[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Mario the Jumpman]

i think dark samus,shadow,tails should be in brawl along with another starfox,earthbound character and i could go on but im just too lazy to put the whole list

NO to more Sonic chars! Tails is a lame mutant squirrel like Nintendo Power says (check page 21 of V246) and Shadow's personality is lame.

 

[Paper Mario Master]

NO to more Sonic chars! Tails is a lame mutant squirrel like Nintendo Power says (check page 21 of V246) and Shadow's personality is lame.

What a bout Knuckles or Amy?

and lame personality? check Sonic or Tails

 

[Clownbot]

NO to more Sonic chars! Tails is a lame mutant squirrel like Nintendo Power says (check page 21 of V246) and Shadow's personality is lame.

PLEASE PUT YOUR BIAS ASIDE.

I sincerely doubt a new Sonic character, but if we get one (and trust me, we'll only get one if we do), it'll be Shadow.

 

[Jimnymebob]

As long as it's the same basic formula of Smash then I'm fine. I just want to see how they'll pull off having more extra features than in Brawl. I'll be impressed if they get together a lot more new content.

 

[mariorocks64]

breakable blocks should be in stage builder

onix should return to pokeballs.

do you think there are anime stuff in the smash series at all?
I may be wrong on this but I just to say it. pikachu's hat looks like ash's hat. but it resembles the the trainer from pokemon staiduim N64.
How did jigglypuff become popular in japan?
and what game had falcon punch besides super smash bros? the falcon punch was seen in the f-zero anime. but I could be wrong if the anime came after super smash bros.

 

[Clownbot]

breakable blocks should be in stage builder

onix should return to pokeballs.

do you think there are anime stuff in the smash series at all?

Yes.

I may be wrong on this but I just to say it. pikachu's hat looks like ash's hat. but it resembles the the trainer from pokemon staiduim N64.

Right....

How did jigglypuff become popular in japan?

Ask a Japanese person.

and what game had falcon punch besides super smash bros? the falcon punch was seen in the f-zero anime. but I could be wrong if the anime came after super smash bros.

I can't quite remember, and am too lazy to look it up right now. If the anime DID come after Smash, then the developers basically pulled the idea out of their a**.

Comments in bold.

 

[Jimnymebob]

breakable blocks should be in stage builder

onix should return to pokeballs.

do you think there are anime stuff in the smash series at all?
I may be wrong on this but I just to say it. pikachu's hat looks like ash's hat. but it resembles the the trainer from pokemon staiduim N64.
How did jigglypuff become popular in japan?
and what game had falcon punch besides super smash bros? the falcon punch was seen in the f-zero anime. but I could be wrong if the anime came after super smash bros.

Breakable Blocks would be sweet- but stage builder needs a complete overhaul.

There's not really any anime things in Smash- Falcon Punch, and the whole idea of Falcon being out of his car was made for Smash 64. Also, the hat is Red's, Jigglypuff has Green/Blue/Leaf's hat, and some Pokemon has the guy from Emerald's bandanna I think?.....

The only anime thing I can think of is Mewtwo- with the fact that he laughs and everything, when on the games he just let out his signature cry.

 

[mariorocks64]

if anime really was being added to SSB, I would suggest piplup as a playable character mabye with the female trainer (Dawn) it would come with bunery, and ambipom. final smash would be mammoswine.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

i think jack from madworld would be epic and travis touchdown from no more heroes would be great in the next installment!

Probably already in this thread but im not going through 1k + pages lol

Travis seems possible, with NMH having achieved great sales over here and has a sequel on the way.

Jack, on the other hand, is less likely. The main reason why he won't make it in is because Madworld was never released in Japan, since it's too violent (which is odd, since japan has their fair share of violent games, among other things). That's too bad, since I would have loved seeing a MW-themed stage with a G-rated version of commentary from Howard and Kreese.

Talking about trophies? Why not talk about... Assist Trophies! We totally need a Cranky Kong AT as a Resetti clone (with different dialogue, obviously).

That'd be great. I miss seeing Cranky complain about modern games.

"Real is brown? Realistic graphics? Pah! Back in my day, one shade of gray and one-pixel graphics was all that we had, and we liked it! Grey's a more attractive color than mud, I'll tell you that much. Casual games? In my day, games didn't have any of that partying, brain-teasing and puppy-caring nonsense. Games that go on forever until you get a high score were good enough to entertain us! Games are easy? Pfft, you people wouldn't know a good game if it slapped you upside the head. If you had played anything from my time, you wouldn't last 10 seconds, I can guarantee you that!"

I'd like to see what he thinks of the whole concept of Smash (as well as the appearance of certain characters like R.O.B. and Game & Watch)...

As long as it's the same basic formula of Smash then I'm fine. I just want to see how they'll pull off having more extra features than in Brawl. I'll be impressed if they get together a lot more new content.

I'd be curious to see what Sakurai and crew will cook up for us in SSB4.

 

[Pieman0920]

@Pieman: Out of fairness, they did have to spend a ton of time digging up old NES instruction manuals for stickers and whatnot. I'd imagine next time they'd be a little more prepared, especially when they've already got everything from Brawl.

Well that'd only be a problem if we assume that the same people who worked on trophies worked on stickers. Plus, while there were a few non-Brawl related trophies that did seem to have been made up just for the game, stickers by their very nature were all ripped from other games. (Plus, when you work for Nintendo, you probably have easy access to old manuals....I'd think.)

 

[mariorocks64]

I wonder if Lip could be an assist trophy or atleast a trophy.

japanese only and american only need to collide. thats one reason to add some japan only characters.

 

[.WC.]

Travis seems possible, with NMH having achieved great sales over here and has a sequel on the way.

Jack, on the other hand, is less likely. The main reason why he won't make it in is because Madworld was never released in Japan, since it's too violent (which is odd, since japan has their fair share of violent games, among other things). That's too bad, since I would have loved seeing a MW-themed stage with a G-rated version of commentary from Howard and Kreese.



That'd be great. I miss seeing Cranky complain about modern games.

"Real is brown? Realistic graphics? Pah! Back in my day, one shade of gray and one-pixel graphics was all that we had, and we liked it! Grey's a more attractive color than mud, I'll tell you that much. Casual games? In my day, games didn't have any of that partying, brain-teasing and puppy-caring nonsense. Games that go on forever until you get a high score were good enough to entertain us! Games are easy? Pfft, you people wouldn't know a good game if it slapped you upside the head. If you had played anything from my time, you wouldn't last 10 seconds, I can guarantee you that!"

I'd like to see what he thinks of the whole concept of Smash (as well as the appearance of certain characters like R.O.B. and Game & Watch)...



I'd be curious to see what Sakurai and crew will cook up for us in SSB4.

Epic Cranky AT speech is epic.

 

[mariorocks64]

I new pokemon should be a pokemon that digs. it goes in the ground and pops out under foes. it does this rapidly. the only question is: what pokemon would do this? I want it to be sandschrew.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I wonder if Lip could be an assist trophy or atleast a trophy.

japanese only and american only need to collide. thats one reason to add some japan only characters.

Indeed, Japan and America content should blend together nicely. Sakurai did show an interest in the possibility of adding Japan-only characters, after remembering how Fire Emblem gained success here.

Heck, Starfy was featured as an AT in Brawl and, guess what? One of his games made it over here and was a smash hit! Who knew?

That said, there are plenty of people that would prefer Lip to be playable.

 

[Pieman0920]

I personally think Lip would work very well, though I do think that she couldn't really replicate what Fire Emblem did unless she actually got a new game.

In any case, about the digging Pokemon thing, there's really no Pokemon who's important enough to do it. Plus in certain instances, digging doesn't make sense. Say Sandshrew tried to dig around in the transition parts of Delfino Plaza? What would happen then?

 

[.WC.]

I personally think Lip would work very well, though I do think that she couldn't really replicate what Fire Emblem did unless she actually got a new game.

In any case, about the digging Pokemon thing, there's really no Pokemon who's important enough to do it. Plus in certain instances, digging doesn't make sense. Say Sandshrew tried to dig around in the transition parts of Delfino Plaza? What would happen then?

I think Lip should get in. Lip's Stick is there as an item, so why not?

Wtf man, Dugtrio. It could create holes in the stage like pitfalls. I see your point there, though.

 

[BG3]

I had a new idea for a slight new quirk for the Coin battles. Instead of coins falling out of every character like before, now something representing currency in their respective games is what comes out after they are attacked. So basically, after Link and Toon Link get hit, rupees come out of them instead of coins. With the Mario series, coins actually look like they do in the Mario series when they are attacked(the Smash coins don't look like the Mario series coins). Maybe the FE characters could have gold get smacked out of them since that is the currency in FE. Generic characters with no real history with money like R.O.B. and Pit could have the Smash coins come out of them like usual. Thoughts?

 

[.WC.]

I had a new idea for a slight new quirk for the Coin battles. Instead of coins falling out of every character like before, now something representing currency in their respective games is what comes out after they are attacked. So basically, after Link and Toon Link get hit, rupees come out of them instead of coins. With the Mario series, coins actually look like they do in the Mario series when they are attacked(the Smash coins don't look like the Mario series coins). Maybe the FE characters could have gold get smacked out of them since that is the currency in FE. Generic characters with no real history with money like R.O.B. and Pit could have the Smash coins come out of them like usual. Thoughts?

I like that idea! What about Donkey Kong, though? .. And Kirby?

 

[Zario777]

DK has bananas. Kirby has stars(?) I dont remember

 

[Big-Cat]

What's wrong with regular trophies? I like those.


@Kuma: If you're big on heavy reading and haven't seen this already, take a gander. I'm about to pass out right now so I can't get in depth, but basically it's VERY time consuming. Sakurai would need to start now to achieve the balance people are hoping for.

I've started to read a few pages of this, and it's rather interesting. It's good to here the issue of balancing from a fighting game developer. Anyway, yeah, balancing SSB4 would take a while, but I think a factor in that would be managing time and resources (including people) properly. As we all know, Subpar Emissary was worked on the most in Brawl.

 

[lordvaati]

on the issue of the Pokemon Anime, I think it came out around 1997 and Smash in 1998, so a bit of the hype was from the show when Smash came out. with Jigglypuff's popularity, it's also popular here too- there was a poll done in Beckett(an American Pokemon Magazine), and Jiggly puff was voted THE most popular character. Pikachu was only # 6 on that list too, which was kind of weird. going by the list, if Pokemon had to have one rep with an anime background, it'd be Meowth, since he was #4 on that list and because he almost got in 64.

@ Zario

I just checked my Canvas Curse game to make sure,and it is stars.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

on the issue of the Pokemon Anime, I think it came out around 1997 and Smash in 1998, so a bit of the hype was from the show when Smash came out. with Jigglypuff's popularity, it's also popular here too- there was a poll done in Beckett(an American Pokemon Magazine), and Jiggly puff was voted THE most popular character. Pikachu was only # 6 on that list too, which was kind of weird. going by the list, if Pokemon had to have one rep with an anime background, it'd be Meowth, since he was #4 on that list and because he almost got in 64.

It helps that he's appeared from Pokeballs in 2 games of Smash, now. That doesn't necessarily guarantee a future appearance in the roster (although Charizard was in one and he ended up being playable).

But hey, at least he stayed in the anime long after Jigglypuff conspicuously stopped appearing in it.

 

[mariorocks64]

basically, jigglypuff is a legend to pokemon to nintendo. smash wants to hang on to the jigglypuff in the anime that use to randomly put everyone to sleep, then draw on their faces. if they really want more anime reference, give pokemon trainer an ash ketchum costume. or make ash a seperate character who acts like PT when pikachu has the red costume.

I hope for the gangplank galleon to be a stage.

I wonder what super mario galaxy stage will be in SSB4?

and what will mushroomy kingdom turn into? mabye a bigger wastelan with buried coin blocks, and broken warp pipes.and the ground would have cracks and they can break if you land on a crack. and the castle in the background could be set on fire. and some times, the stae could erupt from pieces of a platform.

I'm also thinking of a new mario kart stage. a mario kart wii stage. woth miis driving instead of just shy guys. but what course could it be? I'm thinking of moonview highway.

and once again, I think people could hack brawl to turn it into SSB4.

so how are all my ideas?

 

[Pieman0920]

Galaxy stage will probably be based on Good Egg Galaxy, unless SMG2 has more influence.

Mushroomy Kingdom may show up as a past stage, but the stage itself shouldn't "evolve" and get older though. Personally I just hope that we get a Mushroom Kingdom III stage based on SMB3.

And I'd rather have a Paper Mario based stage than a Mario Kart stage. Its also more likely that if there is a Mario Kart stage, that it'd be one of the more iconic tracks, rather than say Moonview Highway. That being said, outside of the Mario/Luigi circuits, which has already been done (well not Luigi's but it'd be the same) there's really only Rainbow Road, and with a Galaxy stage in there, it'd be redundant to add in another Mario stage set in space. (For the record though, Bowser's Castle would work better just being based off the main games, rather than its Kart incarnations, though certain features could be retained in some instances I suppose)

And I very much doubt that people will hack Brawl to the level that it could even theoretically be a Smash 4.

 

[n88]

And I very much doubt that people will hack Brawl to the level that it could even theoretically be a Smash 4.

Oh, they're gonna try.

At any rate, I would like to see something like this for Mario Stages:

Bowser Castle
Good Egg Galaxy
Mushroom Kingdom III
Flipside (I would realy love for all the characters to take on Paper Mario-esque appearances here. But that's not very likely. They'd probably just all be flat.)

Past Stages
Luigi's Mansion
Delfino Plaza

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

And I very much doubt that people will hack Brawl to the level that it could even theoretically be a Smash 4.

ya well they are trying harder and harder every day just to do so, I just hope if they do it wont crash every time you play a round.

 

[mariorocks64]

I forgot that there would be a paper mario stage. I'd say the battle stage from paper mario 2

it would cool!!!!

every aspect of the stage will be included. should I tell you the aspects?

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

I forgot that there would be a paper mario stage. I'd say the battle stage from paper mario 2

it would cool!!!!

every aspect of the stage will be included. should I tell you the aspects?

like the falling stage lights?

 

[Smash Bro]

Y'know what I want? Someone in charge of the Smash Series who'll listen to us, and actually take our input. Someone who doesn't only ask the Japanese public what they want in the game. Someone that's not Sakurai. Have you seen how involved Harmonix is with their Rock Band community?? Three words: Rock. Band. Network.

In terms of the actual game, I think it's obvious that WiiSpeak compatibility is a must, along with better WiFi in general. Nintendo also has to figure out how to back up WiFi compatible games onto SD Cards. What happens if your Wii decides to brick?

Now I must admit, I am a Pokemon fanboy, so most of the characters I want in SSB4 are Pokemon. I need Blaziken in the game. Literally NEED him. I had a spaz attack when I saw my 2nd favourite Pokemon up on that ice mountain in SSE, and now I need my #1 favourite. Blaziken could either be a stand-alone character, or with a female Pokemon Trainer who also has Treecko and Marshtomp. Many people seem to want Mudkip, Grovyle and Blaiken, but I personally see Treecko being more of a fighter than teh Mudkipz. I was kind of looking forward to Meowth being in Brawl, even though he was never confirmed and is kind of annoying. Shadow and Knuckles would be some nice additions. Right-handed Link was in the Wii TP, so he should've been right- handed in Brawl, which is for Wii. Besides, weren't left-handed swordsmen considered to be evil back in Link's times? I always wondered about that...

I'm actually glad that most of the Forbidden 7 didn't make it in. I miss Roy, and Plusle&Minun would've been cool, but...Dixie Kong? Dr. Mario again? Toon Zelda & Shiek? ... No thnx, no thnx.

I don't care what Sakurai says; SSB4 is coming, with or without him. Hopefully this time, they'll listen to what the North American public wants. And in return, I assume that the North American public will give Nintendo the time that they deserve to work on this project, as opposed to flipping out every time the release date gets pushed back (like with Brawl). And to all you MegaMan super-fans, give it a rest. Sega is now partners with Nintendo, and the MGS guys were begging for Snake to be in the roster since Melee. That's the ONLY reason Sonic and Snake got in. The SSB Series is for Nintendo/Nintendo-owned characters. Last time I checked, MegaMan was Capcom. So go play your Marvel VS Capcom 3. Or, should I say, Disney VS Capcom 3.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

So go play your Marvel VS Capcom 3. Or, should I say, Disney VS Capcom 3.

lol you really like to bash on the Mega man fans

 

[mariorocks64]

like the falling stage lights?

yes! and the moon falling, and the giant foot, and the falling forks, and the collapsing background., and more.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

yes! and the moon falling, and the giant foot, and the falling forks, and the collapsing background., and more.

I don't remember a foot.

 

[mariorocks64]

I don't remember a foot.

don't you remember the gray thing thatslowly steps on you or an enemy?

 

[SmashChu]

It may or may not take as long. It may even be doable. It ultimately depends on how they do it. If I recall, Capcom had something like tournaments in development in order to balance the characters in Street Fighter IV. If they try that next time, it may be better balanced. Then again, does it really seem they've tried in the first place?

Do not listen to Smashboards for how the game is balanced. Tournament play castrates a lot of the game. Items are removed, most stages are turned off (or not preferred), the number of players is moved from four to two and other minor rules are added to the context of the game to make it be a big mess.

The game was designed more holistically. Items would be on, stages on, and most likely with 4 players. The balance of the game will change based on what you do and how you play. Tournament Smash created the unbalanced game. Their solution is make a hack (I always thought this was a good idea. I hate Brawl+ as it tries to make the game Melee, but Balance Brawl does more of what I thought it should be).

For most Smash players (those being non-competitive) the game is very much balanced. But, like I said, it is not reflected in tournament play. Let me give you an example. Link, according to Smashboards, was weak in Melee. So, what happens in Brawl? He's worse. Does this mean Sakurai can't balance? No. To everyone else, Link was broken (he was more broken then Fox ever hoped to be). He was just to easy to use for the rest of us. So, in Brawl, he was nerfed.

Come SSB4, Ike and Lucas are more likely to be weaker the Meta-Knight.

 

[n88]

@Smashchu

Brawl+ is like Melee because the purpose of Brawl+ is to create something better used for tourneys. And Melee is far better than Brawl (In terms of competitive use). But, yes, since Sakurai buffs and nerfs according to complaints and such, characters commonly perceived as cheap (Ike, Pikachu) are likely to be nerfed.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

For most Smash players (those being non-competitive) the game is very much balanced. But, like I said, it is not reflected in tournament play. Let me give you an example. Link, according to Smashboards, was weak in Melee. So, what happens in Brawl? He's worse. Does this mean Sakurai can't balance? No. To everyone else, Link was broken (he was more broken then Fox ever hoped to be). He was just to easy to use for the rest of us. So, in Brawl, he was nerfed.

Funny you mention Link and Fox, my brother plays both (and he's definitely non-competitive). In Melee, he felt Fox was unstoppable and Link was pretty pathetic. In Brawl, he feels Fox isn't quite as good as he used to be but Link is a thousand times better.

Anyway, fans in general (competitive or not) have a widely differing opinion on what's broken and what's reasonable. Sakurai has his own little mental tier list too. The only pattern I've seen from his is generally nerfing the very top of the tier list. So aside from Meta Knight and probably Snake, I wouldn't expect anything in particular from him.

 

[Mario the Jumpman]

Who wants Bald Bull to be an AT and have him do the Bull Charge?

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Congratulations, you have made the correct choice.

 

[Big-Cat]

Do not listen to Smashboards for how the game is balanced. Tournament play castrates a lot of the game. Items are removed, most stages are turned off (or not preferred), the number of players is moved from four to two and other minor rules are added to the context of the game to make it be a big mess.

The game was designed more holistically. Items would be on, stages on, and most likely with 4 players. The balance of the game will change based on what you do and how you play. Tournament Smash created the unbalanced game. Their solution is make a hack (I always thought this was a good idea. I hate Brawl+ as it tries to make the game Melee, but Balance Brawl does more of what I thought it should be).

For most Smash players (those being non-competitive) the game is very much balanced. But, like I said, it is not reflected in tournament play. Let me give you an example. Link, according to Smashboards, was weak in Melee. So, what happens in Brawl? He's worse. Does this mean Sakurai can't balance? No. To everyone else, Link was broken (he was more broken then Fox ever hoped to be). He was just to easy to use for the rest of us. So, in Brawl, he was nerfed.

Come SSB4, Ike and Lucas are more likely to be weaker the Meta-Knight.

I don't agree with this ideology, and I can't even visualize how they can balance the game with items which have a tendancy to be gamebreakers. Not only that, but this can end up making characters dependent on items instead of their inherent moveset. It's like trying to merge the FPS and Fighting genres into one.

The way I see it, items, stage hazards, and nonneutral stages can give some characters outrageous advantages and disadvantages and create a major random factor involved. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a tourney***. I like playing Smash in the various ways available. If I want to test my skills, I play on neutral stages with no items on. If I want to mess around, I mess around with the settings. I also want the swap between the two to simple as turning as on a switch.

Anyway, how is Link broken in Melee, and the same goes for Ike and Lucas in Brawl.

 

[Hero.]

The SSB Series is for Nintendo/Nintendo-owned characters. Last time I checked, MegaMan was Capcom. So go play your Marvel VS Capcom 3. Or, should I say, Disney VS Capcom 3.

So Snake and Sonic are owned by Nintendo? and Hasn't Mega man been on Nintendo since NES?