most wanted Fire Emblem and Pokemon characters, respectively, he probably decided to scrap them in favor of the newer characters. It could probably explain the victory music.

Sorry Koppa, it's actually a really bad theory.

The only way we can accept it is to also accept that Sakurai could not have had all four of those characters, and the files suggest the opposite (that Sakurai planned for all 4). Also, it's too early on as Roy and Mewtwo still had victory themes. It's only logical if you accept he can't have 4 characters, but there is no logic to back that up.

 

[Pieman0920]

I don't believe much of this is true. Roy does not have an active role, as the series is non continuing so his game is over and he is not recent, so he does not have a leading role.

Also, regarding his game popularity, as I recall the generally accepted oreder of FE games are: 5/4, 1/2/3, 7, 6, 9, 8, 10, 11...more or less. There are still 4 games in front of it, with only one represented (I counted 1-3 as the same game) leaving characters from the more popular fire emblems (ths the more popular characters) with the playable spot.

I want to see Leaf personally

I don't think you can quite make a popularity ranking for FE like that seeing as tehre's generally two different parts of the FE fandom. In any case, I don't think either ranks 1/2/3 that high, and 11 is technically the same so it seems silly that you put that at the end, especially if I recall the main complaint was that it stayed original to the original games and didn't really use the improvements from 4 and onwards.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

I don't believe much of this is true. Roy does not have an active role, as the series is non continuing so his game is over and he is not recent, so he does not have a leading role.

Also, regarding his game popularity, as I recall the generally accepted oreder of FE games are: 5/4, 1/2/3, 7, 6, 9, 8, 10, 11...more or less. There are still 4 games in front of it, with only one represented (I counted 1-3 as the same game) leaving characters from the more popular fire emblems (ths the more popular characters) with the playable spot.

I want to see Leaf personally

Leaf's cool, but getting back on topic of roy:

Roy has a leading role in his game. His game is one of the more iconic ones to the series regardless of whether people like it, and mainly thanks to smash, It's popular.

Oh, and the possibility of a remake of Roy's game as Toise posted up.

So no, he wouldn't be misrepresenting Fire Emblem, he wouldn't be filler. Does that mean however that we need him? Not having him can also work too.

Sorry Koppa, it's actually a really bad theory.

You know, he could've just had the themes there. I'm sick of hearing "JUST BECAUSE IT'S IN THE FILES WE MUST SPECULATE" And this is coming from a person who really wanted the Fourside music, Mario RPG Music, and all of those Earthbound tracks.

I mean yeah, he could have planned them to be in with the rest of the cast, or he didn't. Nobody has the true answers and all we have to go by it are some blank files that people overspeculate.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

I don't think you can quite make a popularity ranking for FE like that seeing as tehre's generally two different parts of the FE fandom. In any case, I don't think either ranks 1/2/3 that high, and 11 is technically the same so it seems silly that you put that at the end, especially if I recall the main complaint was that it stayed original to the original games and didn't really use the improvements from 4 and onwards.

I was ranking it from what I have understood and heard from those who have played all of the games. 1-3's ranking's could be farther down I suppose, the main point was where 6 ranked. which is generally accpeted as being in the middle as a mediocre FE game.

Take 11 off if you wish, I've seen it referred to as it's own installment, though I never considered it 11.

@TreKoops
The only thing he has going for him is his Smash popularity, which granted is a huge influence. I personally would be satisfied with Roy if I couldnt have Sigurd or Leaf...

though you are off in his game is iconic to the series. It didn't add anything to the formular like 4 or 9 did, and didn;t have outstanding gameplay or difficulty: He's popular (for smash, not in Fe community), not his game.

 

[Pieman0920]

The thing is FE6 isn't iconic. You can argue that Roy is iconic, but that wouldn't FE6 is. Generally it isn't looked upon all that foundly, and the fact that it isn't a international game doesn't help. Out of the 6 non-international FE games, I'd probably the 3rd most iconic at best. Also Roy is probably one of, if not the least popular lords in game. =/

 

[Thirdkoopa]

@TreKoops
The only thing he has going for him is his Smash popularity, which granted is a huge influence. I personally would be satisfied with Roy if I couldnt have Sigurd or Leaf...

though you are off in his game is iconic to the series. It didn't add anything to the formular like 4 or 9 did, and didn;t have outstanding gameplay or difficulty: He's popular (for smash, not in Fe community), not his game.

Actually in the FE Community I'd say he's pretty popular since chances are a lot of people from there also play smash especially with FE Representation. Not that I know much on this but Roy still stands out in the community. Speaking of which, isn't his game one of the best selling in the series?

Regardless, the point is he wouldn't be a filler character to his series If added. Clone? Yeah, possibly. Filler? Important to the series, iconic in the series, one of the better selling games...Yeah nope not seeing anything filler there.

As for his game, I wouldn't know but I hear he died a lot.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

Actually in the FE Community I'd say he's pretty popular since chances are a lot of people from there also play smash especially with FE Representation. Not that I know much on this but Roy still stands out in the community. Speaking of which, isn't his game one of the best selling in the series?

Regardless, the point is he wouldn't be a filler character to his series If added. Clone? Yeah, possibly. Filler? Important to the series, iconic in the series, one of the better selling games...Yeah nope not seeing anything filler there.

As for his game, I wouldn't know but I hear he died a lot.

Your wrong on your first point. Smahs made the series more popular, not debuted it. There were 5 games prior to melee and they all did fairly well. The FE community is those who play FE, not those who play FE and Smash. There are more of the former. To the seires his game was mediocre and Roy himself an awful unit due to mediocre growths and a late promotion. He's not an Icon, because very few who like Fire Emblem AND have played his game like him. No single game is "important" to the seires since they do not blend together. If anything th emost important were:
1-First
4 (might be 5)- Added in many new features that are still in the game today
7- First international
And that's really it.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

He also wanted Dr. Mario in Brawl, too. Does that mean he was not a dud? Oh, and if we didn't need a fifth Mario character, why was Sakurai trying to add Dr. Mario in Brawl? Dr. Mario was going to be a filler clone again. By SSB4, I hope there is a 5th Mario character who is not a filler clone like Toad (I am sorry but Bowser Jr. is a candidate for a filler clone like Dr. Mario is and Toad could not possibly end up a clone of anyone)

I also think Sakurai added Jigglypuff over Mewtwo because he was trying to fix/improve Mewtwo but ended up with time constraints after he had to stop working on Mewtwo and start working on Sonic but he still wanted one more Pokemon to fill out the fourth slot but couldn't finish Mewtwo so he probably decided to run with Jigglypuff since she is very simple to animate and quicker to program. Also, don't forget that Sakurai had to come up with four new movesets for four new Pokemon and that would take a lot of time.

You know you're a lunatic, right?


The fact that Mewtwo and Roy had the individual victory themes DOES mean that he seriously considered them. It's one thing to make a folder for a character, it's another to have only the two of them involved in an entirely new feature on top of that.

Keep in mind that a completely non-existent character is listed among those seven empty folders. Any character who appeared only in that section obviously wasn't given much thought before being cut.

And no, Roy isn't a filler clone. Filler clones are characters that no one asked for AND no one misses. That means Doc and Pichu only. Roy's still easily the third most popular FE character and people are still very, very bitter about his removal (even if it was unintentional on Sakurai's part).

The FE community is those who play FE, not those who play FE and Smash. There are more of the former.

I hope you're not saying more people play Fire Emblem by itself than Fire Emblem and Smash.


Nobody cares if fans like Roy because of Smash or because of Fire Emblem, only that he's popular in general. It's rather obvious that he's still the third most popular character in the series.

And considering FE6 has so far outsold FE5 and FE7-FE11 in Japan, I'd say his game did a pretty good job. Not that that matters, people should've realized that the games themselves are irrelevant as soon as Ike was announced.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

You know you're a lunatic, right?


The fact that Mewtwo and Roy had the individual victory themes DOES mean that he seriously considered them. It's one thing to make a folder for a character, it's another to have only the two of them involved in an entirely new feature on top of that.

Keep in mind that a completely non-existent character is listed among those seven empty folders. Any character who appeared only in that section obviously wasn't given much thought before being cut.

And no, Roy isn't a filler clone. Filler clones are characters that no one asked for AND no one misses. That means Doc and Pichu only. Roy's still easily the third most popular FE character and people are still very, very bitter about his removal (even if it was unintentional on Sakurai's part).





I hope you're not saying more people play Fire Emblem by itself than Fire Emblem and Smash.


Nobody cares if fans like Roy because of Smash or because of Fire Emblem, only that he's popular in general. It's rather obvious that he's still the third most popular character in the series.

And considering FE6 has so far outsold FE5 and FE7-FE11 in Japan, I'd say his game did a pretty good job. Not that that matters, people should've realized that the games themselves are irrelevant as soon as Ike was announced.

I was saying that there are people who like FE more than Smash and don't have affinities for the Smash only FE characters. Then there are people who do, I believ that there are more of the former.

Despite the games sales, anyone who played it, and the others, could tell you it wasn;t too spectacular.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

I played it and I prefer it to every game in the series except FE9. But the game itself really doesn't matter here.

You have to realize that A) no one cares about the distinction between the kinds of fans and B) even amongst FE series fans, most of them prefer Marth, Roy, and Ike over any other individual character. Yes, Smash is mostly responsible for this, but it doesn't change the fact that these are the ones people want to see most.

 

[SmashChu]

You know, he could've just had the themes there. I'm sick of hearing "JUST BECAUSE IT'S IN THE FILES WE MUST SPECULATE" And this is coming from a person who really wanted the Fourside music, Mario RPG Music, and all of those Earthbound tracks.

I mean yeah, he could have planned them to be in with the rest of the cast, or he didn't. Nobody has the true answers and all we have to go by it are some blank files that people overspeculate.

Toise explains it well, but the point is that those two have it while the rest don't, but the rest of the cast (save Wolf) has that theme as well. So, naturally, there should be a connection. It makes sense.

You know you're a lunatic, right?

The fact that Mewtwo and Roy had the individual victory themes DOES mean that he seriously considered them. It's one thing to make a folder for a character, it's another to have only the two of them involved in an entirely new feature on top of that.

Keep in mind that a completely non-existent character is listed among those seven empty folders. Any character who appeared only in that section obviously wasn't given much thought before being cut.

 

[Fatmanonice]

At the moment, I'm just waiting for Christmas so I can play most of the new installments various franchises so it's kind of hard to care too much about SSB4. I'm also starting to think about Zelda Wii more since Miyamoto and Anouma haven't shut up about it for like the past two weeks. Man, it kind of weirds me out that another Smash game probably won't be released for another 5 years and yet a lot of us here are still enthusiatic about it. O_o;