[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[drag0nscythe]

Wut? Do you try playing competitively? Specials are definitely not the only thing that makes a character.

and no. I do not beleive in playing party games competitively.

Suddenly whether a character is original or not is based contingently on what their special moves are. /bull****

The only character in the game even close to being a 'clone' is Toon Link, but all of his attacks have different effects than Links. He's also much lighter so his aerial game is better.

Its official. Melee had no clones either then.

 

[.WC.]

Its official. Melee had no clones either then.

 

[BBQTV]

and no. I do not beleive in playing party games competitively.

aw hell naw

 

[Neo Exdeath]

@drag0nscythe: Well, that explains your warped understanding of specials. Most specials are pure ****.

 

[Pieman0920]

Hoo boy.

Look, Pieman, I think you're an alright guy. One of my favorite posters here thanks to your persistence in any given argument.

But you're COMPLETELY out of touch with pretty much everything. The key characters and elements in all these series, the fans, Sakurai, everything. It wouldn't be so bad if everytime I had to break it down for you, you didn't just go "no you're wrong!" and try to justify your crazy backwards logic.

It's gotten to the point that everytime you start talking about any series, I end up thinking you've never played any of the games, that your entire experience comes from skimming Wikipedia and GameFAQs.

And that's just plain awful.

...And what is your reason for Jody exactly? You never answered the friggen question. Jody isn't really a key element, given that F-Zero's story is lacking at best. Her first role was in X, and that wasn't much given the fact that the game didn't have much of a story. In GX she shows up in one chapter, though is mentioned previously, because Falcon has to go rescue her. Once she's rescued, she's never heard from again in that. In these games she has some connections, such as being a love interest to Falcon and John Tanaka, but being a love interest alone is not a good justification. Really its like saying Pauline is a viable Mario character because she's important in the original Donkey Kong game because she's a love interest of Mario and a object of desire for DK, but even then that's a better than Jody who's relation to Falcon only influences the story of one game in a small way.

Beyond that, she has a somewhat important role within the anime series, but the same can be said of several other characters, and Jody becomes fairly low on the pecking order. In addition, she really has no fans to speak of, where Goroh, Black Shadow, and even Pico seem to have more supporters. Sakurai has shown little to no concern about her though he has put her in as a trophy twice, though the same can be said of a good number of other characters.

Really though, it makes little sense to me that you're saying that I'm just going "no you're wrong" and saying I don't give an explanation when the paragraph you're quoting is a justification for why my views are that way, and your response give me no justification for yours. Your first response questioned if I was a fan of F-Zero, and your second makes accusations, and in no instance do you give me a explanation.

Really, actually saying Jody Summers would be a viable character lays more in line with someone who only reads up on the supplemental material rather than actually playing the game.




Oh, and Arc, every character has some unique special or ability given to them, and certain moves you listed act much differently than others. The Toad moveset you keep throwing around just doesn't have anything unique in it is all, and its pretty much borrowed moves/one move where you use an already established item. All I'm saying is that you should reconsider some parts of it and try to make some of it more unique. If you just have a moveset that copies everything from other people, then I would assume that the chahracter you're giving it to would have to be so popular that it doesn't matter if they don't bring anything new to the table, and that fans will be happy that the character is just there. Quite frankly though, I don't think Toad has that type of standing as of right now.

 

[drag0nscythe]

@drag0nscythe: Well, that explains your warped understanding of specials. Most specials are pure ****.

No warped understanding. Just a different way of looking at things. Smash is for everyone, not just the die hard nintendo fan who needs his fix. It is for those who play casual and for those who play hardcore.

People see things differently.

 

[Neo Exdeath]

^ I know that. I was just replying to your view of specials. You said they make a character.

 

[drag0nscythe]

^ I know that. I was just replying to your view of specials. You said they make a character.

They do. When someone asks, writes or comments on a character being in a magazine, the official Dojo website, on fourms (other then this one) and even on the TV, it is about the B moves. The iconic moves that everyone wants to see the characters perform.

 

[Pieman0920]

Specials are fairly important in defining the character, since they are the thing that people look at when a new character comes up. While their other moves are what normally gives them the edge in more advanced areas of play, I don't think many try to actually describe or think them out for a pottential new character because its something that can't fully be predicted. The moves are generally not too flashy, and their effectiveness in the game totally depends on how they are programmed in, so its just not as fun to hear about them or make them up.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Specials are fairly important in defining the character, since they are the thing that people look at when a new character comes up. While their other moves are what normally gives them the edge in more advanced areas of play, I don't think many try to actually describe or think them out for a pottential new character because its something that can't fully be predicted. The moves are generally not too flashy, and their effectiveness in the game totally depends on how they are programmed in, so its just not as fun to hear about them or make them up.

which is the truth. I do not want to hear that this character will "Punch" with A. It is a duh in a way. Only people who care about frames, speeds, lags, etc. give a hoot about A moves.

 

[.WC.]

which is the truth. I do not want to hear that this character will "Punch" with A. It is a duh in a way. Only people who care about frames, speeds, lags, etc. give a hoot about A moves.

Which is pretty much everybody. Unless you like thinking like a beginner.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Which is pretty much everybody. Unless you like thinking like a beginner.

Or a casual gamer, which is the majority group of players who bought smash.

 

[Arcadenik]

Yes, I agree that specials are important in defining the character. Why do you think I suggested Poison Mushrooms and Golden Mushrooms to be part of Toad's specials? He is associated with mushrooms so it would make sense for him to use mushrooms.

As for the last part in your post, you are basically saying made-up movesets are not fun. That doesn't mean characters with made-up movesets like Captain Falcon, R.O.B., Ice Climbers, and the Star Fox trio can't be in Smash. It is okay to make up movesets as long as it fits the character.

For example, Zelda. She never fought in any Zelda games and her moveset is based on Link's OOT magic spells. Why would she have these magic spells? It has been established that Zelda is a magic user and she is closely associated with the goddesses of the Triforce.... so it made sense for Zelda to have Nayru's Love, Farore's Wind, and Din's Fire. It wouldn't make sense for her to use a sword or use different weapons like Link does because it has been established in the Zelda games that she doesn't do them. She transforms into Sheik, who looks like a ninja and ends up fighting like one.

As for R.O.B., it never fought and yet it is suddenly a fighting robot in Smash. Why does its moveset fit R.O.B. very well? R.O.B. has been known to move its arms around when you are playing Stack-Up and Gyromite so it made sense for R.O.B. to spin its arms around (side B). R.O.B. is also known for using gyros when you play Gyromite so R.O.B. uses gyros (down B). R.O.B. is a robot so it ends up getting stereotypical fighting robot abilities like shooting laser beams out of the eyes (B) and hovering with rocket boosters (up B).

And .WC.? Just because NSMBWii hasn't come out yet doesn't mean Toad cannot use Propeller Suit. The game will be coming out this year or next year anyway... the game will be out long before SSB4 is even announced anyway.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Yes, I agree that specials are important in defining the character. Why do you think I suggested Poison Mushrooms and Golden Mushrooms to be part of Toad's specials? He is associated with mushrooms so it would make sense for him to use mushrooms.

As for the last part in your post, you are basically saying made-up movesets are not fun. That doesn't mean characters with made-up movesets like Captain Falcon, R.O.B., Ice Climbers, and the Star Fox trio can't be in Smash. It is okay to make up movesets as long as it fits the character.

For example, Zelda. She never fought in any Zelda games and her moveset is based on Link's OOT magic spells. Why would she have these magic spells? It has been established that Zelda is a magic user and she is closely associated with the goddesses of the Triforce.... so it made sense for Zelda to have Nayru's Love, Farore's Wind, and Din's Fire. It wouldn't make sense for her to use a sword or use different weapons like Link does because it has been established in the Zelda games that she doesn't do them. She transforms into Sheik, who looks like a ninja and ends up fighting like one.

As for R.O.B., it never fought and yet it is suddenly a fighting robot in Smash. Why does its moveset fit R.O.B. very well? R.O.B. has been known to move its arms around when you are playing Stack-Up and Gyromite so it made sense for R.O.B. to spin its arms around (side B). R.O.B. is also known for using gyros when you play Gyromite so R.O.B. uses gyros (down B). R.O.B. is a robot so it ends up getting stereotypical fighting robot abilities like shooting laser beams out of the eyes (B) and hovering with rocket boosters (up B).

And .WC.? Just because NSMBWii hasn't come out yet doesn't mean Toad cannot use Propeller Suit. The game will be coming out this year or next year anyway... the game will be out long before SSB4 is even announced anyway.

uh. Wasn't Roy's game not even out yet when melee was released. I am sure someone in brawl was the same, cannot remember.

I agree, as long as the moveset fits, then it is fine. Samsh has already proven that keeping things canon does not matter. That is why I beleive Ridley has a chance.

Can you post the moveset again? I want to read it.

 

[Pieman0920]

You misunderstood me Arc. I'm not saying that moves that are made up for the character are bad, I'm saying a moveset completely composed of moves taken from other characters is bad. (Clones being a seperate issue, but pretty much irrelivant here, since Toad wouldn't be a clone in 99% of cases) Zelda and ROB do have made up moves, but at least one of each of their moves has a unique property that seperates them from any established move or item. (Din's fire, the transformation at its time, the rocket boosters technically, the auto charging/reflecting beam, and the gyromite)

All I'm saying is that you should rethink the moves for your Toad moveset and give him one or two things that havn't been done beofre, since his neutral special is just using a item, loads of characters have variations of that side special, his up special is essentially King Dedede's/ROB's depending on which you use, and his down special is Peach's down special)

 

[Wizzerd]

drag0nscythe, going by your logic, Link and Samus are clones.

B: Chargeable projectile
B>: Projectile with unique properties (Returning and exploding)
B^: Spinning recovery
Bv: Bombs

OH EM GEE SAKURAI SUX

 

[drag0nscythe]

drag0nscythe, going by your logic, Link and Samus are clones.

B: Chargeable projectile
B>: Projectile with unique properties (Returning and exploding)
B^: Spinning recovery
Bv: Bombs

OH EM GEE SAKURAI SUX

I knew someone was going to do this. It is quite sad at times. Think scope. You are going out to far, or going to far in.

 

[Arcadenik]

Toad would have to be a small lightweight like Olimar but very fast like his Melee and Brawl trophies mentioned (maybe he could be the second fastest character after Sonic or third fastest character after Captain Falcon). His Brawl trophy mentioned Toad's superhuman strength and I think that could be translated to Toad's ability to lift and carry opponents and crates/barrels with ease like Donkey Kong does and he might have powerful throws to contrast his weak A moves. Toad would have to have poor jumping ability like in SMB2. As for his specials...

B - Toad throws a Poison Mushroom. It would be useful to shrink bigger, heavier, and stronger opponents down to his own size. I think it is a brilliant tactic - imagine a small weak lightweight character like Toad could bring bigger, stronger, and heavier characters down to his own size. Talk about evening the battlefield! This is based on the original Super Mario Kart.

Side B - Toad uses a Golden Mushroom. It might be used like Ike's Quick Draw where Toad runs really fast and tackles down an opponent like you would do in Mario Kart games when you use a Mushroom to speed and try to bump into another kart to steal their items. It could be used like Luigi's Green Missile when Toad is falling and he is far away from the stage and he needs to get close to the stage... this move could cover long horizontal distances like how you use mushrooms in mid-air in the Mario Kart games. It could balance out Toad's poor jumping ability. He might need this since he would be sent flying from the stage too often due to his lightweight.

Up B - Toad uses the Propeller Suit. It might be used to balance Toad's poor jumping ability, too... since he wouldn't jump very high and this move would help Toad cover long vertical distances. This move would inflict no damage like Pit and R.O.B.'s recovery moves. This move is based on the Propeller Suit power-up from NSMBWii.

Down B - Toad pulls out giant Vegetables. In the remake of SMB2, Super Mario Advance, there were giant vegetables. It would demonstrate Toad's superhuman strength when he pulls out giant vegetables out of the ground. I think the vegetables should be about two times Toad's size to highlight Toad's superhuman strength.

Final Smash - I admit this is hard to come up... maybe something related to mushrooms like Mega Mushrooms to grow too big like Giga Bowser... or getting the blorbs to inflate like Jigglypuff's Final Smash... or something from SMB2... maybe he throws a potion to make the red door appears and he enters Subspace where everything is black and blue and his giant vegetables are replaced with coins and they are as powerful as Bonsly when he throws them at the opponents. Maybe Toad throws the coins like how all the characters throw the Trophy Stand item.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Toad would have to be a small lightweight like Olimar but very fast like his Melee and Brawl trophies mentioned (maybe he could be the second fastest character after Sonic or third fastest character after Captain Falcon). His Brawl trophy mentioned Toad's superhuman strength and I think that could be translated to Toad's ability to lift and carry opponents and crates/barrels with ease like Donkey Kong does and he might have powerful throws to contrast his weak A moves. Toad would have to have poor jumping ability like in SMB2. As for his specials...

Seems like a reasonable assessment to me.

B - Toad throws a Poison Mushroom. It would be useful to shrink bigger, heavier, and stronger opponents down to his own size. I think it is a brilliant tactic - imagine a small weak lightweight character like Toad could bring bigger, stronger, and heavier characters down to his own size. Talk about evening the battlefield! This is based on the original Super Mario Kart

The move is interesting, but part of me feels it is broken. Instant poison muschroom, at any time. Shrink opponent first, then pound. I like the idea, but I fear of balance.

Side B - Toad uses a Golden Mushroom. It might be used like Ike's Quick Draw where Toad runs really fast and tackles down an opponent like you would do in Mario Kart games when you use a Mushroom to speed and try to bump into another kart to steal their items. It could be used like Luigi's Green Missile when Toad is falling and he is far away from the stage and he needs to get close to the stage... this move could cover long horizontal distances like how you use mushrooms in mid-air in the Mario Kart games. It could balance out Toad's poor jumping ability. He might need this since he would be sent flying from the stage too often due to his lightweight.

So, best way to describe it is Luigi's Side B move. could be interesting. Just thinking though, it would help alittle with balance of Neutral B if Poison, Gold and maybe some other mushrooms were on one B move. Still, this would be useful for the character.

Up B - Toad uses the Propeller Suit. It might be used to balance Toad's poor jumping ability, too... since he wouldn't jump very high and this move would help Toad cover long vertical distances. This move would inflict no damage like Pit and R.O.B.'s recovery moves. This move is based on the Propeller Suit power-up from NSMBWii.

I agree with this move.

Down B - Toad pulls out giant Vegetables. In the remake of SMB2, Super Mario Advance, there were giant vegetables. It would demonstrate Toad's superhuman strength when he pulls out giant vegetables out of the ground. I think the vegetables should be about two times Toad's size to highlight Toad's superhuman strength.

Seems fine to me also. Looking over the 4 B moves, I would also recommened adding in a move dealing with the toad squad from Super Mario Galaxy. Just because Toad never did it, does not mean he can borrow it. (Thinking of lucas here.)

Final Smash - I admit this is hard to come up... maybe something related to mushrooms like Mega Mushrooms to grow too big like Giga Bowser... or getting the blorbs to inflate like Jigglypuff's Final Smash... or something from SMB2... maybe he throws a potion to make the red door appears and he enters Subspace where everything is black and blue and his giant vegetables are replaced with coins and they are as powerful as Bonsly when he throws them at the opponents. Maybe Toad throws the coins like how all the characters throw the Trophy Stand item.

How about the Star from the paper mario series. Toad pulls out a mega star, which turns him into the retro sprite version. Then he can run around as a Giant 2D toad with improved attack and defense.

Similar to Bowser, but it would fit nicely.

 

[n88]

@drag0nscythe

Wizzerd might be exaggerating a little, but your definition of clones is still far too broad. People like the specials, so they get highlighted. The Specials make up four (Five with FS) of 25ish attacks characters have. It's incredibly shallow to define characters as clones based on four animations. Just because most people think that way doesn't mean it's true.

 

[Neo Exdeath]

which is the truth. I do not want to hear that this character will "Punch" with A. It is a duh in a way. Only people who care about frames, speeds, lags, etc. give a hoot about A moves.

*facedesks*

Look, it may not look important to you now, but 80% of the people on this site probably care about speeds and lags. Who cares about a move if you'll never use it practically? That's what a lot of special moves are.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Really though, it makes little sense to me that you're saying that I'm just going "no you're wrong" and saying I don't give an explanation when the paragraph you're quoting is a justification for why my views are that way, and your response give me no justification for yours. Your first response questioned if I was a fan of F-Zero, and your second makes accusations, and in no instance do you give me a explanation.

I didn't directly counter your arguments because A) arguing with you is pointless unless it rubs off on someone else (since you never change your mind but OTHER people here will) and B) no one here pays attention to F-Zero anything but you and me. It'd have the same effect if we talked about Billy for ten pages aside from that one guy going "OKAY NEW TOPIC!"

Guess I'll humor you anyway.


So, Jody counts. Look at what's she's got:

** Her own satellite character (same for Goroh and Black Shadow)
** The Super Cat in the X expansion kit with that awesome costume (same as Falcon and Goroh with some not-as-awesome costumes)
** A chapter in GX (same for Goroh, Michael Chain, Deathborne, and kinda Silver Neelsen; GX was about Falcon and Black Shadow anyway)
** A major role in GP Legend (which from the sounds of it you don't know anything about, can't blame you for that though)
** A story mode in the GP Legend GBA game (along with Falcon, Goroh, Black Shadow, Jack Levin, Zoda, Ryu Suzaku, and Lisa Brilliant; not gonna blame you for not knowing that either)

And the general prominence at which they show off her or White Cat (guess which two machines appeared in Captain Falcon's ending picture in Smash 64). Overall, she's getting roughly the same kind of special treatment in every game also reserved for Falcon, Goroh, and Black Shadow. The kind that other characters are lucky to get even once.

I'm not gonna pick on you for not knowing how popular she is. We've already had that kind of discussion before so I know exactly what you'd say in response to anything I tell you regarding it.


Now I still question whether you've actually played the games (or more importantly, whether you understand the series well enough in this context). I mean, really, you're comparing her to Pauline. PAULINE. That's your big analogy?

I honestly can't tell if you're just lying, you just don't know the full scope of things, or if you're a nut. Gonna guess all three.

 

[Big-Cat]

@drag0nscythe

Wizzerd might be exaggerating a little, but your definition of clones is still far too broad. People like the specials, so they get highlighted. The Specials make up four (Five with FS) of 25ish attacks characters have. It's incredibly shallow to define characters as clones based on four animations. Just because most people think that way doesn't mean it's true.

While they are only four of the moves for a character, they are called SPECIAL moves which set them apart from the other moves. Think of it this way: no one pays attention much to normal moves in Street Fighter aside from their use in battle, they remember the Hadouken, Shoryuken, Tatsumaki Senpukyaku, Kikouken, Spinning Bird Kick, Sonic Boom, Spiral Arrow, and more.

This is the reason why I want Wolf and Lucas to have new specials.

 

[n88]

Wolf could certainly benefit from a new special, but I hate hearing people whine about how he's "Heavy Fox". It makes me wonder if they've ever actually played as Wolf.

I think Wolf should get a New B-Down and FS at most. He's fine otherwise. Lucas could maybe get a new Speical or two as well, but I don't think the Specials should be completely overhauled. Frankly, they don't need it. Resources would be better spent elsewhere.

 

[drag0nscythe]

@drag0nscythe

Wizzerd might be exaggerating a little, but your definition of clones is still far too broad. People like the specials, so they get highlighted. The Specials make up four (Five with FS) of 25ish attacks characters have. It's incredibly shallow to define characters as clones based on four animations. Just because most people think that way doesn't mean it's true.

The specials are the most important part of the character. There is not much more to say on it.

*facedesks*

Look, it may not look important to you now, but 80% of the people on this site probably care about speeds and lags. Who cares about a move if you'll never use it practically? That's what a lot of special moves are.

see, the problem is "On this site". This is a closed community practically. It is a biased slice of brawl so to speak.

While they are only four of the moves for a character, they are called SPECIAL moves which set them apart from the other moves. Think of it this way: no one pays attention much to normal moves in Street Fighter aside from their use in battle, they remember the Hadouken, Shoryuken, Tatsumaki Senpukyaku, Kikouken, Spinning Bird Kick, Sonic Boom, Spiral Arrow, and more.

This is the reason why I want Wolf and Lucas to have new specials.

Case and point. Thank you.

Wolf could certainly benefit from a new special, but I hate hearing people whine about how he's "Heavy Fox". It makes me wonder if they've ever actually played as Wolf.

I think Wolf should get a New B-Down and FS at most. He's fine otherwise. Lucas could maybe get a new Speical or two as well, but I don't think the Specials should be completely overhauled. Frankly, they don't need it. Resources would be better spent elsewhere.

Same can be said for Ganondorf. He does not need a new moveset, just a tweak, which is what he got.

 

[Neo Exdeath]

The specials are the most important part of the character. There is not much more to say on it.

How about the moves that are actually useful are the most important part of the character?

see, the problem is "On this site". This is a closed community practically. It is a biased slice of brawl so to speak.

Yea, but it's not like casuals keep on using moves that they know won't hit anything. That's like 90% of special moves.

Case and point. Thank you.



Same can be said for Ganondorf. He does not need a new moveset, just a tweak, which is what he got.

Comments in red.

 

[drag0nscythe]

How about the moves that are actually useful are the most important part of the character?

They are like Ryu's jabs and Chun li's kicks. Simple as that.

Yea, but it's not like casuals keep on using moves that they know won't hit anything. That's like 90% of special moves.

Casuals play with items. They spam moves, grab items and have fun. Not calculate, not plan and not be anal about it.

 

[Neo Exdeath]

^Since when was I being anal about this? Also, playing competitively is fun. Also, I haven't played Street Fighter, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[Clownbot]

My apologies for intervening, Neo, but.....

They are like Ryu's jabs and Chun li's kicks. Simple as that.

I don't see what you're getting at here. Even casual players of SF would use these moves. >_>

Casuals play with items. They spam moves, grab items and have fun. Not calculate, not plan and not be anal about it.

This comment, whether or not it was your intention, just makes you look rude to competitive players.

Casuals probably won't go through a whole match using nothing but items and B moves. Reflexively, they probably use the A button at least a little bit. I know I do, and I'm a casual player.

 

[n88]

I'm sure we'll see more and more character differentiation as the series goes on, but I wouldn't expect it to be in SSB4. Against all fanboy's wishes, more characters cannot be constantly added to the Smash Bros universe. IIRC, Sakurai has said that there are only so many characters entitled to be in Smash Bros. Once the roster stabilizes a bit, I'm sure we'll see characters gain some more uniqueness. Because if fewer characters are being added, more time can be spent on those that already exist. I would look to SSB5 or 6 for characters to get fleshed out a bit more.

EDIT: For the record, I know 9 casual players, one of whom uses items. None of them decide that they should just use the Specials because they're more important.

 

[drag0nscythe]

^Since when was I being anal about this? Also, playing competitively is fun. Also, I haven't played Street Fighter, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

the anal comment was not about you. It was about the competitive attitude. You have apples, I have oranges on the competitive comment.

As for street fighter. You have atleast head about the sonic boom (Guiles move). When you look in guides, and look up moves, SF specials are always mentioned in great detail. My old Darkstalkers guide does it. It is what defines the characters.

Now, normal moves do have a purpose, but they are not as important as the special moves.

I'm sure we'll see more and more character differentiation as the series goes on, but I wouldn't expect it to be in SSB4. Against all fanboy's wishes, more characters cannot be constantly added to the Smash Bros universe. IIRC, Sakurai has said that there are only so many characters entitled to be in Smash Bros. Once the roster stabilizes a bit, I'm sure we'll see characters gain some more uniqueness. Because if fewer characters are being added, more time can be spent on those that already exist. I would look to SSB5 or 6 for characters to get fleshed out a bit more.

EDIT: For the record, I know 9 casual players, one of whom uses items. None of them decide that they should just use the Specials because they're more important.

For the record, I know 9 casual players also. All of them use items and most of the time they run for those. When they are not, they spam B moves or A combo.

 

[Big-Cat]

I don't see what you're getting at here. Even casual players of SF would use these moves. >_>

I see more Hadouken and Shoryuken spams than I see casual players (or scrubs to some) using normals that aren't from the Fierce and Roundhouse buttons.

 

[Neo Exdeath]

@Clownbot: Go ahead. I need all the help on this I can get.

@drag0nscythe: You can never trust the book guides for fighting games. The Brawl guide gave Bowser a 9/10 and MK a 7/10. Mk's a ****ing god, while Bowser..... Not so much.

 

[drag0nscythe]

@Clownbot: Go ahead. I need all the help on this I can get.

@drag0nscythe: You can never trust the book guides for fighting games. The Brawl guide gave Bowser a 9/10 and MK a 7/10. Mk's a ****ing god, while Bowser..... Not so much.

That was at the beginning of the game release. Things change. I mainly point to Dojo, where A moves and others were only mentioned under the two conditions.

1. To show that the character is different in some way (Lucas and Ganondorf)
2. To show a gameplay mechanic.

Other then those, A moves were considered to just be there.

 

[n88]

For the record, I know 9 casual players also. All of them use items and most of the time they run for those. When they are not, they spam B moves or A combo.

I can't really say much without being incredibly offensive to people I don't know. If the majority of the casual fanbase is like this, all I can say is that the future of our game lies in the hands of clueless people, and I'm glad I seem to have found a small community in which nobody plays like an idiot.

EDIT: MK's dominance was apparent to anybody who sepnt two matches playing as/against him. I remember losing to some old Melee vets as Bowser (My main at the time) shortly after Brawl's release, then beating them after trying out MK for the first time. Also, I believe the guide classified Squirtle as heavier than Ivysaur.

 

[drag0nscythe]

I can't really say much without being incredibly offensive to people I don't know. If the majority of the casual fanbase is like this, all I can say is that the future of our game lies in the hands of clueless people, and I'm glad I seem to have found a small community in which nobody plays like an idiot.

What do you expect out of a party game anyway? People are playing to have fun. If that is how they enjoy it, that is how they enjoy it.

 

[Clownbot]

I can't really say much without being incredibly offensive to people I don't know. If the majority of the casual fanbase is like this, all I can say is that the future of our game lies in the hands of clueless people, and I'm glad I seem to have found a small community in which nobody plays like an idiot.

Wow, it sounds like both you and scythe are pretty sheltered as far as your activities on this site go (no offense). There are PLENTY of people that play Smash casually here, and some of them post more in General Discussion than Smash-related topics.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Wow, it sounds like both you and scythe are pretty sheltered as far as your activities on this site go (no offense). There are PLENTY of people that play Smash casually here, and some of them post more in General Discussion than Smash-related topics.

I will not deny that. I only really post in this topic.

 

[n88]

@Clownbot

I don't count people from this site as people I know. I honestly couldn't tell you who anyone on this site actually is, what they look like, etc. I'm talking about friends/family/frineds' friends, etc.

 

[Clownbot]

@Clownbot

I don't count people from this site as people I know. I honestly couldn't tell you who anyone on this site actually is, what they look like, etc. I'm talking about friends/family/frineds' friends, etc.

Ah, okay. When you said "small community," I thought you were referring to this site.