[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Tacel]

I think Krystal could get in to Smash 4 without any Star Fox characters getting cut because:

From Super Mario games:

-Mario
-Luigi
-Yoshi (First appearance was in Super Mario World, unless you count Yoshi as having it's own games.)
-Peach
-Bowser
-Wario (His first appearance was is Super Mario Land 2: 6 Golden Coins, unless you count him as having his own games.)

*6 (6, 5, or 4) characters from Mario so far*

From Star Fox games:

-Fox
-Falco
-Wolf

*3 characters from Star Fox so far*

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Adding Krystal to the Star Fox group in Smash would only make 4 characters from Star Fox, which would add up to less (or the same amount) characters than there are from Super Mario.

Oh, TheAceLucario, I did state that, for me, Lucario and Ike were the most likely to be cut, but that's not because I consider them clones.

Oh, sorry.
I thought you might have considered them clones.

 

[Isidro25]

It's evident that Smash counts Yoshi and Wario as their own series, giving them unique symbols apart from the Mario universe. So there are 4 Mario characters in Brawl.

I still think Krystal is possible because of popularity, even if I couldn't care less about her being in or not.

 

[Mario the Jumpman]

Sorry about not reading your links, TheAceLucario. I mainly thought that most people would think that the Starfox series would only get three reps. But now that you showed me otherwise, thank you.

And aren't Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong sometimes considered Mario characters? And what about R.O.B. and Mr. Game & Watch? The reason for the last two is because R.O.B. appeared in Mario Kart DS and there are Game & Watch games with a Mario twist.

 

[Tacel]

It's evident that Smash counts Yoshi and Wario as their own series, giving them unique symbols apart from the Mario universe.

Yes, I just wasn't sure if everyone counted them as separate characters yet.

I think from Yoshi they could add Birdo, and from Wario they could add Jimmy or 9-Volt.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

ATTENTION POKEMON AND EARTHBOUND FANS!

I'm not a big Pokemon fan, but you think Meowth could possibly be a playable character? He was scrapped from the first two games, so Sakurai obviously considered him and almost put him in the game. I alwasy thought, because of this reason, it is possible that he could be playable. Plus, he seems like a popular and easily recognizable Pokemon by anyone, not just fans.

Also, I've never played any of the Earthbound/Mother games, but I'm thinking a new Earthbound rep. seems possible for the next game. Maybe Jeff, he could represent the non-PSI players. And don't forget, a new Mother 3 rep. I always thought Claus, but he seems to similar to Lucas and Ness, and he's not really playable. If there was another Mother 3 rep., who would it most likely be?

 

[Clownbot]

What if, to make handling the roster size easier, they turned Smash DS into a remake of the first game, with a couple of characters that were planned to be in, but got cut?

EDIT: After reading Spydr's post, I think Meowth could definitely be playable if this happened.

Just as something to hold us over until the next console-based Smash.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Yes, I just wasn't sure if everyone counted them as separate characters yet.

I think from Yoshi they could add Birdo, and from Wario they could add Jimmy or 9-Volt.

People don't seem to understand that Birdo has never appeared in a Yoshi game. Birdo originated in Super Mario Bros. 2, before Yoshi even existed. She didn't return until the Mario Sports/Mario Party Series, where she is commonly paired with Yoshi. But that doesn't mean she is a Yoshi character.

If there was going to be any new Yoshi rep., it would be Kamek.

 

[justaway12]

I think Krystal could get in to Smash 4 without any Star Fox characters getting cut because:

From Super Mario games:

-Mario
-Luigi
-Yoshi (First appearance was in Super Mario World, unless you count Yoshi as having it's own games.)
-Peach
-Bowser
-Wario (His first appearance was is Super Mario Land 2: 6 Golden Coins, unless you count him as having his own games.)

*6 (6, 5, or 4) characters from Mario so far*

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Adding Krystal to the Star Fox group in Smash would only make 4 characters from Star Fox, which would add up to less (or the same amount) characters than there are from Super Mario.

Mario only has 4 reps, Wario and Yoshi have thier own symbols and I heard users (way back in this thread) in this thread saying Star fox isn't popular enough, I agree with them (although my opinion shouldn't count since I hardly know anything about Star fox) but people who DO know about Star Fox and it's sales agree it's not popular enough for more than 3(Spadefox, Wizzerd etc.). Thats why Mario, Pokemon and Zelda have 4 reps (not including tranformations) and nobody else, i'm Positive Mario/Pokemon/Zelda is MUCH more popular than star fox especially since I know they are Nintendo biggest money-maker. ​

 

[Clownbot]

If there was going to be any new Yoshi rep., it would be Kamek.

Kamek? He's the 2nd best choice they've got for a new Yoshi rep.
*cough*Baby Mario Bros.*cough*

 

[Tacel]

ATTENTION POKEMON AND EARTHBOUND FANS!

I'm not a big Pokemon fan, but you think Meowth could possibly be a playable character? He was scrapped from the first two games, so Sakurai obviously considered him and almost put him in the game. I alwasy thought, because of this reason, it is possible that he could be playable. Plus, he seems like a popular and easily recognizable Pokemon by anyone, not just fans.

I was thinking about Meowth being a playable character, and I think that he would be an awesome character!

Also, I've never played any of the Earthbound/Mother games, but I'm thinking a new Earthbound rep. seems possible for the next game. Maybe Jeff, he could represent the non-PSI players.

Don't forget the Bubble Monkey!

 

[Tacel]

People don't seem to understand that Birdo has never appeared in a Yoshi game. Birdo originated in Super Mario Bros. 2, before Yoshi even existed.

I know, but I think they could put Birdo in as a Yoshi character, since they are basically partners in Mario Kart Double Dash, and Yoshi does need more reps.

EDIT: Oops, sorry. Double Post.

 

[Clownbot]

The edit is upset that he's been neglected, Ace.

Birdo has no relation to Yoshi outside the sports games. Therefore, she is not a Yoshi character.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Kamek? He's the 2nd best choice they've got for a new Yoshi rep.
*cough*Baby Mario Bros.*cough*

The baby Mario Bros. never did anything, it was Yoshi that played the game. Maybe Yoshi could have an alt. costume with Baby Mario on his back (although it would seem unbalanced and strange).

I say Kamek because Kamek had a vital role in the game, is easily recognizable, has actually fought, and because the Yoshi series needs a new rep. anyway.

The edit is upset that he's been neglected, Ace.

Birdo has no relation to Yoshi outside the sports games. Therefore, she is not a Yoshi character.

And agreed with this.

 

[Knyaguy]

I'm not a big Pokemon fan, but you think Meowth could possibly be a playable character? He was scrapped from the first two games, so Sakurai obviously considered him and almost put him in the game. I alwasy thought, because of this reason, it is possible that he could be playable. Plus, he seems like a popular and easily recognizable Pokemon by anyone, not just fans.

No, Meowth is in the same boat as Jiggs for the most, popular back in the day. He is still in the anime but I think new pokemon reps will come from the future generations to boost up sales for the games.

 

[Tacel]

Birdo has no relation to Yoshi outside the sports games. Therefore, she is not a Yoshi character.

It was just a though...
But then what are they going to do with Yoshi?
How many characters could there possibly be for Yoshi, other then the Baby Mario Bros.?

The baby Mario Bros. never did anything, it was Yoshi that played the game.

That doesn't mean that they can't be playable characters.
I'm sure they could make up a moveset for them.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

No, Meowth is in the same boat as Jiggs for the most, popular back in the day. He is still in the anime but I think new pokemon reps will come from the future generations to boost up sales for the games.

Oh, that reminds me. Do you think Lucario would be replaced by a next gen. Pokemon in the next game? If Sakurai decides to stay with the stupid "4 reps per series" rule, then I can see it happening, thats why Mewtwo was cut.

But if he doesn't and allows more reps, I can see Lucario staying + a next gen. Pokemon and possibly the return of Mewtwo, but I doubt the Mewtwo part.

It was just a though...
But then what are they going to do with Yoshi?
How many characters could there possibly be for Yoshi, other then the Baby Mario Bros.?

Like I said before, Kamek is a possibility. It would add to the narrow villain category and Kamek is vital and easily recognizable as well. As for a moveset, I know he has a few moves of his own, but he could steal moves from Magikoopa's of other games such as Super Mario World.

 

[Mario the Jumpman]

A third Mother 3 rep should be Porky, because it's pretty unlikely for him to be a Ness clone.

Also, Meowth isn't powerful enough (both the anime and games say so) to be playable in Smash 4. Try Infernape; it's fast, strong, heavy, and acrobatic (by that, I mean it can jump, high).

 

[Knyaguy]

Oh, that reminds me. Do you think Lucario would be replaced by a next gen. Pokemon in the next game? If Sakurai decides to stay with the stupid "4 reps per series" rule, then I can see it happening, thats why Mewtwo was cut.

But if he doesn't and allows more reps, I can see Lucario staying + a next gen. Pokemon and possibly the return of Mewtwo, but I doubt the Mewtwo part.

Lucario, yes. Mewtwo had two movies and was cut Lucario has only one movie. I love my Mewtwo but I really don't see him coming back, its been far too long now.

 

[Clownbot]

What fighting potential does Porky have? I've never played the Earthbound/Mother games...

At least Meowth has more significance in the ANIME, which is probably how Jigglypuff became playable.

I'm lovin' Knyaguy's new signature, also.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

A third Mother 3 rep should be Porky, because it's pretty unlikely for him to be a Ness clone.

Also, Meowth isn't powerful enough (both the anime and games say so) to be playable in Smash 4. Try Infernape; it's fast, strong, heavy, and acrobatic (by that, I mean it can jump, high).

But think about it this way...

In the Mario games, Peach is always captured by Bowser. In the Smash games, Peach is powerful enough to beat the **** out of Bowser.

My point is, we are talking about the Smash world. If Peach can kill Bowser in the Smash World, then I'm pretty sure Meowth could fight in a Smash game. I'm only wondering if he's worthy enough. Sakurai obviously thought so, he was scrapped from the first two games so Sakurai considered it deeply. But he doesn't seem popular anymore so I'm just wondering...

 

[Tacel]

Like I said before, Kamek is a possibility. It would add to the narrow villain category and Kamek is vital and easily recognizable as well. As for a moveset, I know he has a few moves of his own, but he could steal moves from Magikoopa's of other games such as Super Mario World.

That's a good idea! I forgot about Kamek, but he was a villain in Yoshi Story. (Or was that Magikoopa?)

So...
-Yoshi
-Kamek
-Baby Mario Bros.

That's 3.

If Yoshi get's 3 reps. then Metroid deserves 3 reps. too.

Maybe Kraid and Ridley?

 

[Mario the Jumpman]

Meowth just isn't a Pokemon I want playable in Smash. It should stay as a Pokeball Pokemon. By the way, here is what Infernape's Specials and Final Smash could be:

Standard Special: Fling: Throws Iron Balls/Bob-ombs/Capsules at opponemts in one of three different trajectories: straight above, straight forward, or in an arc

Side Special: Flame Wheel: Side recovery, burns opponents struck by it for 3 seconds

Down Special: Protect: like Marth and Ike's counter, but doesn't attack opponents and works longer

Up Special: Rock Climb: Rock formation appears and Infernape climbs up it at a high speed, knocking back opponents

Final Smash: Blast Burn

If anyone can come up with an effect for Blast Burn, please let me know. Thank you!

 

[Spydr Enzo]

That's a good idea! I forgot about Kamek, but he was a villain in Yoshi Story. (Or was that Magikoopa?)

So...
-Yoshi
-Kamek
-Baby Mario Bros.

That's 3.

If Yoshi get's 3 reps. then Metroid deserves 3 reps. too.

Maybe Kraid and Ridley?

About the Yoshi series; I don't see the Baby Mario Bros. being playable. They weren't really characters in their own, their were more of an attachment to Yoshi, the actual playable character. So they never really fought or did anything. The Yoshi Series isn't the most diverse or popular series, so for now, they only need two.

About the Metroid Series; If there were to be three reps, one would probably be Dark Samus. Dark Samus is not a clone in any way, and has a vital part in the Metroid Prime series.A third one, I would take one of the other hunters from the DS Metroid game. Probably Sylux, because he is the most recognizable and most common of all the other hunters, making the most Cameo appearances and stuff like that.

Kraid and Ridley are better as bosses. Ridley is a bit too big. A resize would look stupid and make him look to small. Kraid is DEFINATELY to big. If you've played a Metroid game, you'd know he is maybe around 150 to 200 feet tall. He would be a good boss though.

 

[Clownbot]

Yoshi doesn't deserve 3 reps.
If Metroid got 3, Sylux (if he/she/it/potato has significance in a future Metroid title) would get in before... Kraid?

Does Kraid even qualify as a possible character?

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Meowth just isn't a Pokemon I want playable in Smash. It should stay as a Pokeball Pokemon. By the way, here is what Infernape's Specials and Final Smash could be:

Standard Special: Fling: Throws Iron Balls/Bob-ombs/Capsules at opponemts in one of three different trajectories: straight above, straight forward, or in an arc

Side Special: Flame Wheel: Side recovery, burns opponents struck by it for 3 seconds

Down Special: Protect: like Marth and Ike's counter, but doesn't attack opponents and works longer

Up Special: Rock Climb: Rock formation appears and Infernape climbs up it at a high speed, knocking back opponents

Final Smash: Blast Burn

If anyone can come up with an effect for Blast Burn, please let me know. Thank you!

I'm not familiar with Infernape (not a Pokemon fan) but I looked him up. He does seem like a good fighter and a powerful Pokemon, but is he worthy?

The way I see it, for a charcater to get in Smash they need to meet these three requirements:

1) Easily or slightly recognizable by a fan or anyone familiar with the series.
2) Plays a vital role in the game (for a Pokemon, that means a rare, legendary Pokemon, or a main character like he Pokemon Trainer).
3) Is a popular character from a popular and/or recognizable game series.

I can't see Infernape as playable, and I can't see Sakurai even considering him (I try to think like Sakurai). However, it does seem possible for him to be a Pokeball Pokemon.

Yoshi doesn't deserve 3 reps.
If Metroid got 3, Sylux (if he/she/it/potato has significance in a future Metroid title) would get in before... Kraid?

Does Kraid even qualify as a possible character?

Kraid does not qualify as a possible character. He is simply too large too even resize. However, it seems very likely for him to be a boss. And Sylux is present in cameos in Metroid Prime games, and i'm sure he will be in a future Metroid game.

 

[Tacel]

Kraid and Ridley are big, but they could shrink them.
Saying it would make them look stupid is an opinion.
I think Ridley has a bigger chance than Kraid, though... by a long shot.

 

[Clownbot]

It's not that Kraid's too big (which I DO think is a stupid argument), but he doesn't have that much significance in the Metroid series.

 

[Knyaguy]

Kraid and Ridley are big, but they could shrink them.
Saying it would make them look stupid is an opinion.
I think Ridley has a bigger chance than Kraid, though... by a long shot.

I can see them shrinking Ridley, Kraid not so much. If I recall correctly Kraid is the guy in melee who turned the stage in Brinstar Depths. It would be like trying to shrink Godzilla to Smash size. Even if they did, it just wouldn't be Kraid it would be like mini-me Kraid.

I can't see Infernape as playable, and I can't see Sakurai even considering him (I try to think like Sakurai). However, it does seem possible for him to be a Pokeball Pokemon.

Agreed.

I'm lovin' Knyaguy's new signature, also.

Yeah, Its my favourite caption so far.

 

[Mario the Jumpman]

To Spydr Enzo: Arguing about Ridley's size has no point other than to tick of his fans. Ridley can be a great playable character in Smash 4. Just ask drag0nscythe; he made a post about Ridle's moveset and size comparisons, so if you check it, you will see how pointless your side of your arguement is.

And do you have any ideas for Dark Samus's Specials and Final Smash?

 

[Pieman0920]

Sylux doesn't cameo in games plural. He/she/it may have been in MP3's secret ending, but then again maybe not. Either way, it was just a ship, and not him/her/it. So far, I think the only two valid canidates for anothe Metroid character are Ridley and Dark Samus. As far as Kraid goes, he really is too big, with little to no way to resize him. Mother Brain would be a better choice than him in all honesty.

As for the Yoshi series, I think Baby Mario/Baby Luigi would probably be playable before Kamek. Most people don't realize, but Kamek is just the generiic name for a Magikoopa in Japan. To that end, the antagonist of Yoshi's Island is, and always has been, anonymous. To add him into the game would be like adding in a random Koopa Troopa.

 

[Tacel]

Arguing about Ridley's size has no point other than to tick of his fans.

Sigged.
That was the best way to put it.
:bigthumbu
You rock, my friend.

 

[Fatmanonice]

What fighting potential does Porky have? I've never played the Earthbound/Mother games...

At least Meowth has more significance in the ANIME, which is probably how Jigglypuff became playable.

I'm lovin' Knyaguy's new signature, also.

Pokey/Porky really doesn't have any fighting potential because he's never really fought outside of a machine. In Earthbound, he's a sniveling little cry baby who does things like "play dead" when he's in your team at the beggining of the game and in Mother 3, he's a withered old man that's being kept alive by the machine he's in.

 

[Pieman0920]

You could have him fight in a mini version of the spider robot. I kind of had a idea of something like that with a AW character in a mini-Neo tank, and I think it could technically work for Porky as well. Even so, I think that Mother has enough represention right now, since the series isn't exactly too popular.

 

[Isidro25]

Eh, if they want, they can give ANYONE a moveset. And I mean, anyone. Creativity allows for it.

The matter is not "Could they make him/her/it fight?".
The matter is "Will they choose him/her/it to join the fight?".

 

[Spydr Enzo]

I do admit, Ridley could have a chance if he was resized. After all, Bowser was reduced to just a bit more than half his usual height. But still, Ridley is bigger than Bowser in usual height and overall size. Reducing Ridley to the size of Samus (which is about the same height as Bowser, the limit for height most likely) would just look strange in my opinion. IMO, he is a boss, it should stay that way.

There is no way in Brinstar that Kraid would ever become a playable character. Resizing isn't a reasonable option, considering his usual size is... Gigantic. However, Kraid IS the perfect fit for a boss.

I can still see Sylux being playable, even though it has debatable cameo appearances. It is still recognizable and, from what I've read/heard, played a slightly more important role in MP: Hunters.

As for Kamek, we live in America. Kamek is the name of the lead Magikoopa in America, meaning Kamek is a significant character, having it's own name. I don't care what it is in Japan. And I'm still not convinced by the Baby Mario Bros. Somebody post movesets/FSmashes, etc. and how they relate to the Yoshi's Island game, and I may be convinced.

 

[Isidro25]

Melee's intro showed us how Ridley could fit perfectly in the Smash universe, IMO.

 

[Fatmanonice]

You could have him fight in a mini version of the spider robot. I kind of had a idea of something like that with a AW character in a mini-Neo tank, and I think it could technically work for Porky as well. Even so, I think that Mother has enough represention right now, since the series isn't exactly too popular.

I agree. In my opinion, Mother is "complete" and doesn't need any more character reps. I think everyone here would agree with me that the Kirby franchise is the same way too.

I do admit, Ridley could have a chance if he was resized. After all, Bowser was reduced to just a bit more than half his usual height. But still, Ridley is bigger than Bowser in usual height and overall size. Reducing Ridley to the size of Samus (which is about the same height as Bowser, the limit for height most likely) would just look strange in my opinion. IMO, he is a boss, it should stay that way.

There is no way in Brinstar that Kraid would ever become a playable character. Resizing isn't a reasonable option, considering his usual size is... Gigantic. However, Kraid IS the perfect fit for a boss.

I can still see Sylux being playable, even though it has debatable cameo appearances. It is still recognizable and, from what I've read/heard, played a slightly more important role in MP: Hunters.

As for Kamek, we live in America. Kamek is the name of the lead Magikoopa in America, meaning Kamek is a significant character, having it's own name. I don't care what it is in Japan. And I'm still not convinced by the Baby Mario Bros. Somebody post movesets/FSmashes, etc. and how they relate to the Yoshi's Island game, and I may be convinced.

Ridley could easily be made bigger than Bowser to replace him as the largest character in the game. I personally can imagine, if Ridley were playable, for him to be about 2 1/2 Marios tall.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Melee's intro showed us how Ridley could fit perfectly in the Smash universe, IMO.

It did, it showed us how he can fir perfectly as a boss. I've always thought it would be cool for Ridley to appear playable in the game, but doesn't anyone else think it would be a bit strange, having Samus and Ridley be about the same size?

 

[Isidro25]

It did, it showed us how he can fir perfectly as a boss. I've always thought it would be cool for Ridley to appear playable in the game, but doesn't anyone else think it would be a bit strange, having Samus and Ridley be about the same size?

Well, in my post I intended to say that Melee's intro made him battling against a same-sized Samus seem natural, so I wouldn't have a trouble with him being playable.

I think Ridley can work both ways, honestly.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Well, in my post I intended to say that Melee's intro made him battling against a same-sized Samus seem natural, so I wouldn't have a trouble with him being playable.

I think Ridley can work both ways, honestly.

I thought about the Ridley size problem, and I guess it wouldn't be much of an issue. But I always pictured that little tunnel thing in Hyrule Temple (Melee). Bowser nearly touches the cieling when he stands in it. If Ridley were bigger than him, he would go through and if he got a Super ushroom, he would end up coming thrpugh the to[, which would look very strange.

But in cases like this, maybe Sakurai can implement some sort of ducking animation. It doesn't affect moves or anything, and it isn't the same as holding down with the control stick. This would make it look a bit more appealing.

Still, I can't see Ridley being playable. He is still a boss in my opinion.